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Speedy renaming and merging[edit]

If the category and desired change do not match one of the criteria mentioned in C2, do not list it here. Instead, list it in the main CFD section.

If you are in any doubt as to whether it qualifies, do not list it here.

Use the following format on a new line at the beginning of the list:

* [[:Category:old name]] to [[:Category:new name]] – Reason ~~~~

If the current name should be redirected rather than deleted, use:

* REDIRECT [[:Category:old name]] to [[:Category:new name]] – Reason ~~~~

To note that human action is required, e.g. updating a template that populates the category, use:

* NO BOTS [[:Category:old name]] to [[:Category:new name]] – Reason ~~~~

Remember to tag the category page with: ((subst:cfr-speedy|New name))

A request may be completed if it is more than 48 hours old; that is, if the time stamp shown is earlier than 09:18, 15 June 2024 (UTC). Currently, there are 125 open requests (refresh).

Current requests

Please add new requests at the top of the list, preferably with a link to the parent category (in case of C2C) or relevant article (in case of C2D).

  • Country or ethnicity? Better discuss this at full CfD. Marcocapelle (talk) 07:12, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Opposed requests

  • Oppose all governors nominations above, anachronistic. Marcocapelle (talk) 20:08, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • @Hey man im josh: oppose the above duchesses, countesses and baronesses nominations, the proposed name wrongly suggests that Duchess of Foo was their title, while these categories are in fact about Fooian nationality. Marcocapelle (talk) 20:21, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose Kings of the Romans nominations. "King of the Romans" is a full title, it has nothing to do with Romans. Also, this has been on full discussion before. Marcocapelle (talk) 20:30, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    @Marcocapelle: How is this different from MOS:JOBTITLES? King becomes kings when pluralized in all applications that I'm aware of. What more is a discussion supposed to yield? Hey man im josh (talk) 14:41, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Following up on this in case you missed the ping @Marcocapelle. Is the idea that "Kings of the Romans" is itself a proper title? Hey man im josh (talk) 12:58, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

On hold pending other discussion

Moved to full discussion

Current discussions[edit]

June 17

NEW NOMINATIONS

Category:Athletes by location in Greece

Nominator's rationale: Upmerge; only one category. Omnis Scientia (talk) 08:52, 17 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Plague doctor

Nominator's rationale: Selective merge/major purge. Only two of the pages actually fit in this category; the rest are medical professionals who treated the plague. Mason (talk) 01:48, 17 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]



June 16

Category:Mexican baseball players by populated place

Nominator's rationale: Triple merge to parent categories. Only one category layer Category:Mexican baseball players Omnis Scientia (talk) 23:20, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Cheerleader video games

Nominator's rationale: All other activity-related video game categories follow the format of referring to the name of the activity rather than an individual participant in it. For instance, "Cooking Video Games" rather than "Chef Video Games" and "Association Football Video Games" rather than "Footballer Video Games". The category should therefore follow this naming convention. SummerPocket (talk) 20:49, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Works by year and decade, 500-1000

more categories nominated
Nominator's rationale: delete (or merge if incidentally there is an article in the category). In the period 500-1000 this category tree nearly coincides with Category:Buildings and structures by year of completion and Category:Buildings and structures by decade of completion, it is a redundant category layer that adds unnecessary complexity. Marcocapelle (talk) 19:30, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Mansas of Mali

Nominator's rationale: rename as more accurate, this is not about the modern republic of Mali. Marcocapelle (talk) 19:15, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Terrorist shootings in the 2020s

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: Moot. Nom is moot because cats deleted under G5: Creation by a blocked or banned user in violation of block or ban (non-admin closure) Mason (talk) 00:23, 17 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: We don't need to distinguish that the shooting was terrorist related. And this is really giving off the same vibes Mason (talk) 18:47, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Bombings

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: Moot. Nom is moot because cats deleted under G5: Creation by a blocked or banned user in violation of block or ban (non-admin closure) Mason (talk) 00:22, 17 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: Empty pile of categories by a new editor who's category creation behavior is reminiscent of @Brudelman:. I'm nomiating the cats to just get them all out of the way in one go. Mason (talk) 18:38, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Com Truise

Nominator's rationale: With only subcategories for albums (and their covers, which are only image files) along with a discography page, this is overcategorization per WP:OCEPON. StarcheerspeaksnewslostwarsTalk to me 16:55, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Basshunter instrumentals

Nominator's rationale: This is the only category in Category:Instrumentals dedicated to one artist, and all of the items in the category are redirects. Trivialist (talk) 16:29, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Knights of Boufflers

Nominator's rationale: Dual upmerge. The only person is each of these category doesn't mention this knighthood. Mason (talk) 14:27, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Defunct off-price department stores of the United States

Nominator's rationale: Non-defining category Mason (talk) 13:30, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Expulsions of Jews in 19th-century Europe

@Smasongarrison missing rationale in this and the three other proposals above? You could bundle them with the proposal below, or copypaste your rationale from it? NLeeuw (talk) 13:23, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
You caught me mid bundle, as I had just discovered the CFD, and got distracted. Mason (talk) 13:25, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: Narrow categories made by the same user that are not helpful for navigation. If not merged, they need to be renamed to match category conventions. Notably the category creator participated in the CFD Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/Log/2024_February_7#Category:Expulsions_of_Jews_in_Nazi-controlled_Europe, which ended in delete/merge. They immediately recreated one of the categories and added the page back less than 24 hours after the CFD was processed.[1] Mason (talk) 13:15, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Pining folks from previous cfd @Marcocapelle @Buidhe @Keizers @Pppery @Liz. Mason (talk) 13:38, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Philippine Military Academy Class of 1986

Nominator's rationale: We don't categorize alumn by the year they graduated (with rare exception) Mason (talk) 12:56, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Primary sources on Philippine history in the 16th century

Nominator's rationale: merge. Is a non-defining 3x intersection category, and several of the documents in 16th century aren't actually from the 16th century Mason (talk) 12:54, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Authors of Spanish ethnographic accounts of the Philippines in the 16th century

