The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. Proto::► 00:05, 29 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

List of pre-made characters in The Sims[edit]

List of pre-made characters in The Sims (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)

Wikipedia is not a game walkthrough guide. This is just a list of non-notable characters in an otherwise-notable game. Nothing in the article asserts the notability of even a single character, let alone the hundreds mentioned. Furthermore, the article has been tagged as OR and unsourced for months yet has never been fixed. Tarinth 19:33, 22 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Previous nomination: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of Pre-Made Characters in The Sims

NOTE: Please do not remove the AfD notice on the page. User 148.243.59.4 previously removed the notice without any discussion.

• Delete as nom. Tarinth 11:11, 25 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep obviously notable--Slogankid 21:37, 22 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment The above is a non-argument. I do not question that The Sims is notable (it is obvious based on a large number of reviews, media coverage, and so forth), but a laundry list of characters within it is not. None of these characters have been the focus of any particular media coverage. The content is just fancruft. Furthermore, the article has been tagged as OR and unsourced for months without any corrections.Tarinth 21:53, 22 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

• • Comment This is notable because it gives the background and history of the characters in the game. It is definitely of interest to those who play the game, and it's hardly a "list" - there is a lot of information in there. I've played the game for years, and it's got a lot of background info in there that I didn't know about, although I will definitely agree that citing sources would be most helpful.

• • Comment Can you show how they're notable, then? NeoChaosX (talk, walk) 21:39, 22 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete I could be a jerk and say "obviously non-notable" but instead I'll just go with the nominator's reasons. Nifboy 22:09, 22 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete as indiscriminate collection of information and entirely encyclopedic. Since there is no storyline to play through in The Sims, the pre-made characters are not noteworthy. --TheFarix (Talk) 22:45, 22 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete, per nomination --Mhking 23:18, 22 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep. Notable characters in a notable game. If pages can exist for characters in a TV show, then why not characters in a video game? -- Silent Wind of Doom 01:54, 23 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment, there's nothing that asserts the notability of the characters in the game. Certain characters in a game definitely are notable because they have become known beyond the game itself, have been mentioned in stories or other fiction, etc. If a character from this premade list is notable, then there needs to be a reference to a source indepdent of the publisher of the game that discusses or treats with the character in a non-trivial way; and these sources need to be primarily about the character, not simply a passing reference to their existance in the game. Thus, it isn't that game characters can't be notable (I would agree that many are; HK-47 from KOTOR or Minsc from Baldur's Gate are good examples of game characters that have achieved notability on their own, because they've become widely recognized as strong characters that have influenced game development. But this article is nothing more than a laundry list of names that would be better served in a gaming wiki, where comprehensive game guids are accepted. Tarinth 02:43, 23 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete The game is as notable as can be; the pre-made characters (nor any characters in the series, user-created or developer-created) are not even the least bit notable. Aside: Has anyone ever used a pre-made character? Who doesn't create one that 1) looks just like them, or 2) looks incredibly weird/fat/ugly? -- Kicking222 02:13, 23 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete per WP:NOT#DIR. It would appear this is a list of persons (real or fictional). Navou ^talk 18:34, 24 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete Because the game is notable does not mean that every character in the game is notable. This is essentially a gameguide. Even if notability is eventually established these characters should be merged to the main article per WP:FICT. Do not keep as a seperate article. This would actually be a good transwiki to The Sims2 Wiki --Kunzite 20:38, 24 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete I've played the game for years, but there isn't anything notable about these characters outside of the fandom itself. Non-notable minutia of notable topics doesn't belong here.--Crossmr 07:05, 26 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment Now, why are we even looking at this. This article has been looked over before, and was unanimously kept. Isn't there some kind of Double Jeopardy policy in Wikipedia? And if there isn't, there should be. One can just keep nominating an article until they get enough people along to vote for a deletion, even rallying a group of people they know to do such. I'm not saying this is happening, but I find the nominating of an article twice as being very unfair and unprofessional.

But I digress. Maybe we should link to the other wiki. That place is currently linking here. --Silent Wind of Doom 03:49, 27 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

• • We have a policy on this Wikipedia:Consensus can change. Sorry, no Benton v. Maryland here. It does go both ways... deleted articles can also be recreated at later points too. So, if Make Room for Goopy or Everybody Loves Bella becomes a primtime phenom, the article can be recreated. There's been a push by the higher-ups in Wikipedia toward quality over an earlier call for quantity. The old votes were mainly WP:ILIKEIT style votes. We've also gotten some tougher guidelines since then. In Oct 2005 WP:FICT didn't have very strong teeth and WP:WAF was not around. --Kunzite 05:05, 27 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete It reads like a game guide and is unreferenced. —ShadowHalo 23:02, 27 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.