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I just started reading the first book, and I came the this page to see how many books were in the series. The second sentence gave Richard's last name as "Rahl," a MAJOR plot spoiler. I'm not sure what Wikipedia's policy on spoilers is, but I changed it to Cypher so that others will not suffer the same fate as me. If this is not appropriated, feel free to change it back.
The Political Aspects part of the page either needs to be reworked to eliminate weasel words, have some citations added to confirm the information, or be removed. I deleted the sentence regarding Bill and Hillary Clinton as there was no source and it seems controversial to me. I left in the sentence about Naked Empire because I couldn't decide if that needed to go or not due to the fact that I can kind of see how that would be true. The entire section seems to be heavily biased to me. Patrickjsanford (talk) 12:23, 20 October 2008 (UTC)
I don't think that the Keeper should be noted as a Satanic character. The series portrays the Keeper more as the yin to the Creators yang. He is a force that must exist in order for creation to survive as intended.
first person - removed User:MyRedDice
It can be noted that the series has become more ideologically conservative (or more apparently so) over time. This has become particually noticable in the Faith of the Fallen and Naked Empire books. There is however not enough content on the series to add this fact with out causing excessive non-NPOV distortion; if there was sufficient agreement on the observation anyway. - User:138.130.225.134 June 29, 2004
References
After reviewing the page and discussing it with Terry, we felt that the page needs this addition. Please feel free to add to it. Time is limited to add more and apporiate material at this time mystar 68.188.220.8
At the moment, it breached NPOV in about every second word. Also, juding from some of the other edits by this IP/User, I'm not entirely sure that we should assume good faith. So I removed the section for the moment.-- Mystman666 (Talk) 19:44, 25 August 2006 (UTC)
To be quite honest, I'm getting sick and tired of you acting recklessly and in bad faith, Mystar. I've already told you before NOT to delete any discussion from the talk page, certainly not when it is relevant to the article, and again you go and delete multiple of my posts as well as another's. I've restored it, so just leave it there. - Runch 03:25, 26 August 2006 (UTC)
I've no clue as to what your on about. I've deleted nothing from the discussion page. I did revert my earlier edit. I added a Themes and Novels section to which you stated and I quote, ":You're right, this is a useful section. I will revise and expand it when I have a bit of free time. - Runch 03:58, 25 August 2006 (UTC)"
So now you have changed your mind?
The section is useful. It is also something we see on many other fantasy series’ pages.
Just because I've discussed it with Goodkind doesn’t make it "his soap box". He has a voice as well as you or I. The Themes and Novels is an encyclopedia section, and has every right t to be on this page. If you seem to think it hasn't, then it should also be removed from every other authors and series page as well. You cannot have a double standard or you have anarchy. mystar 68.188.220.8 05:13, 26 August 2006 (UTC)
64.230.3.111 20:56, 26 August 2006 (UTC)
Oh..btw... Why then are you singeling out Goodkind's Sword of Truth page's addition of Theams and Novels stateing it to be "NPOV" when ASOFAI has the exact same thing... I don't see you taking action there? I quote from A Sone of Fire and Ice "==Themes of the novels== The books are known for complex characters, sudden and often violent plot twists, and intricate political intrigue. In a genre where magic usually takes center stage, this series has a reputation for its limited and subtle use of magic, employing it as an ambiguous and often sinister background force.
The novels are narrated from a very strict third person limited omniscient perspective, the chapters alternating between different point of view characters. The first volume uses a false protagonist; Martin has a reputation of not being afraid to kill any character, no matter how major, unlike many other authors in the genre".
So what gives?
mystar68.188.220.8 05:17, 26 August 2006 (UTC)
not sure if this is where i would put something about the series not being ended with "Confessor" but the new novel by terry goodkind "The Law of Nines" it is thousands of years in the future but in the same story as the sword of truth series —Preceding unsigned comment added by 164.113.135.10 (talk) 20:08, 29 December 2009 (UTC)
On another note, I've been working hard on revising the pages of the individual books in the Sword of Truth series to conform to WikiProject Novels standards, and I have to say most of the pages are looking pretty good. However, the pages for Naked Empire, Phantom, and Debt of Bones are still in stub status and need attention.