Nominator's rationale: Multiple merge this Narrow category. If not merged, it should be renamed to Spanish ethnographers of the colonial Philippines or something to that effect Mason (talk) 12:47, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:21st-century Somali-Canadian women engineers

Nominator's rationale: Extremely narrow intersection, made by a user who hasn't really learned how categories work Mason (talk) 04:14, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:African women mathematicians

Nominator's rationale: Is underpopulated at the moment. It could be used as a container category. Mason (talk) 03:45, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:African women in engineering

Nominator's rationale: There's no African engineers category parent category. Delete per EGRS. I'm working on adding each person to the proper parent categories. Mason (talk) 03:44, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]


June 15

X by ethnic or national origin

Nominator's rationale: Per brevity, actual contents, and consistency with almost all of the non-US categories. Follow-up to Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/Log/2024_June_7#Category:American_people_by_ethnic_or_national_origin. –LaundryPizza03 (d) 22:36, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:20th century rump states

Nominator's rationale: Upmerge this isolated category. If not merged, it should be renamed to 20th-century rump states Mason (talk) 21:59, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Merge The target category is not large enough to support any diffusion beyond the remaining categories by historical empire. –LaundryPizza03 (d) 22:44, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:21st century in Malé

Nominator's rationale: merge, redundant category layer, this is the only content in the tree of the target. Marcocapelle (talk) 20:14, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Merge Category:Centuries in Malé can also be deleted, as it will become empty. –LaundryPizza03 (d) 23:49, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Battles of the American Revolutionary War by state

Nominator's rationale: WP:MILMOS#BATTLESIN. Follow-up to Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2024 June 6#Category:Battles of the War of 1812 by state. NLeeuw (talk) 19:42, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
do not merge this is simply another step in the path of destroying useful category information at the US state level. US state boundaries are in no way akin to the boundary problems found in some European countries, which was misused used as a precedent by this editor to destroy the state categorization of the Battles of the War of 1812. State boundaries have not generally changed since their formation, unlike the shifting boundaries of European geographic entities. Hmains (talk) 20:02, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I would respectfully request that you WP:assume good faith, and base your opposition to the proposal on Wikipedia's policies and guidelines, rather than a personal POV of how things supposedly were in the past in North America compared to Europe so that WP:MILMOS#BATTLESIN conveniently does not apply to categories you created. I am simply applying our polices and guidelines, confirmed by consensus established in precedents, and I would urge you to do the same. Have a good day. NLeeuw (talk) 22:01, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
There is nothing about 'the past' involving the boundaries of the federal states of the United States. Unlike Europe of the past, the boundaries of these states are generally the same as when they were created over of last 200+ years. That means a battle that took place in a populated place of state x is still correctly stated as having been a battle in state x. I am not doing things in WP for my own convenience, whatever that may be. I am stating the facts. You have requested deletion of all these categories so I assume that is your intent--this does not involve 'faith' of any kind. Thanks Hmains (talk) 23:07, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oh, and I did not mean to offend in any way if that is what happened. I am just here to edit. Thanks Hmains (talk) 00:07, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Don't worry, no offence taken. I only took issue with the passage ...which was misused used as a precedent by this editor to destroy the state categorization.... This way of saying things implies that I am deliberately doing something wrong, and that what I am doing is harmful. The first bit is conduct that users should avoid: WP:Assume good faith means that we always assume that fellow editors are trying to do the right thing, even if they make mistakes. (And I do make plenty of mistakes, and I'll happily be corrected if you can point out what I should have done instead). The last bit may be your opinion, but it is rather strongly worded; it's better not to use words such as "destruction" when it comes to reorganising category trees in a way you don't like. Hopefully that clears things up?
My intention is to upmerge rather than outright delete these categories. Even though deletion is the result, the contents of the former categories will be preserved in their parent categories, and the logbooks will note which categories were merged into which. E.g. battles in New York state will still be in Category:Military history of New York (state), where readers and editors alike can still find them. This upmerging is based on WP:MILMOS#BATTLESIN, a guideline which has existed since about 2007. If you think there is something wrong with that guideline, you are free to raise the issue at Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style/Military history. Making arguments here at CFD for why this guideline should not apply to the United States, however, is not very helpful.
Besides, practically speaking, the main article List of American Revolutionary War battles already mentions the state in which each battle took place. This is one single page for all you want readers to know about the location of these battles, right? NLeeuw (talk) 10:48, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Counterparts to the protagonist

Nominator's rationale: upmerge, "counterpart" is a subjective characterizstion. Marcocapelle (talk) 18:20, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Manual merge Mixture of several distinct concepts, some of which are covered by other subcategories of the target. –LaundryPizza03 (d) 22:43, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Antagonists by role

Nominator's rationale: Unclear why "by role" is in the name. Walsh90210 (talk) 17:31, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:United Hospitals

Nominator's rationale: These categories appear to be equivalent and "Medical schools in London" describes the contents of the categories more clearly. I have not nominated the Category:United Hospitals sports clubs subcategory as that may be the common name. TSventon (talk) 15:19, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I agree that a redirect makes sense. TSventon (talk) 11:47, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Hotel Transylvania television series

Nominator's rationale: Contains only one article. Definitely a case of WP:OVERCAT. (Oinkers42) (talk) 14:57, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:People with substance use disorder

Nominator's rationale: This category will never meet WP:BLPCAT or WP:CATDEFINE/WP:COPDEF. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 13:03, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Hinglaj Mata

Nominator's rationale: merge, the category only contains a single image. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:56, 5 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Merge The Hinglaj Mata Temple doesn't have any scope for a topic category. –LaundryPizza03 (d) 06:33, 5 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Keep Added relevant article pages to the category-the main temple and another a fort. Krayon95 (talk) 06:49, 5 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Why is Hinglajgarh related to Hinglaj Mata Temple? –LaundryPizza03 (d) 09:09, 5 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
From the article itself, the fort is either named or developed after a temple of the said goddess. Krayon95 (talk) 19:13, 5 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Qwerfjkltalk 12:19, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Lists of foods by nationality

