The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete per failure to meet WP:ATHLETE. There is sufficient consensus here that playing for the club mentioned is not enough to pass minimum notability guidelines. Shereth 18:19, 29 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Abderrazak Lmnasfi[edit]

Hasn't played professional football therefore failing WP:ATHLETE Spiderone (talk) 10:12, 15 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in WikiProject Football's list of association football related deletions. Spiderone (talk) 10:12, 15 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per nom; non-notable footballer who fails WP:ATHLETE. Giant Snowman 10:56, 15 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Keep Plays for a club in the highest football league in Morocco, one of the most respected leagues in Africa. --Ilion2 (talk) 05:06, 17 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
- Comment Says who? He still fails WP:ATHLETE because he hasn't played professional football Spiderone (talk) 08:06, 17 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  - Comment The club he plays for is FAR Rabat, FAR is an acronym for Forces Armées Royales, you can translate this to Royal Armed Forces. You think he will not be payed for being in the Forces Armées Royales? I think he will be payed for this, and he will play for them football. So this is professional level. Any proof for your thesis? --Ilion2 (talk) 16:02, 17 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    - Comment This is the club's website [1] and there is no mention of them being professional. Spiderone (talk) 16:24, 17 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
      - Comment And there is any mention that the club is amateur? When the league is notable and the clubs are notable, you say the players are not notable? Sounds silly to me. --Ilion2 (talk) 17:54, 17 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I worked at a school whose teachers played regular matches against teachers from other schools before retiring to the bar on Friday evenings. I was paid to work at that school, and I represented them at football. Do I therefore get an article as a professional footballer (retired)? Lmnas is, presumably, paid for being in the air force if he is an active member of the armed forces, but can you prove that he is paid primarily for representing them at football. Kevin McE (talk) 09:07, 18 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

If you played at the highest level of your country, try it. If you have reasonable arguments, try it. --Ilion2 (talk) 10:05, 18 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

You can't say that the highest level of Moroccan football is notable. You can argue that Morocco is a great footballing nation but there are probably people who would disagree and say Montserrat is a good nation or something like that. Saying that playing in the top level of Moroccan football makes someone notable is pure opinion. Spiderone (talk) 12:09, 18 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Any evidence that the league is not notable is welcome, your deletion request does not contain anything like this, therefore it is just pure opinion. Do not waste your time telling me things you can not ensure yourself here. According to List of professional sports leagues#Football: Association Football this league is professional. --Ilion2 (talk) 14:54, 18 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

If you can find a sourced indicating that the league is fully professional, we will be happy to add it to the list of leagues that confer player notability (found here. The list you cite is an unsourced list that includes several leagues we know not to be fully professional, so it's not as reliable for determining player notability as the list maintained within the WP:FOOTY project that I've linked to. We haven't determined yet either way the status of the Moroccan league, but if a source can be found either way, we'll happily include it in the list. matt91486 (talk) 16:29, 18 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Well, you will not accept fr:Championnat du Maroc de football as reliable source, but there is the Statut des participants professional. This is another indication for a professional league, and the French Wikipedia should know it best. Perhaps someone of the Wikipedia:WikiProject Football speeks french well enough to check this with reliable sources. --Ilion2 (talk) 19:47, 18 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, (X! · talk) · @119 · 01:51, 22 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Delete Fails WP:Athlete; if Lmnasfi is employed by the armed forces then plainly he is not a fully professional footballer and the league that he plays in is not fully-professional. He also fails the primary notability criterion, almost to the point where he fails to meet WP:V. --Malcolmxl5 (talk) 19:42, 25 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - No Ghits for "FAR Rabat" professsional or "Abderrazak Lmnasfi" professsional, so no indication of being professional. -- King of ♥ ♦ ♣ ♠ 00:47, 29 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.