Please see discussion page for above topic. Revmachine21 02:23, 22 January 2006 (UTC)
Regarding Avian influenza, please stick the the maunal of style guidlines, not your own. Martin 17:19, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
Stop your style war now, follow the guidlines, see Wikipedia:External links. Martin 17:27, 23 January 2006 (UTC)
I am confused, being new at this. Who can post on Avian Influenza? Are there some restrictions? The external link I have posted has now disappeared on 2 occasions. Now it sems like the whole topic has disappeared. Looks like user WAS 4.250 moved only part of it to an influenza-virus-A topic instead. What is the motivation and idea? Will the topic come back, including my link - or do I have to post another one? Thanks. User:Anernelson
I'm not sure if being "discovered" was beneficial to the natives of the Americas, but I guess thanks. I actually don't know much about H5N1, but I'll lend a hand I feel I have something to contribute. cheers, Nrets 02:26, 31 January 2006 (UTC)
Very good! You have a real knack for producing relevant policies/guidelines. SlimVirgin (talk) 18:31, 1 February 2006 (UTC)
Thank you very much! WAS 4.250 18:47, 1 February 2006 (UTC)
You reverted my good faith contributions to the DRM article without discussion. my edits removed some POV and removed extraneous information debating the qualities of analog vs. digital media. Please start discussions if you disagree with non-vandalism edits. Ripe 01:47, 6 February 2006 (UTC)
FYI, I wrote the following to User:Ripe:
hi was,
although the dialogue article isn't very big, the "Socratic dialogues" and the "socratic method" are in no way equatable terms (imho, of course). (As i'm sure you are well aware,) the "Socratic dialogues" refer to a set of dialogues written by Plato, xenophon, and a few others in which Socrates is the main character; "Socratic method", on the other hand, refers to a method of inquiry often utilized within the socratic dialogues. On wiki articles, the terms are clearly used in different ways to denote two different things. for instance-
So considering how the terms are used very differently, I think two seperate articles are warranted. Plato's metaphor of the sun, for instance, doesn't just get a section in the Republic or Plato; also, as above, some Socratic dialogues, like the Apology, don't utilize the method at all, so they don't necessarily go hand in hand. As to size, articles have a way of filling themselves out- eg, Socratic method (history) was relegated to being part of Socrates until i unmerged it last april. It can be a stub.
However, if it does get unmerged, it should probably be to Socratic dialogues rather than Socratic Dialogue . . .
Again, i'm sure you're well aware that the two terms don't denote the same thing, and i see from the edit history that that wasn't your argument for merging them. But given that they don't mean the same thing or necessarily refer to the same things or even the same category of thing, I don't really see the advantage to keeping them together.
If you strongly disagree it won't be the end of the world. but again, i just don't really see the advantage in relegating "socratic dialogues" to a section of "socratic method".
thoughts?
thanks for your time!
--Heah talk 04:46, 6 February 2006 (UTC)
Aw gee... I like the star polygon! But, Sparkling prose??
Thanks! Vsmith 02:15, 8 February 2006 (UTC)
Yes, I know, and I considered linking it to that article, but I found the H5N1 to be better on giving background information on the bird flu virus, something I imagine many people will find interesting and educational to read. The Global spread of H5N1 reads more like a diary. But that's just me and I see value in including that one, too. Maybe there's a way to include both links by refrasing the ITN sentence? Perhaps include the word "spreads" somewhere and link it to the global spread article? Any sugestion? Shanes 22:35, 9 February 2006 (UTC)
Regarding your edit [1] please have a look at Wikipedia:Manual of Style (disambiguation pages):
Markus Schmaus 23:17, 9 February 2006 (UTC)
You added the following to Evolution (disambiguation):
According to Wikipedia:Manual of Style (disambiguation pages) it should be:
Disambiguation pages should point the user as fast as possible to the article he is interested in. Any additional wikilinks are only distracting. Markus Schmaus 02:25, 10 February 2006 (UTC)
Please tell me if you can distinuish the colors on the map. Thanks. Hitokirishinji 14:18, 11 February 2006 (UTC)
Hey I've updated the map, new colors and added more info, please let me know if the new colors help. Hitokirishinji 15:51, 14 February 2006 (UTC)
Q: Why is Sweden portrayed as a country that posted the cartoons ?. To my extend of knowledge the governement did in fact censor a publishing from a political party called Sverigesdemokraterne, by shutting down their website.