Nominator's rationale: Food does not have a nationality; only human beings do. Aldij (talk) 11:43, 6 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Meanwhile better targets have been proposed below, so this is outdated. Marcocapelle (talk) 14:54, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
but the category's parent is Category:Cuisine by country, and it looks like Category:Cuisine by ethnicity doesn't have any countries in it. --Funandtrvl (talk) 22:55, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Hmm yeah. I'm still missing the "cuisine" part though. Lists of foods/dishes by cuisine by country? Idk. NLeeuw (talk) 15:43, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Cuisine-related lists by country? --DB1729talk 13:31, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • We do not need food or dishes at all, so Cuisine-related lists by country is the better option. Marcocapelle (talk) 17:59, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, Cuisine-related lists by country sounds like a good choice, since it represents what's in the category. --Funandtrvl (talk) 00:09, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Won't we need Category:Cuisine-related lists, also? --Funandtrvl (talk) 00:16, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Interesting question. I'd say, as Category:Cuisine-related lists does not exist yet, we might as well rename Category:Lists of foods by nationality to Category:Cuisine-related lists. We do not really need "by country" or "by nationality" at this point. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:43, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Yes, it is indeed better! I updated proposal. --Aldij (talk) 11:35, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Qwerfjkltalk 12:17, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I'd put the renamed category as a child category of Category:Cuisine, instead of under Category:Cuisine by country. --Funandtrvl (talk) 03:32, 17 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Women who experienced pregnancy loss

Nominator's rationale: Delete; the idea for this category clearly came from a good faith place but I don't see how helpful it is. Losing a pregnancy is a lot more common than people think, and the further back you go in history the more common it was. Its not a defining characteristic of any of these women even though it was likely a defining moment (or moments) in their lives. Omnis Scientia (talk) 20:07, 6 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Support per nom. and agree with the assessment that its creation was in good faith. There might be a handful, like Catherine of Aragon, where you could make a case that it was defining, but it's a stretch. (And if anything henry the 8th's experience with pregnancy loss would probably be more defining...) Mason (talk) 21:22, 6 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Please see previous discussion, as Marcocapelle linked above.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Qwerfjkltalk 12:15, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Comment. I've read through the arguments in the previous discussion and what else has been written here. Fundamentally, something is defining if it's often (or could reasonably be) mentioned in the lead. For 99% of these pages, its not defining. I still think that the category should be deleted as it isn't defining. For the very few who it could be defining, they can be added to a list. At the very very very least, this category needs to be purged. Mason (talk) 22:04, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
OK, thanks for that clarification. Note to closer: Mason already !voted Support per nom above, so the word deleted in this comment shouldn't be counted. NLeeuw (talk) 13:16, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:18th-century Wallachian poets

Nominator's rationale: 3x merge there are at most 6 people in this poet tree, without a real need to diffuse by century. I made a potential merge target category because Category:Wallachian poets didn't exist as a category.Mason (talk) 21:16, 6 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • It is significantly less of a chore to create small intersectional and valid categories than huge category trees, which can be created at any ulterior time for reuniting the smaller categories and any articles that remain loose. I would rather create "18th-century Wallachian poets" instead of "Wallachian poets" (or rather "Category:Poets from the Principality of Wallachia" -- the two nomenclatures currently compete), if the latter option has me tagging all the articles on Wallachian poets, then sorting them by retagging the same articles with the respective narrower category! It reduces my workload and it is sheer common sense. Note how, in the "military personnel" tree, you had them all fitted nicely for you to just unify the categories; but of course you didn't realize that a lot of articles on Wallachian soldiers from other centuries (say: the 15th) are now not in the category you created, and of course you didn't go searching for such examples to include in the larger category you created (you also didn't realize that the category level you created should now include other trans-chronological articles, such as Category:Spatharii of Wallachia, all of whom were a sort of military personnel). You see: that would be the sort of work required for the part of the category tree that I hadn't bothered created, and the sort of workload you're now externalizing for others. (My contributions focus mainly on content creation, with all the intricate research this requires. I find category creation necessary, but boring -- implying that I should spend my time here on creating potentially immense categories, or hunting down articles to fill out the immense categories that others create, is a bit presumptuous. Just like other requests of that nature, for instance that I should fill out more redlinks to demonstrate to my colleagues here that a category is sufficiently valid -- that "18th-century Wallachian poets" is at least as valid a category as "Aqua members".) Dahn (talk) 02:25, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Also: Category:Moldavian and Wallachian poets is rather pointless. I had created Category:Moldavian and Wallachian chroniclers back when we didn't have a category tree for both former countries, and to address the fact that chroniclers, a sort of occupation that is entirely in the past (for a genre that ended in the early 19th-century), had a trans-border shared tradition of history-writing (and a limited number of articles to fit in there). While this shared tradition can also be argued for poets: if we already have poets in the Wallachian category, what is the exact point of creating a category (other than the already existing larger Romanian one) for "Wallachian and Moldavian poets"? Dahn (talk) 02:31, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    I modeled the parent of Category:Moldavian and Wallachian chroniclers, because this is not my area of expertise. I'm fine with an alternative target, and would have much preferred that a parent category existed instead of having to make an educated guess. Mason (talk) 22:12, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • And I have to say I do not understand the logic whereby we "only" have a category for "foo fooians" if it is demonstrated that there are "enough" (a never-defined "enough") articles to populate it. Sure it would be absurd to have a category for just two articles (though, again, three is apparently enough in other cases). But a category exists not just to neatly group the articles in a shelf; it exists to facilitate navigation, to quickly allow our readers, through this unique instrument offered by our platform, to see all the connections between a set of articles. The evidently absurd example you provide with Category:20th-century Aqua (band) members (I do understand the rhetorical point, but still) shows that you simply do not regard this as an important feature, that you do not conceive of any practical situation in which a reader may need a quick navigational tool for seeing what and how many were the Wallachian poets in the 18th century (including all the utterly mediocre ones that would not be mentioned in a properly developed Literature of Romania), and that you do not see it fit to ask why me as an editor would conceive of a tool to assist such a reader. I find that a bit arresting. Dahn (talk) 02:56, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    @DahnPlease just make all the proper parent categories. It's not an unreasonable ask. Mason (talk) 22:07, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Why is it not helpful? Please elaborate on that point. Dahn (talk) 06:34, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • E.g. from Mihai Iștvanovici there is only one other similar article that you can directly go to, which is not very informative. By merging you can directly go to 5 other similar articles. Marcocapelle (talk) 18:20, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
44 subcategories to Category:18th-century poets by nationality, yet just one gets singled out. Interesting. Also note that of those 44, fully 10 have less than 4 articles included. Biruitorul Talk 07:40, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Merge target? (see Marcocapelle's alt proposal)
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Qwerfjkltalk 12:06, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Malayan law by year

