The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was Speedy delete, fails to assert importance in line with our speedy deletion criteria. Hiding Talk 19:01, 20 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

PlayRadioPlay![edit]

PlayRadioPlay! (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log)

Non-notable band, this article has been speedy deleted at least 5 times, but I'd like an AfD consensus before salting. yandman 13:54, 18 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

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Yandman, PlayRadioPlay is signed to Island Records, a major record label, and is one of the fastest up and coming new bands right now. You can't say a band isn't notable when they'll have a major label release on Best Buy store shelves all around the country in less than 6 months. I just spent 2 ours redoing this article after someone spammed it last night. Give it a rest and let the article be. And learn something about a 17 year old kid that's following his heart while you're at it. --~*LiSaSuArEz*~ 14:28, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

Also, if this page gets deleted, thousands of others bands wiki's will deserve deletion as well, considering PlayRadioPlay! gets more traffic than most bands on MySpace. Sorry I won't post anymore, I feel very strongly about this subject.--~*LiSaSuArEz*~ 14:32, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

• Comment - Your argument here is a perfect example of WP:CRYSTAL and WP:OTHERCRAPEXISTS. Just because someone is going to be successful soon doesn't mean they're notable now, unless it can be verified with independent sources. Likewise, just because there are plenty of other Wikipedia articles on obscure bands doesn't mean that those articles belong on Wikipedia - it just means no one's bothered to nom them for deletion yet. A MySpace page doesn't constitute evidence of notability, even if it gets a lot of traffic. WP:MUSIC demands third-party reliable sources, i.e. sources independent of the band itself. Walton monarchist89 16:29, 18 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment - PlayRadioPlay IS NOTABLE RIGHT NOW, he will only be MORE notable in a few months.--64.134.178.245 07:58, 20 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Lastly, I'm working on citing sources right now. Dan's been in several newspapers. --~*LiSaSuArEz*~ 14:43, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

Hello Lisa. Unfortunately, the dreams of a "17 year old kid that's following his heart" aren't a good reason for keeping an article. And per WP:CRYSTAL, the fact that he may have an album released in 6 months time, and that it may be popular, is not a good reason for keeping an article either. Most bands on MySpace don't deserve wikipedia articles, which is why myself and others spend far too much of out time deleting scores of them. yandman 15:47, 18 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete per Yandman. Fails WP:MUSIC; no evidence of coverage by independent third-party sources. Only external links are to the band's official site and MySpace page, which do not constitute adequate external coverage. See my comments above. Walton monarchist89 16:30, 18 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment - Tag the page as unsourced and it will be taken care of. The page has only been up a few days, give it a break. The reason it keeps getting remade is because enough people keep visiting it that it gets remade. PEOPLE WANT TO KNOW ABOUT PLAYRADIOPLAY. that's the reason wikipedia is here.--64.134.178.245 07:58, 20 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete having a highly trafficked MySpace page does not constitute notability. This article is completely unsourced except for the MySpace page; "official" website only sells merch. Band hasn't even released a single EP yet. PlayRadioPlay does not even appear on Island Records' website. Nothing about this band currently warrants being included in wikipedia.--Mbc362 17:28, 18 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep PlayRadioPlay! IS a notable artist with thousands of fans, a MAJOR record label, national tours, an EP that will be released in just a few months, and an LP release that will be in about a year. Just because YOU haven't heard of a band doesn't mean it's not notable! PlayRadioPlay! is really in a bad spot, because the general demographic of his fans are teenage females, and most wikipedians are older males. Even though PlayRadioPlay doesn't have an official release YET, he still has gained the attention of thousands of people, gaining millions of MySpace plays and views. It's impossible to say this isn't notable. There are far worse wikipedia pages out there, go find them. --~*LiSaSuArEz*~ 07:09, 20 February 2007 (UTC)

• Keep PlayRadioPlay! is a very notable up and rising artist. He has gained national and even worldwide support on myspace.com. He is already very accomplished and is continually growing.

-ClayRadioClay! 02:20, 20 February 2007 (UTC)

• Keep PlayRadioPlay! is a big up and coming artist. He has a huge following and is a signed act. He has a EP that has a set release date and has played numerous shows. This is a band that will be huge in a few months. They already have a huge following underground but pretty soon he wil lbe more main stream. He is very noteable because of the amount of people he has listen to his music everyday.

-Thegetawayplan9 23:26, 19 February 2007.