Since Phantom has yet to be released, stub status is expected. But, if you have recently read either Naked Empire or Debt of Bones, consider updating the Plot Summaries and Character Lists on the novel pages. Thanks for your help! - Runch 01:09, 8 July 2006 (UTC)
I will happily add/edit some of the summary sections. I have but one question: Are the summaries supposed to be so detailed? I understood a summary, especially here, is supposed to entice/intrigue a reader as well as explain (not with POV statements) the general story line. It seems to me that the summaries give away too much of the storyline and too much incoherent detail for an avaerage reader that is not familiar with the storyline. Spoilers here are an understatement! They tend to read more like *Cliffnotes*. Either way I am happy to help. "Knowledge is the Destination-Truth the Journey"-Terry Goodkind 18:46, 13 November 2006 (UTC)Addicted2learn
Welcome addicted to learn! Yes you have hit on a point Runch and I have been discussing the past couple of days.
I made mention of it a few months ago, but got tied up with business. Personally, I wanted to do away with the whole summery thingy and only have a plot intro. I think the summery just gives too much away, but I may well be in the minority on that issue. A few of us are still deliberating it out ~shrugs~ :)
As for editing please have at it. I'm woefully behind in doing that task due to my work load of late, but have a hand at trying to update and upgrade the plot intros and/or the summerys. Please do not heasitate to ask for any assistance or to double check your facts. As I am the worlds foremost authority on all things SOT related I can be a big help with the facts etc.
Again welcome and please do sign into the SOT project on the page.. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Sword_of_Truth
AND happy editing! Mystar 14:02, 14 November 2006 (UTC)
Recently I found out that Sam Raimi, the director of the Spider-Man movies, has gotten Goodkind's consent to begin planning a Sword of Truth miniseries, similar to the one made recently about the "Dune" series. The series would begin production sometime next year. I don't know at what point that news items like this should be added to the article, but I wanted to point it out. I've only got very limited experience at editing Wiki pages so it probably wouldn't be a good idea for me to start it. Just putting it on the table. Thanks! - Blitzrhenzai 22:38, 30 July 2006 (UTC)
The related information will make its way into the article shortly. There are other things going on, and I don't think the details have been passed down the grape vine yet, atleast not to me. As soon as the information is passed along, Mystar will make sure appropriate attention is given to this topic. Omnilord August 1, 2006
There is a huge pile of rather useless SoT character and concept stubs that need to be compiled into a single page. Because there is no Wikiproject for the SoT series I'm posting this notice here. Most of these articles are about characters and concepts that do not have enough information or are not important enough to warrant their own pages. I'm going to AfD these pages in the next few days unless there is an editor that wants to merge these pages as I have neither the time nor inclination to do so myself. The SoT category page has a listing of these SoT stubs. For deletion and merging information see:
NeoFreak 05:54, 27 August 2006 (UTC)
Well reading the information I can see a major over haol is in line. Much of the information is in fact incorrect. Such as the Great barrier. The fact that it states that it could haev been used to win or victory is nothing more than speculation, as the book doesn't even insinuate that. The barrier is a dead lock stop gap measure. I see a great deal if misinformation, incorrect application and personal spectulation on events and what they supposedly mean.
There can be no room for personal speculation on events etc, as the books only give so much information, we cannot have people adding their own spectiulative assumptions and assuned infreance.
As soon as we get a mediation situation underway with Goodkind's main page I will be taking up this cause. Mystar 13:28, 30 August 2006 (UTC)
I've been talking with several individuals who are very familiar with the novels having read them several times over, and possessing a thorough knowledge of the content. My idea is to coordinate them, independent of the current controversy, to start utilizing that knowledge base to compile accurate information regarding plots, elements, and charaters. This has been second priority discussion since probably february to get some people who are familiar to polish up the book articles and the associated element articles so they are factually correct. If any POV seeps in, we can pick it out with a fine-tooth comb. Any objections/commentation? Omnilord 21:41, 30 August 2006 (UTC)
So I've noticed that there is a preponderance of pages on characters in the Sword of Truth. Unfortunately, nearly all of these pages are for characters in the first two novels of the series. Consequently, characters of almost no importance from Wizard's First Rule have extensive descriptions while major characters from later novels receive miniscule attention (such as Nathan Rahl and Emperor Jagang) or have no character page at all (such as Berdine, Raina, etc.). A (presumably up to date) list of current character pages is located at Category:Sword of Truth characters.
Essentially, what we need is for several collaborators to take upon themselves the (monumental) task of creating pages for the major missing characters in the series and updating the pages for the existing major characters so as to be representative of their actions throughout the whole series. I would love to help in this task, but seeing as I haven't read the majority of the novels in several years, I don't feel qualified to do most of the work. If anybody is interested in collaborating on this project, though, let me know, as I'll definitely be willing to help by revising, editing, formatting, and doing all the minor tasks associated with major rewrites. Leave me a message on my talk page! - Runch 01:09, 8 July 2006 (UTC)
I think that some characters that now have their own page should keep it, other should be merged, and others still should be removed entirely due to being too insignificant. My personal opinion on who falls in what category is as follows, disagreement and debate is of course welcome. I'm only using those names that appear in the Category:Sword of Truth Characters.
