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August 22

Category:Muslim apologists

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: keep. Good Ol’factory (talk) 23:45, 9 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: delete, apologist is not a defining characteristic of the articles in this category. Marcocapelle (talk) 20:16, 22 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, I'm sympathetic to that. Such a discussion could be informed by considering Category:Muslim scholars, Da'i, Apologetics, Christian apologetics, Category:Apologetics, Category:Religious apologists and Category:Christian apologists. WMF might consider increasing server capacity. Thincat (talk) 09:23, 23 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Ulama

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: withdrawn. Marcocapelle (talk) 08:14, 30 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Propose deleting Category:Ulama by denomination
  • Propose merging Category:Ulama to Category:Sunni ulama
  • Propose merging Category:Algerian ulama to Category:Algerian Sunni ulama
  • Propose merging Category:Egyptian ulama to Category:Egyptian Sunni ulama
  • Propose merging Category:English ulama to Category:English Sunni ulama
  • Propose merging Category:Filipino ulama to Category:Filipino Sunni ulama
  • Propose merging Category:Iraqi ulama to Category:Iraqi Sunni ulama
  • Propose merging Category:Malaysian ulama to Category:Malaysian Sunni ulama
  • Propose merging Category:Palestinian ulama to Category:Palestinian Sunni ulama
  • Propose merging Category:Russian ulama to Category:Russian Sunni ulama
  • Propose merging Category:Saudi Arabian ulama to Category:Saudi Arabian Sunni ulama
  • Propose merging Category:Somalian ulama to Category:Somalian Sunni ulama
  • Propose merging Category:Yemeni ulama to Category:Yemeni Sunni ulama
  • Category:Ulama by nationality will become empty by the above mergers and can be deleted afterwards
Nominator's rationale: By lack of Shia Ulama categories (Category:Shia ulama and Category:Iranian ulama are both lacking) there is apparently just one - Sunni - denomination with ulama in the category structure. Therefore a by-denomination split is not meaningful. Marcocapelle (talk) 19:42, 22 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Just for practical reasons, to keep the Sunni parents. A reverse merge is okay as well, provided that the parenting is being updated. Marcocapelle (talk) 20:26, 22 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Sunni Muslim scholars of Islam

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: rename. Good Ol’factory (talk) 23:45, 31 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: The category shouldn't be about the religious background of the scholar, but about the object of the studies. This is an entirely similar proposal as for Shia scholars that have been renamed earlier in this discussion. Marcocapelle (talk) 19:20, 22 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Midway Games

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: split. Good Ol’factory (talk) 03:07, 4 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: Requested move old category Midway Games to new category Midway video games reason=Splitted as suggested. Removed pinball games from this category. The remaining games are video games. --Tochni (talk) 15:21, 22 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Just helping Tochni do proper proceedings. George Ho (talk) 15:33, 22 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Journalists killed while covering the Bahraini uprising (2011–present)

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: delete; upmerge contents to Category:Journalists killed while covering the Arab Spring, Category:Deaths during the Bahraini uprising of 2011, and Category:Journalists killed in Bahrain. Good Ol’factory (talk) 23:47, 9 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Propose renaming Category:Journalists killed while covering the Bahraini uprising (2011–present) to Category:Journalists killed while covering the Bahraini uprising of 2011
Nominator's rationale: I don't know; the category has a few articles. Ahmed Ismail Hassan died in 2012, not 2011. Shall we rename or delete the category? George Ho (talk) 15:29, 22 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Catalysts and potential catalysts of change

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: delete. Marcocapelle (talk) 19:30, 31 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: Delete. nondefining/subjective/speculative criteria. - üser:Altenmann >t 15:08, 22 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Criminal psychologist

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: rename. Marcocapelle (talk) 07:33, 30 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: This is the way categories are usually named as they are designed to hold multiple articles. Everymorning (talk) 14:39, 22 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Scapegoats of Dowry law

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: delete. Marcocapelle (talk) 07:42, 30 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: User has created a number of categories and user boxes in this vein, but this one is connected to an article of theirs, now deleted--see Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Cruelty against Husband in India. The very name of this category is grammatically challenged, and it is essentially POV in a rather MMR kind of way. Drmies (talk) 14:37, 22 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Nigeria record producers

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: merge. Marcocapelle (talk) 19:09, 31 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: Looks like the cat creator was unaware that a Category:Nigerian record producers already exists. Stanleytux (talk) 14:28, 22 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Iranian martyrs