• Keep Wikipedia can't delete this page. PlayRadioPlay! is important. Maybe not to EVERYONE, but to SOME people. And those people count. Wikipedia was made to inform the masses on different subjects, INCLUDING bands. If you have an article on My Chemical Romance, you have to let PlayRadioPlay! have one too. Using the fact that PlayRadioPlay isn't 'mainstream' as your reason to delete it is wrong. Just because PlayRadioPlay! isn't favored by some wikipedians doesn't mean a thing. I could care less about your article on 30 Seconds to Mars, but it's there. I could care less about your information on The Killers, but it's there. PlayRadioPlay! deserves to have a page. PRP! helped me in times of need. Dan helped me, he really did. Information on him, and PRP! is important to me. Without him, i might not be here today. If you get rid of this page, you get rid of my help. Martin Luther King Jr. helped people and he has a page. Why can't Dan? He has the right for freedom of speech and, if you delete this, you are suppressing his right. AlixTheEskimo 07:57, 20 February 2007 (UTC)AlixTheEskimo[reply]

• Keep PlayRadioPlay! as they are a notable artist and they're becoming more popular by the minute. If people intruiged by the band come to wikipedia to read about the band, they will have no page to view, no information to read, nothing to learn. Even if a band is not 'worthy of a wikipedia page' why get rid of it just because one person thinks so? I'm sure there are people who do like that band, and they should not have the right of reading about that band taken away from them.

• Keep While you mat not consider the band notable does not mean that you can try to delete them. Although not hugely notable to some of the general public Dan or Play Radio Play is signed to a major label and is currently in studio recording a brand new EP to be released this year. He has thousands of fans, which if that isn't enough to prove notability. The deletion of this page would be closer to Wikipedia vandalism then cleaning up of the site. There are far worse pages on Wikipedia that deserve attention then this wonderful musicians. Wikipedia is an informative source and should not have articles deleted because thet have no significance to an insignificant individual. Thus why I vote KEEP on this article.

-7:09 AM, 20 February, 2007.

• Keep PlayRadioPlay! is most definatly a notable band. Dan has done so much to make PlayRadioPlay! what it is today. By deleting PlayRadioPlay!'s page, it's showing absolutly no respect to all of his hard work, and all the other upcomming bands who have been put down by the man. PlayRadioPlay! deserves just as much attention as any other band. I vote keep for PlayRadioPlay!

-Bry Leigh 11:37 PM, 19 February, 2007.

• Keep PlayRadioPlay! is a notable artist and his music is loved by many. just look at his myspace, kids all over the world are crazy over him. he has over 5 million plays on his myspace proving that hes very popular and well known making him worthy of having a wikipedia —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Itsferlove (talk • contribs) 07:37, 20 February 2007 (UTC).[reply]

• Keep PlayRadioPlay is a legitimate music project that is rapidly gaining fans having just recently been signed to a major label. Deleting the page is completely unnecessary and would go against Wiki's main purpose: allowing people to gain information on a range of topics. Very strongly against Deleting.

- Amy - 20 Feb 2007 —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Ameztv (talk • contribs) 07:39, 20 February 2007 (UTC).[reply]

Keep I don't understand why this is being deleted. It is becoming a very big band, certainly a lot bigger than many of the bands wikipedia has pages for. They are signed to Stolen Transmission record label, which has artists that have a wikipedia account. PRP has over 70,000 friends on myspace. He is playing at The Bamboozle music festival in New Jersey this year. A full-length EP will be out this year, and it WILL be successful. If the problem with this is that there are no EP's out yet, you can solve that by just putting his upcoming EP under his discography section as an UPCOMING EP. There is certainly enough hype to do that. Also, there is a lot of information about how and where Playradioplay! came from in his blog section on myspace, so there is no lack of information. My main arguement is that there are many artists that have wikipedia articles and are not as popular as Playradiplay. Junejo 07:42, 20 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep PlayRadioPlay is definitely a "notable" band. How could a band with 1704590 Myspace views not be notable? If this were to be banned, then so should most other bands.. deleting this would defeat the whole purpose of Wikipedia. Information worthy of sharing should be shared, and this is definitely worthy information and a worthy band. I vote to keep this article.Beccaronica 07:54, 20 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Keep Definitely legitimate group. No reason for deletion. Don't set an unreversable precedent.Fiaworldrally 07:50, 20 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

