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Los tios que escribieron esta pagina son uns frikis, como wikipedia puede mantener esta pagina y no considerarla absurda, es idiota, la gran guerra hacker? además el que lo escribe parece como si estuviera asiendo un resumen de un puto dibujo o comic, como si todos concieran a los tios que participaron alli que gilipollada……………………… —Preceding unsigned comment added by Luiselmas0 (talk • contribs) 00:06, 6 June 2010 (UTC)
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There seems to be a lot of emotionally loaded language and first person perspective used here, it seems in need of a good editing. Josh Parris ✉ 00:09, 31 Mar 2005 (UTC)
- Well, it was an emotional war. Many phones were disconnected. Many slurs and epitaphs were spoken. Conferences were had and wiretapped. In its wake, a couple phones were programmed to be 1CF. War is hell. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.13.159.189 (talk) 17:44, 15 May 2011 (UTC)
Masters of Deception not only deserves a seperate article, but the main article itself needs expanding. --70.240.225.29 22:03, 2 April 2006 (UTC)
I made some edits to this page based on conversation with those involved. Although quite factual, it could use another small pass to correct some grammar, tense, and perspective. --Netw1z 12:11, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
The condensed information here is quite factual. Phrack was a LOD-freindly publication that even resumed publication under Chris Goggans, which chose to censure MOD. Unforuantely some of the most intersting stories from the Hacker Underground are just that... underground. This particular story was documented on both sides in the book Masters of Deception — The Gang that Ruled Cyberspace (ISBN 0060926945) , and this has some additional information from sources involved or familiar with the conflict. --Netw1z 02:35, 1 June 2006 (UTC)
I made the names of the hackers consistent, since it kept switching back and forth between given names and aliases. From an outsider's perspective, it gets confusing hearing that Erik Bloodaxe is doing one thing while Chris Goggans is doing another.--Miss Dark 18:31, 12 August 2006 (UTC)
This article appears to be heavily slanted against Chris Goggans with not a great deal backing it up. Habitually betraying underage hackers? Where's that documented? If he and the others he formed ComSec with had decided to "go legit", what were they going to do in response to MOD's alleged monitoring of their conversations? Write a ".annoy" script? Hack their local telephone switches and turn their handsets into payphones? In the context of LOD having "gone legit", their continued freedom as compared to MOD's criminal convictions puts a slightly different spin on the outcome which appears to have been reduced to "MOD wins cuz they owned LOD's PBX" even though LOD had stopped fighting a "war" that Lex Luthor believed never even existed (reference is linked in main article).
I'd also be interested to see evidence of MOD taking control of every POTS, X.25 or TCP/IP channel in or out of Texas. That's a mighty big claim.
While I have read Quittner and Slatalla's book, I don't actually have a copy. I certainly don't recall any of the above being covered but I might have forgotten. Thedangerouskitchen 07:31, 3 September 2006 (UTC)
And, I'd like to know where the idea that Nahshon Even-Chaim's bust "may have been directly caused by his association with Chris Goggans" came from. The weight of published evidence points to Even-Chaim being named (as Phoenix) in the Secret Service's investigation into a 1988 Citibank hack and Bill Apro's investigation into the Melbourne hacking scene as a whole (where Phoenix was reputed to be among the most prolific members) as the most direct causes. Thedangerouskitchen 12:39, 4 September 2006 (UTC)
I've tagged this article, if you dangerouskitchen have more facts or information about all of this, then please take a stab at fixing it up a little bit. I can't find any mention at all of any "LOD" and "MOD" "war", which is the same thing Lex Luthor says in that letter to cypherpunks from 1993. I see only pages and pages and pages and pages of Chris Goggans and MOD. 6Akira7 15:42, 5 September 2006 (UTC)
Most of this article is taken from a single textfile, and yes it is a bit weighted, written only from the perspective of two groups, but to my memory pretty accurate. My main complaint is that the "great hacker war" is written to appear that only LoD and MoD were involved, when in fact there were many more groups (The reason it's called the GREAT hacker war).
this is total bullshit from the word go. Dates are wrong, and those groups did not dominate or own anything or exist for that fact.
www.irchelp.org.