Nominator's rationale: merge, redundant category layer, Category:Malayan law is otherwise empty. Marcocapelle (talk) 08:58, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:History of Malaysia since Independence

Nominator's rationale: rename per parent Category:Contemporary history by country that I just added. Else at least change "Independence" to "independence". Marcocapelle (talk) 08:25, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Spelling change - what might seem contemporary in some contexts may not be understood clearly as to the specific starting point is actually contemporary or not JarrahTree 08:38, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:History of Malaya

Nominator's rationale: merge, the category seems to be about the Federation of Malaya. Marcocapelle (talk) 08:15, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • The federation no longer exists, a separate history category does not seem to add a lot. If not merged then at least rename to Category:History of the Federation of Malaya. Marcocapelle (talk) 08:49, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:History of Malaysia by Federal Territory

Nominator's rationale: delete, redundant category layer with only one subcategory. Merging is not needed, the subcategory is already in Category:Histories of cities in Malaysia. Marcocapelle (talk) 07:26, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Cultural policy of East Germany

Nominator's rationale: delete, overall poorly fitting content. One article is about a festival, the other article is about general duties of citizens. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:01, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:18th-century German Jewish theologians

Nominator's rationale: Isolated category Mason (talk) 04:03, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Ambassadors of Australia to Kosovo

Nominator's rationale: This category is for people articles, not list articles. LibStar (talk) 02:12, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Film posters by country

Nominator's rationale: The current category names are ambiguous as to whether they're, for example, posters of Swedish films or film posters from Sweden. I'd recommend renaming to "Film posters of Sweden" like the Commons categories. hinnk (talk) 21:56, 29 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Question I hate to be pedantic, but do you mean:
  • Film posters made in Sweden?
  • Film posters hung in Sweden?
  • Posters of films made in Sweden?
  • Posters of films made by Swedish crew members or crew members from Sweden?
  • Film posters that show "Sweden" (e.g. its landscapes or symbols associated with Sweden)?
  • Film posters made or owned by the government of Sweden?
  • Poster of films made by the government of Sweden?
  • Etc.
All of these are more or less reasonable interpretations of Film posters of Sweden. I'm glad you're trying to clarify the catnames, but I don't see it getting much clearer. NLeeuw (talk) 22:11, 29 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Both en:Category:Film posters by language and commons:Category:Film posters by country already better manage this ambiguity, so it does seem like it can be clearer than it is. Even a decision not to rename but develop a consensus on what the subcategories mean and add that to Category:Film posters by language would make it clearer. I don't think being pedantic is helpful here. hinnk (talk) 22:37, 29 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Hmmmm ok. Weak support. It's better than the current situation. NLeeuw (talk) 18:11, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Qwerfjkltalk 17:46, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, HouseBlaster (talk · he/they) 00:54, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:British women Marxists

Nominator's rationale: Do we really need to diffuse this category by nationality? Frankly, I have my doubts that the intersection of gender and Marxism is defining. Mason (talk) 00:41, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Merge per nom. Omnis Scientia (talk) 15:04, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Sibling cats suggest:
More than enough to populate this category. I might add that a lot of subcategories in this tree do not feature a single woman. Women are underrepresented as part of biographies on British Marxists, and I don't think upmerging this category is going to help address that gender gap at all. NLeeuw (talk) 18:41, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Thoughts on populating?
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, HouseBlaster (talk · he/they) 00:54, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Doki Doki Literature Club! characters

Nominator's rationale: Redundant to Category:Doki Doki Literature Club! since that category only includes these characters and the game itself. The characters are all still in that category, so there is nothing to merge here. QuicoleJR (talk) 14:16, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete as creator. Admittedly entirely forgot about the parent category when creating the category, so I agree with the redundancy issue. Though I agree, I still would have appreciated it if we could have finished discussing this before nominating it for deletion. Has one ever considered Magneton? Pokelego999 (talk) 14:20, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry, I guess I probably should have gone a bit slower. QuicoleJR (talk) 14:28, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It's fine, especially since this category is getting deleted either way. Apologies if I was a bit accusatory by accident there. Has one ever considered Magneton? Pokelego999 (talk) 14:31, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Speedy delete per it being a mistaken creation according to category creator. - Cukie Gherkin (talk) 14:22, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: I will tag Category:Doki Doki Literature Club!.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, HouseBlaster (talk · he/they) 00:49, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Populated places in Kirundo Province

