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August 19

Category:Raine's School

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The result of the debate was delete --Kbdank71 15:03, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Delete seems to be a hoax ... -- ProveIt (talk) 00:01, 20 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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Category:IPod

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The result of the debate was rename/merge as nominated --Kbdank71 15:01, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Merge into Category:IPods. -- ProveIt (talk) 23:48, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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Category:Jim Carrey films

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The result of the debate was speedy delete G4. Sango123 17:55, 20 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Delete per Wikipedia:Categories_for_deletion/Log/2006_April_3#Category:Jim_Carrey_films. -- ProveIt (talk) 23:44, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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Category:Cancelled albums

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The result of the debate was rename/merge as nominated --Kbdank71 15:00, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Cancelled albums into Category:Unreleased albums

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Category:"100 Greatest Cartoons"

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The result of the debate was delete --Kbdank71 15:00, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Category:"100 Greatest Cartoons" (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

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Wikipedians by birth

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The result of the debate was rename/merge as nominated except for Users born in Czechoslovakia (no consensus) --Kbdank71 14:51, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Mostly fine set of categories, with a couple hiccups:

I left category:Happy Birthday! alone because it's harmless, elegantly named, and probably contains some very sophisticated architecture I don't want to disrupt. The Czech one seems odd, but there are no other parallel categories and the user in question is Slovak, not Czech. And before judging the "non-stereotypical" one, I encourage folks to check out how big it is.--Mike Selinker 18:57, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

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Category:Dark ambient

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The result of the debate was found deleted --Kbdank71 14:52, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Dark ambient (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

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Category:Fort Worthians

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The result of the debate was rename to Category:People from Fort Worth (and in line with previous similar cfds I will leave a cat redirect). --RobertG ♬ talk 09:50, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Fort Worthians to Category:People from Fort Worth, Texas

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Wikipedians by politics

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The result of the debate was rename/merge as nominated --Kbdank71 14:47, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

  • is there a category for pro-monarchist Wikipedians?? Rhyddfrydol 21:38, 22 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Two main formats here: “X Wikipedians” for parties and basic ideologies, and “Wikipedians who support/oppose X” for things and concepts. This is potentially contentious, so please assume good faith.--Mike Selinker 17:56, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

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Category:Sexy Wikipedians

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The result of the debate was delete --Kbdank71 14:54, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

See: Wikipedia:Categories_for_deletion/Log/2006_August_16#Category:Sex_Symbols. -- ProveIt (talk) 17:16, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • How exactly does adding a userbox make the category worse? I wasn't aware that the userbox had been deleted twice already, and I have no idea what the deleted content was. You cannot say that the deleted userbox was not an improvement on the category. Crisonastick 23:59, 26 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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Category:Accounting

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The result of the debate was delete --Kbdank71 14:59, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Delete - This +cat existed before and was replaced by Category:Accountancy. It should be deleted quickly before anymore +tags get attached and a major clean up needed. What123 16:31, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Comment - There is nothing to merge, this is a category. All the entries are in Category:Accountancy, which use to be called Category:Accounting and it was voted on and renamed Category:Accountancy as this is the name of the main article Accountancy. What123 18:08, 20 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Comment - it was Category:Accounting and then there was a vote to rename it Category:Accountancy it would be insane to keep changing the name back and forth. What123 23:25, 20 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Second time is the charm? If the change was made in error, it should be changed back. Obviously we can't keep debating the same thing over and over, but two debates does not seem extreme to me. --best, kevin [kzollman][talk] 23:29, 20 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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Category:Cricket grounds in the United Kingdom

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The result of the debate was keep --Kbdank71 14:57, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

speedy delete - category has been empty for several days and is both redundant and superfluous given that correct categories for grounds in England, Scotland, Wales and Ireland already exist. -- BlackJack | talk page 16:19, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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Category:Eleanor Powell films

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The result of the debate was delete --Kbdank71 14:44, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Delete as recreation of Category:Films by actor. -- ProveIt (talk) 15:59, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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Category:Samuel L. Jackson Films

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The result of the debate was delete --Kbdank71 14:43, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Delete since Category:Films by actor killed April 11, 2006. -- ProveIt (talk) 15:54, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Good question, here is the answer: The point of a category is to browse to other articles related to a topic that would otherwise be difficult to find. In the case of films by actor categories, this information can be found in the article. Virtually every article about actors has a filmography. If it doesn't it should have one. Imagine that every film gets fully categorized into every actor's subcategory. Films with large casts will have scores of categories that add virtually nothing useful. The articles about the films have the cast listed, and the articles about the actors have the films listed. Making these categories is a wasted effort. We end up with clutter that has little or no added usefulness. -- Samuel Wantman
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Category:Planetshakers Albums

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The result of the debate was rename/merge as nominated --Kbdank71 14:41, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