First category (own page): Richard Rahl, Kahlan Amnell, Zeddicus Zu'l Zorander, Cara, Nicci, Adie, Emperor Jagang. Arguably Abby (due to being the Debt of Bones protagonist), Prelate Annalina, Verna.
Second category (merge into one or more minor pages): the ones that were named as "arguably" in the first category; Chase, George and Michael Cypher, Darken Rahl, Demmin Nass, Denna, Jennsen, Nathan, Warren, Shota (with mention of Samuel), Savidlin (with mention of Weselan and Siddin), Violet and Milena, Rachel, the Sisters of the Dark, Panis Rahl, Gratch, the Bird Man, maybe Giller, and a number of arguable cases.
Third category (delete): Emma Brandstone, Innkeeper Bill, Shar, Anargo, Dennee (doesn't even appear in the books themselves, only important as background to Kahlan), and the arguable cases mentioned in the second category (i.e. everyone not named elsewhere). Paul Willocx 23:49, 30 August 2006 (UTC)
How about we just generate a list of all characters, then categorize them with 'Page', 'Blurb', or 'List at End.' I include the 'List at End' category because I know that it would be helpful for people to know that a character name was used somewhere in the series if they are having a memory lapse. So a sample of the character's page would go "Abby: blurp; Denna: blurp; Rachel: blurp; ... Shar: blurp; Violet: blurb; Insidental Characters: Anargo, Dennee, Emma Brandstone, Innkeeper Bill, Johnrock..." but if someone desided to add one sentence or soemthing to state how that character was used, I don't think it would make that big of a deal for lesser characters. Omnilord 00:29, 31 August 2006 (UTC)
Perhaps we should move this to Category_talk:Sword_of_Truth_characters? Omnilord 00:32, 31 August 2006 (UTC)
This way you will not provide misinformation. Speculative opinion is not fact! Mystar 16:22, 3 September 2006 (UTC)
I just noticed that there is no entry for High D'Haran on the wikipedia. anyone want to get something going with this? i'll be checking this talk page in the next few days to see if anyone wants to work on this. i'd also like anyone serious about this to e-mail me at patrickjsanford at hotmail dot com so we can get a better meeting place untill a perm page is setup.
Patrickjsanford 20:32, 11 September 2006 (UTC)
NeoFreak done put up my High D'Haran page for AfD. please help me keep it up. i've been getting no help with this and neofreaks just one person who's been going on about deleting it all day. please check out the talk page there and then help if you want to. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Patrickjsanford (talk • contribs)
just noticed that theres no page for Drafan. there is a page for Oba, and Jensen so i think that Drafan also deserves a page. he is at least as important as the other two i mentioned, and maybe more so because he was married to Kahlan if even for a short time. this marrage allowed her to later become richards third wife, and it affected the events of the next book heavily. - Patrickjsanford 14:37, 13 September 2006 (UTC)
Patrick, I'm sure you mean well. In reading your arguments and concern, I understand what it is you are saying; however I feel that Neo and Runch are correct here. The Characters do have specifically written values that are contributing to the story, usually in more than one area, that doesn't mean they are necessarily worthy of having their own page. It is honestly a better fit to have them redirected to a page where they all have been included. It saves time searching, it saves time moving from page to page and it saves the searcher from getting lost....IMHO
Lets all work together for a better page. I appreciate your enthusiasm and your tenacity! But lets just redirect all that wonderful energy to getting the pages edited with proper information and honest content! Mystar 16:07, 15 September 2006 (UTC)
hold on a second! it's not this page i'm wanting peer review on. i edited the Princess Violet page and want interested parties to review what i did, and see if they can improve it. i know that this isnt the documented peer review method, but theres no since in getting the whole wiki involved in a big thing. anyway, i added the last sentace to the third paragraph about the box in princess violets room, and put in the last paragraph about how richard kicked her. just wanting people to help with it. - Patrickjsanford 16:55, 16 September 2006 (UTC)
