The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. OR, SYNTH Black Kite 19:00, 9 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Wii Series[edit]

Wii Series (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log)

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The "Wii Series" is not recognized at Nintendo websites and appears to be original research. Relevant content should be merged into Touch Generations. Aether7 (talk) 21:48, 2 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete per WP:OR and WP:NEO --Teancum (talk) 23:41, 2 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep. Of course "Wii series" isn't recognized at Nintendo websites. As I explained on the talk page months ago, "Wii Series" is an unofficial name for a group of games starting with the word "Wii" that are clearly part of a series, much like Wars (series). As these games are a well known video game series and are clearly notable, the article was built as "Wii Series". The only other possible name for this article would be "Wii (series)" (which I happen to think would be better, but that's irrelevent to this afd). --Yair rand (talk) 23:46, 2 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I think a similar discussion happened with Wars (series). The games seem to be part of a series, yet no official name has been given for it. Thus, the article is named for the common word of the games' names, which is "Wii" in this case. Nowhere would one be able to find the name "Wars series" used officially, yet the article still goes under that name. --Yair rand (talk) 00:08, 3 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I disagree. The primary name for that series is Famicom Wars, and I would support a move if it were proposed again. Just because some games in the series were neither for the original Famicom, nor included Famicom Wars in the title (the Game Boy Wars games), doesn't mean that it wasn't the name of the overall series. Contrary to some of the arguments in the "Move to Famicom Wars" discussion, the Advance Wars games and Battalion Wars games used the Famicom Wars naming in Japan. Naming aside, the crucial difference between that series and the so-called "Wii Series" is that Famicom Wars is officially acknowledged as a series. Dancter (talk) 02:13, 3 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I also disagree. It is the word "Wars" that connects those games as a series, not the name of the console. Also, the Wars series is all part of the same genre. Sports, Music, Fitness, (and Chess if I may) however are all different. You say that the Wii games listed are part of a series because they have the word "Wii" in it; how would it be much different if I said Bass Hunter 64 and Donkey Kong 64 are part of a series because they both have "64" in it? Games with words like "Famicom", "Game Boy", "64", "Wii", etc. are not part of a series because they are on the same console and named after it. Aether7 (talk) 16:38, 3 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I'm not sure if you're trying to support my argument or undermine it. I was trying to explain that the "Famicom Wars" naming persisted long after that series moved on to other consoles. Despite the use of the word "Famicom", the Famicom Wars name came to mean its own thing, apart from the console. It's not the same thing as the "64" designations. Dancter (talk) 18:16, 3 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I did not say that they are part of a series because they all have "Wii" in the name, I said that the article should be named "Wii series" or "Wii (series)" because they all have "Wii" in the name and there is no official name available. The article is not about the name "Wii series", it is about the currently unnamed series of which all titles begin with "Wii". --Yair rand (talk) 19:07, 3 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

To Dancter: My earlier comments were responding to Yar rand with my own reasons for disagreeing, not trying to undermine your comments. To clarify, it is the name "Wars" that has continously persisted throughout the series in multiple regions. "Famicom" has persisted in Japan and "Advance" has also persisted into the games on the DS. This is all just further indication that the Wars series is truly a series. While I agree that "Famicom" and "Advance" have come to mean its own thing for the Wars series, this is not the case in my comparison of the "Wii" and "64" designations. Aether7 (talk) 19:47, 3 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

To Yar rand: Ok, so you disregarding the name "Wii" as indication of these games being a series. What other evidence is there that these games are intended to be a series? Aether7 (talk) 19:47, 3 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Wii Sports Resort is a sequel to Wii Sports. Wii Sports Resort's location (the Wuhu Island) is the same at Wii Fit and Wii Fit Plus, and Wii Sports Resort reuses a game from Wii Play. Yeah, I know, what I just said is OR, but you asked the question. Angryapathy (talk) 20:18, 3 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