Nominator's rationale: Only 2 pages at present, so not useful for navigation. – Fayenatic London 13:10, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Considering the current number of articles in the category I am withdrawing my support. Marcocapelle (talk) 04:25, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Thanks. ♦ Dr. Blofeld 06:29, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Communes are administrative units if I understand correctly, not populated places. Marcocapelle (talk) 03:35, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    • Exactly. I have reverted those additions, because the Communes of Burundi are not "populated places" which means cities/towns/villages. – Fayenatic London 10:23, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
      According to the wikipedia articles, each of the seven communes in Kirundo Province has a capital with the same name. The capital of the Commune of Bugabira is Bugabira. The capital of the Commune of Busoni is Busoni, and so on. Kirundo Province had a population of 628,256 as of the 2008 census. The 2018 population was estimated as 927,761, or about 130,000 per commune. Our coverage of this region is atrocious. Let's not make it even harder for editors to improve it.
      This source describes Bugabira as a small town with colonial-era architecture. Bugabira commune is divided into the collines of Kiri, Kiyonza, Gaturanda, Rubuga, Kigina, Nyakarama, Nyamabuye, Nyabikenke, Rugasa, Gitwe and Kigoma.[2] Google maps shows Gaturanda as a region south of an arm of Lake Cyohoha South with labelled villages named Gaturanda, Rugondo and Rubuga. Gaturanda village looks substantial.[3] In 2012 the Global Water Partnership Eastern Africa gathered data related to drought in Rubuga, Kigina, and Gaturanda in Bugabira commune.[4] In August 2014 six houses were burned in Bugabira commune, including five in Gaturanda and one in Kigoma.[5] In April 2016 Gaston Sindimwo, President of Burundi, visited Gaturanda, which lies on the border with Rwanda, to ask the people not to stir up problems over refugees.[6] In 2023 Bugabira municipality issued a call for tenders for extension of the Gaturanda health center.[7].
      Clearly these is enough information online to piece together sketches of the many populated places in Kirundo Province. The category structure should be ready for them. Aymatth2 (talk) 13:43, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
      • The category structure should be made ready after there are enough articles, not before. Marcocapelle (talk) 16:07, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • @Marcocapelle: How many populated places are enough to justify the category for the province? Would it matter if they were all in the same commune? Aymatth2 (talk) 22:43, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • @Fayenatic london: You may want to chime in on this. An accepted number could save a lot of time on debates over lightly-populated categories. Aymatth2 (talk) 01:13, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    • @Aymatth2: "Five" is often mentioned at CFD as some editors' opinion of a sensible minimum. Personally, I would create a category for four. In a case like this, where additional stubs could easily be created, I would not bother nominating a category that had three members – but I would still not encourage you to create it for less than four. – Fayenatic London 08:00, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I have often included Commune and town in the same article for African countries. Makes sense for places in the developing world where there may not be an abundance of sources. Though I don't think we should really have the commune and town in the same article for places which cover an area of 235 square kilometres like Bugabira. Either way, it would be silly to delete a category simply because the region is underdeveloped. ♦ Dr. Blofeld 14:07, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Seven articles as of relisting.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, HouseBlaster (talk · he/they) 00:48, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Rock, Rock, Rock!

Nominator's rationale: Not a lot of opportunity for growth here. The two songs articles can be merged to Category:Songs written for films. StarcheerspeaksnewslostwarsTalk to me 21:50, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Sure.
I would suggest to take out “I’m Not a Juvenile Delinquent” and “You Can’t Catch Me,” then just leave that category as it is. However, I guess deletion might be a solution for Wikipedia I guess. So fair enough. Inajd Inajd0101 (talk) 21:58, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
On a second thought, I oppose this deletion because WP:SMALLCAT is not approved and these songs were written for the movie. Therefore, leave it as it is. Inajd Inajd0101 (talk) 08:16, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
In other words, keep. Inajd Inajd0101 (talk) 18:26, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, HouseBlaster (talk · he/they) 00:44, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Tracker musicians

Nominator's rationale: Tracker software is commonly used to create chiptunes, such that there is a very significant overlap between the two categories. Given the mostly overlapping and duplicative nature of the categories, a merge seems warranted. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ () 22:13, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose Yes, there is some overlap, but a tracker does not imply chiptune, and not all chiptunes made with a tracker. Also, "tracker" is strictly a type of music software, while "chiptune" is also considered a genre of music. If it makes sense to merge them into a single Category:Chiptune and tracker musicians, I'd be fine with that. Or maybe by platform, e.g. Nintendo musicians, Amiga musicians, etc. --Vossanova o< 01:07, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    That is preferable to the status quo, so I am fine with that too if people disagree there is an overlap. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ () 11:04, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, HouseBlaster (talk · he/they) 00:44, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]


June 14

Category:Jesuit musicians

Nominator's rationale: Non defining intersection between occupation and religion Mason (talk) 23:52, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Women's Premier League (cricket) franchise owners

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: withdrawn (non-admin closure) Marcocapelle (talk) 04:27, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: Parent categories use the word team, not franchise: Category:Women's Premier League (cricket) teams, Category:Women's cricket teams in India, Category:Cricket teams in India, Category:Women's cricket teams Gjs238 (talk) 12:48, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Withdraw proposal as per Vestrian24Bio. Gjs238 (talk) 19:33, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Cricket organizations

Nominator's rationale: Serves no purpose, as the only contents are a subcat that is in the same parent cat as the category being discussed. Gjs238 (talk) 12:39, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Military operations of the War of 1812

Nominator's rationale: 2 C, 0 P. WP:NARROWCAT. Both children are already in parent trees, or not all items in them involved Canada or the UK. NLeeuw (talk) 09:52, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:War of 1812 on the National Register of Historic Places

Nominator's rationale: 1 P. Just delete, it is already in the trees of its parents. NLeeuw (talk) 09:48, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Washington, D.C., in the War of 1812

Nominator's rationale: 1 P, which is already in the trees of the other parents. NLeeuw (talk) 09:47, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Holidays related to the War of 1812

Nominator's rationale: 1 P, which is already in other parent. NLeeuw (talk) 09:43, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Presidents General of the General Society of the War of 1812

Nominator's rationale: 1 P. Target might not be viable either? NLeeuw (talk) 09:41, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Battles of the War of 1812 in Canada

Nominator's rationale: WP:MILMOS#BATTLESIN. Follow-up to Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2024 June 6#Category:Battles of the War of 1812 by state. See also recent precedents, e.g. Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2024 May 24#Battles by location in Germany. NLeeuw (talk) 09:28, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Rashidun governors of Ta'if

