< July 10 July 12 >

July 11

Category:Irish Roman Catholics

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was no consensus. Conscious 07:11, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Delete - needs to be deleted -- the overwhelming majority of Irish subjects are R.C. and there are too many sub and sub-sub categories for this category. Ireland is not a country (unlike say Finland or Iceland) where this religious denomination is any cause at all for particular interest. If carried to its logical extreme the overwhelming majority of people from Ireland will have to be included on this category as well.

There are about 10 or 11 names that will need to be manually re- categorized.

Ciociabasia 22:58, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Just a note to respond --not voting again -- you misunderstand me; when I stated that "...where this religious denomination is any cause at all for particular interest" I meant that it is because the overwhelming majority of its natives have always been R.C. Would you make a list of British Anglicans? Israeli Jews? Austrian Catholics? Italian Roman Catholics? It is absurd and unnecessary, since the already existing categories or the text will clearly establish the person's denomination in most if not almost all cases.

If this category remains then every person who qualifies will need to be added. Moreover every country on the face of the earth should get its own category on this basis (French Catholics, Lebanese Catholics (Greek or Roman??), Indian Catholics, Somalian Catholics; South African Catholics, Polish Catholics; Russian Catholics, etc). "Unmanageable" will be an understatement. Ciociabasia 20:31, 12 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:American people by state to Category:American people by state or territory

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was keep. Conscious 07:11, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Not all of the subcategories are statehoods: Washington DC, Guam, Virgin Islands, Puerto Rico. User:Arual 21:54, 11 July 2006 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:Guantanamo attorneys to Category:Guantanamo Bay attorneys

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was rename. Conscious 07:11, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The current category title is ambiguous. Guantanamo itself is a disambiguation article on Wikipedia. The proposed new name would clarify things, but an entirely different, better wording might also exist. Kurieeto 21:50, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Wikipedia:Missing Wikipedians to Wikipedia:Users not currently active

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was misplaced request, use the move button, the talk page, or WP:RM if there's a disagreement. Conscious 07:11, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:Louisiana-Monroe Indians football

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was delete. Conscious 07:11, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Delete. I had created the new Category:Louisiana-Monroe Warhawks football before recalling to use this page. This is related to the other CAT (footbal players) proposal 2 below for renaming. Thanks. Aaron charles 19:57, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:Texas lists to Category:Texas-related lists

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was rename. Conscious 07:11, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

x-related is the form used by the grand-parent category Category:Lists by country as well as the only other lists by state category Category:Hawaii-related lists. JeffW 19:44, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:Louisiana-Monroe Indians football players to Category:Louisiana-Monroe Warhawks football players

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was rename. Conscious 07:11, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The mascot of the University of Louisiana at Monroe changed on June 26, 2006 and the category should be changed for consistency. Aaron charles 19:38, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:Catholic religious life to Category:Roman Catholic religious life

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was no consensus. Conscious 07:11, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The articles listed in the category relate to the Roman Catholic Church specifically rather than churches of the Catholic tradition generally, and should be changed to remove ambiguity. Fishhead64 19:02, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:Catholic liturgy to Category:Roman Catholic liturgy

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was no consensus. Conscious 07:11, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The articles listed in the category relate to the Roman Catholic Church specifically rather than churches of the Catholic tradition generally, and should be changed to remove ambiguity. Fishhead64 19:01, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

  • Having perused the content, I believe the omission of any significant Eastern content suggests this category is intended to be particular to the Roman church. Gimmetrow 18:31, 13 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:Rogues galleries to Category:Fictional villains

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was merge. Conscious 07:11, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

More obvious title. Tim! 18:46, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:African American Senators to Category:African American United States senators

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was no consensus --Kbdank71 20:18, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I was originally going to send this to speedy to lower-case the "S", but it is also necessary to specify which senate, in line with the intention of the category, as there are also senates in individual U.S. states. Chicheley 20:26, 27 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

relisting from June 27 with a view to gaining consensus on how to rename this category Tim! 18:13, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:Microbreweries