DRAGONS! i would like to request a short article/stub on the 3 kinds of dragons mentioned in the sword of truth series. there are a few sentances in "Wizards First Rule" describing blue, green, and red dragons present in the SOT universe. wondering if anyone would like to find this and make a page about it. i would presently, but i am rather inebreated at the moment, and don't think it would be a good idea to write a drunken article. anyway, don't know if anyone will take this seriously, but just wondering. also! i want to know if anyone is interested in creating a SOT wikipedia group. kinda like a project i guess. i just think that this area could be greatly improved if some people would take an intrest and edit on a regular basis. i've seen the wiki do some great things, and want to get SOT involved. if not i guess i can make my own website or something, but this is a lot better due to all the editors. thanks. man, i wish that the communication on here where a lot better though. seems allfully lonely on the wiki with so few people resonding. there arent enough people that take an interest in categories and then stick with them for a while. seems like everything i like is dead. it was nice when people took an interest in Sword of Truth and edited it like mad trying to get the best article they could. thanks. Patrickjsanford 05:43, 25 September 2006 (UTC)
The Wikipedia:WikiProject Sword of Truth is now up and running, although there will undoubtedly be many changes, updates, and revisons over the next few weeks. Please join if you are interested! You can use the shortcut WP:SoT for easy access. - Runch 17:11, 25 September 2006 (UTC)
I altered one sentence. It was originally, "It is stated that Witch Women are able to see events in the flow of time, which is also a form of prophecy." I changed it to "It is stated that Witch Women are able to see events in the flow of time, which is also a form of prophecy, however the events that they can see, while true, ultimately don't occur as one might expect." I feel this is accurate, as in Wizard's First Rule Shota told Richard that both Kahlan and Zedd would betray him, Zedd be using Wizard's Fire against him and Kahlan by touching him with her power. While it is true that both Zedd and Kahlan used their powers against Richard, a wizard's web cast on Richard by Darken Rahl caused both Zedd and Kahlan to think that Richard was Darken. So it wasn't truly a betrayal, as Shota's words had Richard and Kahlan thinking. -- NME 06:34, 29 September 2006 (UTC)
Thoughts on adding the following heading to the SoT main article?
The Goodkind's sole body of work to date, the Sword of Truth series, has received both criticism Reviewers discuss the awkward and repetetive prose and violence of the series. However, critics have also noted improvement in his writing over the development of the series, his ability to construct a detailed and creative world, and his writing of heroic characters with a powerful sense of morality. Goodkind himself has defended his inclusion of items such as torture, stating that (regarding Wizard's First Rule) his purpose was to highlight the helplessness, degredation and irrationality of an abusive relationship, not to shock or disgust. WLU 16:40, 2 November 2006 (UTC)
Well, again you seem to have over looked the rules. These are nothing more than blogs, most are personal attacks.
We have stated that these are not acceptable for use. Also having never read the series, we are then forced to conclude that you have no idea as to their validity. People can say or write any thing they wish...so what?
That in no way makes it valid. Peddle your disdant for Goodkind elsewhere please. Mystar 02:48, 9 November 2006 (UTC)
What rules have I broken? There is not a single blog. The closest to a blog is the Christian Fantasy one, which could easily be replaced by one of several others. They are not personal attacks (inchoatus being a possible exception, which could again be replaced, perhaps by the infinity review). Several praise Goodkind. This section opens the door to including other positive reviews as well. WLU 13:59, 9 November 2006 (UTC)
Sadly you must not have read any of them. Least of all Flag thingy who outright attacks with vehement and repugnant attacks...sorry we all have discussed this before. They are blogs, not professional reviews and all only offer attacks rather than reviews.
Again, as you have so stated you care not for the Author whom you've admidtedly never read, so go peddle your whares elsewhere.Mystar 22:42, 9 November 2006 (UTC)
Notes from past arguments on this crapola....
· To WLU: Anything on a blog is not a reputable source (See Wikipedia:Reliable Sources). In addition, anything that TG may have said to any of his fans really is a completely trivial piece of information, and as such, it is not of an encyclopedic nature.
· Finally, to Mystar: Please stop accusing everyone who disagrees with you of vandalism (Please read Wikipedia:Vandalism and specifically the section entitled What vandalism is not). I've been contributing to this page for months now, and I have yet to see one instance of true vandalism by a regular contributor.