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Category:Nature's Best

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The result of the debate was keep --Kbdank71 14:35, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Nature's Best (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

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Category:Solid Steel

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The result of the debate was rename/merge as nominated --Kbdank71 14:33, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Solid Steel into Category:Ninja Tune albums

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Category:British Islamist terrorists

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The result of the debate was keep --Kbdank71 14:32, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Category:British Islamist terrorists (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

  • Comment. After reading WP:NCCAT and it's numerous subpages, I am not understanding your example. Priests; Roman Catholic priests; Italian priests; Italian Roman Catholic priests. If we follow Wikipedia:Naming conventions (precision) which do you feel would be the most appropriate? - Jc37 17:43, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Your example is actually quite different than the nominated cat. RC priests are a subset, categorized by nationality in some cases. Perfectly valid. However, you will notice that Islamists are a subset of Muslims, not criminals, which contains terrorists: two separate sets. In such cases, we categorize by a generic description of the event, or by the name of the group. That is, in fact what was done to contain members of the RC sex scandal; they have their own cat which is a subset of both religion and crime. —Viriditas | Talk 02:32, 20 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • It sounds like your concern is the order of the modifiers, since the name appears to be a merger of two concepts: British terrorists and Islamic extremist terrorists (both of which apply to those within this category, I presume). I might support a 'Rename adding "extremist" to the name. And is there a difference between saying Muslim extremist and Islamic extremist? Apparently there is a difference between Islamic and Islamist. (The latter being extremists.) (See also Muslim#Disagreements and Islamic extremist terrorism.) - Jc37 03:26, 20 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Entities of type Y are subtypes of entity type X if and only if every Y is necessarily an X. Terrorists are types of criminals; Islamists are types of Muslims. Muslims are not types of criminals. For example, in the case of the Roman Catholic sex abuse cases, members of the Roman Catholic church were named and implicated. Categories describing the nationality, church position, and crime of each person were not created due to the reasons above. Instead, a general category was created for the scandal itself (Category:Roman Catholic Church sex abuse scandal), and that cat was populated with members who maintained their original categories, such as by conviction (sex offender), by position (American Roman Catholic priests), and other crime cats (American rapists). The categorization of terrorists is no different than that of sex offenders. We do not mix religion and crime; instead we create a new category that either represents the incident or group, and categorize appropriately. This leaves the current categorization scheme intact while adding a new relationship. End result: Category:British Islamists and Category:British terrorists will be populated with the members of Category:British Islamist terrorists, and a new category will be added describing the relationship between the two. One solution might be to add relevant terrorist incident cats (for example Category:July 2005 London bombings) to relevant members, as the need arises. Notice, then, that all descriptive information has been accurately represented and preserved. —Viriditas | Talk 06:00, 20 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • I notice that you've added more information to the nom. Now the concern is citations for each individual in the category? Anyway, concerning the name: according to Wikipedia:Naming conventions (precision) as much information as necessary should be included. So in this case, it's either keep or rename (I'll vote below) - Jc37 01:34, 21 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • You need to look at Wikipedia:Naming conventions (categories) and Wikipedia:Categorization of people. We don't categorize terrorists by religion, but by nationality. Furthermore, the members in the current category cannot be verified; in some cases the group or incident can be verified, and as such provides an additional categorization. There is no precedent for this current categorization which combines two disparate sets of data to form an inaccurate, subjective, inconsistent categorization method. To date, there has not been a single good argument to keep this category. Essentially, you are saying we should create Category:American Roman Catholic priest rapists. This is absurd. We don't use the category system like this. —Viriditas | Talk 01:46, 21 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment: Islamism and Terrorism are two distinct data sets. We categorize by one or the other, not both. The current scheme places two categories on each page, a Category:British terrorists, and a Category:Islamists, if they apply. A third category, describing the terrorist incident in question, may be added for additional information. This current category disrupts this scheme and enforces the POV of the person who created the category. Muslims aren't a type of criminal, and all Islamists aren't terrorists. When we need to describe a group of terrorists, we use the name of the terrorist group; we do not describe them by their religion. —Viriditas | Talk 01:54, 21 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Atm I don't see a reason in your arguement to change my vote, however, I am more than willing to hear your thoughts. I don't see the validity of not including British + Islamist terrorist in the title of the category. Can you give me specific quotations? - Jc37 05:13, 21 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • I gave many reasons why the category doesn't work, but the simplest one is that of consistency. Long time Wikipedian User:GCarty created this cat on Aug. 11, 2006, in response to the August 10, 2006 transatlantic aircraft plot investigation, so it cannot be said to be based on actual research. As for consistency, GCarty also created Category:American Islamist terrorists previously on Feb 12. All three of the members of that cat duplicate Category:Al-Qaeda members, which is already a member of Category:Islamist groups, so there is no justification for this category in the first place: GCarty's categorization scheme does not add new information but in fact duplicates it, in addition to distorting the occupation