A:You are confusing government behavior with the behavior of newspapers within a country. In the west, newspapers are not controlled by the government. The citizens that own them have the right to publish facts and opinions and speculations. It's called freedom. And if the government does not like it we the people will fire their sorry ass and replace them. Read the American Declaration of Independence for the idea that we the people have the right to institute whatever government we want. WAS 4.250 14:11, 16 February 2006 (UTC)
Before you distribute gratuitous insults, you should check your facts. If I was not a physicist, as you seem to believe, it would be difficult to explain why NASA gave me $300,000 for fusion propulsion research and what I am doing down here at the European Southern Observatory as a visiting astronomer, or for that matter how I got all my papers published.
What people like you don't realize is that cosmology is science, not religion. It's observations that count. Attempts to ignore things that invalidate a theory like the Big Bang, or to censor them as Joshua Schroeder and others try to do, has nothing to do with science.--Eric LernerElerner 16:18, 11 February 2006 (UTC)
I have not distributed "gratuitous insults". I have questioned various things about you. That you find my scepticism to be an insult is no concern of mine. I do believe you are a "physicist". Some are better than others. I have doubts about how good a physicist you are; not whether or not you are one. A friend of yours worked or works at NASA according to your web site. Inside influence? Kickbacks? I don't know. But getting a contract proves little. Not getting it renewed proves at least as much.Being a visiting astronomer and publishing papers is par for the course for both good and bad physicists and does not prove which you are. I do realize "cosmology is science, not religion. It's observations that count." You declare things about me which are not true with remarkable ease - maybe you also do that in the field of physics? As I say, I have my doubts about you. And this intemperate outburst certainly doesn't change my mind. You talk as if no one can honestly disagree with you. WAS 4.250 16:54, 11 February 2006 (UTC)
Thanks for digging up the source material for Jimbo's request about divisive templates -- I'd been hoping to find all that info in one place, and now, well, there it is. Cheers, JDoorjam Talk 16:55, 14 February 2006 (UTC)
You are very welcome. WAS 4.250 17:34, 14 February 2006 (UTC)
The coding at the bottom of the article looks to be overly-specific and in the wrong place, so I was about to remove it - however I notice that this has already happened and been reverted. I wonder if we might be able to come to an agreement about it? Why is it important that it stays in the article? Thanks Cpc464 04:57, 17 February 2006 (UTC)
Are you refering to a detailed description of the structure of an RNA molecule that defines part of what the H5N1 is? How is part of the blueprint for the item the article is about wrong to put in the article? Some people come to this article claiming viruses don't even exist. Or that what some one said 100 years ago about the subject is still true. People need to be face to face with the level of detail modern science has on the subject so they don't believe all the nonsense out there. See Antoine Bechamp and Homeopathy and [2]. WAS 4.250 14:48, 17 February 2006 (UTC)
Hey thanks for the kind words... you're right, I haven't done much on improving actual articles I'm afraid. Part of it is that I've been on vacation and don't have access to my journals and books. But more to the point, I've just been trying to get over the jitters-- I don't want to step on any toes. But I'm getting more bold, and I'm confident that over time I can make improvements here for the better.