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was keep --Kbdank71 20:56, 19 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Delete: There is no agreed definition of what constitutes a microbrewery other than it is a brewery which produces an amount of beer per year ranging from less than 1,500 barrels to less than 1 million barrels [2] Usage varies from country to country - and the term is sometimes replaced with the term craft brewer. The majority of breweries in the world are small and produce less than 15,000 barrels a year, so the majority of breweries could be classed as microbreweries by size. A more reasonable approach would be to create a Global breweries category to deal with the smaller amount of breweries that do not fit the microbrewery tag, and which - because they have brewing plant in more than one country - do not fit easily on the breweries by region category. This proposal is contentious. There is a debate going on at the WikiBeerProject [3] SilkTork 18:11, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for repopulating the category while this discussion is ongoing. ×Meegs 10:00, 12 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Comment That's an interesting comment. The reason I am suggesting removing the cat is that it is inherently POV. As there is no agreed definition of what constitutes a microbrewery each person will have their own opinion, their own POV. Whenever someone places a microbrewery tag on an article they are making a POV judgement that another editor may disagree with. The term itself is contentious and vague. Which definition are you thinking of using when you wish to apply the microbrewery tag: this one: "In the United States, a microbrewery is a brewery producing less than 1 million hectolitres per year." [4], which is the US Government view; this one: "Microbrewery - Breweries and brewpubs producing less than 1,500 barrels per year." [5], which is by Bill Owens at American Brewer Magazine; or this one: "Microbrewery: A brewery that produces less than 15,000 barrels (17,600 hectoliters) of beer per year." [6], by the Brewers Association. And if you are thinking that the term microbrewery conveys something more than just size - as in approach to brewing or customer satisfaction, then you'd have to show in what way you feel brewery X is different to brewery Y - and if you start getting into areas of use of adjuncts or flexibility of approach, then even global brewers produce beers with no adjuncts, while small breweries use adjuncts; and some small brewers have been producing the same beer for decades, while global brewers are altering their portfolios to reflect changing customer taste. You see? I'd be happy for someone to explain to me the advantage of keeping such a category. I enjoy a debate. And I could well be wrong here. I'd appreciate someone explaining what they feel a microbrewery actually is, and why we should have a category for such breweries. SilkTork 09:30, 12 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
I think the superset of all of these definitions should be included in the category. That way, no matter what you reasonably expect a microbrewery to be, you'll be able to find it in the category listing.
Are there any problems with this approach? Are any of the definitions unreasonable, or for the sake of neutrality, we should ask are they challenged or controversial? —Michael Z. 2006-07-12 16:59 Z
I'm interested. You are suggesting we list breweries in terms of the amount of beer they produce? It's possible, but difficult. We could, of course, also list breweries in terms of the style of beer they produce. Or we could list breweries by how long they have been in existence (a particular favourite here in Europe, especially here in the UK). Or we could list breweries in terms of ownership (another favourite in Europe, especially in the UK, where family run breweries are favoured - and have their own organisation: [7]). All these things are possible. And there is a sense in which I like all of them. However, when the beer categories were sorted out and breweries were grouped as they are now by region [8], that seemed the most useful way of organising them. The volume of beer that a brewery produces has nothing to do with its quality or importance. The brewery that most beer geeks like myself deem to be the most interesting produces a very small amount of beer: Westvleteren Brewery. Though one of the world's largest breweries - Scottish & Newcastle - is responsible for one of the world's most significant beers: Courage Russian Imperial Stout. Size, as such, means nothing in terms of the brewery's quality or importance. And size as determined by a term as contentious as "microbrewery" is certainly the least exact way of measuring it. I see where you are coming from - and I'm aware and interested in the many ways that breweries can be categorised. However, it seems to me that most of the ways we could categorise breweries are either not helpful, or are too vague or are POV. And using the term "microbreweries" is unhelpful, vague and POV - it hits all three! If the microbrewery cat survives this nomination (and I hope it doesn't, but looks like it might because most people don't understand the issues and are not getting involved in the debate), I will endeavour to make it as user friendly as possible. Though I would still like you to give me what you feel is a usable definition of microbrewery so that I can see how best to make the category work for you. SilkTork 22:47, 12 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Mass-market beer, microbrewed beer, brewpub beer are categories that may be difficult to delineate precisely, but most beer drinkers know what they generally indicate. They will be useful ways to categorize beers, alongside regional categories and brewing styles.
