The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. (non-admin closure) Armbrust, B.Ed. ^{Let's talk}_{about my edits?} 00:15, 8 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Evil clown (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log)

(Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)

The article is unreferenced and apparently a fringe theory based on a single work. It has been nothing but a magnet for uncited trivia and cruft. May fail notability guidelines.
⋙–Berean–Hunter—► 19:01, 21 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Popular culture-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 19:06, 21 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Merge any worthwhile, verifiable content to Coulrophobia * eldamorie (talk) 19:21, 21 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep It gets ample coverage in the news and books. Restore what it was before over 90% of the article was gutted after it ended in keep during its first nomination last year. Rename it List of evil clowns in popular culture, or make a separate article for that.
• World art: the magazine of contemporary visual arts, 1995 - Snippet view

Thus, the widespread fear and loathing of clowns, crystallized in the ubiquitous image of the Evil Clown, ... The Evil Clown bodies forth the black comedy of a society in which the giddily amoral tubeoisie shouts "Go, Juice, go! ...]

• [1] Villains and Villainy: Embodiments of Evil in Literature, Popular Culture, Page 74

Anna Fahraeus, Dikmen Yakalı-Çamoğlu - 2011 - 225 pages - Preview

An evil clown is therefore free from not only from external societal constraints, but also from the internalized repression that allows us to function within society. The clown exists outside of our social order, but he is intimately... click the link to read more. Dream Focus 19:46, 21 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete Such an article would require quite a bit more than just Dery's discussion of the theme to establish notability in reliable sources. Nwlaw63 (talk) 20:14, 21 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep The term is not without use in the media:

• Used to describe characters associated with the Batman series.
• Used to describe an advertisement sign with a questionably innocent-looking clown on it named Calico; also see [2], [3], and [4].
• Used to describe a character in a show.
• Used to describe Saddam Hussein in the Toronto Star.

In addition to this usage, the term is also used at length beyond just the Dery book:

• This article describes a man who is hired to be an evil clown.
• This report republished in the Annual Survey of American Law about the dangers of online interactions and how one prominent individual was guised as an evil clown in a MUD. I, Jethrobot ^{drop me a line} (note: not a bot!) 21:30, 21 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment These are not sources that establish the notability of this idea - they are simply sources that briefly mention an evil clown somewhere. A reliable source for this actually discusses the idea. This is a fundamental idea in reliable sources - it needs to discuss the topic at length, not simply mention it in passing. Nwlaw63 (talk) 20:20, 22 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

• Dammit. User:Can't sleep, clown will eat me would be on a wikibreak. Clarityfiend (talk) 05:53, 22 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

• Merge the current content to coulrophobia, and also create List of evil clowns in popular culture from earlier revisions of article. -- The Anome (talk) 10:33, 22 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment As a sufferer of coulrophobia, I'm going to give my input on this issue, coulrophobia is not a fear of evil clowns, it is a fear of clowns in general, to merge coulrophobia with Evil clown would give readers the impression that coulrophobia is a fear of evil clowns, which clearly coulrophobia is not, coulrophobia is not a fear of evil clowns, it is a fear of clowns in general. Greg The Webmaster (talk) 16:18, 23 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

• I endorse this view. The concept of evil clown should not be confused with coulrophobia.
  ⋙–Berean–Hunter—► 16:43, 23 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

• OK, I'm convinced by Greg The Webmaster and Berean Hunter's arguments above -- changing my opinion back to keep. -- The Anome (talk) 00:19, 24 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep I'm not sure what the problem is here. This is a hugely notable device used in many movies, TV shows, and books. It's one of the most well-known out there. How exactly is it a "fringe theory?" --Qwerty0 (talk) 07:03, 28 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Then get over there and add some sources and not trivia. During this article's existence, it has been a cruft magnet. This is no serious treatise on the "hugely notable device". Were it so then we wouldn't be here. Go look at the article history and see the crap I pulled out of it. As it reads now, there is the opinions of one author which constitutes the face value of fringe theory. If it is highly notable then you won't have any problems finding serious studies on the subject to expand the article.
⋙–Berean–Hunter—► 14:11, 28 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

---

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Bryce (talk | contribs) 08:02, 31 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

---

• Keep The importance of an article of an evil clown archetype in a literary and fictional context rather than coulrophobia (a psychological condition) is noteworthy; they are no more identical than arachnophobia is to spiders. However, more critical analyses than Mark Dery's are needed; are there no other critics who have written about the archetype of an evil clown? And can a history of depictions be found? Benjitheijneb (talk) 03:16, 2 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep Any who delete this page will be cursed by the Evil clown. Clown has spoken. -WikiSkeptic (talk) 04:00, 4 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep but the article does still suffer from the same issues that created the need for the first AFD, it reads like an essay and is based too much in personal interpretation and not enough in reliable sources. There may be some synthesis going on here. Not the worst example of synthesis but this article needs some rewriting. RadioFan (talk) 13:18, 7 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.