Thanks. Freddie deBoer 20:48, 18 February 2006 (UTC)
Hiya! I think the section of the article about information sources is very limited and quite Americo-centric. I'd think it would be a good idea if we collected the websites and telephone helplines, etc, for as many different countries as we can, or at least as many English-speaking countries as we can. XYaAsehShalomX 14:05, 19 February 2006 (UTC)
Hi! I see what you mean. So I changed the section, putting country specific data at the botttom. We currently have US and UK. India, Nigeria, Austrailia, Canada, and New Zealand might deserve an entry. Thanks for helping! WAS 4.250 14:30, 19 February 2006 (UTC)
The Sarfati article is currently undergoing major discussions about how to redo it here: [3]. It may be more productive if you join in there than make various edits to the page right now. JoshuaZ 21:35, 21 February 2006 (UTC)
Thanks for finding that quote - I think it captures the intent of the page - and is worded in such a way as to avoid my concerns. Trödel•talk 16:21, 22 February 2006 (UTC)
Thanks for supplying the link at User talk:Jimbo Wales. What I couldn't find anywhere, is a temporary injunction. According to Auntie Beeb, the Congress IPs have only been blocked for short periods of time. Accordign to the RfC, the IPs had been blocked and unblocked. What seems to have been the latest block, given on February 1st, expired after three hours. Aecis Mr. Mojo risin' 09:51, 23 February 2006 (UTC)
I have no idea what this is all about ("I have no idea what your problem is" has wrong connotations). Do you know something happened and you are looking for a source? Blocking is done as little as possible. Maybe the evidence is that it is a tempest in a teacup and you are looking for wind damage to the house? WAS 4.250 11:00, 23 February 2006 (UTC)
Well, I know from the RfC that Congress staffers have edited wikipedia. Some of these edits were pov (adding praise, removing criticism, or vice versa), some were vandalism (like adding the name of ScottMcClellan to douche) and some were good contributions. I'm interested in this case, because it's the first time such a high profile institution has been so directly linked to wikipedia that it has led to an RfC. Aecis Mr. Mojo risin' 11:45, 23 February 2006 (UTC)
You are exactly right. I am also interested. It's just that as near as I can tell, it was mostly teenage or college age volunteers goofing around. A tempest in a teapot. WAS 4.250 11:50, 23 February 2006 (UTC)
Hi,
Should we discuss here instead of messing up the main page?
The WHO July 2003 report I quoted actually included the same events that you quoted in the earlier Feb 2003 report. In summary, it says:
1) From Dec 2002 to Feb 2003. Some "Pneumonia cases" in Guangdong, China (i.e, the "suspicious" reports you quoted, that the Chinese claimed to be "not connected to the father and son H5N1 case in HK" and was "under control"). The Guangdong cases was identified a few months later to be Sars, NOT H5N1 (July Report)
2) The Feb 2003 (father and son) case: a family developed h5n1 in HK after visiting Fujian, China. It was reported to WHO (July Report). FYI: Fujian and Guangdong are different provinces in China
3) The Guandgong pneumonia later spread to HK, then to the rest of the world, which was then known as Sars. - See "July Report".
4) There is no "discrepancy" between the July and the Feb reports. Both described the father and son case as H5N1, PLEASE READ MORE CAREFULLY.
(BTW. I was in HK at that time. As I remember, there was some disagreement between HK and mainland China regarding the source of the Feb 20003 cases. (HK claimed the victim got it in mainland, mainland claimed that they got it after returning to HK.), but it was reported to WHO by HK nevertheless. (unsigned comment by User:Sorgwa)
She replaced Tony's summary with one that was substantially inaccurate. Tony is, as he himself says, one of her supporters. How is that "bullying"? Guettarda 16:02, 25 February 2006 (UTC)
Response at Wikipedia talk:Requests for arbitration/Agapetos angel. WAS 4.250 16:15, 25 February 2006 (UTC)
You could at least take a stab at explaining your logic, you know, instead of making glib statements of dismissal. Guettarda 15:06, 26 February 2006 (UTC)
I like you far too much to further upset you. WAS 4.250 15:42, 26 February 2006 (UTC)
I am very sorry to hear about your problem. Perhaps, it would be a good idea to approach an administrator or bureaucrat for help. Additionally, you may have to scan your computer for viruses or malware. Hope to see your problem being solved soon! --Siva1979Talk to me 16:04, 25 February 2006 (UTC)
If you are ready to conceed the point, please remove your delete tag ASAP. We can close the item out to save the admins time. Talk page and logs must be updated. If you do not know how, I can do those latter items for you. AWM -- 68.122.118.161 10:23, 26 February 2006 (UTC)
I have every confidence that admins will do what is proper when it is proper. I am ready to concede that further involvement on my part is unwise as I, rather than the noteability of the article, have been increasingly a focus. WAS 4.250 10:33, 26 February 2006 (UTC)