If there is any controversy about whether a particular brewery falls into a particular category, then we should look at the definitions that you've mentioned above, and evaluate the categorization in light of them. Until then, what's the problem? —Michael Z. 2006-07-13 03:37 Z
The problem is in the phrase you have just used: "most beer drinkers know what they generally indicate". Among the founding principles of Wikipedia is that the information contained here should be verifiable. I am trying to indicate with references to reliable sources that there is no verifiable evidence that the term microbrewery is solid enough to use in an encyclopedia as a category - that all we have is the gut feeling of various drinkers that they roughly know what it means, and a variety of formal definitions of size. So the problem is that it is a misleading, unverified, POV term and when used as a category immediately invites editors to indulge in POV Original Research. The main information available for whether a brewery goes into the microbrewery category will be the editor's general gut feeling. That people use the term is not in dispute - I use the term in speech to fellow beer geeks and in articles I have written [9]. What is in dispute is the usefulness of a vague POV term as a category. The term, while used, is widely acknowledged as being vague, and is being replaced by the term craft brewery, which is also seen as problematic. What people mostly want to indicate is that they are unhappy with the "big" brewers, and would like to support either their local brewery, or an interesting brewery from another country that they have heard good things about. My suggestion is that we just turn things around, and look at categorising the "big" breweries rather than the non-"big" breweries. This will be easier because there are fewer of them. Criteria will be easier to draw up. And it will solve the problem of which regional brewery category the multi-site breweries should be placed. The end result will be the same. All breweries not placed in the "big" brewery category will be the sort of brewery that drinkers gut instinct tells them is a microbrewery - ie: 95% of the breweries on Wikipedia. SilkTork 09:05, 13 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Why not just use the superset of the very concrete definitions you yourself cited? Nothing vague about that. And what is the verifiable definition of a "big" brewery? —Michael Z. 2006-07-13 14:40 Z
The other notion I'm not sure about - are you suggesting that we have a series of categories for breweries by size, ranging from global down to brewpub? As I indicated above, I'm not sure of the value of judging all breweries by size - though there is, I acknowledge, a widespread interest in differentiating "mass-market"/"global" breweries from the rest. Once, however, we get away from the "mass-market" brewery philosophy, people's interest in splitting into precise sizes fades quickly. There are other ways of categorising breweries, as I indicated above - such as by age. In the UK we have a particular interest in certain breweries which are commonly over 100 years of age which we term "Regional Breweries". These are of varying sizes - their main grouping is by age, and by sphere of influence (the region). British beer geeks are constantly debating which breweries are "Regional" and which ones are not. And, while Greene King was growing in size the term "Super Regional" was used. Not to do with size - but to do with distribution of beer. My point in all this, is that there are many ways of grouping breweries. Grouping them by country was seen as the most popular and most workable way. At the time the beer cats were reorganised the Microbrewery cat got left behind because it was placed off in a side-shoot of Brewing. That it got left was a mistake. But I'm quite happy to debate the issues. Something positive may come from this. SilkTork 18:22, 13 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
I wasn't suggesting a range of categories. A brewpub is a different type of brewery, which typically only brews beer for in-house service. Some brewpubs are also microbreweries.
But that's beside the point. If there is a dispute about whether something is a microbrewery, we can use the superset of the criteria you mentioned further above. That's not vague. What's wrong with that? —Michael Z. 2006-07-13 21:16 Z
  • Sorry - I'm being a bit blond. Could you rephrase? I think you're suggesting that we use the varying definitions of microbrewery as criteria for deciding if something is a microbrewery? But you can't mean that, as the definitions are shifting sands. I'm having problems with the word "superset". I don't know what that means in this context. SilkTork 22:48, 13 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
I'm suggesting that in the case of a dispute, if an article meets any of the three definitions of microbrewery you cited, then it can be categorized as a microbrewery. How is that "shifting sands"?
Besides, I think you may be imagining a problem that doesn't exist. I haven't seen any disputes about breweries being categorized as microbreweries. —Michael Z. 2006-07-14 02:02 Z
  • I'm clearing fighting a lost cause here. The microbrewery category is here to stay - so we need to now work out the best way forward. I will honour my commitment to making it work and populating it appropriately - but you do need to explain to me very clearly what you want. Do you want to continue this on the Project page, my talk page or yours? SilkTork 18:42, 14 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
It occurs to me that, in Britain at least, there is a legal definition: breweries under a certain production level, in volume produced per year, get tax breaks. I will see if I can look up what that production level is. --Stlemur 15:59, 16 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:Cultural icons

