I stated the reason for reverting in my edit summary: your changes were completely original research, which is inappropriate and not allowed on Wikipedia. In other words, you were adding your own personal interpretation of the character. Things like "Fawful seems to be..." or "It is possible he could be compared to..." are inappropriate for encyclopedic articles. When you start off with "They may be slightly off-target" then it's a clear indicator it shouldn't be added. --ThomasO1989 (talk) 00:01, 9 May 2013 (UTC)
Wikipedia is not for speculation. The information you were publishing cannot be verified, which means they can't be backed up by reliable sources. In this case, you weren't actually "citing the game," you were instilling your own analysis about the character based on something, which is original research. Wikipedia readers don't want "possible" reasons, and they certainly don't want "doubt." None of the information you were giving can be confirmed by the game or any other source, therefore none of it is useful or appropriate for an encyclopedic article. It hurts the quality of the article when you simply add stuff that you made up. --ThomasO1989 (talk) 15:50, 9 May 2013 (UTC)
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Command and Conquer Expert! speak to me...review me... 23:40, 17 May 2013 (UTC)
You're still projecting your own analysis of the character, and per WP:BURDEN if you want to make a claim, it is you, not me, who needs to provide a reliable source that explicitly supports it. Even so, the observation is completely arbitrary and trivial. Saying that Bowser has a large spiked shell is enough to describe that facet of Bowser's appearance to a person unfamiliar with the character. It is unnecessary to go into indicate detail and debate whether or not it's considered "clothing" just because "one or two games imply it." --ThomasO1989 (talk) 02:06, 18 May 2013 (UTC)
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MarioWiki is not an acceptable source per WP:SPS. It allows original research and does not require references, so it is not considered reliable. It also doesn't change the fact that the observation is relatively minor in the scope of the article. Debating whether or not "it changes the air of the character" is not appropriate. Wikipedia isn't the place for you to be "creative" and paint a character in a way you want it to be. It is the same as original research per WP:SYNTHESIS. --ThomasO1989 (talk) 17:06, 18 May 2013 (UTC)
And again, you're missing the point that you've yet to provide a reliable source that explicitly states this. All examples you given have not supported the claim in any way, just along the lines of "A and B, therefore C," which is your own analysis. "Large spiked shell" is accurate enough. When you add claims that "it might be clothing" without providing any source other than "the games imply it" then you risk making the article less accurate. How does "They wear a metal shell armor with spikes." prove that the shell is removable? How do you know that the Koopa wasn't actually born with a spiked shell? Has any source stated Koopalliers' shells are removable or did you yourself come to that conclusion? Do you see where this falls apart? --ThomasO1989 (talk) 19:23, 18 May 2013 (UTC)
First off, you have it completely backwards. Wikipedia is not based on "Make a claim, find evidence to back it up," because it also falls under original research and is a waste of time.
Second, most of your statements are already mentioned in some articles. However, "Only koopaliers, Bowser, and his "children" have spikes." is completely arbitrary, not to mention false, which is even worse: Spinies, another type of Koopa, have spikes. You could change the sentence to add Spinies, but what about other enemies? How far will you go until the sentence is no longer about Bowser? Trying to cover and generalize everything when you don't have a single, reliable source to back it up will eventually make the entire sentence irrelevant and nonsensical.
Also, you still have not provided any proof that the spiked shell is Bowser's or any of the Koopas' choice. The average reader does not know what a "koopalier" is, and explaining what it is has nothing to do with Bowser. Why do you believe that this information will be of use to the average reader? If the reader only wants to know what Bowser looks like, "large spiked shell" is enough, why does it matter that he know that the shell is removable or not? Why does he care if the shell was a choice?
No matter how you try to phrase it, unless you have a source that explicitly states the claim, your evidence only falls under original research and synthesis. You can't use screenshots as proof, because they can be ambiguous and someone unfamiliar with the series can't verify the claim, and trying to analyze them falls under original research too. Not to mention that screenshots can be easily fabricated. Either way, a screenshot of a spiked Koopa does not prove that the shell is a choice. To be completely honest, you're trying too hard to make sense of a fictional series where not only mushrooms make humans grow and turtles have wings, but is also constantly inconsistent. It's not worth your time or mine to analyze and find a citation for something so trivial. It is best to leave out the statement altogether because if you have no explicit proof then you risk introducing inaccuracy.
