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April 5

Category:Estuaries of Cardiff

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: merge to appropriate parents. – Fayenatic London 16:20, 4 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: Superfluous category - there are no estuaries of Cardiff. Cardiff is a city on the Severn Estuary and is unlikely to find itself on any other estuaries in the foreseeable future. Sionk (talk) 00:07, 6 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Agree And the same applies to the other subcategories of Category:Estuaries of Wales etc. England and Scotland both have only one or two categories for estuaries.
Note -- None of the categories are tagged. Peterkingiron (talk) 17:18, 6 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
I've tagged the categories (didn't see that step, these are my first CfD noms). I've also nominated the other 7 Wales estuary categories for deletion. Sionk (talk) 22:51, 7 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
I've also added back Category:Estuaries of Wales to Severn Estuary, as suggested by BrownHairedGirl. Sionk (talk) 17:14, 16 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Bays of Cardiff

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: delete. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 17:11, 14 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: A patently ridiculous and superfluous category when you consider there is only one Cardiff Bay with nil chance of there being any others. Sionk (talk) 23:49, 5 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Television towers in Japan

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: rename all per nominator. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 17:13, 14 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: Rename. I looked at the 4 articles in the Japan category and other then the name on two of them, there is nothing defining about them being a TV tower. One does not even discuss what the tower is used for and another mentions its use as a radio relay. Communications is one of the parent categories. Depending on how the early discussion goes, I may elect to add the others or it this gains consensus the others can be done as speedies. Vegaswikian (talk) 23:46, 5 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
All of the related categories have been added to the nomination. Vegaswikian (talk) 01:57, 7 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
There are more than 4 articles in Category:Television towers in India. Shyamsunder (talk) 06:10, 6 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
At the time of that comment, the only one listed was Japan which has only 4 articles. There never was a claim that all of the categories to be listed would only have 4 articles. Vegaswikian (talk) 23:59, 6 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Cross and Circle games

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: speedy rename per WP:C2C. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 15:18, 10 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: At present, the article that is the main of this category is entitled Cross and circle game. pbp 20:46, 5 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Czech Board Games games

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: speedy delete per creator's request (WP:CSD#G7). --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 21:20, 5 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: I got the name wrong. Should have proposed rename, but had created new category already. --Craw-daddy | T | 16:48, 5 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Fictional Druids

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: rename. Good Ol’factory (talk) 02:39, 24 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: The word "druid" seems to be lowercased in most contexts, including in the article druid. Some of these characters are from Shannara, where the word "Druid" is more of a rank. But I don't think that means the category should have that capitalization inherent to it.-- Mike Selinker (talk) 15:12, 5 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Put another way this seems to be categorizing that things in fiction are called Druids, but it is unclear that they really share anything besides the name.John Pack Lambert (talk) 01:00, 10 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
This comment makes no sense. We are not discussing any of these things here. Do you want to merge this to some other category? What category?John Pack Lambert (talk) 20:22, 12 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
There is a suggestion at Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/Log/2013_April_30#Category:Fictional_sorcerers to merge sorcerers into wizards and sorceresses into witches. I'm not convinced that "druids" is quite close enough for that. – Fayenatic London 16:08, 4 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Argentine rugby union teams

