Dan Shafer

Hello, TenPoundHammer,

When I was closing the AFD for this article and looking at the page history, I was surprised to see that it was you who decided that the article was in good enough shape to move it from Draft space to main space. Did your opinion of the sourcing change over time? I was just surprised to see the change of opinion over the past 7 months. Liz Read! Talk! 22:45, 24 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I moved it to article space after a good-faith request from the article's subject. Then I came across the article again later on and re-evaluated it. Ten Pound Hammer(What did I screw up now?) 22:48, 24 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
You were contacted by the article subject? That's unusual. Thanks for the explanation. Liz Read! Talk! 00:23, 25 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Added more sources for the article, Starveillance

Hi, TenPoundHammer. I noticed that the article that you wanted to delete was the article, Starveillance due to having no sources. I had to add more possible sources including the ones that you removed to improve the article. I sorry I did it, I just wanted to fix the article to prevent it from being deleted.--VictorRocks (talk) 17:23, 25 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]


Hello, again, TenPoundHammer,

If you look at Category:Proposed deletion as of 24 April 2022, you'll see that there are 269 articles that were PROD'd this day. That is quite a lot more than a typical day which is between about 15-50 articles that are PROD'd. I know you aren't responsible for all of these pages but you PROD'd quite a lot of them!

There's really only two admins who review PRODs these days and each article that is tagged needs to be reviewed individually to make sure it is eligible for proposed deletion. If you could pace yourself and PROD fewer articles each day but over more days, that would help us manage the workload a little better. There is no rush with deleting unnecessary articles and so if you again find a lot of these articles in the future, please think about tagging 10-20/day over a week rather than 100+ on one day.

Also, you really need to post a notification for each of these articles on the talk page of the article creator. I see you use Twinkle, so make sure that the "Notify page creator" box is checked off every time you tag a page for any type of deletion (CSD, PROD, AFD/TFD/CFD/etc.). This is an important step in the deletion process that shouldn't be skipped. Thank you for doing this with each deletion tagging in the future.

This is a message coming from me, as one of the two admins who regularly review PRODs and I'm just speaking for myself. Reviewing proposed deletions is just one of the tasks I do each day and I can see that next Sunday will be a busy one! Thanks again. Liz Read! Talk! 18:08, 25 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah, I kinda fell down a rabbit hole full of short-lived TV show articles and just didn't know when to stop. A few of them have already been contested. I'll pace myself next time I find a stretch like that. (I've got my eye on the ((history shows)) articles, but I'll pace myself on those.) Ten Pound Hammer(What did I screw up now?) 19:00, 25 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I'm working on a list of articles I plan to prod and I'll spread them out over the next however many days so as not to overwhelm the queue.
Also I've found that like 80% of the articles I've nominated, the article creator was clearly no longer editing, so in those cases I saw no reason to notify the creator. Ten Pound Hammer(What did I screw up now?) 04:55, 26 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I don’t understand; you were just asked stop with all the prods, so now you switched to a frenzy of AFDs? And why are so many of them Food Network series? Erpert blah, blah, blah... 10:04, 27 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Because they are unsourced stubs for which I could find no sources? Ten Pound Hammer(What did I screw up now?) 15:06, 27 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Also, as pointed out in the AFDs I did nominate, Liz's issues had nothing whatsoever to do with AFD. Are there 300+ television AFDs currently running with my name attached? No. Was my rationale valid? Clearly it must be if others are agreeing that the articles I nominated should be deleted. I also hardly think that fewer than five Food Network shows is "so many". Ten Pound Hammer(What did I screw up now?) 15:12, 27 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

A much deserved thank you

Tireless Contributor Barnstar.gif
The Tireless Contributor Barnstar
Hello TPH. Your work here at the 'pedia is always appreciated. When you take the time to create something like this you truly deserve this barnstar. Best regards and many thanks MarnetteD|Talk 02:46, 28 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

No hard feelings?

Creston Ohio Police Ford Explorer (15667599289).jpg
PROD Police
Lately I feel like I end up reverting your PRODs a lot and I thought I'd drop you a line to make sure you know I'm not intentionally hounding you or trying to be an arse. I'm just patrolling the relevant database reports for compliance with WP:PRODNOM. I hope it does not dishearten you from your important work trying to clean up the bottom of the Wikipedia barrel. :) Ben · Salvidrim!  20:16, 28 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
It's fine. I'm expecting some of these to be contested because that's how it is with prods. Ten Pound Hammer(What did I screw up now?) 20:25, 28 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Excessive prods, AFDs, and Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Bumper Stumpers