Personally, I don't see any reason that this should be dragged out any longer. Stating whether or not the shell is removable or is a choice is not of interest to the average reader. --ThomasO1989 (talk) 07:26, 20 May 2013 (UTC)
If it just is not important, than that is fair. I won't waste my time, but I can still say that it is true. There are many instances where Koopas (in general) remove shells, and nothing has really set Bowser apart. It is just that you should understand that it is not eluded to. Koopas actually took their shells off (well technically they stolen but anyway).
TheUnknownNinjaNN2 (talk) 13:09, 20 May 2013 (UTC)
I will read policies, but it near the end it simply degraded to: I want to prove I am right, cause I am right. Granted in a friendly way.
TheUnknownNinjaNN2 (talk) 19:06, 20 May 2013 (UTC)
He made his original statement sound like: You are wrong I am right end of story. (With regards to my statement.) i would have no issue with a need for citation,but it is not very nice to just flat out say someone is wrong.
TheUnknownNinjaNN2 (talk) 20:50, 20 May 2013 (UTC)
I was no longer refferring to policy. My statement was a fact with actual instances in the game, yet he kept saying it was alluding. Besides, I will admit that I tend to read between the lines in discussion, but you are still liable for how you come across. Also, his statements countering were illogical. He claimed that a spiny was proof of other shelled koopas when: a spiny is a buzzy beetle! He could have at least been creative in his countering. Even if Wikipedia does not except it, logic can still determine wether the fact could be true. Besides, I did not mean bullying. I just figured he needed me to explain better. If he is willing to explain his statements better, then that is fine, but I have explained myself and I declare this discussion closed.
TheUnknownNinjaNN2 (talk) 03:01, 21 May 2013 (UTC)
Also, there are no hard feelings. I just feel that this discussion is getting redundant.
TheUnknownNinjaNN2 (talk) 03:02, 21 May 2013 (UTC)
I guess a better way to phrase it would be to say that it came across as calling me a liar. Not in those words, but that tone. Also, a bit adamant. Sorry if thats not true, but I am just stating how it sounded.
I honestly figure that there was a miscommunication.
TheUnknownNinjaNN2 (talk) 04:33, 21 May 2013 (UTC)
Spike Top is the variation of Buzzy Beetle that has a spike and can climb up walls. Super Smash Bros. Brawl also says that a Buzzy Beetle is "A Koopa underling with a heavy shell protecting it from fire." So both Buzzy Beetles and Spinies are Koopas, neither of which have been shown to emerge from their shells. As you can see, the claim "Koopas can take their shells off" is not true for all Mario enemies. Inconsistency prevents you from using one example as "proof" for another. That is the danger of synthesis. --ThomasO1989 (talk) 05:20, 21 May 2013 (UTC)
With reading some of your discussions with Woodroar or Thomas, it appears you continue to argue semantics and little details. At least one of them has mentioned that its getting tiring, as is it with me. Please, while its good to ask questions, but some of your follow up responses when you don't get the answer you're looking for are getting a little disruptive. Please keep in mind that we're all here to work on an encyclopedia, not just argue endlessly. Thanks. Sergecross73 msg me 15:45, 22 May 2013 (UTC)
Answered in this edit. --ThomasO1989 (talk) 04:58, 23 May 2013 (UTC)
I only replied again, because Servdrim the Admin (or whatever his name is) jumped in and said I was arguing. Then you jumped in and said the same thing.
Please read and consider all the comments that are written before you claim "I wasn't given enough information" or "what does that have to do with anything." Woodroar's main point in the entire conversation was clearly "Nintendo Nightmare is not notable to get its own article nor is it notable enough to be referenced to in any other Wikipedia article." You continued to ask if an external link to the game could be provided, which contradicts Woodroar's point. So it wasn't unreasonable for Sergecross to assume you were arguing with Woodroar. Please remember, even if you believe that you can't get along with me, we're all trying our best to be clear and unambiguous. But it's still both confusing and frustrating to be asked to explain the same point over and over to the point of having to spell it out. --ThomasO1989 (talk) 18:47, 25 May 2013 (UTC)
If you read Woodroar's reaction, then it is clear that he misunderstood. He had no problem doing it, and I even told Sergecross that he shouldn't jump into user conversations without being asked. Besides, Woodroar said it was a policy of linking to 'userspaces'. Nowhere did he say that the edit was bad simply because it referenced NN. At least, I didn't see it.