WAS, below Durova's comment you noted, "Half the problem would go away if both sides would agree to not edit other people's opinions even if they list your name as agreeing with them when you didn't". I agree, except I think only AA did that. The other half of the problem would have gone away had AA answered two simple questions: do you work for AiG? and are you related to (married to, whatever) Sarfati. Had she simply said yes or no, the issue would have just gone away, basically. A no answer, and nothing else. A yes, and we would have requested that she edit on the talk page only. But, not answering pissed a lot of people off (besides the evil three or four of us named in the RfAr). Oh well, life is full of twists and and turns and ups and downs. Jim62sch 18:14, 1 March 2006 (UTC)
I have read comments by AA such as "Guettarda, expressing that you disagree with my assessment, that your dissent was implied, after my assessment is appropriate. Editing my post was not. agapetos_angel 04:29, 8 February 2006 (UTC)" here without verifying for myself that it was so. My impression was that AA created a list of people she thought agreed with her and some people edited her opinion by deleting their names. Is this inaccurate? WAS 4.250 18:37, 1 March 2006 (UTC)
I reluctantly read them all. I only found two worth further notice. Please comment on [16] and [17]. Thank you. (I think they are congruent with my previous statements.) WAS 4.250 23:54, 1 March 2006 (UTC)
Making false claims about people is, in my opinion, unacceptable. It has nothing to do with editing other people's posts (though I thought it important to strike my name from the forged straw poll). The issue is that she falsely attributed an opinion to me, apparently for the purpose of creating some sort of controversy between her proposed version and the existing version. I find it unacceptable for someone to post intentionally misleading summaries. Regardless of whether her first "summary" (the forged straw poll) was intentionally false or simply an honest mistake, her re-posting the information showed intent in her falsehood. That is unacceptable. And since she refused to remove the information, I removed the entire post, in order to avoid editing her comment. And I am still await your clarification of your previous comments. Guettarda 23:48, 1 March 2006 (UTC)
Guettarda, you are a tremendous asset to Wikipedia. Thank you for helping us make Wikipedia better. I, also, in my small way, am trying to help. False claims are a bad thing. Editing another's opinions, no matter how wrong those opinions are, might not be the best response. Are you able to accept any of this? WAS 4.250 00:00, 2 March 2006 (UTC)
Thank you. As easy as that, huh? One simply changes the tag from proposed to guideline? No peer review by a board for of reviewers for guidelines or policies? If there is a procedure that I missed, I would appreciate a link :) DanielDemaret 16:19, 4 March 2006 (UTC)
Wikipedia:Be Bold, Wikipedia:IAR, Wikipedia:WWIN ? WAS 4.250 16:27, 4 March 2006 (UTC)
This was ment as a joke, right? Gerard Foley 17:38, 10 March 2006 (UTC)
Yes. An attempt at communicating in the form of parody. WAS 4.250 17:42, 10 March 2006 (UTC)
It was very funny! Gerard Foley 17:43, 10 March 2006 (UTC)
Thanks! We tried communicating in every other way that his suggestion turns a no-censorship proposal into a do-censor proposal, in vain. I thought, time to try humor. Glad you liked it. Frankly, I wonder if he is serious or just trolling us. WAS 4.250 17:47, 10 March 2006 (UTC)
Perhaps what you are looking for is ((trollWarning)). Gerard Foley 20:04, 11 March 2006 (UTC)
No, the guy acting like a troll probably isn't. On the other hand, Jennifer has contributed nothing but generalized venom. I felt like just deleting all her "contributions", but wrote that instead. WAS 4.250 20:10, 11 March 2006 (UTC)
I saw you added a full quote to HeLa, I switched it to "blockquote". Do you have access to the full article for Van Valen, Leigh M. & Maiorana, Virginia C. (1991): HeLa, a new microbial species. Evolutionary Theory 10:71-74.. I always wanted to read the full text. --Richard Arthur Norton (1958- ) 22:04, 11 March 2006 (UTC)
Please say if you do or don't disagree with my proposed "simple" changes. Metarhyme 02:30, 12 March 2006 (UTC)
Go for it. WAS 4.250 04:31, 12 March 2006 (UTC)
Hi WAS, thanks for the note. I am aware of the limits of wikipedia, and a big defender; and of course wikipedia (along with gutenberg) is the spiritual godparent of LibriVox. in fact, at librivox we have a very similar debate to the one about wikipedia's accuracy, in our discussions about "quality" of recording, and must regularly make the same defenses as wikipedia, as applied to audio (which I can't seem to find right now on our forum, otherwise I would give you the link, for interest). You also might be interested in this long defence of wikipedia I wrote in answer to a librarian who asked us to take wikipedia links off our pages because they are dangerous to her students: http://librivox.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1016 ... so this is a little of background about why we got our backs up about the epsidoe: we feel like a sister project to wikipedia and it was, um, difficult to be labeled linkspam & threatened with a blockage.