KEEP: isnt it more work to delete them then just keep it up? i vote KEEP : ) _Hicklingt 07:55, 20 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep Playradioplay is in fact a notable artist. Dan has an incredible talent, which makes his music very unique Just because there is no actual website for PlayRadioPlay! and only a myspace, shouldn’t be a reason, for deletion . He is signed to a MAJOR record label, an EP will be released within a few months. PlayRadioplay! may not be known to most adults, but teenagers word wide if haven’t listened, have heard of PlayRadioPlay! He is becoming more popular day by day, with well over a million plays. If that can’t be suitable for a wikipedia article I don’t know what can. -KaraOh kara 07:56, 20 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete. I'm sorry to say it in the face of such enthusiasm, but I don't think PlayRadioPlay yet meets our guideline WP:BAND. Based on that, WP:INN, and WP:CRYSTAL, I agree with the nom that this should be salted until PlayRadioPlay meets the guidelines. Which I hope will be soon, and I wish the band and their supporters the best of luck in making that happen. William Pietri 07:59, 20 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment- - What guidlines is PlayRadioPlay! not meeting other than people CLAIMING it is n't notable, and not having sources? An article has to be up for longer than a day before it's expected to be fully sourced. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 64.134.178.245 (talk) 08:06, 20 February 2007 (UTC).[reply]
    • If you can demonstrate that PlayRadioPlay meets WP:BAND through verifiable information from reliable sources then the article will be kept. Discussions like this stay open for five days, so you'll have plenty of time. If not, then you are welcome to recreate the article as soon as PlayRadioPlay meets WP:BAND guidelines. Hoping that helps, William Pietri 08:10, 20 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]
      • From WP:BAND
        "#6 Has become the most prominent representative of a notable style or of the local scene of a city; note that the subject must still meet all ordinary Wikipedia standards, including verifiability."
        PlayRadioPlay! is the most prominent representative of a new genre of music called "Electro Pop" or "Synth Pop" in Dallas/Fort Worth, TX, as well as online.
        "#8 Has won or placed in a major music competition."
        PlayRadioPlay! won a national competition to perform at Bamboozle Left on October 15th and 16th, a major music concert in Pomonoa, California with many notable acts, including Dashboard Confessional and Brand New. The event was hosted at Cal Poly Pomona Athletic field with 68 bands on 5 stages.
        In about a month, PlayRadioPlay will have qualified for more of these criteria, as he is currently shooting a music video that will receive national airplay, and is about to have an official release that will receive national airplay on public radio.--~*LiSaSuArEz*~ 08:27, 20 February 2007 (UTC)
        • Hi, Lisa. That looks like progress. Can you show us where we can verify that information from reliable sources? And do you have anything more? Note that what might happen in the future doesn't count for this discussion. See WP:CRYSTAL for more information on why. William Pietri 08:32, 20 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]
          • Hey william.Here are two (of many) press releases about PlayRadioPlay publically announced on AbsolutePunk.net
            PlayRadioPlay Signs to Major Label
            Bamboozle Lineup Additions--~*LiSaSuArEz*~ 08:45, 20 February 2007 (UTC)
            • You're making progress, but I think you should go back and check out WP:BAND, WP:V, and WP:RS again. In particular, I'm thinking of this bit: "[The band] has been the subject of multiple non-trivial published works whose source is independent from the musician/ensemble itself and reliable." Any information in the article has to be verifiable from reliable sources. Forum posts generally don't qualify. William Pietri 08:55, 20 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]
          • http://www.thebamboozleleft.net/page-lineup.php --Ameztv 08:40, 20 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]
            • Yep. That's proof that he played at a 68-band festival. But it doesn't demonstrate that he won a major music competition. They also don't list PlayRadioPlay on their list of artists or their Buzz Bands section, which suggests that PlayRadioPlay wasn't featured. William Pietri 08:49, 20 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]
              • PlayRadioPlay didn't play at the festival. He did win the contest though.--~*LiSaSuArEz*~ 08:55, 20 February 2007 (UTC)
                • Ok. Can you prove that? An article in a newspaper announcing the winners would be a good start. And can you find reliable sources saying that the contest is a major one? William Pietri 08:57, 20 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]
                  • Here is the press release about him winning, but having to drop.
                    PlayRadioPlay Drop Bamboozle
                    and the only way I know how to prove that bamboozle is a major even is to link you to The Bamboozle's SOURCED wikipedia page. --~*LiSaSuArEz*~ 09:04, 20 February 2007 (UTC)
  • Looking at the references people have dug up so far, I don't think we have enough material from reliable sources yet for an article. Remember that, as it says in WP:V, "The threshold for inclusion in Wikipedia is verifiability, not truth." What we can't verify, we don't put in. Forum posts don't count as reliable sources, and even press releases would be of limited use (if we had any). The only thing we have is that he was on the schedule for one of many music festivals, but we don't have proof that he won a competition, or that the competition is a major one like, say, the Eurovision_Song_Contest. Does that make things clearer? William Pietri 16:01, 20 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep PlayRadioPlay is a band with devoted followers that is known by far more than just "its local town". He's known by word of mouth by at least every kid in your normal highschool setting. if not as popular as hellogoodbye, without even having released his first album, he is moreso. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.113.55.94 (talk) 08:21, 20 February 2007 (UTC).[reply]

