The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was merge to List of characters in the Soul series. MBisanz ^talk 01:29, 24 October 2008 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Siegfried (Soulcalibur)[edit]

Siegfried (Soulcalibur) (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View log)

While a major protagonist in the series, Siegfried has not been emphasized as a stand-alone character from his Nightmare persona until recent games. As a result, there is little reception for him when not Nightmare, who by comparison as a character has more citable material. Article has additionally not been worked on with a direction of improvement for the subject in quite some time. Proposing to merge what can be salvaged into Nightmare's article and removal of remaining trivial material. Kung Fu Man (talk) 05:36, 20 October 2008 (UTC)Reply[reply]

• Note: This debate has been included in the list of video game related deletions. MuZemike (talk) 05:49, 20 October 2008 (UTC)Reply[reply]
• Keep as nomination is actually a proposal to merge rather than delete, and I'm not at all convinced this character shouldn't be kept anyway, as he's the protagonist of a very notable series, featured in ads and the box art, etc. Andrew Lenahan - Starblind 14:53, 20 October 2008 (UTC)Reply[reply]
• Heartily endorse massive trimming and reorganization of the whole series of character articles (basically a merge !vote). List of characters in the Soul series is a complete and utter mess right now, along with the rest of the character articles. This particular article is filled to the brim with OR in a vain attempt to meet WP:WAF (e.g. a "Creation and conception" containing nothing more than an excessively detailed physical description). The remainder have similar problems and I'd wager the whole lot can be better condensed into one, maybe two articles. Nifboy (talk) 16:37, 20 October 2008 (UTC)Reply[reply]
• Note: This debate has been included in the list of Fictional characters-related deletion discussions. -- • Gene93k (talk) 16:42, 20 October 2008 (UTC)Reply[reply]
• Merge - The article does not establish notability, so it doesn't need to exist. TTN (talk) 18:14, 20 October 2008 (UTC)Reply[reply]
• Merge per common sense. JuJube (talk) 18:54, 20 October 2008 (UTC)Reply[reply]
• Keep or Merge - It's obvious that Siegfried is important, however the current idea of merging with Nightmare is flawed at best. I think it would be better for them to share a page together like Siegfried on one half and Nightmare in the other. Like Nifboy said though, the list of characters needs serious cleanup. DynamoDT (talk) 18:56, 20 October 2008 (UTC)Reply[reply]
  • The problem comes up though how do you describe Nightmare without Siegfried? One character ends up in effect repeating everything the other says to a point, then they diverge. I'm not sure if there's really another thing to compare this to (Venom/Eddie Brock maybe, but even then the new hosts have histories of their own).--Kung Fu Man (talk) 21:18, 20 October 2008 (UTC)Reply[reply]
    • That's why they would be merged together should that path be chosen, since it's an easy place to refer to. They're only together in SC1 and SC2, but in every other Soulcalibur game, they're separate, even Soulcalibur Legends. Having them share a page with different sections shows that they're both the same and different at the same time. I think more people would be happier this way than have one character overshadow the other because it feels like you're just leaving out important necessary information.DynamoDT (talk) 22:35, 20 October 2008 (UTC)Reply[reply]
      • Dynamo, to clarify something, to have a joint article the real-world content would really need to support both. As it stands though it doesn't: it primarily supports Nightmare, and really only with IV does it actually start to focus on Siegfried.--Kung Fu Man (talk) 10:26, 21 October 2008 (UTC)Reply[reply]
        • Actually, Soulcalibur III, IV, and Legends all shift the focus towards Siegfried, and take great pains in establishing the two as separate characters. But irreguardless, you want to redirect all references from Siegfried to Nightmare on the precept of, "once the same, always the same." With great reservation, I vote a merge on this. That Siegfried appeared in the series before Nightmare in the series almost demands that they have separate articles, but there are far too many users here willing to fight that to the bitter end citing "notability".--199.79.10.117 (talk) 12:10, 21 October 2008 (UTC)Reply[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.