re: links, though, I understand fully the concerns about not being a link farm, but wikipedia has very specific guidelines about *what* links should be allowed, external_links. see # 3 of "what should be linked to": "An article about a book, a musical score, a webcomic, a web site, or some other media, *should link to the actual book,* musical score, etc. if possible." So in fact Wikipedia policy says EXPLICITLY that gutenberg text should be linked to; and LibriVox recordings of the actual book should, I think, be linked to as well - especially since they are free non-commercial (different story if its amazon selling the book, or audible selling the mp3s). Too me the question of whether the links are good is far far more important than who does the linking, or how, which is where & why we got caught in the mess in the first place. Anyway it seems as if a slightly cumbersome solution has been reached, though not my preferred becuase it is inefficient & head-ache inducing, but it is a solution nonetheless, and if its the best we can do then that's fair game. PS thanks for making the LV page! Mackinaw 23:17, 12 March 2006 (UTC)
I saw your note on the Jimbo Wales talk page, and Mackinaw's talk page. If only you had stepped into this discussion a day ago. I don't know if you've seen the back and forth between Mackinaw and Mel Etitis, but the result has been frustration on our (Librivox's) part. We've come to the point that we don't want to bother with Wikipedia anymore. I think the consensus among those of us who have been active in this conversation at Librivox is that if Wikipedia values links to Librivox, you'll add them. If not, we're not going to the effort to do so.
I can see now that we should have only added links to the page of the work in question. By the way, it was my additions that Mel Etitis reverted that brought this about (I'm not aware of any other reverts he made).
I still don't understand why the amount of links that are added is a problem. I don't see why they have to be done one at a time, over several days distance, but there's no need to explain such to me. We were adding links as projects were completed, and I'm guessing that we complete one or two plus projects a week. Of course, if we had only been linking to the work in question rather than the author page as well, more than half of the links that were added wouldn't have been added.
Anyways, since you expressed an interest in this situation based upon your comments, I felt the need to respond. -GreenKri 20:16, 13 March 2006 (UTC)
each recording starts: "this is a librivox recording, all librivox recordings are in the public domain," read by the reader of the rest of the recording. so we *hope* that that gives us the cover required. and we're in the process of gettign some legal advice on various things, but we are still very grassroots - we have not a dime anywhere in the project. everythign is volunteer.
re: gutenberg, they have mainly short works, where we have many long works. but in fact we are working with gutenberg to figure out how best to coordinate efforts; the problem is figuring out whether to just link to our titles from gutenberg pages; or to put LV recordings (many gigs) on their servers. the link solution is the obvious choice, but for some tech reasons, it's not so straightforward. but you'll note that gutenberg mentions LibriVox (as well as a couple of similar projects) on their audio page: http://www.gutenberg.org/audio/ ... but gutenberg's main focus is text, not audio - so the discussions we're having is to become the (or perhaps one of several) audio arm of gutenberg.Mackinaw 00:56, 13 March 2006 (UTC)
I have been removing personal attacks from this page but they keep getting re-added. Any idea what should be done about it? Thanks, Gerard Foley 01:20, 13 March 2006 (UTC)
I am deeply sorry for anything I have done that in any way leads you to say: "Next time I see personal attacks being made I'll defend the person making them." WAS 4.250 18:43, 13 March 2006 (UTC)
re: spamming: my [[18]] show a bunch of what might look spam-like stuff which was march 12, re-adding 7 links that User:Mel_Etitis had removed, i thought wrongly (I presume this is one reason everything went so sour). Prior to that march 12 episode I had 7 edits relating to librivox, from Oct 7-Nov 21, a 45 day period. which seems to me reasonable.