• Comment Please note:

• This is not a straw vote, simply restating what others have said before you does not further this discussion. If you have a new argument or proof of PlayRadioPlay!'s notability, please share it. Additionally, the fact that Dan Hunter is directing people to this page and the fact that the vast majority of the users voting to keep have no other contributions to this encyclopedia has not gone unnoticed.
• PlayRadioPlay! is not mentioned on either Stolen Transmission Records' or Island Records' website. No proof that it is signed to either company is given. Additionally, blogs or message boards are not considered reliable sources.
• Wikipedia is not MySpace. People go to MySpace to find and listen to bands they could not otherwise find, people go to Wikipedia for encyclopedic matters.
• "PRP! is notable because it will release an EP soon and it will be successful," "This is a band that will be huge in a few months," etc. is not a valid argument per WP:Crystal.
• "There are far worse wikipedia pages out there, go find them" is not a valid argument per WP:OTHERCRAPEXISTS.
• "Wikipedia was made to inform the masses on different subjects, INCLUDING bands," "Wikipedia is an informative source and should not have articles deleted because thet have no significance to an insignificant individual," etc. is not a valid argument per WP:ABOUTEVERYTHING.
• "If you get rid of this page, you get rid of my help. Martin Luther King Jr. helped people and he has a page. Why can't Dan? He has the right for freedom of speech and, if you delete this, you are suppressing his right." is not a valid argument per the true meaning of freedom of speech.
• "Even if a band is not 'worthy of a wikipedia page' why get rid of it just because one person thinks so?" is not a valid argument per WP:HARMLESS.
• "If this were to be banned, then so should most other bands" is not a valid argument per WP:ALLORNOTHING.

When PRP! does release an album and it turns out to be even mildly successful, sure that could make PRP! notable enough to include in Wikipedia. We're not saying it can never be included, just that it doesn't meet the requirements (yet).--Mbc362 16:46, 20 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Keep: u shouldnt delete this page because people luv this guys music and ur takin that away from them.Alot of poeple listen to his music,and its very important to Dan and fans that you dont close this page. I have one question for whoever is deleting this, have you heard this guys music? It keeeps me goin every day!=] Thank you and i hope you make the right descion.

Keep: I have something to say! FYI, just "someone" did NOT spam the PlayRadioPlay page! That someone was Dan, the writer and recorder and sole artist who made PlayRadioPlay! And now he is blocked for it! Here is his most recent blog that can be viewed on PlayRadioPlay's myspace.

"The Wikipedia Battle and New Song Leakage

)

First of all (hehe), this is going to sound unusual... A few days ago I logged onto Wikipedia.com and defaced the PlayRadioPlay Wikipedia page by changing all of the text to neon green and pink font, and adding "Daniel often spams his own Wikipedia page", among other things. Being the power-hungry little boy I am, I then went to the George W. Bush article and changed all of the font to red, white, and blue, and added, "Anybody that takes down the patriotic font hates America!" (Joking, of course).

Well, serious Wikipedians didn't like this and the change to the Dubya article was quickly reverted. Also, the PlayRadioPlay page (as well as the Sky Eats Airplane page, which I posted a few funny pictures of Lee from my private collection on) was DELETED!!! A few days later, someone was nice enough to post a new LONGER PlayRadioPlay page, and the veteran Wikipedians are trying to get it deleted AGAIN. Thanks to everyone so far that has voted to "keep" the wikipedia article! I would vote but... I'm banned from wikipedia :)

In closing, I've learned my lesson, I'll no longer deface Wikipedia articles... however fun and amusing it may be. Someone should also remake the Sky Eats Airplane Wikipedia article since I was accidently responsible for it's deletion and I feel bad :(.

The wikipedia article (Thank you Lisa Suarez!!) can be viewed here

...

Oh well, I love all of you! Thanks for being totally radical.

<3 Dan" --Hiding Talk 19:01, 20 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.