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: no consensus. Good Ol’factory (talk) 03:36, 27 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Propose renaming Category:Argentine rugby union teams to Category:Argentine rugby union clubs
  • Propose renaming Category:Austrian rugby union teams to Category:Austrian rugby union clubs
  • Propose renaming Category:Bermudian rugby union teams (sic) to Category:Bermudan rugby union clubs
  • Propose renaming Category:Bulgarian rugby union teams to Category:Bulgarian rugby union clubs
  • Propose renaming Category:Croatian rugby union teams to Category:Croatian rugby union clubs
  • Propose renaming Category:Czech rugby union teams to Category:Czech rugby union clubs
  • Propose renaming Category:Danish rugby union teams to Category:Danish rugby union clubs
  • Propose renaming Category:Greek rugby union teams to Category:Greek rugby union clubs
  • Propose renaming Category:Hungarian rugby union teams to Category:Hungarian rugby union clubs
  • Propose renaming Category:Indian rugby union teams to Category:Indian rugby union clubs
  • Propose renaming Category:Irish rugby union teams to Category:Irish rugby union clubs
  • Propose renaming Category:Irish rugby union teams by county to Category:Irish rugby union clubs by county
  • Propose renaming Category:Lithuanian rugby union teams to Category:Lithuanian rugby union clubs
  • Propose renaming Category:Moldovan rugby union teams to Category:Moldovan rugby union clubs
  • Propose renaming Category:Pakistani rugby union teams to Category:Pakistani rugby union clubs
  • Propose renaming Category:Polish rugby union teams to Category:Polish rugby union clubs
  • Propose renaming Category:Romanian rugby union teams to Category:Romanian rugby union clubs
  • Propose renaming Category:Serbian rugby union teams to Category:Serbian rugby union clubs
  • Propose renaming Category:Slovak rugby union teams to Category:Slovak rugby union clubs
Nominator's rationale: Rename. The choice of "club" and "team" within Category:Rugby union teams is not consistent, and should follow local usage. That head category is not even consistent with Category:Rugby union players by club. Most of the contents of the nominated categories use the word "club", and so do the corresponding Category:Rugby union players in Argentina by club, Category:Rugby union players in Ireland by club. Moreover, Category:Rugby union-related lists has more articles called "List of rugby union clubs in Foo" than "List of Fooian rugby union teams". – Fayenatic London 09:43, 5 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
That wasn't quite my intention. Rugby is one of the most club-centric team sports, in the UK at least - the original Baa-Baa's are structured as a club (so that's one example of people playing for two clubs in a season), and their French equivalents likewise (my point was I'm not sure about NZ rather than about Barbarians in general), ditto university sides (unlike most US sports). I'm quite a rugby fan and I'm struggling to think of any example of a UK team that would have an article on the "team" rather than the club/union. The Army/Navy were the only ones that came to mind as possibilities, but I see they are unions in their own right (equivalent to the county organisations), so are categorised under Category:Rugby union governing bodies in England. The Lions would not be categorised as a Fooian team being multinational (although as a combined UK/Eire entity they're little different to the Ireland "national" team) and looking at Category:Multinational rugby union teams suggests we'll never have many articles on rugby teams (as opposed to clubs or unions). It's not like cricket where it's common to have a Joe Bloggs XI (or more likely the Duke of Bloggs XI!). So from a purely British perspective, having cleared up my own query on Army/Navy, I'm happy with the idea of rugby sticking to Fooian clubs. I don't know about how things are organised in other countries, but I imagine they will follow the British system of clubs and sides representing unions at province/state level.Le Deluge (talk) 16:01, 9 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Well I'm not convinced that even in England the idea of classifying all teams as clubs/unions is correct. Why are the unions synonymous with teams—we have an article for England national rugby union team (note the use of the word team) and the Rugby Football Union? For example the Army Union is not the same as the army team - does the union not administer several sides (I imagine there is more than one side/team under their administration) What about County sides? Provincial unions and provincial representative sides also should not necessarily have merged articles. We are talking about the countries above of course. Anyway take for example [1] [2] [3] - examples in Argentina, England, and France where an international side played non-club, non-provincial sides. My opposition stands to the name change; I'm not sure what the motivation for it is, other than have every country classify their teams/clubs/sides etc the same. My advice is make Category:XXXX rugby union teams the parent category for Category:XXXX rugby union clubs. - Shudde talk 11:40, 10 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