by nationality scheme by adding religion. In no other instance is a set of religious people mixed with a set of criminals, even though Wikipedia is full of religious terrorism spanning the spectrum, from American Christian terrorists like Eric Robert Rudolph, Ugandan Christian terrorists like Joseph Kony, and all the rest. For some strange reason, when it comes to categorizing Muslims, people lose their ability to reason. For the record, I am not a Muslim. —Viriditas | Talk 09:21, 21 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • I wasn't expecting this category to be branded Islamophobic. I was simply trying to classify terrorists by ideology as well as by nationality. If the August 2006 airliner bomb plot is conclusively linked to al-Qaeda, then the category could be renamed Category:British al-Qaeda members. --GCarty 10:47, 21 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Hi. Category:Criminals is not classified by ideology, but by type of crime, like the example Jc37 gave about the RC priests; it's the same set of articles. —Viriditas | Talk 12:07, 21 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • First, thank you for your response. You've added new perspective to the information for me (and information is what we all need for a discerning choice : ) I was hoping for some specific quotes from policies or even guidelines (since I haven't found several of your points on the pages noted) You'll also please pardon me if I feel like this is similar to an old Algebra class I had regarding sets and sub-sets. If A = British + Islamist + terrorist, then A belongs to several sets: The British set, the Islamist set, the terrorist set, the British Islamist set, the Islamist terrorist set, the British terrorist set, and the British Islamist terrorist set. Each of those sets are potential categories. I'm still not seeing why a specific person "A" cannot belong to each of these sets. This obviously is not dealing with the question of whether those currently in the "set" (category) are each actually congruent to "A". Incidentally, does a category of American Roman Catholic priests executed after being considered criminals in China, while long, sound like a legitimate category to you? - Jc37 00:05, 22 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • British people belongs to People and Categories by nationality. People and Religion are both children of Society. That's the relationship. Religion is not a member of People, but Beliefs, which in turn belongs to Thoughts. There is no overlap at this level, but they do overlap in many sub-cats. Yes, some criminals are Muslim, but all Muslims are not criminals. So these people can belong to other sets, but we don't do it due to overcategorization. Why should we list criminals by belief; why not shoe size or hair color? This form of categorization implies that Muslims are types of criminals. The category doesn't work that way; it's sorted by occupation. The identity of the criminal is defined by the type of crime. I've looked throughout the Criminals cat to find something approaching "British Islamist terrorists" and came up empty. We must be consistent. What is an "Islamist terrorist"? It is usually defined as a group, and that is how it should be listed. Terrorists are listed by nationality, group name (if any), and when appropriate, by another type of criminal act, such as hijackings. Category:People by religion and occupation does not seem to be populated by criminals or nationality, although some categories have used nationality due to size. Again, no terrorists, but this category is a complete mess. Persian mathematicians are a member of Muslim mathematicians, so all Persian mathematicians are Muslim? Same goes for Arab mathematicians. How interesting, the Jewish scientist Mashallah is categorized as a Muslim as a result. It doesn't end there, either. I could go on, but why? The categories are completely out of control. Why are occupations being classified by religion? Christian pet detectives? Zoroastrian street sweepers? Where does it end? As for the priests: Chinese executions and People executed by method would be appropriate. If there is a group of ten or more, adding a new category which describes the group and incident at a certain level is encouraged. Victims of human rights abuses has Political prisoners, but People imprisoned or executed for their religion, or some such variant would work, which could then belong to Chinese repressions, as well as others. —Viriditas | Talk 04:18, 22 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Why does it make sense to categorize terrorists by nationality, and by type of action, but not by ideology (Islamist, nationalist, separatist, communist, neo-Nazi, anarchist, animal rights)? --GCarty 11:52, 22 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Before I respond, does anyone know if there is a point that we should move a discussion to the talk page?
Ok, you (Viriditas) have brought up some interesting points that I'd like to consider/respond to.
    1. "There is no overlap at this level, but they do overlap in many sub-cats." - Such as this one, I presume?
    2. "Yes, some criminals are Muslim, but all Muslims are not criminals." - I don't think that that is being disputed at all.
    3. "This form of categorization implies that Muslims are types of criminals." - In this case, I disagree. You've actually argued against this reading by claiming that "terrorist" is an occupation (which also may or may not be true.) British Islamist cab drivers would not presume that all Islamists are cab drivers, just that those in this specific category are (that these belong to this sub-set).
    4. "So these people can belong to other sets, but we don't do it due to overcategorization." - citation and reason please? An example I find is Abdul Nacer Benbrika under Category:Muslim activists This person (according to the article) is a terrorist, as well as an activist. By his inclusion in this category, should we presume that all activists are terroists? Obviously not.
    5. "Why should we list criminals by belief; why not shoe size or hair color?" I think a direct analogy would be the "The Red-Headed League", a group from a case of Arthur Conan Doyle's Sherlock Holmes. Since the criminality stems from the circumstancial (whether extremist muslim, or having red hair) then I do think it's notable.
    6. "I've looked throughout the Criminals cat to find something approaching "British Islamist terrorists" and came up empty." Category:Provisional Irish Republican Army members Nationality + Belief + terroist.
    7. "this category is a complete mess." and "The categories are completely out of control." Find an appropriate talk page somewhere, list it at the WIkipedia:Village pump, get a discussion started, and let's get it fixed by concensus. : )
    8. "Why are occupations being classified by religion?" Why not? - Jc37 12:21, 22 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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Category:Japanese actress