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was delete all. the wub "?!" 21:33, 19 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I am merging all of these into one vote -- I see no reason why someone would vote differently for one over the others.--M@rēino 14:26, 12 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Delete due to non NPOV. who is or isn't an icon is a matter of opinion. Drmagic 17:57, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:Hanna-Barbera and Cartoon Network Studios series merge into Category:Hanna-Barbera and Cartoon Network Studios series and characters

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was merge as nominated --Kbdank71 18:48, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Should actually be a speedy merge. Category:Hanna-Barbera and Cartoon Network Studios series was created in April 2006, for apparently no reason at all, and various series are staggered between both categories. --FuriousFreddy 02:01, 27 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted from June 27 for more discussion Tim! 17:44, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:Airports in British Overseas Territories to Category:Airports in British Overseas Territories and Crown Dependencies

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was rename. --RobertG ♬ talk 11:39, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

If "and Crown Dependencies" is added it will be possible to allocate the airports in the Channel Islands and the Isle of Man to this category, which will tidy up the parent category. This category is a subcategory of two other parent categories which use the phrase "British Overseas Territories and Crown Dependencies". Choalbaton 16:29, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:Philosophy and religion portals

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was delete --Kbdank71 18:44, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

This is a pointless extra click. Category:Religion and Category:Philosophy are rightly separately, and it is no more appropriate to create a portmanteau category for portals than it would be to combine the subject area categories. Honbicot 16:11, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:Issues in the culture wars

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was delete --Kbdank71 17:53, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

DiePerfekteWelle 14:26, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

For Wikipedia, it's time we call a truce of neutrality on this so-called "culture war." This category is admittedly ethnocentric, as the intro clearly states that this divisive war only applies to the political climate in the United States. The disclaimer on talk pages that the topic may be controversial suffices. Delete. DiePerfekteWelle 14:26, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:Murdered Romans to Category:Roman murder victims

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was rename (I boldly implemented Carlossuarez46's suggestion as less ambiguous). --RobertG ♬ talk 11:43, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:Rotary Club members

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was delete --Kbdank71 16:58, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I keep seeing this on the articles about front rank politicians - which suffer from serious category clutter - and it just doesn't add anything. It isn't a defining characteristic and according to the text some of them were only honorary members. We shouldn't be categorising people by every conceivable affiliation. Chicheley 12:47, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:Ambidextrous people

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was delete --Kbdank71 16:26, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Not a defining characteristic. Category clutter. Chicheley 12:42, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:Law of Gabon to Category:Gabonese law

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was rename as nominated --Kbdank71 16:46, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Rename to the usual style. Chicheley 12:38, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:French liberal parties

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was delete --Kbdank71 16:56, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

(({What does "liberalism" means in a French context? This is very slippery category, because "liberalism" hasn't got the same sense in the US and in France. In France, "liberalism" refers to economic liberalism, and is associated with right-wing parties, while in the States it is opposed to "conservative". But a party such as the Sarkozy's UMP could be alternatively qualified as "conservative" and "liberal", and includes people from both tendencies!!! This is understandable enough, if one gets that this means that one may be conservative in the social sense and liberal in economics policies. Furthermore, "liberalism", in this French context, is opposed to gaullism, which Jacques Chirac claims to be the heir, a claim laughed out by all political commentators! User:Intangible who created this category has asked for deletion of Category:Far right political parties in France and attempts to substitute the current classification with US criterias, which is a form of ethnocentrism and lack of understanding of the French context, where left/right criterias are used since the French Revolution.Tazmaniacs 12:38, 11 July 2006 (UTC)))[reply]