Prods will be removed from time to time - but it's supposed to be the exception, not the rule. You didn't really address my concerns at WP:Articles for deletion/You Wrote It, You Watch It; shouldn't many of these hundreds of recent nominations be merges and/or redirects? What did you do WP:BEFORE nominating? Also can you reply to my comment at WT:WikiProject Television? Finally, I saw your recent nomination of Bumper Stumpers. Two things - you seem to be nominating a lot of Canadian TV programming. When you do so, can you also tag the Canada deletion sorting group (WP:WikiProject Deletion sorting/Canada) - Canadian shows are typically posted there. I haven't done any research yet, but it would surprise me that a show that aired for near a decade on a big-3 national network, and whose name is well known to so many, is going to pass AFD! It would help if you searched for these things in Proquest/Wikipedia Library as per WP:CONRED. I hope your prods/AFDs of American programming is better - and truth be told, I can't possibly check so many. Nfitz (talk) 02:02, 29 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks, I didn't know about that. Newspapers.com does cover a lot of Canada, so I'm stunned that they turned up literally nothing. The show spent far more time in reruns on obscure networks (face it, nobody was watching Game Show Network yet in 1995) than anywhere else major. Ten Pound Hammer(What did I screw up now?) 02:23, 29 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Newspapers.com doesn't cover most of the biggest Canadian papers. Proquest has a very good collection though. There's a lot of Montreal Gazette scanned on Google Newspapers site - it's only text on Proquest, and sometime you want to see the actual page. Newspapers.com is very poor for French Canadian newspapers. I've only done the most cursory of searches, and it looks like there's at least a good Toronto Star hit. Really these cheap gameshows were just a way for the two commercial networks to meet their Canadian-content (Can-Con) requirements without spending a lot of cash, but still getting some revenue. I'm really surprised they'd have got aired elsewhere. Nfitz (talk) 04:59, 29 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

undid a redirect you did for an obvious notable episode

[1] You turned an article into a redirect with the edit summary (not notable). Two reliable sources were already mentioned as reviewing it, both of them giving significant coverage in their review. Over 5 million people watched the episode, so of course it'd be reviewed in places. Kindly take time to read the articles before you rampage around eliminating them, and can you undo the removal of the links to this article you did in various articles? Dream Focus 07:07, 29 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I did read it and saw only two brief reviews. Literally 99% of the article was plot. What was lost other than a very very very very VERY short review? Ten Pound Hammer(What did I screw up now?) 18:06, 29 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
https://www.ign.com/articles/2010/04/02/flashforward-better-angels-review https://www.avclub.com/flashforward-better-angels-1798164664 are certainly not short reviews. People go to articles about episodes to read about the episodes, far fewer read anything else about them. The reviews just confirm it meets the general notability guidelines. Dream Focus 18:15, 29 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
That said, I think I got all the links? Ten Pound Hammer(What did I screw up now?) 18:10, 29 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

PRODs again

Hello, I've contested a few of your PRODs that you made on the basis of being completely unsourced, as I have found sources. An example is Buzzkill (TV series). Given the huge number of PRODs that could be deleted on 1 May and the likelihood that at least some of these are notable, could you please self-revert your nominations and nominate them at a slower pace to allow them to be properly reviewed? Thanks NemesisAT (talk) 13:05, 29 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I figured some would be contested. Self-reverting seems unnecessarily convoluted though. Far too many of them were created back when we still allowed IPs to create articles, are two sentences long, and don't even have an infobox -- that's how neglected they are. There's still time to contest them now if any are worth saving. Ten Pound Hammer(What did I screw up now?) 17:52, 29 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
ETA: I'm open to any that might have potential for rescue. Ten Pound Hammer(What did I screw up now?) 17:56, 29 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I'd think that almost all of them should be redirects to the network, at the minimum. I've asked you about this a couple of times now - but you haven't answered. I'm not sure who else to talk to about this. Doesn't quite seem like an ANI issue. I'm tempted to remove them all myself - but that might be pointy - but there's no time to do a proper review to unprod before they start expiring. Any Admins page-watching with some thoughts on best direction with these 200+ prods. Gosh, there's over 50 active AFDs too, just in the Television area!! Nfitz (talk) 20:56, 29 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The main concern was that I slow down on the PRODs so as not to overwhelm the queue since only two admins watch the prod queue. I would not be surprised if any of the prods set to expire on Sunday manage to buy some extra time. That's also why I set up User:TenPoundHammer/TV cleanup, so I can have a publicly viewable workspace and a means for others to help assist me in cleanup. If nothing else this means you won't see me prod 200+ articles in a day again. Ten Pound Hammer(What did I screw up now?) 21:10, 29 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
My main concern is that most of these have obvious redirect - and to some extent merge targets. Secondarily is the shear number of prods and AFDs. The question though, is what to do. Any admins watching - trying to avoid a WikiDrama. Nfitz (talk) 22:49, 29 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for slowing them down, though I'm still concerned about those that expire Sunday. I don't have time to go over them all before then, may I remove them? NemesisAT (talk) 22:59, 29 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
There are a few that are borderline and I wouldn't object to shifting them to AFD, redirecting, or moving to the TV cleanup list I made. I think some of the really glaring ones like 5 Ingredient Fix that are only a sentence long can probably stay prodded, though. Ten Pound Hammer(What did I screw up now?) 23:06, 29 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I can't tell that they fail notability guidelines based on just reading the articles though, I'd have to do a newspapers.com search for each one and I don't have the time to do 200 searches this weekend. NemesisAT (talk) 23:14, 29 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I'll go through a few of them myself later tonight and see what I find. Ten Pound Hammer(What did I screw up now?) 23:16, 29 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Again I ask - why not redirects to the network? Nfitz (talk) 03:09, 30 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Because certain editors just seem to love undoing my redirects. Ten Pound Hammer(What did I screw up now?) 03:10, 30 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
How does that have any bearing if they should be redirected? Nfitz (talk) 04:10, 30 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Because 98% of the time when I redirect something, someone undoes it literally seconds later. So why should I bother? (yes, that includes the redirecting I'm doing now) Ten Pound Hammer(What did I screw up now?) 04:15, 30 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Isn't prodding stuff rather than redirecting, when there is a good redirect (or merge) target, an example of [[WP::Do not disrupt Wikipedia to illustrate a point]]? Nfitz (talk) 04:24, 30 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Sometimes I feel that there is no valid merge/redirect target, or that the term is vague enough to clear up the title, or there is another work with the same title that needs to be moved there when the non-notable one is deleted. Also, isn't certain editors undoing my redirects literally seconds after I make them every bit as WP:POINTy? Ten Pound Hammer(What did I screw up now?) 14:41, 30 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Maybe you need to do just one redirect, and then go through the process; and then use that as a precedent. Nfitz (talk) 22:34, 30 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Well, NemesisAT really de-PROD'd a large number of the PRODs you tagged last week. Although I was a little critical of the volume of nominations, looking at some of these articles, well, I don't see how anyone could argue we should keep these 1 or 2 season lame reality shows on cable networks. I hope to see some of these turn up at AFD. I'm not sure if some of these could be bundled together unless you did it by TV network. Liz Read! Talk! 02:51, 1 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I've been going through and AFD'ing a few of the more egregious ones. Some that weren't even TV articles got declined by NemesisAT anyway, and I've picked those out too. The rest I'm pushing onto the cleanup list for now, although others may AFD them if so inclined. Ten Pound Hammer(What did I screw up now?) 02:54, 1 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]