re: who can add links: according to User:Mel_Etitis, however, I cannot, nor can any LibriVox volunteer add links to LV, even to appropriate content (ie the actual book), on the appropriate page (the article about the actual book), even in moderation. instead we must post in the talk pages & wait for someone else to post the link
what links are spam: If adding the link to the actual book on the book page is ok, but adding a link to the Author page is not OK, that makes sense to me. if adding links to short works or poerty is not acceptable because of linkfarm worries, that sounds reasonable to me. a message saying such nicely would have been well-received I am sure. but here is the message kri got: "Please stop. If you continue to use Wikipedia for advertising, you will be blocked from editing." see [19]. Thinking that unfair she responded. I responded. I re-linked (I don't know how to revert, I am just a traveller here, not a native). Acrimonious debate raged. The upshot of which was that User:Mel_Etitis stated that: 1. he agreed that LV content *should* be linked on the page of the text 2. but that LV volunteers are *not allowed* to make the link. (they can suggest the link on the talk page). which seems to me a crazy sort of policy. but then perhaps it is because I am looking at wikipedia from the outside as a user of the resource, and not from the inside. if it is agreed that wikipedia policy says the link *should be there* then, as a user, I find it difficult to understand why anyone would enforce a rule about *who* adds the link. If it's questionable content, I understand. But if policy says explicitly it should be there, then it should be there. Note that I very much understand that there is a difference between linking on the author page, or linking to short works; but for long texts the policy seems clear to me, says wikipedia external links policy: "An article about a book...should link to the actual book."
Now the big problem in the background in all this is we have a big community of volunteers over at librivox, many of whom feel insulted by User:Mel_Etitis's handling of this. And I feel I was insulted personally several times -- though that's not very important; presumably Mel feels the same way. But the impression over at LV is basically that wikipedia has been very hostile to our project; and other than Jimbo (and you for writing the article), not supportive at all. User:Mel_Etitis suggests a sort of probationary status for LV volunteers, and I guess understandably they didn't react well.
It is really no skin off LibriVox backs whether the links are in wikipedia or not. But It seems to me they *should* be here; just as they should be in gutenberg too (which we are working on). The beauty of wikipedia is that it was easy for us to get the links here. now it is hard(er), and everyone is pissed off for how LibriVox was treated by (a) wikipedia admin. The losers are wikipedia users who now will not have links to resources which are explicitly stated as a link that *should* be in an article. Whew. -unsigned comment by User talk:Mackinaw
Mackinaw 00:22, 14 March 2006 (UTC)
So, that clarifies things, and in a reasoned way. Thanks for that. Now, the great hope is that non-LVers on wikipedia take up the cause - which might get tricky because we hope that anyone making LV links will also be tempted to read for us - which will compromise their impartiality ;) Mackinaw 03:31, 14 March 2006 (UTC)
Yes. Wikipedians all hope to alter the "impartiality" of its readers. Towards increased impartiality! And we do that by providing more information. And now thnks to you, that "more information" can include audio. Thank you from the bottom of my heart for helping provide information to all mankind. Bravo to you sir! WAS 4.250 03:48, 14 March 2006 (UTC)
...that the External_link policy be updated to say this explicitly? ie to say that the don't link if it's your site -put it in talk. If this had been clear to me & clearly stated in the policies, instead of the conflicting policies (link this; don't link this) which seemed to me to be open to interpretation, i suspect we all would have saved much time & anguish. Mackinaw 00:56, 15 March 2006 (UTC)
Wikipedia is an everybody can edit anarchy, in spite of recent events to the contrary. Improve it yourself ONCE. Clue me in. We'll improve what needs improving. You have every right and we have every expectation for you to contribute by direct change of what needs changing. Don't be shy. Just don't revert!!! (talk on the talk page instead of reverting) WAS 4.250 01:05, 15 March 2006 (UTC)