Why can't liberals be royalists? I mean really, one of the main liberal parties of Europe, the VVD has no problem with a constitutional monarchy in the Netherlands at all; the same can be said for liberal parties elsewhere in Europe. Intangible 13:19, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Because there is something called the French Revolution and the king was guillotined! Being a royalist today in France definitely qualifies you as far right whatever the claims made. It is no use to refering to other countries, where constitutional monarchy may have been transformed into a democratic modern regime. In France, democracy and liberal democracy is called: the French Fifth Republic. The only "liberal royalists" in France were the Orleanists, whom have stopped being royalists since the death of the comte de Chambord in the end of the 19th century. Tazmaniacs 14:04, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Comment. Liberal Alternative is a French liberal party and thus should be categorized as such. This is just a logical extension of categorization of Category:Liberal parties. Should the category Category:French fascist parties be deleted as well? I don't think so. Intangible 15:55, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per nom. Dahn 09:02, 15 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per nom - FrancisTyers · 02:05, 17 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:Ministers to Category:Ministers of religion

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was rename per nom as least ambiguous suggestion. --RobertG ♬ talk 11:46, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

This renaming proposal is just a holding job to prevent confusion between this categories for government ministers. The whole "people of religion" categorization scheme needs to be reviewed, and when that is done this category might prove to be redundant. Chicheley 11:20, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

  • "Bent government ministers with religion"...?  Chuckle, David Kernow 12:10, 18 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:Assassinated ministers to Category:Assassinated politicians

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was merge as nominated --Kbdank71 15:54, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

This article only contains one article and is at the nub of a bit of a mess. The article is about a government minister, so I suggest this is merged into Category:Assassinated politicians, which contains hundreds of article. Looking up the tree we find category:Murdered ministers, which is being used for government ministers, and category:Ministers, which is being used for religious ministers. They need to be dealt with too, but I've looked at the "people of religion" categories before, and sorting them into a consistent form would be a massive task. Best to leave that for another time and just deal with this one small piece of confusion now. Chicheley 11:17, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:Plagiarists

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was delete --Kbdank71 15:51, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Category seems to have been created by editor Nropsevolselawobmij who is the only one using it, and who has been using it to tag people who were merely accused of plagiarism. It people prefer an "accused plagiarist" category, that might be an appropriate replacement but seems to me kind of pointless. Better just to lose it altogether. Uucp 11:11, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:Assassinated kings to Category:Assassinated monarchs

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was merge as nominated --Kbdank71 15:38, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

These two categories are being used inconsistently. Merge into the broader Category:Assassinated monarchs. Chicheley 11:02, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:Fictional fictional television programming

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was found deleted --Kbdank71 15:37, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

This should be merged with Category:Fictional television programming. Both of them are about television programming inside works of fiction, the only difference being that in the former category, the programming is also fictional. This distinction is useless, as real-life television programming inside works of fiction doesn't have articles. It also creates confusion, as for example Jesus and Pals is in the latter category, even though it is a fictional television program. JIP | Talk 08:25, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:Governmental ministers of France to Category:Government ministers of France

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was merge as nominated --Kbdank71 15:26, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I found this category, which is not in Category:Government ministers by country right after creating the conventionally named Category:Government ministers of FranceChicheley 08:15, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:Beano places

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was merge as nominated --Kbdank71 20:53, 19 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Refers to The Beano. Has two entries and little potential for growth. Merge into parent cat Category:The Beano. —Blotwell 07:47, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:DC Thomson Comics locations to Category:DC Thomson Comics towns and cities

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was rename as nominated --Kbdank71 15:23, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

This repurposing would only require deleting one member (Bash Street School) and would fit the category into the Category:Fictional towns and cities hierarchy. —Blotwell 07:47, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:Australian journalists of sport and Category:Australian journalists of surfing

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was merge as nominated --Kbdank71 20:51, 19 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