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: no consensus. (Note: I am aware that one user lodged two contradictory !votes in this discussion. I did not strike out either.) Good Ol’factory (talk) 23:52, 9 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: The word "martyr" is a biased word. How does it come that such a category exists in Wikipedia!!  Diako «  Talk » 20:50, 28 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
At worst, Listify then delete, but that would be a less appropriate option in my view. Peterkingiron (talk) 14:59, 29 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
We don't distance the categories that way with "classified by" for religious or communist martyrs in the Category:Martyrs tree. I'm not neccesarilly opposed to the change, but we should be even handed.RevelationDirect (talk) 17:21, 29 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Mr.Rahpouyan. I have nominated this category for deletion and I'm myself an Iranian. I believe that all the categories you mentioned should be deleted or at least they should be renamed. Diako «  Talk » 06:00, 30 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
It's not important for me that where are you from. Just I need a logical reason for deletion tag. What's your reason to delete or rename all these categories?-- Rahpouyan110 (talk) 06:11, 30 May 2015 (UTC) Struck comment by sockpuppet of User:Srahmadi. —Psychonaut (talk) 18:15, 8 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]
I said that I'm myself an Iranian as an answer to your comment that you said "Does wikipedia has double standard?". I told the reason. The word "martyr" is a biased word. Wikipedia is an online encyclopedia. An encyclopedia should respect the neutrality. Using such words are againt the policies of wikipedia. Diako «  Talk » 06:56, 30 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
OK Sir. If you want to respect the wikipedia rules and you say that it's a bias word, so why you didn't start deleting the other martyrs category?!?! category:Iranian martyrs has been made on 27th May 2015. So please Start putting "deletion tag" or "rename" other categories, then I will start renaming this one. Regards -- Rahpouyan110 (talk) 07:13, 30 May 2015 (UTC) Struck comment by sockpuppet of User:Srahmadi. —Psychonaut (talk) 18:15, 8 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Is this only my duty to correct all the defeciencies of Wikipedia. Why don't you do it? You can nominate the other ones, I will protect you. Diako «  Talk » 08:44, 30 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
This discussion will lead to nowhere and it is exactly the reason why I said earlier we need a broader discussion about the martyrs tree. Marcocapelle (talk) 10:39, 30 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
That isn't what the title means. "Iranian" is the demonym of people of Iranian ethnicity, and as such, the title simply means "martyrs who happen to be ethnically Iranian". And, in any case, the totalitarian theocratic government of Iran certainly do not represent "the view point of Iranians" anyway.--Anders Feder (talk) 23:39, 31 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Why 'clearly not', if there are sources calling them as 'Martyr'? Mhhossein (talk) 13:46, 31 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Because it is a loaded label. The implication is that those bestowed with the label were more "righteous" than those not given the label (e.g. enemy soldiers) which is obviously completely POV.--Anders Feder (talk) 23:40, 31 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
The implication is that American people (or state) regard them as more "righteous" than others. Mhhossein (talk) 12:27, 3 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]
According to what dictionary?--Anders Feder (talk) 13:41, 3 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Actually the Iranian category doesn't stand entirely on its own, we also have Category:Revolutionary martyrs with three subcats and a fair amount of articles. Besides the article Martyrs allows for secular martyrs. So I would really discuss in the context of the entire tree, see this discussion. Marcocapelle (talk) 09:55, 31 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • I think the "Revolutionary Martyrs" category should be scrapped. Ghandi was killed by a radical Hindu nationalist who dislike his seeking coliving and reconciliation with the Muslims. His killing was not related to his revelutionary activities in opposing colonialism.John Pack Lambert (talk) 05:11, 7 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Wow... I asked that he be blocked after evidence of socket puppets, but you would have to actually read the discussion to see that. Why do you try so hard to make this personal? Ism schism (talk) 23:35, 8 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Because your tendentious editing is caused by a person - namely you.--Anders Feder (talk) 23:42, 8 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]
I can't believe you're still upset about the Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Ahmad Keshvari discussion? You need to move on from that. These discussions don't need emotions added to them. Keep it rational, please. Ism schism (talk) 23:55, 8 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]
I am not upset about that discussion at all - I am upset about your lacking competence.--Anders Feder (talk) 23:59, 8 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Looks like you've run out of real arguments. Ism schism (talk) 00:12, 9 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]
No, that looks like the description of you.--Anders Feder (talk) 00:19, 9 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Can we find a single article to put in this category? Even legitimate historical Islamic martyrs like Husayn ibn Ali are generally Arab and the notion of an Iranian "nationality" is a modern construct anyway.--Anders Feder (talk) 08:31, 13 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]
That's a harsh oversimplification considering the number of lives lost since the revolution. Ism schism (talk) 11:51, 13 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]
What does "the number of lives lost since the revolution" have to do with anything?--Anders Feder (talk) 12:15, 13 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Pointing out the large number of deaths is a response to your question "Can we find a single article to put in this category?" Clearly, there are enough to choose from. Ism schism (talk) 15:30, 13 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]
What does the number of deaths have to with the number of martyrs to choose from?--Anders Feder (talk) 15:56, 13 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Do you have any reliable sources for this alternative definition of the term?--Anders Feder (talk) 01:06, 14 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: relisted after adding CfD template on category page. The discussion originally started 2015 May 28. Marcocapelle (talk) 12:05, 22 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Marcocapelle (talk) 12:05, 22 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Whether "the dead cares" is very much irrelevant. Wikipedia content is not dictated by what biographical subjects may think of themselves; it is governed by Wikipedia's policies. And there certainly are no Wikipedia policies that stipulate that "If the day after tomorrow an Iranian Muslim is killed in Texas, and he is declared a martyr by the authorities in his denomination, then he's also an Iranian martyr." In the unlikely event that the Catholic Church declares someone from Iran a martyr and that person is notable, we can easily create a category at that time. Until then it is mere crystal-balling. Please point to the actually existing, reliable sources that designate any notable Iranian subjects "martyr" in the present reality.--Anders Feder (talk) 01:39, 23 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
@Nyttend: What, precisely, is "outlandish" about it?--Anders Feder (talk) 14:49, 28 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Did you read my second sentence? Or if you're unable to understand that, consider Category:Houses in Henry County, Ohio. At the moment, its only article is a house that is also a former prison, and I don't know of any other houses in the county that would qualify for notability. Try putting the category into Category:Defunct prisons in Ohio: would this be appropriate, since every article currently in the category is also a defunct prison, and there might not be any notable subjects that should go into Houses but not into Defunct prisons? Absolutely not! Categories are named and categorised to refer to a concept (in this case, "Iranian martyrs"), without regard to the articles currently and not-currently in the category. Otherwise, if the current contents were all military people of some sort, it would be appropriate to put this category into Category:Iranian military personnel, but then we'd have to remove that category if someone added a non-military person. So in summary, a category's name and uses shouldn't change just because of the addition or removal of articles to that category. Nyttend (talk) 15:06, 28 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
@Nyttend: Of course I read your second sentence. That isn't what I asked. What does your second sentence have to do with anything I've argued? Or "if you're unable to understand that", what have I said that contradict your second sentence?--Anders Feder (talk) 15:26, 28 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Local civil rights history in the United States

