The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was redirect to List of The X Factor finalists (UK series 6). Brandon (talk) 07:56, 26 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Joe McElderry[edit]

Joe McElderry (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log)

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Procedural nomination. This article has been repeatedly switched to and from a redirect to List of The X Factor finalists (UK series 6). That target contains bios of all the X Factor finalists and opinion is divided as to whether an independent article over and above that is justified for this act. There has been no AfD, just a simple redirect to List of The X Factor finalists (UK series 6), a discussion should be held and in my opinion, is one of the popular contestants on this series of The X Factor. Hassaan19 (talk) 16:32, 17 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Procedural note: Hassaan19/82.36.17.10 is the article creator; (s)he has additionally !voted below. I42 (talk) 20:13, 17 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

It subsequently transpired (s)he also !voted another time, claiming to be the uninvolved admin Woohookitty. This is was under discsussion at Wikipedia:Administrators'_noticeboard/Incidents#User:82.36.17.10 Wikipedia:Administrators'_noticeboard/IncidentArchive579#User:82.36.17.10.

• Strong keep. One of the most notable contestants on The X Factor. Largely featured in the press, at one point was noted as "the best male vocalist in the competition" by Dannii Minogue. Seems popular within young audiences, in my opinion, needs an article to give independent notability, which Joe doesn't have at the moment. 82.36.17.10 (talk) 18:52, 17 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Note: above comment was placed by 82.36.17.10 but the signature was amended to make it appear that it was placed by Woohookitty. I42 (talk) 06:35, 19 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• Strong delete, redirect and protect. Absolutely no indepedent notability, per Woohookitty 82.36.17.10 above - WP:1E applies. I42 (talk) 19:52, 17 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• • It wasn't me though. :) It was 82.36.17.10 masquerading as me. I changed the signature to reflect who really said it. --User:Woohookitty ^{Disamming fool!} 01:28, 18 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    • Note: it is an established principle that the top 3 finalists in the X Factor are considered notable, because they have placed in a major music competition. If this act reaches the top 3 then I would have no objection to recreation of the article. I42 (talk) 21:46, 23 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• Strong keep. Lots of independent notability, the article can only be improved. Hassaan19 (talk) 19:58, 17 November 2009 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.36.17.10 (talk) [reply]

• In what way is he independently notable? All coverage is entirely related to X Factor - indeed, every reference in the article has X Factor in its title. I42 (talk) 20:32, 17 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• I42, you have a point mentioning he has no independent notability, but is popular on the show, and should be credited on the X Factor for the time being until he gets a record deal. Hassaan19 (talk) 21:11, 17 November 2009 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.36.17.10 (talk) [reply]

• But when there is no independent notability, policy requires that we redirect to the parent article. In this case, that is the list of X Factor contestants where a bio already exists, which is what I propose. We don't speculate about what may happen in future; there is no certainty in that. I42 (talk) 21:16, 17 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• Redirect, no indication forindependent notability. WP:BLP1E may apply. If McElderry gets a record deal, the article may be recreated. Huon (talk) 02:06, 19 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• This AfD nomination was incomplete (missing step 3). It is listed now. DumbBOT (talk) 12:12, 19 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• Redirect and protect the redirect. The author wants "an article to give independent notability, which Joe doesn't have at the moment", but that is not what Wikipedia is for. JohnCD (talk) 21:06, 19 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Redirect and protect the redirect. Doesn't meet WP:MUSIC and most X Factor contestants do not become independently notable. When/if he meets notability criteria, an article can then be created. Boleyn3 (talk) 21:31, 19 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• Redirect for now - I'm not sure he has achieved notability independent of the show itself, as Jedward have. It's borderline in this case though, and he may become notable in future, which is why a redirect is best - the article can always be recreated if needed. Robofish (talk) 23:16, 20 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

As the creator of the deletion, I think many people like to know more about Joe's background. For the moment, I see no reason to delete an article that has so many references and quite a good quality, despite no 'independent notability'. Hassaan19 (talk) 12:46, 21 November 2009 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.36.17.10 (talk) [reply]

Many references? There's only 18..Pic Editor960 (talk) 21:12, 21 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• Strong Redirect: currently, all he is notable for is appearing in a talent show. Nothing else. Unless he wins, or comes in second, I think there is no need for an article. Pic Editor960 (talk) 21:12, 21 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Redirect until they release a single. Darrenhusted (talk) 15:09, 23 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• keep for now He is notable in the pop music world as of right now, and the article is probably getting a fair number of hits. After the competition is over, a further course for the article will be more clear. PolarYukon (talk) 21:36, 23 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• FYI: 6671 hits this month. By comparison: 19036 for Jedward and 186777 for The X Factor (UK series 6). I42 (talk) 21:46, 23 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete and I guess redirect. Not notable, only going to become viable if he places in The X Factor. Sky83 (talk) 20:54, 24 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.