These categories are empty or have one article and should be deleted, Category:Australian sportswriters serves the same purpose and is consistent with the supercategory category:Sportswriters.--Peta 06:58, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:Anime and manga inspired webcomics to Category:Anime and manga webcomics

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was keep --Kbdank71 15:21, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Category was moved out of process, the name as it currently is actually excludes manga on the web. Dread Lord CyberSkull ✎☠ 06:54, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose The rename would excluded all webcomics that do not originate from Japan, most notably Megatokyo, Sexy Losers, and Grim Tales from Down Below. --TheFarix (Talk) 13:01, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment Or, as an alternative proposal, we could merge the two categories into a single one called "Webmanga and manga-inspired webcomics" or something like that. There's no need to mix "anime" into it since we're dealing with sequential art, not animation. –Abe Dashiell (t/c) 20:32, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Neither should be deleted, nor should they be merged. The name of the second one should not have anime removed.
Webmanga is a neologism that should be avoided.
Mea Culpa. I was BOLD. The contents of the original category (at the the time) did not fit the very misleading name that it was given. NONE of the contents were webcomics that were the intellectual property of a company or artist that had produced Japanese-language anime or Japanese language-manga. There were (and continue to be) several comics listed the category which are doujinshi-style derivitives on someone else's intellectual property or that were marked as "manga" by an American publisher.
Most of the entries in the current inspired category often contain a sentence in the lead that says "xyz comic was drawn by so-and-so in anime-style"
Examples (notes, emph, and comments added):
  • Anime Arcadia: "The comic is drawn in the anime style,"
  • Nana's Everyday Life: "a [Illustrated fanfiction.. err] webcomic...based on Elfen Lied [a manga/anime] and, to a lesser degree, Gunslinger Girl [a manga/anime]"
  • "Tomoyo42's Room [another illustrated fanfiction] follows the duo in a world where they have the relationship only hinted at in the anime. "
(There are some notable comics that don't rip-off other people's copyrights which do this too:)
  • "Inverloch is a popular webcomic drawn in manga style" ...
  • Then there are some like Planet Zibes which I would be hard pressed to define as anime or manga-style. (Further comments on the artwork withheld.)
I would also like to note that the two articles that are now in the "Ani-manga" category either only recently added to the wikipeida (July 3) or they were only recently categorized as webcomics (July 11). They did not exist at the time the second category was created. --Kunzite 02:10, 12 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:AU-SR shields

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was delete --Kbdank71 20:48, 19 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

All contents in the category are up for deletion, as well as being superseded By new category placed in Wikimedia Commmons - http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Australian_State_Route_shields. Boochan 06:50, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:Love songs

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was delete --Kbdank71 20:38, 19 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

This category is way too broad. Every other song with an article at Wikipedia is related to love. I don't think it's necessary to put them all into a category as it's not a special characteristic. --musicpvm 06:42, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:Snoop Dogg promo videos

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was no consensus --Kbdank71 15:19, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The description for this category is "This category contains a list of videos that has cameo appearance by Snoop Dogg and/or weren't released as standalone singles of his." I don't consider a Snoop Dogg cameo in a music video a notable enough characteristic to deserve its own category. --musicpvm 06:39, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:People from Virginia Beach, Virginia to Category:People from Hampton Roads

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was withdrawn/keep --Kbdank71 14:30, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I'm nominating this for a couple of reasons:

I'd also accept Category:People from the Hampton Roads area. Just so long as it's not linked to a specific city! — Dale Arnett 05:57, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

More singles to songs

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was rename/merge all. --RobertG ♬ talk 08:24, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Both should be renamed per previous discussions.

