- REDIRECT Category:Years of the 18th century in Egypt to Category:Years of the 18th century in Ottoman Egypt – C2C per Category:18th century in Ottoman Egypt, which was renamed per Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/Log/2020_August_31#Category:17th_century_in_Egypt. If this set is approved for speedy processing then a mass nomination will follow for 19th century. – Fayenatic London 08:06, 21 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]
- REDIRECT Category:1798 in Egypt to Category:1798 in Ottoman Egypt
- REDIRECT Category:1799 in Egypt to Category:1799 in Ottoman Egypt
- REDIRECT Category:1800 in Egypt to Category:1800 in Ottoman Egypt
- REDIRECT Category:1790s in Egypt to Category:1790s in Ottoman Egypt
- REDIRECT Category:18th-century Egyptian people to Category:18th-century people of Ottoman Egypt (like Category:16th-century people of Ottoman Egypt)
- REDIRECT Category:17th-century Egyptian people to Category:17th-century people of Ottoman Egypt
- Strong oppose. @Fayenatic: That was a bad CFD decision in substance. Rebranding the chronology categories for a region on the basis of which coloniser was in control at the time adds no value for navigation (which is the main point of categories), and actively impedes navigation by removing consistency. The adjective "Ottoman" adds precisely nothing of navigational benefit, and fails WP:CONCISE. If this approach was followed through, we would have a series of different titles for the Egyptian chronology categories, for each of the successive colonial regimes, and then probably a series of titles for the various indigenous regimes which have followed. That complexity helps neither readers nor editors. We have a head article "Egypt" covering all these eras, and that title is best for navigation.
Procedurally, that CFD was fundamentally flawed. It should have tagged and listed all the categories involved, which would have drawn the attention of more editors to the the folly which was being proposed. I appreciate that Fayenatic is trying to clean up after that flawed close of a flawed nomination ... but the unintended effect of using speedy to followup a flawed nomination is a form of stealthy bypasss of the consensus-forming process of CFD. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 01:27, 22 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]
- @BrownHairedGirl: just for info, I had not joined in this Ottoman Egypt discussion after earlier in vain having tried to change Category:Ottoman Syria which is used for the entire Levant, while no such polity in the entire Levant existed for most of the time. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:38, 22 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]
- Just for info - "Egypt" is a colonial name for the Nile Delta province imposed by occupant Roman Empire; the original naming was probably MSR in Ancient Egyptian language, though by the time of Roman occupation it had in fact become a Hellinistic dynasty named Ptolemaïkḕ basileía. Most modern Egyptian population is made of Arab Muslim invaders coming during Arab conquests from nearby Arabia (this is preserved in the official name of Egypt - Arab Republic of Egypt), while minority Copts are descended from Byzantine Christians who themselves descend from colonizing population from earlier era.GreyShark (dibra) 06:44, 22 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]
- @Greyshark09: Most of that has no relevance that has to this discussion. Howver, the fact that you agree that the term "Egypt" has been in use from Roman times makes your rebranding nomination rather silly. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 07:19, 22 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]
- It was Provincia Aegyptus, which has almost nothing to do with modern Arab Republic of Egypt, except partial territorial overlap (very partial). Roman Aegyprus categories were recently renamed to differentiate from Arab Republic of Egypt due to anachronism - see relevant discussion.GreyShark (dibra) 10:13, 22 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]
- @Greyshark09:
almost nothing to do with modern Arab Republic of Egypt ... except that per the lead of Provincia Aegyptus, it "encompassed most of modern-day Egypt except for the Sinai Peninsula". Your obssession with relabelling at regime change serves on purpose other than to disrupt category navigation, and I think it's time to revisit the damage which you have done by your sneaky CFDs which don't even list the subcats. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 16:04, 22 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]
- Actually, nothing. Different population, different culture and language, different ruling class, different ethnic groups, different everything. Even the name "Egypt" for Jamahuriyyat Mizr al-Arabiya is Western, not used by current country's population and government. It is only your imagination connects Ancient MSR, Roman Aegyptus, Ottoman province of Mizr and modern Jamahuriyyat Mizr al-Arabiya into some continuous fiction. Same way you can refer to Arab Republic of Iraq as continuation of Sumer and Akkad and Canada as continuation of the Iroquese Federation.GreyShark (dibra) 08:24, 23 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]
- Agree with Oppose arguments. It is all so much simpler to use "Egypt" all along. Place Clichy (talk) 20:58, 22 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]
- Although BrownHairedGirl says category navigation will be impeded, it's not impeded much, since the category header templates use ((navseasoncats)) which can bridge changes in name where redirects are set up. As well as Ottoman, the history of Egypt has the periods of Roman and Byzantine Egypt, see Category:Centuries in Egypt. I have no axe to grind here, and was (as BHG acknowledges) trying to resolve inconsistencies; but Wikipedia currently has plenty of other examples of chronologies using the colonial name, e.g. the Portuguese period in Category:Decades in Mozambique (to cite another one that currently needs sorting out). – Fayenatic London 22:56, 22 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]
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