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Reviewer: Reidgreg (talk · contribs) 01:42, 1 March 2024 (UTC)
Nominator: Chiswick Chap (talk) at 17:27, 18 July 2023 (UTC)
Article links: nominated revision, reviewed revision, promoted revision
Looks like a fun and interesting article. I'll try to get a review posted in the next few days. – Reidgreg (talk) 01:42, 1 March 2024 (UTC)
I will update the checklist as progress is made.
Prose is really good! I only found a few things to comment on.
the loss of horses and ponies stolen from The Prancing Pony inn. I'm not sure that there's a good reason to italicize the name of a building. (I realize that the GA Bree (Middle-earth) does so.) Proper names get word capitalization which is usually enough emphasis and does not require italics (MOS:BADITALICS).
"invite the reader into a compelling and remarkably complete pre-modern world, saturated with ... values .. of respect ... nature, and ... the spirit", retaining "personal integrity and responsibility and [not] decanted into a soulless calculus of financial profit-and-loss."I did not see the underlined part in the source.
For the most part this is a checklist as I went through the sources. Citation numbers are as of this revision.
1 – Beowulf quote and translation
2 – "Culver 2013". AGF for offline reliable source; saw a bit from a Google Books snippet view
3 – on jstor. I wonder if maybe these two citations should be moved down to the end of the following sentence?
4 – "Fraser" the pdf download did not want to display for me but I was able to copy the text into another program.
5 – the url was corrupted; repaired.
6 – webpage seems to have moved but I found it at the internet archive. Added archive links.
7 and 8 – "Lacon 1994" and "Kelly 2016". The inline citations to these may have to be moved around a bit to properly cover the material. For example, the quote "the old Northern European world of fairy-tale and a relatively modern world represented in the Shire"
is currently cited to "Lacon 1994" but actually appears in "Kelly 2016".
9 - on jstor.
Sharkey's unjust rulewas a rule of economics developed by an economist named Sharkey. No wonder I couldn't find an article on it! Would you consider changing it to → under the unjust leadership of Sharkey ?
10 – Found the 2003 paperback edition of this has snippet view on Google Books. Can verify about breeding orcs who fight in daylight. AGF on remainder.
11 – on Project Muse
12 – on Oxford Academic. "weirdly cloned" and "high explosives". Combined these three cover the material.
13 – "McLarty 2006" on Brill, page 177
14 – "Curry 1998" on Google Books, verified quotes pages 62–63, 13–14, and 131.
"in contemporary terms, the domination of financial and technological magic over enchantment ... is something we see confirmed everywhere in Middle-earth today ... [and that] Progress is not only good for us but unavoidable".The source has "just as we continue to hear a great deal about how all this Progress is not only good for us, but
, just as we continue to hear about how all thisProgress" — not terribly quotable, really.
do not omit text where doing so would remove important context or alter the meaning of the text.)
stating that "in contemporary terms, the domination of financial and technological magic over enchantment ... is something we see confirmed everywhere in Middle-earth today ... [and that] Progress is not only good for us but unavoidable". |
And in contemporary terms, the domination of financial and technological magic over enchantment – often through exploiting it (something at which advertising and public relations are masters) – is something we see confirmed everywhere in Middle-earth today, just as we continue to hear a great deal about how all this Progress is not only good for us, but unavoidable in any case. |
—article text | —2004 ed p.67 |
The first and third underlined parts are easily removed without changing the meaning. But the second underlined part informs us of how the non-underlined parts on either side of it relate to each other. Curry isn't stating that 'Progress is good' but that it is frequently heard from others. That Curry chose the wording that one is seen confirmed everywhere while the other is heard about is suggestive that they are in several ways unequal.
What about changing: [and that] → [along with the sentiment that] ? – Reidgreg (talk) 02:48, 8 March 2024 (UTC)
In Curry's view, Tolkien's Middle-earth writings "invite the reader into a compelling and remarkably complete pre-modern world, saturated with ... values .. relationships of respect with each other and nature, and ... the spirit", retaining "personal integrity and responsibility and [not] decanted into a soulless calculus of financial profit-and-loss."I'm concerned that the "values .. relationships" part doesn't read well and that it is a bit long now, right on the forty-word threshold for block quotes. Question: What about: "saturated with ... values [for] relationships ... with each other, and nature, and ... the spirit"
15 – "Carney 2013" Used five times in the same paragraph (the first two sentences also covered by 16). The clickbait on the CNBC website forced the text into too small of a column so that much of it was not visible; I copied to another program to read it.
16 – "Woolley 2012" Nice.
17 – I was blocked by a subscription the first time I tried to retrieve this but then got through the second time.
18 – "Clinton 2016".
19 – "Stuart 2022". Found this on Springer via Wikipedia Library (link). Didn't see where the source was supporting the cited material but 18 covers most of it.
20 – "Salon" This source also explicitly calls it a "parody". (I did not spot this in the above sources.) However, I didn't find any mention of economics to cover It portrays Mordor as an economically progressive society
. It may be that the placement of citations 18–20 are off a little bit.
Appears to have good coverage of the available sources on the topic.
A couple issues with quotations noted above.
No evidence of edit warring.
3 images, all on Commons, tagged with CCSA licences.
As for captions, I'm a little cautious about separating the fictional from the real. With the third image's caption, there is a brief statement, an evocative quote, and a description of the real-world scene depicted. Could something similar be done for the first image's caption? Perhaps there isn't a suitable quote, but I'd appreciate if the first sentence was clear in its describing fiction.
Although not part of the GA criteria, here are some other areas you might want to improve:
Noted.
Just a few little tweaks and this should be good. I'll try to respond to any questions on this page or otherwise let me know below if you're finished and would like me to go over your changes. – Reidgreg (talk) 20:09, 5 March 2024 (UTC)