The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. Ad Orientem (talk) 00:55, 6 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

List of European saints[edit]

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This list has several problems with it. It claims to be an exhaustive list not only of those saints that have been born in what is now Europe but also those who have visited Europe. I cannot see a purpose for this list other than cruft. Benkenobi18 (talk) 18:10, 29 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Lists of people-related deletion discussions. Bakazaka (talk) 18:53, 29 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Christianity-related deletion discussions. Bakazaka (talk) 18:53, 29 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Europe-related deletion discussions. Bakazaka (talk) 18:53, 29 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Keep -- Place the Saints project banner on the talk page. There are a number of saints-by-region lists, none of which have gone through AfD. We should give this AfD time to season, bring it back in a year. Tag it up to highlight the need for sourcing, discuss some options to eliminate the cruftiness, options that could serve as WP:Saints list guidance. If this list was limited to saints born or died in Europe, would that be a keep? -- Paleorthid (talk) 23:13, 29 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

As is the list makes no distinction between those who are born in Europe and those who have visited at any one point. The list is wholly unsourced, meaning it would take longer to construct such a list by paring this list down than it would be to blow this list up completely and start from scratch. We have smaller sublists which are quite useful, for individual countries like France and Italy. The reality is that a great majority of the saints would fall in a 'Saints born in Europe' Category, which would hinder the usefulness of such a list. Salvaging it was my first thought but then I realized it would be more work to salvage than to AFD this, due to how it's been constructed. Benkenobi18 (talk) 02:59, 2 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of History-related deletion discussions. North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 12:09, 30 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Wrong venue. Saints should be listed on Wikipedia, and there are too many of them to list in one article, so decisions have to be made about how to divide up such lists. The place to make such decisions, which affect lots of articles, is not a deletion discussion for one article. WP:WikiProject Religion or Talk:List of Saints would be much better places. I would however point out that non-Christians, and non-Catholic Christians, also have saints, so any article titles should reflect which religion or denomination they are about. Phil Bridger (talk) 12:17, 30 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Keep. Meets WP:LISTPEOPLE. European saints are discussed as a set in sources - e.g. [1][2][3]. Inclusion criteria (specifically whether visiting Europe (with or without performing a saintly activity) is sufficient - a side issue which probably doesn't affect all that many (definitely not the pre-modern ones)) - is an issue for the talk page, not AfD. Icewhiz (talk) 12:21, 30 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Delete blow it up. Entirely unsourced in the article, and entries (Princess Olga Paley) fail verification. Bernard Vũ Văn Duệ has no clear tie to Europe. Almost everything on List of saints would fall here. None of Icewhiz's references suggest to me that having a "European saints" page (as opposed to per-country pages) is useful or required by how the topic is covered in sources - the references talk about saints of countries in Europe (i.e. saints of Scotland), not describing the saints as "European saints". His third ref talks of the "strong bond" between saints and countries. power~enwiki (π, ν) 19:01, 1 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.