TheUnknownNinjaNN2(Talk,Always willing to discuss this subject) 20:14, 25 May 2013 (UTC)
Hello, I'm Salvidrim. Although everyone is welcome to contribute to Wikipedia, it's important to be mindful of the feelings of your fellow editors, who may be frustrated by certain types of interaction, such as your addition to User talk:ThomasO1989 and other talk pages. While you probably didn't intend any offense, please do remember that Wikipedia strives to be an inclusive atmosphere. In light of that, it would be greatly appreciated if you could moderate yourself so as not to offend. The goal of your presence here should solely be to improve the encyclopedia. Engaging in discussion with other editors about specific improvements to Wikipedia is helpful; arguing and discussing on a user talk page as you've been doing is pointless at best, and potentially counterproductive. I admire your passion for the project and urge you to continue improving articles! :) ·Salvidrim!· ✉ 23:55, 23 May 2013 (UTC)
Hello, TheUnknownNinjaNN2. I can see by your contributions on the Video games WikiProject talk page that you are making an effort to get into Wikipedia, more than simply writing the Nintendo Nightmare article. If you are indeed interested in being a Wikipedia editor and diversifying your contributions to articles, would you like to learn the ropes and how to identify ways to write good articles? I've been a Wikipedian since 2008, almost entirely with the Video games WikiProject and the Sega task force, and I'd hate to see anyone who's willing to put in the effort on any subject just slip by the wayside. I can really help you get started if this is something you're looking to do. Let me know if you're interested. Thanks, Red Phoenix build the future...remember the past... 00:45, 25 May 2013 (UTC)
TheUnknownNinjaNN2 TalkBig Project 07:05, 25 May 2013 (UTC)
TheUnknownNinjaNN2(Talk,Always willing to discuss this subject) 07:15, 25 May 2013 (UTC)
Seeing your comments on Talk: Super Mario (series), the text in the boxes is caused by leading spaces. It's a type of formatting. If you click Edit on this subsection here, you'll see that
this line looks normal, but
this line has an extra leading space.
--ThomasO1989 (talk) 23:46, 26 May 2013 (UTC)
Hi TheUnknownNinjaNN2,
Great to see you're participating in discussion in the Video Game Wiki Taskforce. Couple of things though, when discussing, new comments that go below the previous one are moved up a bit to the right. You know, so it is easier to see how the discussion is going, who says what, etc. For instance, a discussion like this:
I believe Mario should be the new Xbox One mascot.
Is written down with colons in front of them. Each colon moves the paragraph up at bit. So if you have a whole story to make your point, use colons likewise.
Like that.
And on signatures, I see you've already started trying to make your own. A piped link also works, so go nuts! A piped link is this thing: [[Tomb Raider (2013 video game)|Tomb Raider]], so it shows up as Tomb Raider. Also, usually users put it right after their last sentence. Like this! --Soetermans. T / C 11:28, 27 May 2013 (UTC) (if you have any questions, feel free to ask!)
Well, I personally like my sig lower, unless that just bothers people? How do I do the colons?
TheUnknownNinjaNN2(Talk,Always willing to discuss this subject) 14:06, 27 May 2013 (UTC)
TheUnknownNinjaNN2(Talk,Always willing to discuss this subject)
Wikipedia ads | file info – #158 |
21:23, 28 May 2013 (UTC)
Hello. I regret to inform you that you cannot post such things as this on Wikipedia project talk pages, as it is has nothing to do with Wikipedia. Please read WP:SPAM, WP:FORUM, and WP:SOAP, thank you.--十八 07:41, 10 June 2013 (UTC)
1. I wouldn't even call it a game. I am literally trying to make the premise, and see what happens.
2. I was not debating the fact that it doesn't belong on this site. I was saying that spam doesn't really apply to this post.
TheUnknownNinjaNN2(Talk,Always willing to discuss this subject) 04:20, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
BELOW IS THE TEXT IN QUESTION.
Now you are probably thinking "oh great, spam", but HOLD ON. I am asking Wikipedians specifically because their unbiased point of view is exactly what I need. Now, the project.
Below is the premise to a video game, but I don't want to do that. I want to examine the flip side. I want help doing this project.
