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Moving text relevant to Wikipedia_talk:bans and blocks. Restoring the best version so far.
Request: can someone familiar with this topic (a) expand this article (b) review what is said about the Judeo-Christian tradition in ethics and (c) rip Ethics in the Bible apart, as it is from an utterly POV source.
Someone please add this man to the philosopher list:Francis Schaeffer also see his Wikipedia page
This article is designed to be about Christian philosophy, not Christianity in general. Please do not delete the main point of the article. If you have a problem with a particular section, please discuss it here first. Thanks. RK 02:07, Apr 14, 2005 (UTC)
I beg to differ strenuously with you RK. Someone imposed a whole mass of material that belongs elsewhere in "apologetics" or something else. It was no introduction, but an insertion of someone's sytematic thesis and distanced the true Introduction of the matter which cannot be accurate without proceeding historically, in the nature of the case. Reformatikos 7:16 PM April 14, 2005 (EST)
The task of the Christian philosophy article is to trace thru the emergence of Christian philosophical contributions and highlight what relation they had to other philosophies in whose environoment they dwelt in different times and ages. -- Reformatikos
The previous insertion, which I take to be yours RK and which requires all sorts of apparently unexamined and questionable presuppositions, tried to drive a division between religion and phliosophy as two binomially opposed subjects. -- Reformatikos
Some philosophies insist on doing so, even some syntethist Christian philosophieis. But Christian philosophizing need not do so. It can stand on its own and is equipped to review its own historical emergence and doesn't have to argue for the existence of God - why should it even bother to do so, as Christian philosophy which is oriented to understanding the structures of creation and their diachronic development. -- Reformatikos
Whereas if ultimate values are the heart of the definition of "religion" then every religion (including atheisms or absolutizing rationalisms) can generate various philosophies from its own inner genius over historical time. I wanted to emphasize Christian philosophizing as an integral and inevitable movement but with diverse results over time. -- Reformatikos
There is no problem of "two fields" for Christian philosophizing. I am not deleting the main point of the article at all, you are inserting extraneous material to make "apologetics" and certain of you personally selected problems in the border discipline of "philosophical theology" the central issue. -- Reformatikos
But this RK approach makes a static systematics of your own divising the POV-ridden norm for a topic that has to be pursued historically, in order to see how those Christian philosophies for which we have extant documents or references, posed their own problems, figure by figure, over time - either in thetic construction, in posing problems, and in borrowing or refusing solutions along the way.
This is not the place for you to take over the lead with your own settled systematics - most of which issues are not germane - Christianity doesn't necessarily have to raise the question of whether God exists, except outside it's own phlosophizing and in another discipline called "apologetics." Create your own "Christian apologetics" entry, or "Christian philosophical theology" entry, and then a reference can be made in "Christian phliosophy" for those not really interested in philosophy to divert their attention to "apologetics" and/or "philosophical theology." I find you to be completely inappropriate and out of order in this move of yours. This is no place for your systematics. Yours Reformatikos 7:16 PM April 14, 2005 (EST)
Here is an example of what I mean. Look at Introduction to Philosophy: A Christian Perspective, by Norman L. Geisler and Paul D. Feinberg, Baker Academic, 1987. The authors are both Christians and philosophers. They believe that the two are complimentary, not contradictory. The contents of their book list the subjects they discuss (partially quoted, below), and they are the same subjects that many classical Christian philosophers discuss, namely: RK
What are the sources for the following assertions?
"As with any fusion of religion and philosophy, the attempt is difficult because classical philosophers start with no preconditions for which conclusions they must reach in their investigation,"(emphasis mine)
"This is known as apologetics and is a common technique found in the writings of many religious traditions, including Judaism, Christianity and Islam, but is not generally accepted as true philosophy by philosophers."(emphasis mine)
Removed this apparent bibliographical passage from "Interaction between Christian and non-Christian philosophers" along with a large section of text in a different language; this was out of place where it was, but I'm putting it here rather than throwing it away since others want to make use of it in the article; it does seem relevant at first glance. Gthb 15:30, 15 November 2006 (UTC)
This article does not meet Wiki standards for writing. It is filled with OR--original research. If has been unsourced for a long time. It should be scheduled for deletion.Afaprof01 04:48, 14 May 2007 (UTC)
VOTE: DELETE ARTICLE. I agree that the article is very poorly written and contains what seems to be homespun (OR) understanding of both Christianity and philosophy. The attributions about Jesus are unclear and misleading. The fact that this article has been around so long without ANY citations from reputable sources makes it very suspect and essentially worthless. Oberlin 03:35, 15 May 2007 (UTC)
Leibniz was christian, you can see that in his teodicee.
Isn't this both an oxymoron and a misnomer?!?!?! --Carlon 20:13, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
This article was automatically assessed because at least one WikiProject had rated the article as stub, and the rating on other projects was brought up to Stub class. BetacommandBot 03:51, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
After reading this article, I must say that it makes me think it was written by an atheist! 66.74.230.117 (talk) 21:17, 28 February 2008 (UTC)
Well of course you think that. Just like, by reading your contributions, one might get the inkling that you are horribly, horribly biased, not unlike myself. The only difference being that I don't say anything unless someone is acting particularly stupid. 24.95.247.110 (talk) 10:16, 8 January 2009 (UTC)
The opening paragraphs of this article are deeply problematic. The definition of Christian philosophy as "the fusion of various fields of philosophy with the theological doctrines of Christianity" is refuted by the contents of the page itself. Already there is mention of Kierkegard and Dooyeweerd, founders of Existentialism and Reformational Philosophy respectively - no mere blending of philosophy with theology! Some work described as Christian philosophy may indeed fit this description, but the topic cannot be limited to this a priori.