Nominator's rationale: merge/delete for now, currently only 1-2 articles in each category, this is not helpful for navigation. No objection to recreate the category when some more articles are available. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:26, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Bengali–Assamese script

Nominator's rationale: There is a single Bengali–Assamese script shared between the two languages, even though they use different alphabets. –LaundryPizza03 (d) 00:11, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Wrong, there are multiple scripts for both languages (note the plural "scripts"), and the Bengali–Assamese script is one of these scripts used and shared by both languages (with minor differences), but there are other scripts (like Naoriya Phulo script). Look at the category content, they clearly cannot be merged as their listed scripts are not the same. They are not all the same single script. Only the Bengali-Assamese script (just named "Bengali script" in Unicode and also named "Eastern Nagari") is unified; the other scripts are distinct. As well within the "Bengali alphabet" and "Assamese alphabet" (which are relevant parts of the shared script specific to each language) are not the same (just like there are multiple Latin-base alphabets). verdy_p (talk) 02:21, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]


June 13

Category:Military regiments raised in Nova Scotia

Nominator's rationale: Overlapping category, no parent category:Military regiments exists. Mason (talk) 23:08, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Mexican engineer stubs

Nominator's rationale: Underpopulated stub category with no evidence of approval by Category:WikiProject Stub sorting. As always, stub categories are not free for just anybody to create on a whim, and require a minimum of 60 articles for entry -- but even after deep-scanning the Category:Mexican people stubs parent for any missed engineers, this still only has 17 articles in it.
The stub template is fine, since it can always just sort articles into the target categories, but there would have to be at least 43 more articles before a dedicated category was warranted. Bearcat (talk) 19:54, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Muwahhidism

  • Propose deleting
Nominator's rationale: I propose the deletion of these categories because they make no sense. Muwahiddism isn't a separate branch (like Sunni, Shia, Ibadi, Ahmadi, Quranism), it's not a fiqh school (like Hanafi/Shafii/Maliki/Hanbali divide among Sunnis), it's not an aqeeda school (like Athari/Maturidi/Ashari divide among Sunnis or Usuli/Akhbari divide among Twelver Shia) or anything.

Anyone who considers himself a Muslim (no matter what school he follows) considers himself a muwahhid (موحِّد) which means "a monotheist" in Arabic, literally a follower of tawhid (توحيد), monotheism, the central concept of Islam. It's just a term which is more often used as a self-description by Sunni Salafis to highlight their purism in contrast to anyone else (for example, Sufis have a practice of visiting graves of their sheikhs, Salafis see this act as a departure from the concept of tawhid in Islam. Although Sufis don't consider it as a violation of tawhid, they still see themselves as muwahhideen (monotheists). But anyone who claims to follow Islam, he by definition considers himself a muwahhid regardless). That's it. It's not a separate branch of Islam. It's just a "label" or a "trademark", so to speak. These categories are excessive and absolutely uncalled for. Sorry for bad formatting, by the way (I'm editing off my phone). Fixmaster (talk) 19:24, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Socialist film directors

Nominator's rationale: delete, intersection of unrelated characteristics. A few of these articles may be moved to a Category:Victims of McCarthyism, but that would be a very different discussion. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:42, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Support per nom Mason (talk) 23:09, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Australian flour millers and merchants

Nominator's rationale: Dual merge. There's no parent category, and for the most part merchants aren't defined by whether they sold flour or not. Mason (talk) 03:14, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Keep In Australia millers commonly purchase the grain, mill it, and sell the flour, adding value. So they're millers by trade, not merchants. Doug butler (talk) 03:50, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Australian commercial artists

Nominator's rationale: Non-defining type of artist. Notably there is not a parent category of commercial artists as far as I can find. Mason (talk) 02:56, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Keep Commercial artists create their art for mass duplication: advertising, souvenirs etc. Not like portraitists etc. Doug butler (talk) 03:54, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Australian bigamists

Nominator's rationale: There's no need to diffuse this category by nationality. Mason (talk) 02:54, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Australian event managers

Nominator's rationale: I'm on the fence about speedying this category, however, I'm not 100% sure that I've correctly mapped this category to the right parent of event planning. Mason (talk) 02:50, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Australian metal workers

Nominator's rationale: There are three ways this category can be handled. Either rename this to match the parent category of Metalworkers, merge to Australian metalsmiths‎ or rename to reflect that the intent of this category Metal manufacturing companies of Australia‎. Mason (talk) 02:48, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Artesian people

Nominator's rationale: Non-defining for the only person in the category Maximilien Robespierre Mason (talk) 02:40, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Just for info, they are people from Artois (but I am not certain if Artesian is correct English). Marcocapelle (talk) 17:18, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Violence in the Palestinian territories

Nominator's rationale: merge, all four articles in the category are about events after the establishment of the State of Palestine. Marcocapelle (talk) 20:02, 5 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Merge per nom.
NLeeuw (talk) 06:36, 6 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Possibly. Which articles are you thinking of in particular? Marcocapelle (talk) 06:35, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    No special case at the moment, but there should be cases of violence ocurring in the Palestinian territories before the state establishment? --Mhhossein talk 06:47, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    That's a good point. The State of Palestine didn't exist until 1988, while Palestinian territories have existed since 1967 (or 1949), depending on definition.VR (Please ping on reply) 09:25, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, HouseBlaster (talk · he/they) 01:49, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Romans from Africa

Nominator's rationale: rename, many of these people were not Romans. Aligning this with e.g. Category:Roman-era people by ethnicity. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:14, 5 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Some more explicit support/opposition to various potential names for the categories would be appreciated :)
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, HouseBlaster (talk · he/they) 01:42, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Australian newspaper proprietors

Nominator's rationale: Duplicate category. Mason (talk) 01:26, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Keep Three functions: Owner, publisher and editor. Often separated, for instance politicians may be newspaper owners but not publisher or editor. Influence without responsibility. Pastoralists may inherit a loss-making paper and subsidise its continued operation. Doug butler (talk) 01:59, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
There are no other categories in this tree that make that distinction. Further, I'm pretty sure that there's a cfd that closed on similar newpaper owners, if I'm recalling. Mason (talk) 02:43, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Australian leather merchants

