The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. Ritchie333 (talk) (cont) 11:59, 27 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

John Bazz[edit]

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John Bazz (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log · Stats)
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Does not meet WP:GNG independent of The Blasters, I would propose redirecting to that article. Originally converted to a redirect by Onel5969, reverted by the initial editor. I wasn't able to find any more significant coverage on the internet; I searched Rock's Backpages as well and found a fair amount of coverage, all of it about The Blasters. signed, Rosguill talk 00:35, 19 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of People-related deletion discussions. signed, Rosguill talk 00:35, 19 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Bands and musicians-related deletion discussions. signed, Rosguill talk 00:35, 19 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This discussion has been included in the list of California-related deletion discussions. signed, Rosguill talk 00:35, 19 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]
The reason was not the reviewer's retirement. It was the unilateral nature of the redirect without a discussion, as is taking place now. If the reviewer had remained available, I'd have taken it up politely with that person. I note also that the previous decision was based on the subject not having notability outside his main band. I don't really see the validity of that reason, but nonetheless, I sought to address it by showing association with a variety of other notable musicians. Rory1262 (talk) 16:47, 19 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]
I just added another piece regarding Bazz and his association with the notable bluesman Charlie Musselwhite. Again, this goes to show that Bazz's career is not just about the Blasters. He's sought after by others and is recognized in his field as high-caliber. If more such material is wanted, I'll look for it. Rory1262 (talk) 17:58, 19 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Added a line from Marc Ford for further breadth. Rory1262 (talk) 21:16, 20 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]
I have also established a page for Mike Eldred, who (in my view) is also a notable musician in his own right. If that's accepted, then that would make three additional and separate pillars of support for Bazz's notability. Thank you. Rory1262 (talk) 15:16, 21 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]
A problem here is that while there's some fleeting coverage establishing that Bazz has played in Eldred and Ford's bands, I'm not sure it rises to the level of significant coverage of Bazz. It looks like this is the extent of such coverage as related to Eldred, unless I've missed something (I checked the coverage related to Ford last night and came to a similar conclusion, although I don't have the exact source link on me at the moment). We wouldn't create a Wikipedia article for a a session musician for whom we can only find brief mentions of playing in a half dozen notable bands, and this is almost the same scenario. signed, Rosguill talk 16:52, 21 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Please let me see what else I can find, then. Sidemen do tend not to be the focus of articles, to be sure, but I wouldn't view Bazz as some faceless session guy. And I'll note again, the last line of the piece here, which summarizes a source that devoted a nice bit to Bazz. Rory1262 (talk) 17:30, 21 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Quote from notable peer bass player John Doe added. Rory1262 (talk) 18:04, 21 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]
And another piece of the mosaic from Mike Eldred. A clear and broad-based picture has emerged, in my view. Rory1262 (talk) 20:05, 21 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]
A core issue here is that notability is not a measure of importance, it's a measure of whether there is enough information written in reliable, independent sources such that we can write a full-fledged article without resorting to original research. Quotes from his friends and bandmates may be useful for music scholars conducting research, but I don't think it's enough for our purposes. signed, Rosguill talk 20:09, 21 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]
A full-fledged article without original research -- I do believe that's what I've gone to considerable lengths to provide, with support from an array of legitimate (non-blog) sources. If the same standards for which you're arguing here were to be applied elsewhere, I venture to say a whole lot of stubs would need to be deleted from Wikipedia. Rory1262 (talk) 20:47, 21 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

*Weak Keep Sources that are normally necessary to merit a keep are slim, as correctly noted by Rosguill. But Rory1262 (talk) makes a persuasive argument of an example where multiple cases of tangential recognition add up, and has done the legwork to provide evidence. A bit unconventional i-vote from me, but at least worth a "weak" keep. ShelbyMarion (talk) 23:29, 21 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Glad you see it that way. Appreciated. Rory1262 (talk) 23:47, 21 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]
I also find ShelbyMarion's view significant in light of his explicitly stated interest in musicians' qualification for notability. Rory1262 (talk) 12:50, 22 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Another mosaic piece is in place. I found that Bruce Willis handpicked Bazz to be in his band the Accelerators in 2002-03. Rory1262 (talk) 18:35, 24 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Did some reorganization to sharpen focus. Rory1262 (talk) 20:58, 24 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
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