Thus I propose that the whole section "Reconciling Christianity with philosophy" is a topic for another article, or at least should be moved further down this article. Let's give a chance for radically Christian philosophies to be presented before defining them out of existence!
RMGunton (talk) 20:59, 22 February 2010 (UTC)
I believe the following two paragraphs that I've cut from the section "Rennaisance and Reformation Christian Philosophers" may be valuable for other editors (indeed I partially agree with the second one) but not for readers.
"Two later Dutch Protestants are mistakenly put in the foregoing philosophical "era" by some historically ignorant contributor to this page. Neither belong to this era. One was a stock-market speculator on ships' voyages to the Dutch West Indies, and led in the disruption of the Reformed Church of the Netherlands over an inflated and misformulated Protestant Neo-Scholastic theory of "free will" that produced as its counterpoint the reactionary Canons of Dordt (Arminius became part of the sect called "the Remonstrants"). The other belonged ruffly and belatedly to the same school but remained nominally Reformed, while producing a great body of scholarship on International Law, his writings ironically becoming influential in the predestinarian Scholastic circles of Scotland. But these were neither Reformers nor philosophers."
"Even more serious a problem in this history of philosophy section, erroneously entitled "Renaissance and Reformation Christian Philosophy" is the lumping together of the Renaissance with the Reformation. This lumpen-historiography of philosophy has no place in the historical evaluation of Western philosophy's periods, continuities, discontinuities, re-emergences, twists, turns, and recurring problems traceable to a finite original number (Vollenhoven, Wolters), that arguably have simply exfloriated over the centuries. There were many Renaissance thinkers of importance, some definitely philosophers, who are not mentioned at all by previous contributors to this page. Absolutely inexcusable. So, the erroneous heading itself obscures epochal differences (Vollenhoven), while at the same time Desiderius Erasmus Roteradamus is never branched off from the Renaissance thawt to his own lone stance of textual critique and satire of church, state, and ranks of society; but it was he, if any one person, who moderated between the two conflated zeitgeists, and synchronic but alternative types of Christian philosophy. Yet was himself no philosopher."
RMGunton (talk) 22:35, 22 February 2010 (UTC)
Who in the world put Kant as a Christian philosopher? That should be deleted. Kant was a Christian philosopher tbf — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2405:204:309A:A877:0:0:2767:C8A1 (talk) 13:18, 11 December 2021 (UTC) 75.141.113.231 (talk) 20:59, 14 September 2010 (UTC)
I cannot see any specific reason for the POV-tag, it was marked by sir Anon IP 64.234.0.101 HERE, with the reason (adding the tage... where are the sources?) in May 2009. It must certainly have timed out now. The article is a little POVvy from an anti-philosophical sentiment, but not enough to warrant a fat POV-tag. Rursus dixit. (mbork3!) 07:38, 6 November 2010 (UTC)
The section Origins of Christian philosophy is wrong. Jesus did not philosophise, neither The Apostle Paul. The origins of "Christian" philosophy (scholastics and so) is mostly Plato, Aristotle and the Stoics. Rursus dixit. (mbork3!) 07:43, 6 November 2010 (UTC)
Why isn't Dostoevsky included on the Christian philosophers list? He was certainly Christian and his writings reflect that. Andrei Bolkonsky (talk) 00:59, 2 July 2012 (UTC)
Dostoevsky's religious beliefs are debated among scholars. See the section in the article about him regarding his religious beliefs. Eb7473 (talk) 17:04, 7 August 2012 (UTC)
This should probably be titled 'List of Christian philosophers' as it doesn't really detail anything unique about Christian philosophy, just lists Christian philosophers. —Tom Morris (talk) 13:44, 18 March 2015 (UTC)
The comment(s) below were originally left at Talk:Christian philosophy/Comments, and are posted here for posterity. Following several discussions in past years, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.
This is a stub because it refers to Calvin as a philosopher, but doesn't talk about his philosophy or influence (eg. the assumption that people are bad presumably had an impact on the American constitutions restriction of state power). -- TimNelson 07:45, 29 March 2007 (UTC) |
Last edited at 07:45, 29 March 2007 (UTC). Substituted at 11:39, 29 April 2016 (UTC)
This article contains unclear sources and lead section does not summarize enough key points. — Preceding unsigned comment added by GuJi and GuaGua (talk • contribs) 06:13, 14 April 2019 (UTC)
This article Need to be completely rewritten, its contemporary form is very bad (Pseudo-Dionysius the areopagite (talk) 18:15, 15 September 2019 (UTC)).
WP:TNT is the only way to save this article(Pseudo-Dionysius the areopagite (talk) 00:13, 24 September 2019 (UTC)).
Can I rewrite this article?(The Sr Guy (talk) 16:09, 28 January 2020 (UTC)).
What really are the philosophy of Christian religions 158.62.80.208 (talk) 13:51, 14 September 2022 (UTC)