Nominator's rationale: Do we really need to diffuse merchants by whether they sell leather? Mason (talk) 01:24, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Keep Like steel merchants, corn merchants, ship merchants, drapers and stockbrokers, it's a specialized trade. Doug butler (talk) 02:13, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Merge to both the proposed target and appropriate subcategories of Category:Leather manufacturers or Category:Tanners. An odd category without a nonexistent main article and no others like it. –LaundryPizza03 (d) 02:15, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Doug butler Please make sure to have non-Australian parent categories, when you create similar categories. Mason (talk) 02:43, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I try. Doug butler (talk) 04:03, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]


June 12

Category:Live at the Fillmore East albums

Nominator's rationale: C2C — see subcategories in Category:Live albums by venue in the United States for similar examples. Trivialist (talk) 22:05, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Croat Roman Catholic clergy from Bosnia and Herzegovina

Nominator's rationale: Ethnicization of entire tree of Category:Catholic clergy of Bosnia and Herzegovina. It's a one editor's attempt to squeeze ethnic labels onto categories regarding one of the religious communities of the country. It should be checked if this issue was already dealt with once before. Note that other two communities (Orthodox and Islamic) are categorized only with their respective denomination labels not with their eventual ethnicities. ౪ Santa ౪99° 16:31, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Croat Christian clergy from Bosnia and Herzegovina

Nominator's rationale: Ethnicization of entire tree of Category:Catholic clergy of Bosnia and Herzegovina. It's a one editor's attempt to squeeze ethnic labels onto categories regarding one of the religious communities of the country. It should be checked if this issue was already dealt with once before. Note that other two communities (Orthodox and Islamic) are categorized only with their respective denomination labels not with their eventual ethnicities. ౪ Santa ౪99° 16:31, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Croat Greek Catholic clergy from Bosnia and Herzegovina

Nominator's rationale: Ethnicization of entire tree of Category:Catholic clergy of Bosnia and Herzegovina. It's a one editor's attempt to squeeze ethnic labels onto categories regarding one of the religious communities of the country. It should be checked if this issue was already delt with once before. Note that other two communities (Orthodox and Islamic) are categorized only with their respective denomination labels not with their eventual ethnicities. ౪ Santa ౪99° 16:29, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Legendary creatures

Nominator's rationale: merge or reverse merge, largely overlapping categories. I will tag both categories. Marcocapelle (talk) 12:10, 2 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Merge per nom. Omnis Scientia (talk) 10:32, 3 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • At the moment "legendary" sits above, but the hierarchy could just as well be reversed because there isn't a clear distinction. The fact that the above two editors disagree on what Legendary means illustrates the confusion. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:30, 3 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    While I'm not necessarily opposed to merging related folklore/legend/mythology categories together, I don't know which goes where. AHI-3000 (talk) 01:36, 5 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: I assume a redirect would be needed after merging.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Qwerfjkltalk 16:02, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

A redirect certainly seems helpful, especially if we agree a merger is a good idea, but are in doubt about the best target. One way or the other, readers and editors will thus find their way. NLeeuw (talk) 17:23, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Painters of the Holy Land pre-1948