--musicpvm 05:25, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry about that, didn't realise there was a policy when I created the cat. Move is fine with me! Martin Hinks 07:05, 12 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
I created this category. I'm fine with the change, if that's what the general policy is. Sorry if I chose the wrong one. Eixo 00:22, 12 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Don't worry about it. It's a very recent change.--Mike Selinker 05:45, 12 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Adding this nomination from Provelt:

Since Category:Singles by artist does not exist any more. ProveIt (talk) 16:47, 12 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Adding this nomination from Provelt:

There is no more Category:Singles by artist. -- ProveIt (talk) 15:15, 15 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:American_saints to Category:United States saints

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was speedy keep based on the strong consensus of July 3rd's discussion. ×Meegs 11:17, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I'm going to try this again. I tried last week. Better category name, consistent with other saints categories. This is a very small category. --South Philly 04:17, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:Webcomics that use Clickwheel to Category:Clickwheel webcomics

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was rename as nominated --Kbdank71 20:36, 19 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Better category name, consistent with other webcomic categories. Dread Lord CyberSkull ✎☠ 03:17, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Agreed. And done. Lincalinca 04:45, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:Current Minnesota Twins players

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was delete --Kbdank71 14:33, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Delete. Entire category is subject to change frequently, especially as the trade deadline approaches yearly, when the roster expands yearly, and during every offseason. Small category that requires much attention (see previous statement). Minnesota Twins roster already exists. -- Win777 02:39, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:Limited-access roads to Category:Freeways

The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was no consensus --Kbdank71 15:15, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The title is ambiguous, as "limited-access road" can mean anything from a full freeway to a local surface road for which driveway access is limited. See [10] for evidence of the latter:

Limited access road for the purposes of this Strategy (section 5.6.3) is a local road occupied by a district/city council, where the number of accesses onto that road from properties is limited, due to road safety and visibility reasons.

The same is true of "controlled access":[11]

"Controlled access highway" means every highway, street or roadway in respect to which owners or occupants of abutting lands and other persons have no legal right of access except at such points only and in such manner as may be determined by the public authority having jurisdiction over such highway, street or roadway.

On the other hand, to the best of my knowledge, freeway is a term with only one modern meaning - a road with full control of access. Motorway is a similar term, but is not all-encompassing; motorway status implies certain standards and the banning of slow vehicles like bicycles. Many non-motorways are freeways. --SPUI (T - C) 09:03, 1 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Also, Motorway is also a type of road as well as a class. Read Motorway. As is an Autobahn or at least it was before you merged the article. JohnnyBGood t c VIVA! 00:00, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
I have marked this as needing a citation. --SPUI (T - C) 00:07, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
I'll be searching for one. For now I'd also like to point you toward our own Wiktionary which labels Motorway/Freeway/Autobahn as equal terms for the same type of road in different countries. So to does Websters and the Cambridge Dictionary. Cambridge goes so far as to state the definition of freeway as "US usage of Motorway" which supports my position that Freeway being used is just another form of systemic bias. Infact in both of those publications Expressway is presented as the nominal parent of Autobahn/Freeway/Expressway as the trifecta are limited access versions of Expressways. JohnnyBGood t c VIVA! 00:19, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
According to the Cambridge Dictionary, a motorway is "a wide road built for fast moving traffic travelling long distances". This is somewhat unclear, but our article on motorway makes it clear that bicycles are banned from motorways. On the other hand, they are allowed on some rural freeways, including many Interstates in the U.S. West. --SPUI (T - C) 00:29, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
True our article is more indepth. But as the failure of that merge pointed out there is no consensus that motorway should be replaced with freeway or that they are identical. Granted they are all terms for the same type and class of road, but no one who knows anything would mistake a freeway for a motorway for an autobahn. For a similar example no one would mistake a McIntosh Apple for a Granny Smith Apple for a Golden Delicious Apple. Granted they're all Apples but they're not the same thing. Apple would be the super category, just as Limited Acces Road or Limited Access Divided Highway should be here which should then be subordinate to just Highway just as Apple would be under Fruit. JohnnyBGood t c VIVA! 00:41, 11 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Note: all but one of the people that support Category:Freeways also support Category:Freeways and motorways. — Preceding unsigned comment added by spui (talk • contribs) 2006-07-11 10:15:24
Nota Bene: -- both Category:Freeways and Category:Freeways and motorways were rejected at Wikipedia:Categories for deletion/Log/2006 March 30#Category:Freeways to Category:Freeways and motorways! Many things in this category aren't Freeways or Motorways. --William Allen Simpson 06:50, 12 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.


More