- The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was: promoted by SL93 (talk) 15:54, 24 August 2019 (UTC)
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Psalm 150[edit]
- ... that Psalm 150 names nine kinds of musical instruments to be used in praise of God, including the harp, lyre, drum, flute, cymbal, and shofar? Source: "He should be praised with every type of instrument, from the blasts of the shofar to harps, tambourines, flutes, cymbals, and more. (David lists nine types of instruments in all – even castanets!)" (Orthodox Union)
- ALT1:... that in the ancient Jewish text of Perek Shirah, verse 5 of Psalm 150 is said by the spider, and verse 6 by the rat? Source: "The Spider is saying, "Praise Him with sounding cymbals! Praise Him with loud clashing cymbals!" (Psalms 150:5)" ... "The Rat is saying, 'Let every soul praise God, Hallelukah! (Psalms 150:6)" (Perek Shirah
5x expanded by Gerda Arendt (talk) and Yoninah (talk). Nominated by Yoninah (talk) at 22:51, 12 June 2019 (UTC).
- Of the two hooks, I think I prefer ALT1, but the wording seems to assume that readers know what Psalm 150, Perhaps instead of "said by the spider" or "by the rat", perhaps the hook could be rephrased to instead say "said by a spider", or a general statement like "certain verses are said by animals such as a spider and a rat"? Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 00:02, 27 June 2019 (UTC)
- @Narutolovehinata5: Perek Shirah asserts that each animal, bird, and inanimate objects like the sun, moon, and earth, all "sing shirah (praises)" to God. It then connects a verse in Tanakh with each animal/bird/object. The format for each entry is: The spider says, '(text of verse)'". The rat says, '(text of verse)'". It is inaccurate to say that these verses are "said by a spider". I think the way I wrote it is most accurate and also hooky. Yoninah (talk) 00:13, 27 June 2019 (UTC)
- Hmmm, can you rewrite the hook then to focus on Shirah's assertion? Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 00:23, 27 June 2019 (UTC)
- OK:
- ALT2: ... that the ancient Jewish text of Perek Shirah asserts that the spider and the rat praise God with verses from Psalm 150?
- I added this explanation of Perek Shirah to the article and sourced it. Yoninah (talk) 20:09, 27 June 2019 (UTC)
- Hmmm, can you rewrite the hook then to focus on Shirah's assertion? Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 00:23, 27 June 2019 (UTC)
For the most part, article meets expansion and paraphrasing requirements. A QPQ has been done. Most of the article is sourced, and ALT2a is cited inline and verified in the sources. However, the article has several unsourced statements, such as most of the "Musical settings" section and the last sentence of the Catholicism section. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 00:40, 28 June 2019 (UTC)- The Catholicism section has one cite in the paragraph, which meets WP:DYKSG#D2. Pinging @Gerda Arendt: on the musical settings section. Yoninah (talk) 01:39, 28 June 2019 (UTC)
- Will do later today. Ping me again if I forget please. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 05:31, 28 June 2019 (UTC)
- I managed a few from the top. Do you really need more, when the title of the pieces is Psalm 150? I didn't write the list, - it was there before we expanded. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 22:23, 28 June 2019 (UTC)
- Gerda Arendt, Yoninah, Narutolovehinata5, where does this nomination currently stand? It has been over a month since the last post here. Thanks for getting it moving again. BlueMoonset (talk) 01:50, 30 July 2019 (UTC)
- I asked if I have to find references for the fact that a composition named Psalm 50 is based on Psalm 50, in several cases, and already in the article before we expanded. No answer yet. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 05:48, 30 July 2019 (UTC)
- Personally I think there's probably no need for a reference to cite the fact that Psalm 150 is based on Psalm 150 from the bible, as this is a DYK and theoretically sourcing standards are lower than say for a GA or an FA. The rest of the sourcing issues (such as the lack of citations in the Musical settings section) remain, however. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 11:06, 18 August 2019 (UTC)
- Do we have a misunderstanding? It is precisely in that section that several pieces are called Palm 50. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 11:11, 18 August 2019 (UTC)
- As I said, I'd be okay not citing the ones that are already called Psalm 150 by themselves, my comment about the sourcing issues is more out of concern that other editors may not feel the same way. With that said, some of them probably do need to be cited (such as the work of Rubbra, Stravinsky, and Ellington) since their mention in the article did not mention 150. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 11:16, 18 August 2019 (UTC)
- @Narutolovehinata5: everything is cited now. Yoninah (talk) 16:05, 18 August 2019 (UTC)
- The unsourced statement on Catholicism I mentioned before still lacks a reference, though as DYK rules only require at least one reference per paragraph and the previous sentence already has a footnote, as long as the information is already in an existing source, I'm willing to let it pass. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 00:38, 22 August 2019 (UTC)
- Same source, I fixed it. Yoninah, what you did is just amazing! --Gerda Arendt (talk) 06:21, 22 August 2019 (UTC)
- The unsourced statement on Catholicism I mentioned before still lacks a reference, though as DYK rules only require at least one reference per paragraph and the previous sentence already has a footnote, as long as the information is already in an existing source, I'm willing to let it pass. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 00:38, 22 August 2019 (UTC)
- @Narutolovehinata5: everything is cited now. Yoninah (talk) 16:05, 18 August 2019 (UTC)
- As I said, I'd be okay not citing the ones that are already called Psalm 150 by themselves, my comment about the sourcing issues is more out of concern that other editors may not feel the same way. With that said, some of them probably do need to be cited (such as the work of Rubbra, Stravinsky, and Ellington) since their mention in the article did not mention 150. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 11:16, 18 August 2019 (UTC)
- Do we have a misunderstanding? It is precisely in that section that several pieces are called Palm 50. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 11:11, 18 August 2019 (UTC)
- Personally I think there's probably no need for a reference to cite the fact that Psalm 150 is based on Psalm 150 from the bible, as this is a DYK and theoretically sourcing standards are lower than say for a GA or an FA. The rest of the sourcing issues (such as the lack of citations in the Musical settings section) remain, however. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 11:06, 18 August 2019 (UTC)
- I asked if I have to find references for the fact that a composition named Psalm 50 is based on Psalm 50, in several cases, and already in the article before we expanded. No answer yet. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 05:48, 30 July 2019 (UTC)
Thanks. All the issues I've raised appear to have been resolved, so this is now good to go with either ALT2 or ALT2a. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 08:55, 22 August 2019 (UTC)