Nominator's rationale: I'm not really sure what to do with this category name, because it isn't particularly helpful/descriptive. Is this painters from after 1948 who painted the "holy land" or is it painters of what the "holy land" looked like after 1948. Mason (talk) 13:12, 25 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Thoughts on deletion/merging?
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, HouseBlaster (talk · he/him) 15:24, 2 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I see only one of the 5 described as "Orientalist" (and Marcocapelle just categorised then as such). James Tissot is indeed a name I recognise as painting events from the Hebrew Bible, though not necessarily "the Holy Land". E.g. File:Tissot The Women of Midian Led Captive by the Hebrews.jpg supposedly took place in southern Transjordan in what is now Saudi Arabia.
Moreover, a lot of them were apparently Jewish, while "Holy Land" is a Christian term. It's really difficult to shape a category around such a vague concept with the people currently and proposed to be in there.
I should add that "Holy Land" can be an appropriate term if the subject in question is entirely Christian, for, by and about Christians, e.g. Recovery of the Holy Land. No other phrase will describe that late medieval Christian literary genre that aptly. But for these painters...? I'm not convinced. NLeeuw (talk) 21:20, 2 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It's highly unclear where the events of Numbers 31 took place (if anwhere), but it seems more likely to be in modern Israel or Jordan than Saudi. In any case, Tissot spent time in Palestine to get his settings right, without I think getting as far as modern Saudi. I don't think that a century ago "Holy Land" was exclusively a Christian term - it would be rather ironic if it was. Johnbod (talk) 21:57, 2 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Well, Arabic Wikipedia ar:الأراضي المقدسة says: The Holy Land is a term used in the Christian and Jewish religions to refer to the holy places in Palestine, especially Jerusalem , Bethlehem, and Nazareth...
Hebrew Wikipedia he:ארץ הקודש says: Jews usually refer to the Land of Israel as the "Holy Land".[Source needed] However, the Bible refers to it explicitly as "holy land" in only one passage, the book of Zechariah, chapter 2, verse 16.
It doesn't seem like it is very common (at least not in the arguably main languages used by the most relevant religions and populations) to use the term "Holy Land" in Judaism or Islam. They may regard the land as sacred in some way, but calling it "Holy Land", capital H capital L, seems very much a Christian practice.
At any rate, if 19th-century and early 20th-century Orientalist is our scope, why not use the term Levant instead? It fits the period well, is broader than just Palesrael, and is not as politically and religiously charged. NLeeuw (talk) 01:53, 4 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
A fine piece of OR, & reliance on primary sources! You contradict your own research superbly there! "Jews usually refer to the Land of Israel as the "Holy Land"" and you conclude "It doesn't seem like it is very common (at least not in the arguably main languages used by the most relevant religions and populations) to use the term "Holy Land" in Judaism or Islam. They may regard the land as sacred in some way, but calling it "Holy Land", capital H capital L, seems very much a Christian practice." Wonderful! "Palestine" (much less controversial in this period, & the official name for some of it) would be better than "Levant". I don't mind splitting off the 2-3 proto-Israeli figures, who I agree are rather different. Johnbod (talk) 02:30, 4 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Well no, I'm not claiming this is in-depth research lol. Let's try something a bit more empirical:
  • Google Books search: landscape "orientalist paintings" "holy land": 2.110 results
  • Google Books search: landscape "orientalist paintings" "levant": 1.950 results
  • Google Scholar search: landscape "orientalist paintings" "holy land": 207 results
  • Google Scholar search: landscape "orientalist paintings" "levant": 223 results
Neither "holy land" or "levant" is particularly likely to be part of the title. Painting the Holy Land in the Nineteenth Century (1997) and Visions of the East: Influence of the Levant on the Italian Renaissance (2015) are two rare exceptions to this rule.
David Roberts is often mentioned, but more frequently with "Palestine" than with "Holy Land". His bio David Roberts (painter) uses the term "Holy Land" no fewer than 12 times, though usually in conjuction with other 'countries' around it: his travelogue The Holy Land, Syria, Idumea, Arabia, Egypt, and Nubia comprises about half of those mentions.
Gustav Bauernfeind (not yet in this category) is more usually associated with "Levant"; in fact, his bio has Gustav Bauernfeind#Painting the Levant, mentioning 'the Levant, the Orient, Ottoman Palestine, Jerusalem, Lebanon, Syria, the Holy Land'. Seems to me that Levant is the broadest, most encompassing and inclusive term of the two (or three if we count 'Palestine'). As it is broader, it could also include paintings of certain biblical narratives that are set in Transjordan (such as the one of Tissot referenced above), which may or may not be included under the term "Holy Land". It might be a good idea to add a catdesc that gives a description of what we mean by 'Levant', and the term 'Holy Land' does seem fitting there (amongst the other regions/countries I mention in this comment) instead of in the catname itself. Maybe that's an acceptable compromise? NLeeuw (talk) 13:49, 4 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
PS: Something like catname: Category:Orientalist painters of the Levant
Catdesc:
Might that work? NLeeuw (talk) 13:58, 4 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It might (moving out the proto-Israelis), but I don't understand why people keep talking about "landscape" painters/paintings. Some, like Lear and Roberts, mostly were, but others, like Hunt and Tissot, concentrated on history paintings of Biblical narrative subjects, obviously many with landscape backgrounds. I'd still prefer Palestine to Levant. But I think it is important that we explicitly restrict the category to those who had actually spent time in the area, rather than working things up in Europe. Johnbod (talk) 17:18, 4 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Well because currently one of the parent categories is Category:Landscape painters. If that is incorrect, we should purge that parent. NLeeuw (talk) 10:09, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Qwerfjkltalk 16:01, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  • @Santasa99: considering the articles in this category it is certainly meant as "of", not as "from". Marcocapelle (talk) 15:00, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Polish social activists of the Prussian partition

Nominator's rationale: This category should either be merged or renamed to make it clearer how this is defining. Mason (talk) 01:32, 3 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Qwerfjkltalk 15:58, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Comment This question is part of a wider issue concerning the categorisation of "Polish people" during the Partition period from 1795 to 1918. Last year I tried to address it, but no consensus emerged: Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Poland/Archive 19#Categorisation of Category:Polish people of the partition period.
In short: we'll need to choose whether we mean "Polish" as an ethnicity (as Marcocapelle suggested), or as a nationality (as Mason is indirectly suggesting, since Category:Polish activists is in the Category:Activists by nationality tree). Ethnicity is always a difficult one to establish and results in lots of sourcing problems, and it means we can't put these people in the Category:Polish people tree (because it is part of the Category:People by nationality tree). So nationality seems the best approach. For our purposes here, the Prussian partition is best understood as the Grand Duchy of Posen, though it is a little more complicated than that (I'll get back to that).
But how do we grant a Polish "nationality" in a time when they did not have a state? My proposal was to recognise certain historic non-sovereign entities as "Polish":
1815:
  Grand Duchy of Posen (Prussian Partition)
  Congress Poland (Russian Partition)
  Kingdom of Galicia and Lodomeria (Austrian Partition)
  Free City of Kraków (independent until 1846)
Should we categorise all inhabitants of these polities as having "Polish nationality", or not? Currently, only inhabitants of Congress Poland and the preceding Duchy of Warsaw are deliberately categorised as Category:Polish people.
Until we resolve that question, it's probably difficult to do anything with these Polish Partition categories. We do not want to erase Polish history, but it's really challenging to categorise it either. NLeeuw (talk) 07:01, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Activists for Palestinian solidarity

Nominator's rationale: This is a random mix of people who aren't activists. Purge the category and leave in actual activists. Omnis Scientia (talk) 14:29, 25 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Also I'm not too sure about it but maybe rename to "Pro-Palestinian activists". Any other suggestion would be helpful; this one seems rather vague. Omnis Scientia (talk) 14:30, 25 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Support rename to "Pro-Palestinian activists", if only because that new name would be shorter and simpler, yet also straight to the point. AHI-3000 (talk) 15:30, 31 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I'll wait for some consensus here before I proceed with the subcategories. Honestly, going through them, I don't think any of these people in any of these categories were checked to see if they actually were activists for Palestinian solidarity, particularly given a number of these aren't pro-Palestinian but rather anti-Israeli. Omnis Scientia (talk) 14:33, 25 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I would prefer keeping this category, I should add, since there is a big Palestinian movement and activists who are pro-Palestinian. I just think we should be careful who to put in. Some of these "pro-Palestinian" people aren't pro-Palestinian at all. Omnis Scientia (talk) 14:36, 25 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I think renaming it to "Advocates for Palestinian Solidarity" would be best. NesserWiki (talk) 02:50, 31 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]