As always, lets all be civil here. Thanks, Runch 23:05, 21 September 2006 (UTC)
Terry is not a sadist, don't make him out to be one just because he is able to create evil villains who can portray evil traits (IE sadism, violence, sexual-misconduct). If you want to address this, keep it local to the books/series, and don't make it sound like you are labelling the author with the same sweeping judgement. We can work on making it read appropriately in the appropriate article(s). Omnilord 22:29, 5 October 2006 (UTC)
Again we seek creditable sources...professional and NOT POV driven or attacks simply because the bloger feel threatened by Goodkind's success Mystar 00:40, 10 November 2006 (UTC)
WLU, you need to realize that there is more conversation that goes on about these articles than is present on these talk pages. Talk pages are somewhat inefficient to realtime colaboration efforts. In most of our cases, Mystar happens to be the person who makes the edits for the group. Some of us who are able to make use of their time to perform edits will login to wiki and do so, but of late many of us have been quite overburdened with work and the impending holiday season doesn't help to aleviate time constraints. So when Mystar speaks, he often does not speak only for himself, but for a large number of editors that just don't have more time to contribute than to have a brief instant messenger conversation with mystar about the direction something should take.
Mystar is a very blunt person after a point, and you passed that point a long time ago by refusing to yield your constant and consistant insistants on including material that the concensus has deemed inappropriate and un-encylopedic. Not only have you presumed to be the only authority on editing and have "owned" pages, you have repeatedly been cited as deliberately stating that you want to see mystar banned, you want to see Terry Goodkind shamed on Wikipedia, and you are now trying to use the wikipedia dispute resolution process to do so.
If you have such a strong aversion to Terry Goodkind, why don't you just walk away from all things Goodkind like a reasonable person would? Omnilord 05:44, 11 November 2006 (UTC)
Thanks for the addition Omnilord (realizing you're away for Turkeyday - research shows that transitory increases in calories such as through single days like Thanksgiving resulted in brief elevations in metabolism, not long-term weight gain. Have some gravy!) My problem with the section as is conflates fantasy with a youthful audience. I am an adult, and I read fantasy, as does my brother and many of my friends, my mother and my step-father, I'm guessing many of the editors of the Song of Ice and Fire pages as well, but we'd have to take a poll. Also, Sword of Truth is without a doubt fantasy, pretentions of TG aside. Reading fantasy does not mean you are a kid or immature. Plus it really sounds like an apology for TG's adult themes. The conflation of fantasy with children is one of the things I find irritating, as if writing fantasy is somehow something dirty or shameful or childish. Fantasy is a genre like any other - there's good and bad. Writing good fantasy, even though TG disagrees and this is a page on TG's novels, is not inherently bad, and right now I find the paragraph to be prejudicial against fantasy. Wikipedia should reflect a NPOV, not the POV of the author (o'course he can have opinions on the page, but with references and it should be obvious that it's his). Also, references to names past the first should be last names (i.e. replace Terry with Goodkind). I've already taken the liberty. WLU 02:16, 23 November 2006 (UTC)
I re-worked the paragraph to remove the whole 'fantasy is for children' bit - now it talks about two of the things that make it adult - philosophical themes and violence, but I hope I phrased it in a way that doesn't portray TG as a raving sadist. WLU 15:39, 14 December 2006 (UTC)
Just have a staw poll. WikieZach| talk 21:19, 28 November 2006 (UTC)
A what? Omnilord 22:19, 2 December 2006 (UTC)
The sentence under Themes is wrong: "The Sword of Truth series is also known for its intricately woven political intrigue, offering a stark contrast between Objectivist and socialist or collectivist beliefs." I may not know too much about collectivist beliefs, but I do know that, although he may portray an anti-socialist (or anti-communist) Americanized POV, that does not mean that is what he's actually referring to. I believe the term(s) needed here would be despotism, referring to the oligarchy involved. Do not use the term socialism when it simply isn't. There seems to be a large difference between what most North Americans view as socialism, and what the rest of the world views as socialism. At best, you could say that the contrast is between libtertarianism, and authoritarian communism. At best. However, it would still be much better to leave politics out of this. Especially seeing as how the comparison made is actually between a philisophical POV, and a political POV. It makes no sense. It's like comparing apples to oranges. If no one has any objections, I would like to remove that sentence.
"The Sword of Truth series is intricately woven with political intrigue designed to embody the stark contrast between Objectivism and collectivist beliefs." Omnilord 01:17, 16 January 2007 (UTC)
References
However, Darken Rahl and the Sisters of the Dark learn subtractive magic, though the Sisters of the dark learn by making a pact with the Keeper of the Underworld, where as Richard is born with the natural right.
Isn't it common knowledge that a warlock is a male wizard, and a witch is a female wizard? I highly doubt it is different in this series.
Just as 'human' applies to both men and women, 'wizard' applies to both witch and warlock.
Someone should just remove that part, and edit it to : there are only four types of magic-users... or something like that.
