The result was Delete ~ trialsanderrors 09:00, 3 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Very superficial article, unencyclopedic, seems to fall under WP:NOT. Deprodded, the prodder suggested "redirect & merge with Teaching English as a Foreign Language", and I agree. The original contributor objected to merging so I don't want to carry it out without community discussion. Accurizer 22:40, 27 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Keep This article is not superficial. It states the essential facts of the topic which are documented by the books mentioned. One of the books is out of print and I have no interest in promoting it. I objected to the merge with "Teaching English as a Foreign Language" because that article is blatant advertising for unnecessary certificate courses. I did not spam that article; I tested and demonstrated its lack of a neutral point of view by linking to a site with a different opinion. The link was removed because it conflicts with that article's primary purpose, which is to sell certificate courses marketed by the sites that article links to. Is it not odd and even suspicious that none of the crticisms I'm making of "Teaching English as a Foreign Language" are being addressed, let alone denied? Is that site not blatant advertising? Are there any links that question the value of certificate courses? The value of my article is that it adds balance to the "quick qualification" certificate business, which is entrenched in other articles on teaching abroad. What a tragedy if my article is deleted while the certificate sellers remain unopposed and unquestioned! omadaf2 Omadaf2 07:08, 28 November 2006 (UTC) 28 Nov 06. Please see my user page for more info. Omadaf2 07:16, 28 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Comment Thanks for your input. I'm new to Wikipedia so I don't know how important technical questions are (in this case, whether a separate article is needed or appropriate), but in my opinion it is secondary to the main issue: Wikipedia is being exploited to sell unnecessary certificate courses by the article "Teaching English as a Foreign Language," and my attempt to contribute more balance by adding a link that expresses a different opinion was quickly deleted and itself called "spam!" The bottom line is that my neutral article is up for deletion, but the certificate sellers' article isn't. If I delete the commerical links from their article I'm sure I'll be accused of "vandalism." Why doesn't an editor delete those links? A separate article is needed because "Teaching English as a Foreign Language" doesn't allow disagreement with their marketing strategy. Omadaf2 09:37, 28 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Comment Please note that this is a conflict between a teacher with long experience who is telling the truth about teaching abroad (me) vs. salespeople who are using Wikipedia to market unnecessary certificate courses, i.e. the writers and editors of "Teaching English as a Foreign Language" (TEFL). Deleting my article or "merging it" with the latter sounds like a prime candidate for an investigation of conflict of interest. My recommendation to delete TEFL for some very good reasons was greeted by a recommendation of "speedy keep" without even addressing the specific violations of Wiki policies. Are the people who want to "merge" or delete my article prepared to show that they aren't in the business of selling certificates? Forgive me if I sound indignant, but where is the concern about what the writers/editors of "Teaching English as a Foreign Language" are doing to Wikipedia? Omadaf2 17:01, 29 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Comment Omadaf2, it is inappropriate to preface each follow-up comment with keep (or for that matter, delete). The closing admin will need to assess consensus and prefacing each of your comments with keep or delete makes it look as if you are voting multiple times. Since you are unfamiliar with the AFD process, this is most likely an innocent mistake. However, please be aware that it would otherwise look as if you were trying to "stuff the ballot box" in a clumsy and obvious manner. I have taken the liberty of changing your subsequent 'keep's to 'Comments' to make it easier for the closing admin to determine the consensus. --Richard 23:43, 29 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Delete I disagree with Omadaf2. The content of this article does not provide sufficient value to warrant keeping. If there really are multiple books on the topic, surely more content could be added to this article. Until such time, I vote for deletion without prejudice against recreating the article with more substantive comment. --Richard 23:43, 29 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Comment I looked at the Teaching of English as a Foreign Language article. It does not seem to have the violations that Omadaf2 is complaining about. Perhaps the violations have been removed? In any event, I did come across the Teaching English as a Foreign Language in Hong Kong article and I think it should be deleted for the same reasons that this article should be deleted. --Richard 23:43, 29 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Comment Reply to Richard: OK, I'm willing to add more content. Could you suggest exactly what kind of content would make this article's continued existence likely? Is there a time limit? Omadaf2 14:33, 30 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Comment The article cites two books to document what the article says. It does not "promote" anything. The information may not be useful to you, but it could save young people hundreds of dollars on unnecessary certificate courses promoted by my critics in their article "Teaching English as a Foreign Language." Here are some quotes from the "Teaching English as a Foreign Language" article.
“The basic qualification” is a “TESL or TEFL certificate” Blatant advertising and meaningless other than expressing “The ones you should buy, see our external links for easy ordering”
“the two most commonly recognized certificates” are the UCLES CELTA and the Trinity CertTESOL Unverifiable and blatant advertising.
“The typical” (unverifiable) U.S. qualification is a TESOL “although many shorter certificates exist” Irrelevant Who cares if shorter certificates exist unless this is a shopping guide?
“Schools willing to take untrained staff typically run short courses” Unverifiable How common are schools that force teachers to pay for training? VERY common only on the sites that sell certificate courses.
“More Information on the TEFL Profession” Links are Blatant advertising If your site steers visitors to buy certificate courses, advertise here. Any links to sites that question the value of short certificate courses will be quickly deleted.
Genuine want ads for teachers in the international press rarely mention certificates as preferred, let alone required, but on the sites that sell such courses the percentage of ads shoots up amazingly. Attempt to contact those "employers" to confirm the ads and you receive no reply. I wonder why. Omadaf2 18:57, 30 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]