The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was soft delete. Deletion is supported, and not clearly opposed. There has been detailed discussion and search for sources to try to establish what exists at the location, though nothing clear has been established, other than there appears to have been a community at one time around a mill which may or may not continue to exist. This is a form of soft delete - the article may be undeleted into Draft space on request, from where it may be moved into main space after passing review. SilkTork (talk) 13:41, 3 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Fletcher Mill, Virginia

[edit]

[Hide this box] New to Articles for deletion (AfD)? Read these primers!

(Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)

Previously bundled, re-nominating individually. The "unincorporated community" description appears to be a GNIS error; sources simply describe this place as a mill, and there's not enough significant coverage to meet GNG. –dlthewave ☎ 15:23, 11 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Geography and Virginia. –dlthewave ☎ 15:23, 11 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Previous participants pinged here to avoid multiple noticfications. –dlthewave ☎ 15:39, 11 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Am looking into this Mill, It might be in literature as Fletchers/Fletcher's Mill in Sperryville, as seen here. Will try to do some more research but I need to take a break. Shearonink (talk) 23:34, 11 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 19:14, 18 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Comment Here is pic of Fletcher's Mill, circa 1870, Fletchers Mill, VA. There is also 2015-garden-dialogues-sperryville-va-house-at-fletcher-s-mill, so yes Fletcher's Mill is in or near Sperryville. It is not separately listed on the NRHP, but I am checking if it is in Sperryville Historic District (Nrhp doc is slow to download). --Doncram (talk) 02:09, 20 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The modern design house named "Fletcher's Mill Residence", presumably thereabouts, has sources Residential Dsign Magazine article, https://richardwilliamsarchitects.com/FLETCHER-S-MILL. Still downloading. --Doncram (talk) 02:17, 20 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

From the NRHP doc: "By 1910 Sperryville reached its prime. Four churches stood within the bustling village: two Baptist, one Episcopal, and one Methodist. The town had five general stores, five com and flour mills, pal, and one Methodist. The town had five general stores, five com and flour mills, a jeweler arid watch maker, a saw mill , several furniture dealers as well as a number of blacksmiths-wheelwrights. However, the growth was abruptly halted in 1911 when the Snoot tannery closed...". The district appears to include Zirkle Mill but has no mention of Fletcher's; I presume Fletcher's is outside... oh, its coordinates put it 1.8 miles away by Google maps. It is on the Thornton River. There are a few houses there, including 9 Fletcher's Mill Rd. with elaborate formal gardens behind, and 17 Fletcher's Mill Rd, and there's a building on "Short Rd." which from Google Streetview appears to be a horse barn. Three roads make a triangle: Sperryville Pike (U.S. Route 522) and those two mentioned. Seems to me like a location, i guess you would call it an unincorporated place.

There's a photo and passage about a visit to Fletcher's Mill in 1919 article in American Miller. The miller, then, a Mr. Wayland, had a house and farm nearby, no mention of more community then. Any historic mill like that would be a significant landmark, a place of note, anyhow. Maybe merge/redirect to Thornton River? --Doncram (talk) 02:41, 20 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Just out of curiosity, what gave you the idea to treat it as a location or "unincorporated place" instead of just a mill? –dlthewave ☎ 04:15, 20 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Uh, because there is a Wikipedia article which was saying it is an unincorporated community until you just changed it, and a Gnis source. Does Gnis cover individual mills? What does the Gnis source mean? And by a deletion nominator changing what the article says, stripping some stuff out, during the AFD (which is usually confusing and I think not recommended), does that mean u support it being an article about a mill? If so, could you please withdraw the AFD, as there are no other "delete" votes. If you want to continue the AFD, please add back what you removed.

The mill is also listed List of wheat and corn mills registered with the Dairy and Food Division of the Department of Agriculture and Immigration of Virginia in July 1911, July 1912 as having a guaranteed daily capacity of 24 bbls. (barrels?) of flour and 75 bus. (bushels?) of meal (cornmeal?), with the latter footnoted to say that it was below minimum capacity, whatever that means (did that mean it was guaranteeing 75 bus. production but that was below its actual maximum capacity?). That was for James H. Fletcher of Sperryville, VA. --Doncram (talk) 05:25, 20 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

And it has a different level of registration [https://www.google.com/books/edition/Bulletin/n8gcAQAAIAAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&dq=Fletcher%27s+Mill+in+Sperryville,+Virginia&pg=RA1-PA4&printsec=frontcover in similar list for the year July 1914-June 30, 1915

The place or unincorporated community or mill, on Virginia Route 620 (which the Fletcher Mill Rd. is designated), is also the put-in place for a 7 miles (11 km) class II and III whitewater run (page 149 of Adventure Guide to Virginia by Leonard M. Atkins, Hunter Publishing Inc., 1998

And it is also a place in a 1988 Paddler's Guide by H. Roger Corbett

and there is also coverage (but I can't see how much) in 1976 Back to Nature in Canoes

And it is a place in another Canoeing Whitewater guide from 1974

And it is covered in a 1987 Appalachian Whitewater book, which also mentions that during the American Civil War that Southern troops camped by the Thornton River in Sperryville, perhaps meaning this spot but I can't see.

And it appears in (but I can't see how much coverage there is) in Fact, Fiction, Foolishishness in Rappahannock County Virginia, or something like that by Elizabeth Branch Johnson, looks like a local history book.

So it is seeming to me to be a known place, as well as having been a mill. Google satellite view suggests to me that the mill is gone; it didn't look good in the 2018 photo linked above, but once notable always notable applies. --Doncram (talk) 05:47, 20 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I removed the "unincorporated community" description as it had no reliable source. GNIS is unreliable for "feature class" designations because yes, the database does erroneously list mills and other random buildings that appear on topo maps as "populated places".

I hoped my question would help you take a step back and ask yourself whether the sourcing that we have (excluding GNIS) treats this as an actual community. Mills, stores, crossroads, etc are often used as landmarks in rural areas even though they don't usually meet our notability standards, and unfortunately I'm just not seeing enough direct coverage of the subject itself to justify an article. I might change my mind if such sources can be found.

As for the location, the 2018 photo appears to match this spot on the satellite view which is consistent with American Miller's description of the water source as a small stream. –dlthewave ☎ 12:39, 20 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Ah, well, good that the mill seems to survive, on what is labelled as Beaver Dam Creek in Google satellite view which i think is 2022 imaging. That makes sense that the creek would have been blocked by a dam for the mill, rather than the river being blocked. That's more than 100 yards away from the river, in trees, and not likely visible from the river or the point given in coordinates in the Fletcher Dam article or the closeby point that Google gives when one searches on Fletchers Mill. So actually that tends to mean that "Fletchers Mill" is a bigger place, like a community, when stated as the location for canoe put-in onto the river, IMHO. --Doncram (talk) 20:41, 21 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Note: For possible navigation, the previous bundled AFD was Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Lawthorne Mill, Virginia, closed "no consensus" on September 11, covering 10 places with "Mill" in name, and now separately running are:

--Doncram (talk) 02:55, 24 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 20:40, 25 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Delete for failing GNG. I ran a search for "Fletcher Mill" and got a roadway guide and a Maine-based peppermill company. USPS doesn't think it's important enough to have its own ZIP code.Blue Riband► 02:31, 3 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.