Is the usage of hacker vs. cracker correct in this page? --Edlin2 01:17, 30 October 2006 (UTC)
This page seems to have a whole bunch of NPOV problems. As well, the statements made don't seem to be at all supported by the related citations... the only source I don't have access to is the full text of the book on the Masters of Deception. Does anyone have this? I'd like to take a look myself, because if it conforms significantly with its excerpt printed in Wired then I'd have to assume that most of this is unsupported opinion.
Secondarily Chris Goggans seems to claim that book is extraordinarily biased. If this writing is representative of the book I'm inclined to agree... Aside, I am not invested in this at all, as I have no idea who any of these people are and have nothing to bring to this but good faith. Chromancer 23:07, 17 October 2007 (UTC)
The author of the book states that he interviewed Chris Goggans - mostly likely both sides probably feel the book is biased in the other's direction - just as the changes seem to be made by people partial to one side or the other, or sometimes by people and organizations who weren't. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Sensible matters (talk • contribs) 15:50, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
Ok, I've finally managed to again (it had been a few years) get my hands on Quittner and Slatalla's book on the MoD, from a library. The closest it comes to corroborating the claim that MoD controlled all POTS, X.25 and TCP/IP in Texas is a section in which it is alleged MoD, specifically John Lee, had access to C-SCANS, a computer system from which it was possible to to configure anything in Southwest Bell's network. While this is indeed a lot of power, it does not constitute control over all POTS, X.25 and TCP/IP in Texas. If someone doesn't come up with some kind of citation or reasonable explanation as to how the section of the book I described corroborates the claim, I am going to cut it. Thedangerouskitchen (talk) 10:27, 26 December 2007 (UTC)
I ran the Fifth Amendment BBS, which was where this whole event started. For the record, I was never interviewed for the book. I share the same opinion as Chris. The book was biased, in favor of the members of MOD. According to the book, the key event of the book is that John hears a "racial slur" which drives him to start this "war". One point the book conveniently forgets to mention is that one of the members of MOD chose to go by the name "Supernigger". As someone who was on the phone bridge many nights, this person would be addressed by their handle on a frequent basis.
My opinion, MOD saw that the guys in LOD had the respect of the underground. Similar to the gang style tactics that we see in the movies, they chose to attempt to make a name for themselves in the underground by taking out the perceived "kings" of the underground. As the court records show, they failed miserably at this attempt.
Quittners book was their last hack.
You are friends with Chris Goggans so obviously you can't be objective.Considering you aren't in either MOD or LOD - it would stand that you wouldn't be interviewed for the book. You ran a BBS - probably the lowest rung in the hacker food chain. The book isn't biased, it's just difficult to write any book and truly be objective. Using the freely editable discussion area of Wikipedia to slight people probably robs you of whatever little credibility you had left.
- So does contacting news shows and saying you can "Hack past firewalls using only 5 keystrokes." h0h0h0. - But the man with the golden gums is right. Micron/William J. Casperon was the worst kind of hanger-on in the old days. He thought LMOS was a Jetson. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.13.159.189 (talk) 17:55, 15 May 2011 (UTC)
netw1z —Preceding comment was added at 15:08, 7 May 2008 (UTC)
The most recent edit of the epilogue has Chris Goggans described as a narc and a commentary on LOD's alleged deficiencies with X.25 and RBOC systems. Can we not stick to documented facts? Thedangerouskitchen (talk) 13:38, 8 May 2008 (UTC)
As interesting as this article may be, it has three references, one of which does not appear to be "Independent of the subject" as required by WP:NOT, and it clearly has NPOV issues, though I can see why. :P Sephiroth storm (talk) 14:57, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
This part reads like conjecture or opinion. It may be factual, but the tone doesn't lend itself to believing it. One part that stands out is the part that reads ever. Just that word, mainly, but the whole section needs a good proofreading.
Also is the SCCS system mentioned the UNIX source code control system?
Family Guy Guy (talk) 04:41, 24 December 2014 (UTC)
This article really needs a cleanup. To be honest, I would have nominated it for deletion, but I see there has already been a deletion discussion. I'm just going to list some clear problems:
20WattSphere (talk) 00:13, 5 February 2023 (UTC)