If Nintendo were to make a statement calling it the "Wuhu Island series" you might have something there. Table tennis in Wii Play does not even compare with table tennis in Wii Sports Resort. Aether7 (talk) 21:01, 3 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Comment As for the original question in this AfD, should the content be merged with Touch Generations, I see no sources that include this "Wii series" with Touch Generations. Angryapathy (talk) 14:43, 4 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment - since Sport, Fit, Play and Music have different development teams, isn't this just a "List of games published by Nintendo that begin with the word 'Wii'"? Marasmusine (talk) 14:24, 3 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep While the title of the page may not be a universal term, the page itself reflects key titles released by Nintendo which have been specifically designed for the capabilities of the Wii. The issue to me is the title, not the content of the page. Angryapathy (talk) 16:43, 3 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Additional comment A quick persual of the web gave me this article, "here", which says, "Miyamoto described 'Wii Music' as one of the fundamental Wii games that was in development at the same time as 'Wii Sports,' 'Wii Play' and 'Wii Fit.'" Obviously they have an assocation, even if they don't have a specific name. Angryapathy (talk) 17:01, 3 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Comment What you describe is part of the focus of Touch Generations which these games were later associated with. I am looking to merge relevant content to that article. Do you still want to keep or would you rather merge? Aether7 (talk) 17:10, 3 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Comment (I oppose merge) - There is nothing to merge. None of the material in the Wii Series article is worthwhile merging into a Touch Generations article because none of the refrencing support or mention Touch Generations. If anybody has new material related to Touch Generations, then it can be added to that article. -- Whpq (talk) 14:56, 4 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I forgot about statements such as that. I still think that the article is problematic, presenting the games in manner not generally reflected outside Wikipedia. I would still favor only strictly verifiable information about a series, meaning that use of the "Wii Series" name be minimized, the synthetic reception section and figures be removed, and that the bulleted list and table be replaced with contextual prose. I don't want this to become another "nth generation" situation, in which original research becomes entrenched, circularly justifying itself when outside sources cite Wikipedia. Dancter (talk) 18:16, 3 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Comment - It is not "obvious" this is a "series" without any sources to indicate that Nintendo is doing these games as a "series" as opposed to being games that all happen to require specific capabilities of the Wii and are therefore not on other platforms. Really, with the available sourcing, all you could do is make a list of games from Nintendo that are exclusive to the Wii. -- Whpq (talk) 19:41, 3 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Comment As for the original question in this AfD (I suggest everyone read that this is a merge proposal, not an outright deletion), should the content be merged with Touch Generations, I see no sources that include this "Wii series" with Touch Generations. Angryapathy (talk) 14:43, 4 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Comment This is still just a deletion proposal. I said "relevant content should be merged", that is to say if there is anything relevant to merge. Upon further comparison of the two articles, I agree with Whpq's comment that there is really nothing to merge. Aether7 (talk) 16:30, 4 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete as original research. There is no sources identifying this as a series. That they all have Wii in the title is likely to do with the fact that they are Wii-exclusive titles and represents a consistent branding for their product. -- Whpq (talk) 17:16, 3 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete - For starters, the article's title is spelled wrong. You don't capitalized words like "Series" if its not part of a proper title. Secondly, this is just a list of Wii games that has the word "Wii" on its title. It would be like creating a list of every GBA game that has the word "Advance" on their titles and calling the article "Advance Series". Jonny2x4 (talk) 14:32, 4 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The basis of this being a series is not that they all have "Wii" in the title. There are dozens of games that have "Wii" in the title. This refers to a group of games that are collections of smaller games that all take place on Wuhu Island, use Miis as playable characters, are "designed to appeal to a wide audience extended beyond the traditional gamer demographic", developed and published by Nintendo, and use the features of one of the various Wii devices as the basis of the game. --Yair rand (talk) 15:17, 4 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Unless Nintendo officially classifies them as a group where you can yank off the "Wii" at the start as a floating term (that's what needing an article for a series is), we have no right to change how they use the name of their trademarked software titles. Period. ♪ daTheisen(talk) 15:39, 4 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete as video game WP:SYNTH gibberish. If this sticks, I'm going to have to insist that a "Super (series)" article get created to needlessly confuse readers by re-categorizing every Super Nintendo game released with a name beginning in "Super" (there are about 260). Each game starting with "Wii" is a separate title and they have no relation other than their publisher (Nintendo) and the decision to give them an incredibly simple name so that it'd be easy product recognition. Just because it's in the same fictional place or, um. Ok, I'm going to go with disagree+2 based on what the "definition" of this series was just given to be. For a more realistic comparison, do we have a single tag (series) article for the 16 original SNES game releases? Those were all meant to compliment one another to welcome in new players just as the WiiSomethings are. ♪ daTheisen(talk) 15:39, 4 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Weak delete – While we know what the series of Wii games is called, we don't know what, as no one has bothered coining the term for the series' name, nor has anyone verifiable acknowledged that there is a series. Otherwise, I agree with the original research and verifiability concerns here. Now if there was something here verifiable that this is all in a series and is named as such, then I would favor keeping it. MuZemike 00:43, 9 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.