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: merge. Good Ol’factory (talk) 23:43, 31 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: Per WP:SUBJECTIVECAT and WP:NONDEFINING. What is "local" depends on where you are sitting and, by design, the African American civil rights movement took local acts of civil disobedience and brought them to national attention through the media and the courts. We have many local history categories like Category:History of Cardiff but they are local in scope whereas this one is national without local subcategories. RevelationDirect (talk) 00:19, 22 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Note: Notified Pb30 as the category creator and this discussion has been included in WikiProject United States History. – RevelationDirect (talk) 00:19, 22 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Local Historic Register places in Martin County, Florida

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: rename to Category:Martin County Local Historic Register. Good Ol’factory (talk) 03:06, 4 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Propose Deleting Category:Local Historic Register places in Martin County, Florida
Nominator's rationale: Per WP:OVERLAPCAT and WP:NONDEFINING. Martin County created a local heritage register. There is no main article about this registry and I'm not sure it would be notable but you can read about it on the county government web site. 3 of the 4 articles are already on other, more defining heritage registers so we're not losing much navigation. (Alternatively, if kept, we should rename it to Category:Martin County Local Historic Register to make it clear that this is a formal noun not a description.) RevelationDirect (talk) 00:11, 22 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Note: Notified Clariosophic as the category creator and this discussion has been included in WikiProject National Register of Historic Places. – RevelationDirect (talk) 00:11, 22 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
These are separate things. Category:National Register of Historic Places in Martin County, Florida is a federal list. Category:Local Historic Register places in Martin County, Florida is a list of items meeting local requirements. The notability of the federal list is well established, and on Wikipedia is broken down by county or large city. Items on the federal list may or may not appear on the local list. Items on the local list may or may not appear on the federal list. The question here is whether or not the local list is notable enough to have a category - or are the members of the list notable enough to make the category notable and useful. I'm arguing that yes, for some types of local historic lists, the notability is sufficient, and is this case, being a government sponsored list over a county-wide area, keep this list, renamed per RevelationDirect. Generic1139 (talk) 21:27, 2 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for confirming. I'm fine with that. RevelationDirect (talk) 22:21, 2 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
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