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The result of the debate was rename/merge as nominated --Kbdank71 14:30, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Merge into Category:Japanese actors. -- ProveIt (talk) 14:56, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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Category:Tommy February6 releases

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The result of the debate was rename/merge as nominated --Kbdank71 14:26, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

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Category:Actors who portrayed The Mad Hatter (Batman)

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The result of the debate was delete --Kbdank71 14:25, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Actors who portrayed The Mad Hatter (Batman) (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

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Category:Freiburg School and Category:Freiburg School economists

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The result of the debate was keep/withdrawn --Kbdank71 14:22, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Delete Obscure claimed school. Main category has one eponymous article and subcategory has three stubby entries JQ 11:43, 8 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so that consensus may be reached.
 Please add new discussions below this notice. Thanks, the wub "?!" 13:13, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

And economics is important to all our lives. Thanks Hmains 16:17, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

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Category:Canadian Football League punt returners

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The result of the debate was rename/merge both to Category:Canadian football return specialists --Kbdank71 14:21, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

POST-CLOSING UPDATE: I noted that Dale and I made a mistake in our suggestion to rename, in that all these subcategories are "Canadian Football League (X)", not "Canadian football (X)". So I changed the closing instructions to "Canadian Football League return specialists".--Mike Selinker 14:47, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Merge into Category:Canadian Football League kick returners. --Amchow78 (talk) Amchow78 19:30, 8 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so that consensus may be reached.
 Please add new discussions below this notice. Thanks, the wub "?!" 13:11, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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Category:Municipalities in Spain and all of its subcategories to Category:Municipalities of Spain

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The result of the debate was no consensus --Kbdank71 14:15, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Moved from speedy after dicussion. Vegaswikian 22:09, 8 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

per naming conventions. Tim! 19:29, 4 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so that consensus may be reached.
 Please add new discussions below this notice. Thanks, the wub "?!" 13:04, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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Category:Giant Panda (Hip Hop)

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The result of the debate was rename/merge as nominated --Kbdank71 14:06, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Giant Panda (Hip Hop) to Category:Giant Panda albums

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Category:Rayons of Azerbaijan

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The result of the debate was rename/merge as nominated --Kbdank71 14:05, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Rayons of Azerbaijan to Category:Districts of Azerbaijan
Rationale: To use standard English term. David Kernow 10:42, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

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Category:Lobbying groups

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The result of the debate was rename/merge as nominated --Kbdank71 14:04, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Lobbying groups into Category:Advocacy groups

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Category:Celebrities with MySpace accounts

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The result of the debate was delete --Kbdank71 13:58, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Celebrities with MySpace accounts (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

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Category:Commonwealth Sport

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The result of the debate was no consensus --Kbdank71 14:01, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Commonwealth Sport to Category:Category:Commonwealth of Nations sports competitions (changed - see below)

  • The problem with that is that it implies that these things are actually organised by the CofN - ie. "official" - I very much doubt if that is true, at least for some of them? --Mais oui! 12:25, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
    • Category:Sports events associated with the Commonwealth of Nations...?  Regards, David 13:46, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Perhaps the category could be renamed Category:Sport in the Commonwealth of Nations Petepetepete 13:58, 21 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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Category:Entertainers from Creole Decent

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The result of the debate was delete --Kbdank71 13:57, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Entertainers from Creole Decent (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

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Category:Rock'n'Roll

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The result of the debate was delete --Kbdank71 13:52, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Rock'n'Roll (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

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Category:Bassists

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The result of the debate was ok, let me know when it's done. I have no idea how to divide them. --Kbdank71 13:44, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Members should be divided between Category:Double-bassists, Category:Bass guitarists, and Category:Musicians. -- ProveIt (talk) 06:01, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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Category:Fictional South Park foods

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The result of the debate was rename/merge as nominated --Kbdank71 13:46, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Fictional South Park foods (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

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Category:Georgia maps

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The result of the debate was delete, empty --Kbdank71 13:49, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Georgia maps into Category:Maps of Georgia (country)

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