The Holocaust in Yugoslavia

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: merge. I will do this merger manually, as some of the other head categories also look appropriate in some cases. – Fayenatic London 17:43, 15 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: The category should be based on the country name, not poorly defined subdivisions. They are all seriously overcategorised. For the information of editors not familar with the history of Yugoslavia in WWII, Yugoslavia was partitioned in 1941 and none of these countries existed in their current boundaries between 1941-45. They were split between Germany, Italy, Hungary, Bulgaria and Italian Albania, and an Axis puppet state the "Independent State of Croatia". There is also no mention of two other modern countries, Montenegro, and Bosnia and Herzegovina. Peacemaker67 (send... over) 08:22, 5 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Merge A holocaust related event that occurred in say, Bačka or Syrmia, would be quite hard to categorize (Hungary, Independent State of Croatia or Serbia). On top of that there are separate categories for the Independent State of Croatia and Croatia complicating things further and forcing editors to resort to arbitrary, not necessarily consistent categorization decisions.--Tomobe03 (talk) 12:32, 5 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Merge - but how about Category:The Holocaust in the Balkans? Given the potential for pedantry, it might be better to go geographical.Le Deluge (talk) 17:55, 5 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
The Balkans is a poorly defined geographic region. Slovenia is sometimes excluded, and Greece is sometimes included. Yugoslavia's pre-war borders were clearly defined. Peacemaker67 (send... over) 00:19, 6 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Merge - per nominator's reason. As for the Balkins? That should be merged to Category:The Holocaust in the Soviet Union -- GoodDay (talk) 22:07, 5 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • I think you are confusing the Balkans with something else. Under most definitions of the Balkans, they do not include the Soviet Union. They generally include what was Yugosalvia, Greece, Albania, Bulgaria and normally Romania. The inclusion of Slovenia is a bit iffy though, and Romania allows us to maybe include Bessarabia, but that was not even pre-war Soviet Union.
  • You're correct. I getting confused with the Baltic states. GoodDay (talk) 14:38, 6 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
agreed. Peacemaker67 (send... over) 05:49, 6 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Looks to me like we're all in violent agreement... Peacemaker67 (send... over) 05:27, 8 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
I do have to point out though that the claim "European boundaries have been stabel since WWI" is bunk. 3 countries have fragmented. Poland, Czechoslovakia and Romania all lots significant chunks of land after WWII, and Yugoslavia and France gained land from Italy (although very little in France's case). Most of the countries of central Europe had very different boundaries in 1930 than they do today. Greece also experienced boundary changes after WWII, since it gainsed some islands from Italy.John Pack Lambert (talk) 01:04, 10 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
I understand your point, but I don't think that has much of an impact on this discussion though. The pre-war boundaries were clear, and the exclusion of areas that were in Italy before the war and Yugoslavia afterwards would be excluded in the scope statement for the category. Peacemaker67 (send... over) 11:58, 10 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:1992 in the Czech Republic

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: merge. Good Ol’factory (talk) 03:38, 27 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Propose merging
Nominator's rationale: The Czech Republic was created on 1 January 1993. Events of 1992 in that area took place in Czechoslovakia. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 06:59, 5 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Since Bohemia and Moravia were not distinct entites after 1948, your argument makes no sense at all. There is a Czech entity as a distinct sub-national entity on par with Slovakia from 1969 forward.John Pack Lambert (talk) 20:26, 12 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Albums arranged by Donovan

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: delete. Good Ol’factory (talk) 03:39, 27 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: Delete. Just one example of a pop album in which the arranger is not a defining characteristic of the album any more than who engineered it or who mixed it, as opposed to say something like Category:Albums arranged by Nelson Riddle, which seems somewhat relevant. --StarcheerspeaksnewslostwarsTalk to me 06:15, 5 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Cultural Sites on the UNESCO World Heritage Tentative List

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: delete. Good Ol’factory (talk) 03:40, 27 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Propose deleting Category:Cultural Sites on the UNESCO World Heritage Tentative List (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
  • Propose deleting Category:Tentative World Heritage Sites in Nigeria
  • Propose deleting Category:Tentative World Heritage Sites in Serbia
Nominator's rationale: Being on the Tentative List (TL) is (according to the World Heritage Site article) a status conferred by a country - it's not an award conferred by UNESCO. Being on the TL is not a defining characteristic (e.g. few articles in the category mention it in the lead) and (IMO) it fails WP:OC#AWARD as (by definition) it's not the top international award in its field. Membership of this category may also be non-permanent as it's unclear whether an article about a site that is promoted to a WHS (or removed from the TL) should be removed from this category.