Madking 18:35, 3 March 2007 (UTC)
Actually, IIRC, Zedd does use the word Warlock in the incident on his front porch in Wizard's First Rule. He explains that a Warlock is the male equivalent of a Witch (though we never hear of one in existance). Esentner (talk) 21:14, 4 May 2009 (UTC)
This article can't avoid gushing on how great the series is every couple sentences:
The Sword of Truth, written by Terry Goodkind, is an epic fantasy series encompassing the stories of a diverse cast of characters.
Okay... fine... let's read on:
Each volume is self-contained, in that the primary conflicts of each novel are resolved within that novel; however, binding it together are the delicately interwoven threads of the many underlying characters and ongoing events throughout the works of this highly complex series.
Wow, delicately interwoven threads, you say! Let's move on to the next section:
The Sword of Truth is an epic fantasy series featuring a vast cast of unique characters.
Funny, I'd have called the characters "painfully derivative"...
Goodkind portrays in his novels, through complex character development, that individuals can remain true in the face of adversity without sacrificing their values and moral beliefs.
Who says he uses complex character development? You? Please cite something or take your opinions elsewhere.
The Sword of Truth series is also known for its intricately woven political intrigue, offering a stark contrast between Objectivist and socialist or collectivist beliefs.
Wow, everything is so intricately woven.
Perhaps there should be a section on the (very much mixed) critical reviews of this "masterpiece". Sorry for my tone :(
68.20.39.117 12:23, 1 May 2007 (UTC)
This guy doesn't have an article, or even a sub-subsection to himself, yet he seemed to have a pretty rare form of magic. Was he notable (I believe he died in the same book he appeared), was he described, is there any info on him? Because the Sword of Truth is a SERIOUS series (or it's supposed to be), I don't exactly like imaging him as a one-handed James from Team Rocket with a sketchpad... It's disturbing in all sorts of ways... XD 169.229.121.94 20:14, 14 May 2007 (UTC)
And NO, he's NOT on the minor characters list. 169.229.121.94 20:16, 14 May 2007 (UTC)
As for where he is, I'm guessing Wizard's First Rule. I DON'T OWN ANY BOOKS IN THE SERIES, WHAT I KNOW IS FROM ONLINE. 169.229.121.94 20:19, 14 May 2007 (UTC)
I don't know who wrote that history page, but it reminds me of some papaers I have read on history books. The first couple of books in this series are covered in exceeding detail, and then its as if the author(s) realized they were taking too much space and condensed the rest of the books to several sentences. Some of the information in the History section is plain wrong, other parts have distorations or incomplete references and facts. Any objections to my reworking that section of the page? OptumusPatronus 03:03, 15 May 2007 (UTC)
I added an "original research" tag to the article, because multiple sections of it, and paragraph 3 on "Historical and Cultural Themes in the novels" in particular, seem to have been written as personal interpretations of the material. If this is not the case, it would be worthwhile to add some good sources and citations.
Should someone start a new page that inculdes the individual countries, such as Kelton in the Midlands? I noticed that this page doesn't go into too much detail on the country and its people. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.153.176.2 (talk) 16:27, 28 March 2008 (UTC)
Frostlion (talk) 20:20, 2 February 2008 (UTC)
Hello!
Can we get a Spoiler Alert on the top of the page. I just found out that the protagonist will be emulating Skywalker soon ("NOOOOOOO[...]OOOOOO!") and I haven't gotten there in the book yet, nor did I know to be wary of it due to the missing Spoiler Alert.
Thanks! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.134.59.200 (talk) 11:25, 18 April 2008 (UTC)
I understand the policy on no spoilers, but I'm still sad that 2 sentences into the general article, it's revealed that the hero is related to the villain :( Could've omitted the surname. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.238.24.44 (talk) 03:33, 18 December 2012 (UTC)
This is a pretty poor article - where is the real world critism of the neo-con ideas presented in those books? that peace protesters should be killed, that torture is an acceptable practice when done by the good guys? --Killerofcruft (talk) 15:33, 20 June 2008 (UTC)
That's a joke right? Here is a verbatim quote - Nicci had no compunction about what she was doing. She knew that there was no moral equivalence between her inflicting torture and the Imperial Order doing what might on the surface seem like the same thing. But her purpose in using it was solely to save innocent lives. The Imperial Order used torture as a means of subjugation and conquest, as a tool to strike fear into their enemies. And, at times, as something they relished because it made them feel powerful to hold sway over not just agony but life itself.
of course we need Reliable sources for it to go in the article. --Allemandtando (talk) 23:00, 11 July 2008 (UTC)
This article is way way too in-universe. If someone else doesn't sort it, I'll be back shortly to take care of the problem. --Allemandtando (talk) 10:06, 27 June 2008 (UTC)
I have made substantial edits to the page based on the widespread inclusion of POV elements. While even the then edited state does not conform to my standards (for reasons of style and, more significantly, a funny pro-series stance that I regard as unfit for wikipedia) I do not have the time or energy to labor on these behalves. A list of my edits is included below. If there is disagreement with my undertaken measures, do please present your arguments first. I do not present arguments, as I consider the edited parts self-explanatory in regards to their unsuitability. The UC and OR disclaimers strike me as understatement as well.