Anyone not banned (example you) can add anything (example LV) to any talk page about anything that relates to editorial decisions concerning the encyclopedia article it is a talk page for. To say it another way: Don't spam talk pages either. But you can add relevant information to any talk page for any article such that an unbiased editor could use information from you in helping them decide how to make it a better encyclopedia article. Again, the whole issue is we are writing an encyclopedia, not hosting a blog or webvertizement. The talk pages are to help us write the article the talk page is attached to. Philosophy, chit-chat, and promoting things (people, ideas, sites, products, services) occurs but is frowned on. Good contributors having a little fun is normal and accepted as helping to build the community that is building the encyclopedia. Outsiders (to the article, not necessarily to wikipedia) coming to an article talk page for the sole purpose of promoting something (usually creationism, anarchy, socialism, capitlism, etc more than say ivory soap) are asked to go away. See the archives of the evolution talk page for an unending series of people coming there to tell us the page is biased and should include more about creationism or any anarchy article talk page for an unending debate over anarchy as a philosophy as much as the article itself. Our article on the cartoons that were protested around the world had a talk page that was repeatedly contributed to with arguments pro and con censorship. These are examples of what we try to have less of, as they don't help build the encyclopedia, and just use us as a talk forum which is not our mission. Does that answer you question? WAS 4.250 12:06, 15 March 2006 (UTC)
Regarding your revert at Influenza:
I think you may have made a mistake, see diff
Prodego talk 21:52, 16 March 2006 (UTC)
If interested, here is new LibriVox link/wikipedia info page from our forum: http://librivox.org/forum/viewtopic.php?p=21254 Mackinaw 16:58, 17 March 2006 (UTC)
I would emphasize that if the poem or book does not have an article, they are encouraged to create the article. Just don't create an article that is too much of a stub (too short) or breaks copyright laws or doesn't indicate importance (who is the author? what comments have important people made about it? Google is your friend here.) Look at similar articles and copy their style, including relevant categorization, subsection headings, reference style. But then that's what I would emphasize. Were I to edit that page and say all of this, maybe you would get on me for spamming your site! Ha! Cheers. WAS 4.250 17:33, 17 March 2006 (UTC)
Now that perhaps people have calmed down, I've moved the more personal comments to our user pages. My aim is not to reopen the confrontation but to explain my comments hopefully in a less agressive atmosphere.
I'm not going to get drawn into an argument over this article, and for the benefit of future editors I suggest you adopt a less confrontational style of discussion. The fact is these articles are not logically separated or cross-linked. Hopefully at some point someone will be allowed to change that. I apologise for stepping on anyones toes. |→ Spaully°τ 20:46, 12 March 2006 (GMT)
First of all I apologise for some of the comments I made, those which I have put a line through and the original "you did not" regarding using talk.
To explain my second reply which was a bit short I've copied parts of your first talk page comment with why I felt it was innapropriate:
Suggesting you think my edits to influenza are "stupid" and "ignorant".
How am I supposed to feel anything but indignation at the patronising tone?
1.The second of my two edits was different to the first, taking into account your previous edit comment 2.Prior to my second edit I started a new section on the talk page, in which I explained my reasoning.
I tried to find the information, and so am in as good a position as anyone to make that claim. "It is clear you don't know what you are talking about" is hardly respectful.
I do not feel this adheres to WP:CIVIL, and incorrectly I responded to this in the same tone.
My comment regarding allowing others to edit the article was again innapropriate and stemmed from a feeling from looking through previous edits that you are close to violating WP:OWN. I don't still think this.
I will not retract my comment about your confrontational tone, as I feel you were confrontational, although I responded to this badly.
Reply if you wish, but my aim is just to explain and apologise for some of my comments. I hope that we can work together to improve these articles at some point. |→ Spaully°τ 13:18, 20 March 2006 (GMT)
Just copied this here to bring it to your attention:
I was about to delete the last few comments again with this explanation:
There seems to be a precedent for removing non-contributing comments from talk pages, and there is no doubt the final few messages were not useful. I'll wait for your comment however before I remove the information again. |→ Spaully°τ 14:17, 21 March 2006 (GMT)
On the paleocene page there are a number of somewhat random & cumbersome references to a text (listed in the ref section) by Hooker, in a funny format. (Hooker). Is it standard to add references to works like this throughout the article? It seems that referencing some "facts" but not others is a bit odd; and if wikipedia articles referenced all facts - well it would be a mess. But rather than just remove though I would ask for some sage counsel. See Paleocene paleogeography for the specific issue in question.Mackinaw 17:36, 20 March 2006 (UTC)