Note: The category was renamed by a 2009 CFD, but that CFD was not discussing the existence of the category. DexDor (talk) 05:49, 5 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

No, it doesn't, because it is not an award. It is a level of listing in cultural registers, and one that is much higher than a basic national listing, which we accept everywhere as defining. There is some strange thinking going on here. Note that for most of the Global South we don't have "national monument" type categories, and on a small sample of articles I did, these were the only cultural register type category the articles had. Johnbod (talk) 13:04, 15 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

:: I don't agree with the nominator's rationale which I interpret like this:

  • If TL status is conferred by UNESCO then it is permanent and defining characteristic
  • If TL status is conferred by a state then it may not be permanent and not defining characteristic
  • Conclusion: this category should be deleted per WP:OC#AWARD
I think that WP:OC#AWARD does not even mention state/international levels or permanent/temporary characteristic. --Antidiskriminator (talk) 11:53, 5 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Isn't that a WP:OTHERSTUFF argument ? The NRHP and listed building categories keep getting mentioned in CFDs (e.g. the Chinese tourist ratings one), but the NRHP/LB categories might themselves not survive a CFD per WP:OC#AWARD. DexDor (talk) 06:10, 7 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
This makes no sense. We always accept being a "national monument" etc as defining, where we have categories (in fact for most countries we don't), so what is the logic in refusing it for this much higher listing rank? Johnbod (talk) 13:04, 15 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
I see where you're coming from, but I disagree. My reading is that this is a sort of intermediary state. We don't have a list of Category:Actors nominated for an academy award, even though that may be more of an honor than winning a lesser award. And in this case these places aren't even nominated yet, they are just on a tentative list - nomination (and then conferral of the status) comes later. OTOH, we do have Category:Beatified_people. Nonetheless, this is also not WP:DEFINING - I've never heard of "Go visit this site, it's on the tentative list" - but I have heard "This is a national monument" and "This is a UNESCO world heritage site".--Obi-Wan Kenobi (talk) 14:43, 15 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:US college sports venues

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: upmerge, but to all parents.
There is a clear consensus that these categories are too narrow, and that they fail WP:SMALLCAT. However the discussion did not note that this would remove the articles from their other parent categories: e.g. Category:Auburn Tigers baseball venues is also a subcat of Category:Auburn Tigers baseball, Category:College baseball venues by team in the United States, Category:Baseball venues in Alabama, and Category:Auburn Tigers sports venues ... so a multiple upmerge is needed.
There are 4 other sub-categories of Category:College baseball venues by team in the United States. If editors want to nominate any of them for merger, please can they check whether multiple merge targets are needed? --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 13:57, 12 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: Merge/Rename as required. These are just a sample of >140 WP:SMALLCATs in the Category:College sports venues in the United States by institution hierarchy - most of them with just two articles and the biggest I can see has 7. At the very least they need upmerging to the "sports venue" level - and I wouldn't be too sorry to see some merged all the way up to the main institution page as in many (but not all?) cases these will be facilities that are part of the institution's estate so can be treated like any other part of the campus. I can understand the drive to carve up the >300 members of Category:College baseball venues in the United States but by institution doesn't seem the best way to do it, perhaps by state would be a better way? Is there an easy way of tagging all the categories involved? Le Deluge (talk) 01:37, 5 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Huh? What do you mean "by state"? These are for specific univeristies, how can we subdivide the univeristy contents "by state"? Do you mean a present and a former cat? I am confused.John Pack Lambert (talk) 01:11, 10 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
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