In your redirects of individual episodes (which I don't have a lot of issues about, personally), why are you redirecting, for example, The Goat (How I Met Your Mother) to List of How I Met Your Mother episodes rather than How_I_Met_Your_Mother_(season_3)#ep61? Nfitz (talk) 04:29, 30 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Because I tend to forget that individual season episode articles exist. Ten Pound Hammer(What did I screw up now?) 14:34, 30 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Flower Shops (The Album) and Good Time

Hi, I was wondering if you could make articles for Ernest's album Flower Shops (The Album) and Niko Moon's album Good Time, thanks. David829 (talk) 00:00, 30 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Sure, I'll get on those once I work through the tangled mess I made on the 24th. Ten Pound Hammer(What did I screw up now?) 01:41, 1 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]


Hi, I disagree with redirecting tv episode articles that have two or more reliable sources such as reviews as they are barely or close to notable. Could you instead prod or afd those for more discussion. Also IGN is a reliable source as is the AV club, regards Atlantic306 (talk) 01:39, 1 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

For every article I found where an IGN review was cited, said review was 404. Ten Pound Hammer(What did I screw up now?) 01:40, 1 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
They're easily fixed if you use the internet archive or archive is or mark as dead link in brackets. The average lifespan of an internet link is only 100 days so links are always being fixed by bots or editors, regards Atlantic306 (talk) 01:44, 1 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I still feel that per WP:NEPISODE, a review or two isn't enough for an episode's notability absent any other sources. Ten Pound Hammer(What did I screw up now?) 01:45, 1 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
There are a number of editors who disagree with that and feel that WP:GNG overrules a local consensus.Atlantic306 (talk) 01:50, 1 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I was just commenting on the volume, not the activity itself. Ten Pound Hammer is responsible for ridding the project of a lot of very, very marginal articles. Liz Read! Talk! 02:54, 1 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Most of the people saying "keep" are legitimately providing sources (shout-out to @Cunard: here). No one seems to have had a serious issue with my AFDs in the past week-plus except @Dream Focus: and whoever tried to speedy-close those Food Network AFDs. But as I said, I ultimately don't think Dream Focus is acting in bad faith and am willing to make peace. Ten Pound Hammer(What did I screw up now?) 02:57, 1 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
ETA: Shoutout to @NemesisAT for adding sources to some of the de-prodded articles, too. Ten Pound Hammer(What did I screw up now?) 03:04, 1 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Proposed deletion of Michael Carter (musician)


The article Michael Carter (musician) has been proposed for deletion because of the following concern:

Passing mentions of the subject and cannot find additional sources

While all constructive contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, pages may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the ((proposed deletion/dated)) notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page.

Please consider improving the page to address the issues raised. Removing ((proposed deletion/dated)) will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. In particular, the speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. Walter Görlitz (talk) 03:46, 1 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]