Yes, I see what you mean. Wikipedia is a work in progress at all times. You don't have to produce a perfect end product in order to contribute. We encourage everyone to help make wikipedia better any way they can. Some like to begin new articles and let others finish them. Some like to add lots of data. Some like to provide references. Some like to correct spelling and "copy-edit" in general. Some spend all their time removing vandalism. Some like to bring articles to "featured article" status, which is as close as wikipedia has to saying an article is "done" or good enough. Check out the features articles for the best examples of what we are aiming at. Feel free to improve articles with additional references, but removing references is usually very bad, because anybody can edit and it is only the references (sources) that let someone verify. We are trying to increase references, not decrease them. Thanks for asking. WAS 4.250 19:31, 20 March 2006 (UTC)
Obviously I was wrong to think you were a decent person. If you had read my evidence you would see that the straw poll I was refering to was not the revised version (which she posted after I struck out her forgery of my sig). I wasn't the only one who called it that - KC and Jim were on her case about her forged straw poll long before I saw it. But, obviously, you are going out of your way to post misleading diffs in an attempt at character assassination, to twist my words to make me look like a horrible person. Not much I can do about that. Oh well. You did a good job of fooling me. I would have hoped that you had the decency to say things like that to my face. But then, I made the mistake of thinking you were a decent person. Well, foolish me. I have no idea of what you agenda is or what motivates your dislike for me. I just deeply regret assuming good faith. Guettarda 01:25, 22 March 2006 (UTC)
The above was in respose to the below posted at User talk:Agapetos angel. WAS 4.250 01:36, 22 March 2006 (UTC)
Consensus vote requested:
So, from the people who have responded to this consensus attempt, I submitt that we have:
FOR the revised version:
AGAINST the revised version:
agapetos_angel 04:09, 5 February 2006 (UTC)
Count me in as for. JoshuaZ 04:35, 5 February 2006 (UTC)
What in the world are you doing? You seem to be creating a faux straw poll and adding people's names without their consent. That is NOT how Wiki works -- although if Wiki were a dictatorship... You seriously need to stop this now. Jim62sch 23:38, 5 February 2006 (UTC)
No, Jim. That was not my intent at all. The parenthetical remarks (I've added more) were to show that I was adding the information as a summary, not a poll. I thought it was obvious that I am putting the information in bullets, not conducting a poll. I am trying to get this section back on track and resolved, without any further waffles about what this or that editor meant when they said such & such. Instead of responding like this, could you please stay on topic and 'ring in' on the header. I would appreciate, also, if you are against it, reasons why and suggestions to improve the proposed revision. agapetos_angel 23:49, 5 February 2006 (UTC) [20]
Calling the attempt at a summary a "straw poll" is either stupidity or deliberate disruption; in either case clear bullying. WAS 4.250 00:30, 22 March 2006 (UTC)
In your original edit you wrote:
"So, from the people who have responded to this consensus attempt, we have the following 'votes' regarding the revision:
FOR the revised version: * David D. * agapetos_angel * Alai (expressed 'no direct objection') AGAINST the revised version: * Guettarda (implied)"
What does "from" mean if people are voting here in this list? Why is "votes" in quote marks if it is a real vote? Why are there no time stamps if this is either a vote or a forgery of a vote? If Alai voted, why say (expressed 'no direct objection') in third person past tense rather than first person present tense? How can Guettarda say "implied" about his own vote? WAS 4.250 01:04, 22 March 2006 (UTC)
WAS 4.250, how is the discussion at AA talk helpful toward settling the differences of the parties involved. This issue has been rehashed ad nauseam. IMO, outside parties should try to assist these users in moving past the dispute. Your comments seem to stoke the fire. FloNight talk 22:24, 22 March 2006 (UTC)
A rude characterization of my action, but you get points for clever. FloNight talk 02:01, 23 March 2006 (UTC)
Nothing clever about this statement, though. Calling the attempt at a summary a "straw poll" is either stupidity or deliberate disruption; in either case clear bullying. WAS 4.250 00:30, 22 March 2006 (UTC) Curious about the point of this statement? FloNight talk 02:24, 23 March 2006 (UTC)
Clever:
Oh, good grief. I just get done responding to one response and you not only have a second response, but you've stricken both of them. Striking says "You can still read this, but because I put a line though it, I disclaim responsibility for it." You can say you are wrong; you can delete this entire subsection with my blessing (really); you can explain the sriking; but striking alone just says to me that you want to be able to provoke without taking responsibility. In summary, I think we both want you to just delete or archive this whole conversation as a distraction, a misrepresentation (don't ask me of what, I'm on a roll here), and/or adding fuel to the fire. Peace, love, and truth to all my brothers [and sisters]. WAS 4.250 02:50, 23 March 2006 (UTC)
WAS 4.250, I struck it because:
FloNight talk 03:31, 23 March 2006 (UTC) p.s. I meant 1. Mentally quick and original; bright. FloNight talk 03:38, 23 March 2006 (UTC)