The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. RL0919 (talk) 17:47, 7 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

List of Major League Baseball all-time leaders in home runs by pitchers[edit]

List of Major League Baseball all-time leaders in home runs by pitchers (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log | edits since nomination)

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I have two issues with this article. 1) This seems to be an outdated statistic, as the adoption of the DH by the NL this year will render pitcher batting obsolete, excepting pitchers who bat for themself, like Shohei Ohtani. 2) This does not seem to be an official MLB statistic, thus most of this article is original research sourced from baseball-reference. I am only able to find one RS discussing the most "home runs hit by pitchers", the SABR ref in the article. Natg 19 (talk) 17:01, 31 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

• Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Baseball and Lists. Natg 19 (talk) 17:01, 31 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Keep - Disclosure: I've been editor that took this list from a small list to what it is now. I believe the statistic to be relevant, even with the universal DH implemented, as it still generates interest. Eventually, the "active" section will disappear, but the rest will always be historically relevant. It DOES seem odd that this is a stand-alone home run by position list, so there really needs to be a list for each position for this to be fully relevant. I have a rough draft of the Catchers list, but I do find that constructing it encroaches on original research. Just need to find some lists published by SABR and other verifiable sources. I haven't had the time in years to dedicate to building and editing, so others would have to step up.Neonblak ^talk - 18:01, 31 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

• Do you know of sources that can demonstrate interest in this particular statistic? I do think that there is interest in all time home leaders for other positions, but not for pitchers specifically. Natg 19 (talk) 18:29, 31 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Comment the fact that pitchers will only rarely be batters should have no bearing on whether or not this remains an article - notability is not temporary so if it has been a notable topic it remains one. Whether this list should exist is a different question for which we'd need evidence of RS covering this topic or evidence that it would merit inclusion in a different article but needed to be spun out for reasons of size. I'm confident the latter piece isn't true so it would just be about whether or not this list is notable. Best, Barkeep49 (talk) 18:41, 31 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

• Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Sports-related deletion discussions. CAPTAIN RAJU^(T) 19:03, 31 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• We'll have to wait and see if the sourcing is there, but I want to second Barkeep49's observation that notability is not temporary. LEPRICAVARK (talk) 21:10, 31 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• FWIW, thirding Barkeep49's comments regarding WP:NTEMP and that a rule change does not render the subject's history obsolete. But yes sourcing would be nice. Echoedmyron (talk) 00:04, 1 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete as WP:OR....William, is the complaint department really on the roof? 13:54, 1 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment The relevant guideline is WP:LISTN:

  One accepted reason why a list topic is considered notable is if it has been discussed as a group or set by independent reliable sources, per the above guidelines; notable list topics are appropriate for a stand-alone list. The entirety of the list does not need to be documented in sources for notability, only that the grouping or set in general has been.

  If that can be established, Stathead and the like can easily help fill in the rest of the list and ensure that it is comprehensive.—Bagumba (talk) 18:13, 1 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep Meets WP:LISTN with grouping discussed in the following sources of significant coverage:
  1. "Career Batting Records From Great Hitting Pitchers" (PDF). SABR.
  2. "This is each position's top home run hitter". MLB.
  3. "Which Pitchers Hit the Most Home Runs in MLB History?". Sportscasting.
  4. Seventh Inning Stretch: Baseball’s Most Essential and Inane Debates. pp. 26–27.
  5. "Extra! Extra! Read All About It! Pitcher Hits Triple!". The Hardball Times.
  6. "Pitchers Dig the Long Ball (At Least When They Are Hitting)". Spring 2012 Baseball Research Journal.—Bagumba (talk) 18:57, 1 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

     I've integrated some into the article.—Bagumba (talk) 08:18, 2 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep - meets GNG and NLIST. That the DH has been adopted does not make the history of pitchers hitting non-notable (notability is not temporary in any case) and being an official statistic is not an element of notability. Rlendog (talk) 12:41, 2 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep -- Passes NLIST per the SABR piece and sources cited by Bagumba. Cbl62 (talk) 15:03, 7 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.