The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. \ Backslash Forwardslash / (talk) 06:14, 12 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

1977 Australian network television schedule (weekday)[edit]

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As per Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/1982_Australian_network_television_schedule_(weekday). Topic is not encyclopedic, unreferenced, and misleading, as it (if it can be verified) reflects only part of 1977 (Autumn/Spring) and only part of Australia (Melb & Syd). The-Pope (talk) 13:55, 27 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Comment As a matter of policy, I don't think that its unencyclopedic, or that articles of this nature are barred. I think there's an exception in WP:NOTDIR, section 4, "Directories, directory entries, electronic program guide, or a resource for conducting business. For example, an article on a radio station should not list upcoming events, current promotions, current schedules, et cetera, although mention of major events, promotions or historically significant programme lists and schedules (such as the annual United States network television schedules) may be acceptable." Still, this seems to have more problems than the 1982 schedule that got booed off the stage in August. As nominator points out, it's not verified; maybe these reruns were seen nationwide and not just in Victoria. I guess it illustrates the dearth of original programming back then, but it doesn't look much different from the daytime listings for what you'd find on a Los Angeles TV schedule back in 1977. Mandsford (talk) 16:41, 27 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Delete: A directory. Joe Chill (talk) 19:34, 27 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Comment I agree with Mandsford. A national TV schedule can be encyclopedic. Perhaps someone could check for references, in the form of Australian TV columnists discussing the scheduling decisions back in the day, or books about the history of TV in that country. There is an explicit niche left for such an article in WP:NOTDIR. This is an international encyclopedia, so the NOTDIR mention of the US schedules does not limit notability to that one country. Edison (talk) 21:45, 27 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Keep The previous decision was an error & totally ourt of line both with our policy and our general practice, and should be clearly repudiated here; then we can work on reconstructing it. It is not a directory--a directory would list each show on each station in full detail, and this is a summary of the major shows on the network. Given that being a network show is in practice enough to make even an individual show notable, I do not see a a table correlating these notable shows is the least indiscriminate. Many such pages have been upheld. There is nothing peculiarly less notable about australian television than elsewhere. The very example given in the NOTDIR specifically , literally , and deliberately permits articles like this. There should be no problem verifying--did no australian newspapers list tv shows in the 70s? DGG ( talk ) 02:44, 28 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This debate has been included in the list of Australia-related deletion discussions. -- Bduke (Discussion) 06:55, 28 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Comment WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS doesn't count. I don't care that the US network schedules are acceptable. Prove that Australia had a national network in the 70s - I remember (WP:OR) that in the 80s, Melbourne TV was different to Perth TV. Verify that columnists reflect on past schedules. Show that it is notable. Show that is accurate for at least most of the year and it wasn't variable during the year. I think it has too many holes and question marks to be suitable for wikipedia. I would assume that the article creator got the list from some source... why didn't he reference it?The-Pope (talk) 13:19, 28 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Keep per DGG. ABC, Seven and Nine were national networks but in Perth and possibly elsewhere Seven had some Ten shows until NEW-10 was created in 1988. That being said, such can be accounted for by notations in the text or table - it's no reason to delete. Perth TV guides can be easily accessed at both the Battye Library in Perth, and numerous state libraries in other cities. Orderinchaos 21:22, 29 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

On doing some literature reading it appears that the TVW-7 and STW-9 stations were only affiliated rather than members of the network. I'm not sure when TVW-7 joined the Seven Network. (In fact, this is still the case for STW-9, unlike any other commercial station in metropolitan Australia.) Orderinchaos 21:42, 29 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Beeblebrox (talk) 20:53, 4 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Delete. Can this even be verified? I see no sources listed. JBsupreme (talk) 06:37, 5 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]
- Yes - by anyone who has access to newspapers of the period. Unfortunately those are not online, but anyone with access to a newspaper archive or a state library in Australia can look at back copies of The Age. If discussion of the content are needed, articles in publications such as the National Times and Australian Women's Weekly can also be accessed. Orderinchaos 07:09, 5 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  - So it can be verified some day, but it presently is not. In which case I am reaffirming my delete, and strongly so. JBsupreme (talk) 08:27, 5 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per WP:NOTDIR and per The-Pope's arguments - I'm certain that there wasn't a single national TV schedule in Australia in 1977 and it's obvious that the same programs weren't shown every week. Nick-D (talk) 06:09, 10 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I would lean towards "keep" if there was evidence that there were coordinated and consistent national schedules in that era for televison in Australia. But evidence suggests otherwise for the commercial stations. As an example, compare the television guides for channels 7,9 & 0 on 17 June 1978 (in winter of the following year) for Melbourne and Brisbane: 17 June 1978 Melbourne 17 June 1978 Brisbane. I would therefore suggest to delete. Melburnian (talk) 05:38, 11 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per NOTDIR, WP:V, and Melburnian above me. It's impossible to have a factual article about a subject if the subject was always in flux. We can only discuss TV schedules if they are static, and even then we need to discuss the historic reception of the schedules, not just list what aired at what time. We can't have articles about subjects which cannot be verified, or elude verification. Them From Space 19:39, 11 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Delete, violates the letter and spirit of WP:NOT#DIR. Abductive (reasoning) 02:54, 12 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.