The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. Rlendog (talk) 19:25, 25 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Dieter Backhaus[edit]

Dieter Backhaus (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log • Stats)

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Contested PROD. Concern was Article about a footballer who fails WP:GNG and who has not played in a fully pro league. PROD was contested on the grounds that he had played in the highest level of German football at the time. This is not quite true. The highest level was the Endrunde (finals) of the German Championship for which VfL Bochum, his club, never qualified. Sir Sputnik (talk) 12:52, 18 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Football-related deletion discussions. Sir Sputnik (talk) 12:54, 18 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Sportspeople-related deletion discussions. Sir Sputnik (talk) 12:54, 18 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in WikiProject Football's list of association football-related deletions. Sir Sputnik (talk) 12:54, 18 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep. WP:FOOTYN states that when considering the notability of amateur era footballers, those who played at "national level of league football" are considered notable. I don't know what this "finals" is that you're referring to, but his club did play in the second division of German football, which was a nationwide league.Basalisk ^{inspect damage}⁄_berate 14:46, 18 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Changing to delete per Sputnik's reasoning below. Basalisk ^{inspect damage}⁄_berate 13:51, 23 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep per Basalisk This player played in the innaugral DFB Pokal (German league cup) which should be enough to pass [WP:GNG]Seasider91 (talk) 15:27, 18 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete Player never played in the national championship finals. The Oberligas were regional leagues mostly filled with obscure clubs, so appearances in this competition should not be considered notable. Also fails WP:GNG. J Mo 101 (talk) 10:30, 19 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete - hasn't played in a pro league and not enough significant coverage, fails WP:GNG and WP:NFOOTBALL. GiantSnowman 21:54, 19 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete - article about a amateur footballer who only played in lower league, and didn't represent his country at senior level, and fails WP:NFOOTBALL. Also fails WP:GNG. Mentoz86 (talk) 11:56, 20 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment. Just a note; since this guy played in the pre-professional era, it's not of much consequence to say he was just an "amateur" or "hasn't played in a pro-league". The club he played for wasn't a top-flight club, but they did play in a national league, and so he passes WP:FOOTYN (see point 4). I know that's just an essay, but it was written by the football wikiproject specifically for difficult cases such as this. Basalisk ^{inspect damage}⁄_berate 12:14, 20 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Prior to the first Bundesliga season in '63 there was no national league covering all of (West) Germany. The Oberligen were a series of Regional leagues which fed the national finals. The winner of which became German Champions for that year. For the Oberliga West covering North-Rhein Westphalia, it was the winner and runner up that qualified for the finals. Bochum never finished higher than fourth. As such, the pre-pro points of WP:FOOTYN don't apply here. Sir Sputnik (talk) 13:16, 20 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Remember - FOOTNY is just an essay, and one that is long obsolete and not fit-for-purpose. I don't think you'll find many members of WP:FOOTBALL who were a) around when it was written and b) in agreement with it. GiantSnowman 13:40, 23 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Fair enough. Well that was just my two cents, I think Sputnik's argument supersedes mine anyway, he clearly has more info than me. In fact I'm going to change to delete Basalisk ^{inspect damage}⁄_berate 13:51, 23 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.