A game maker with the Yoyo Games username Supmaster004 got bored one day and decided to try a massive project. He heard that Cleverbot (an automated conversation simulator) had downloadable code that he could adapt to his game making program. He combined it with a 3D engine he had created a while back. He then felt like using this new engine to build a world, but he needed ideas. After a long time spent on brainstorming, he decided to steal... er borrow a lot of mascot/favorite Nintendo characters. He ended up with a horrible, glitchy, throw-together game, and he attempted to alleviate this by creating special tools the characters and the player could use to execute a piece of code. Hopefully, it would cause the game to fix itself. Now the only thing left is to test, and later upload, the game......
Oh, and just in case one of the characters decides humanity should be destroyed or something, this "game" should be played/tested on a computer with no internet connection. Common sense, right?
Contact me if you wish to help.
TheUnknownNinjaNN2(Talk,Always willing to discuss this subject) 04:40, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
(edit conflict)Some points:
--ThomasO1989 (talk) 05:34, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
1. A guy named Channgi actually blew up at me one time for attempting to solve a miscommunication. I have no problem with anyone coming in (as ling as they wait until I have replied between 11:00 to 2:00 AM CST, and are kind.
2. You assume that I had not. All I stated was that it was not spam. Spam ,to me, means something like: Buy Ugg Boots (in a place where nobody discusses shoes of any kind).
3. You misunderstand the project. I actually want to take this guy (cleverbot.com) and populate a computer generated world with his Nintendo. The reason why I need Wikipedians (or writers in general) is because I must create "biographies" of every singe "person". Its not like a guy could do that in a lifetime!
4. I only knew it did not belong AFTER the guy messaged me. I only stated the spam part to be funny (in a way), because I guy would think it was some random sale or: spam.
TheUnknownNinjaNN2(Talk,Always willing to discuss this subject) 05:52, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
You do get what the project effectively is, right? What if someone were to 'enslave' it? You get an entire automated task force. I am talking about building a (really badly coded) universe in a pc (with code editing privileges). Why wouldn't someone want to at least know about it or be involved? Also, I am not sure how Conflict of Interest applies, Woodroar.
TheUnknownNinjaNN2(Talk,Always willing to discuss this subject) 06:42, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
Benifits
1. Automated characters can do maintenence and such (more advanced maintenence than bots)
2. Writing practice (its a lot of writing, keeps people sharp)
Relation
1. I need a very specific style of writing for the characters' biographies (or whatever you would call it). I can't ask just /one person/. Even, if I limit the populas to 1,000,000 that still requires a group capable of doing an encyclopedic writing style. Where else can you find such a group???
TheUnknownNinjaNN2(Talk,Always willing to discuss this subject) 06:54, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
Have I made a second message? NO. So is it not clear that I stopped?
TheUnknownNinjaNN2(Talk,Always willing to discuss this subject) 07:10, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
You asked me questions and I answered. All I am saying is that "spam" doesn't really apply as I am asking ALL of wikipedia, not random members. That would be like saying that going to the main Wikipedia request page to ask for help on this would be spam. I am asking for wikipedia to invest a little time in something that could easily multiply our work speed.
At this point: don't discuss the spam anymore. If you have any ideas who/where I might ask, then let me know, but please drop it. Spam is just too misused nowadays. You could probably do a survey on definitions of spam and get a whole range of things. Its just too... Vague.
TheUnknownNinjaNN2(Talk,Always willing to discuss this subject) 07:52, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
Alright, it looks like you're being disruptive again, so I'm here with a final warning.
Here is the challenge on my website, complete with an email address to send your solutions to. Good luck! --FastLizard4 (talk•contribs) 06:37, 12 June 2013 (UTC)
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Hello TheUnknownNinjaNN2. It has been over six months since you last edited your WP:AFC draft article submission, entitled "sandbox".
The page will shortly be deleted. If you plan on editing the page to address the issues raised when it was declined and resubmit it, simply ((db-afc))
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Thanks for your submission to Wikipedia, and happy editing. Rankersbo (talk) 06:43, 3 November 2014 (UTC)
Hello, TheUnknownNinjaNN2. It has been over six months since you last edited your Articles for Creation draft article submission, "Nintendo Nightmare".
In accordance with our policy that Articles for Creation is not for the indefinite hosting of material deemed unsuitable for the encyclopedia mainspace, the draft has been nominated for deletion. If you plan on working on it further, or editing it to address the issues raised if it was declined, simply and remove the ((db-afc))
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Thanks for your submission to Wikipedia, and happy editing. ♔ MONARCH Talk to me 03:12, 26 September 2015 (UTC)