Introduction:
"diverse cast of characters" completely removed. "delicately interwoven" removed. "highly complex" removed and sentece adjusted.
Novels of the Sword of Truth:
First sentence removed in entirety, as it is redundant and does not present new information.
Themes of the novels:
"The Sword of Truth series is also known for its intricately woven political intrigue" removed and sentence adjusted, since it is baseless, POV and - in actuality - very much false.
"philosophical themes" changed to singular and sentence adjusted, since former structure suggested some little Socrates at work. Philosophical exposition is limited to elements of Objectivism and 'Collectivism', which has already been mentioned.
Audience:
Nothing changed, although the last sentence unverified(-able) and suggests POV. Still, within the acceptable.
History and Geography:
Nothing changed, and little problematic.
Sword and Seeker of Truth:
"ghastly" adjective changed to something more suitable for an encyclopedia.
Pronounciation of names:
n/a
Characters:
Odd exposition on the Creator and the Keeper, but kept for the time being.
Political aspects:
Kept, but will require sourcing or deletion is recommendable. Section should probably be expanded, given the massive and ouvért ... well, preaching in the series that amounts to a considerable part of its total length. Monologues of Richard are easily comparable to those of John Galt, but wikipedia is not the place for these assertions. Although this section is likely central to an understanding of the series, lack of Original Research somewhere else should get it deleted in entirety. --fnord
One negative aspect of the Sword of Truth's magic is that it drains the life force from the one wielding it, slowly and over time changing all the seekers into a Gollum-like creature. When Richard discovers Samuel, the last Seeker and confronts Zedd, Zedd can only offer a glimmer of hope to Richard that the prophecies speak of "The one true Seeker who will master the sword and be protected from that terrible fate".
The part about Samuel and Zedds saying that he is sorry is true, but Samuel is not a true seeker announced by a wizard, he is a coward who has stolen the sword. And he lost the "fight" with the sword on the first time he killed someone with it. After Richard used it the first time, Kahlan said, that Zedd said, the first killing is special and the sword will try to overpower the man wielding it. "All" remember how powerful and frightening a "true" seeker announced by a wizard is, so is it really true, that all seekers end like Samule if they don't die? Another thing is that Samuel does not kill with it, because he fears the pain, the sword gives, but Richard kills with the sword before Denna captures him and is proteced by his right anger. 84.57.240.41 (talk) 21:38, 3 August 2008 (UTC)
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I posted the statement because it's vital to the section. However, if someone can find where Terry himself posted it, instead of having to cite a message board, that'd be great. Also, please feel free to clean up my formatting or change it to be suitable for a quote, this is one of my first times editing Wikipedia.Hypershadow647 (talk) 23:08, 5 February 2009 (UTC)
Ikip (talk) 06:55, 22 February 2009 (UTC)
The overlooking of legitimate criticism, such as the author's soap-boxing, the ignorance of real political and philosophical terms in the editors defending the author, etc. I don't care very much one way or the other about the author or the series (both are nothing special and the work is very derivative) but its profile has been raised by the TV adaption and this page is not fit for an encyclopaedia as it stands. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.195.192.30 (talk) 00:22, 30 October 2009 (UTC)
A video is up on Terry's site and youtube channel promoting a new Richard and Kahlan novel for early 2011. Notice he doesn't call it Sword of Truth!
This is exciting! He probably is continuing the story in the Sword of Truth universe since the show has brought so many more people to the books! Seekeroftruth469 (talk) 16:09, 4 April 2010 (UTC)
The Law of Nines section states that the lead protagonist Alex Rahl is a descendant of Jensen Rahl. Is this in fact confirmed? According to the series Richard & Kahlan's children will include male Confessors which are a horror that must be avoided at all costs. This book mentions the Rahl golden age ending but doesn't specify if it ends with Richard's (or his heirs) death or disappearance. It strikes me as conceivable that Richard and Kahlan in an effort to enjoy a normal life in the woods, would need to leave their world, certainly their own little corner of it. Given Alex was able to activate the gateway I'd say he must have magic in his blood though of course the book suggests otherwise. There were a few other artifacts and indications though that to my mind imply the possibility of magic. Anyhow isn't it reaching to state that Alex is Jensen's descendant rather than Richards? I'd suggest changing the claim to reflect the ambiguity.203.25.1.208 (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 23:32, 19 October 2010 (UTC).
— Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.57.10.236 (talk) 22:27, 13 January 2013 (UTC)
There are some hyperlinks that don’t work correctly. For example, under the section “Invasion of the Imperial Order,” there are links to Verna and Ann. They should take one to the appropriate sections in the “List of the Sword of Truth Characters.” Will someone with more savvy than I please repair these links. Thank you. Mike Bandy (talk) 09:22, 15 August 2011 (UTC)
The comment(s) below were originally left at Talk:The Sword of Truth/Comments, and are posted here for posterity. Following several discussions in past years, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.
Comment(s) | Press [show] to view → |
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Assessed as B class. However this article need to more more rigorous on the "referencing front". I needs to incorporate a "Literary significance & criticism" section. Generally move away from a "Fansite" tone. :: Kevinalewis : (Talk Page)/(Desk) 09:37, 15 January 2007 (UTC)
Reassessed as Start class. The article lacks proper references and lacks important sections such as "Background", "Publication history", "Style" and "Reception". Ladida (talk) 07:27, 2 December 2008 (UTC) Looking at the criteria I completely agree that reassessment was called for - however I believe C-Class is the more appropriate level. Check the WP 1.0 descriptive criteria for each class if you have any doubts. :: Kevinalewis : (Talk Page)/(Desk) 10:45, 2 December 2008 (UTC) |
Last edited at 10:45, 2 December 2008 (UTC). Substituted at 08:26, 30 April 2016 (UTC)
This article is clearly not limiting itself to books part of the official "sword of truth" series. That culminated in Confessor and Omen Machine began a new series.
Legend of Magda is similarly not part of the series. So if we mention this then why not have a section for Law of Nines? Both are separated from the main sequence by centuries.
It is silly to dismiss it as speculation when anyone who reads Confessor recognizes the undisputable connection. Ranze (talk) 13:52, 30 May 2016 (UTC)
The introduction paragraph states there are 20 books in the series, then just below it they are listed 'in chronological order' ... I'm only counting 19 titles though. If the titles were listed by date of publication, would there be 20? Does listing them by fictional timeline of events warp the fundamental laws of this reality whereby 20 and 19 are the same number and equal to one another? How many rules were there? 42 right? Pretty sure there are 42 wizard rules. It's only logical. Not sure I want to get involved. I've not read the wheel of something or whatever either, but I'm not looking the amount of uncertainty involved with establishing a baseline for what it's getting into if I pick up one of these books.. I was wholly unprepared for the way the song of ice and fire painstakingly described every mouthwatering bite of every meal every character had and I had to stop reading it after I put on 30lbs (binge feasting while I read), IDK if I can put up with the childishness I've seen it these debates. Why is it unacceptable to flit from one escapist fantasy to another leaving without judgments, it's escapism, enjoy the ride... But I digress. I'm really confused about the 19≠20 thing though since Kindle doesn't list "book 6" with it's numerical designation as it does for 1-5 && 7-11 then it jumps to 14.. I really must insist that you lost the titles by their publication dates as well, story time timelines are only as complete as a guarantee that no official Canon stories will every be published by the original authors again.. like Anne Rice vowing to never write another one of those kinds of stories again (paraphrased), then twilight happened. *Sighs* But trying to put them in chronological order in the midst of her still writing novels would be ludicrous, especially given the broad scopes of time each novel encompassed. At the very least, each mini synopsis should have publication dates and probably list each one's order in any original numbering schemas. I'm gleaning the idea that the first book was the first wizard rule or whatever, so that kind of information, while redundant to your understanding, should be foremost present to any layman who happens upon this article. Users are either in it to follow every link they see, it they are looking for information. In the case of the latter, they are unlikely to load page after page of articles to get to what they might be looking for (this is especially true when browsing on mobile devices and data networks), it's simply not time efficient. And if it takes so long to get to the point that you forgot what the point was... Well, isn't that pointless? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.35.137.24 (talk) 15:44, 29 April 2018 (UTC)
Should the "Publications" section be expanded to include the "The Law of Nines?" — Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.237.28.188 (talk) 05:13, 17 March 2019 (UTC)