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May 24

Category:Computer and video game series templates

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The result of the debate was Rename. Vegaswikian 02:44, 2 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Rename this category to Category:Computer and video game navigational boxes to be similar to other navigational boxes. See the sub-categories of Category:Navigational templates for other categories with similar names. --CapitalR 22:52, 24 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

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Category:Series templates

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The result of the debate was Delete (empty) --William Allen Simpson 01:58, 1 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

This category has been replaced by Category:Navigational templates and is no longer used by any pages. It can be safely deleted without any effect. ---CapitalR 22:23, 24 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

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Category:Modern Orthodox rabbis

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The result of the debate was Keep - TexasAndroid 13:34, 2 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Right on the edge between no consensous and consensous for Keep, I'm going to call this one keep. Either way, it stays. - TexasAndroid 13:34, 2 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Note: See detailed discussions at Category talk:Orthodox rabbis for the background to this vote. IZAK 12:05, 26 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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Environment by country

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The result of the debate was Rename to Enviornment of Foo. Vegaswikian 23:49, 1 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

This proposal is to change the current Nationality x naming convention of Category:Environment by country sub-cats to a by country wording. As the concept of nationality specifically regards a relationship between people and a nation, I don't believe this direct sub-cat of Category:Nature should use the nationality naming convention, which we generally only apply to socio-cultural topics that are represented as products of a nation of people, like Category:Art by nationality or Category:Rock music by nationality. Additionally, the primary cat involved here has always been named Category:Environment by country, not Category:Environment by nationality.

As for "of country" or "in country", "of country" had greater support in preliminary discussions at Wikipedia talk:Naming conventions (categories). Reading for example "Environment of the People's Republic of China" may sound more natural than the other choice, "Environment in the People's Republic of China. In regard to in country, an argument in favour is that the subject in question, the Environment, pre-dates and is irrespective of the formation of countries and borders, and so is not reliant on a state for its existance, and is therefore not "of" that state. However, it is noted that for some other subjects that pre-date states, like Category:History by country, the "of country" wording is being used.

As a final note, while natural environment is the master article for this subject, the other sub-cats of Category:Environment don't use "natural environment" in their name, so it was declined to suggest that new wording in this proposal.

--Kurieeto 21:14, 24 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Comment Nationality represents a nation of people, which doesn't neccessarily follow the borders of a country. It's akin to an ethnicity. Generally only things that are cultural products of people are categorized by nationality. There are some exceptions, like this Environment category, or Category:Aircraft by country, but those are being assessed. Categorization by nationality is more difficult IMHO than by countries because countries have more fixed borders. If you have further questions I'd encourage you to bring them up at Wikipedia talk:Naming conventions (categories). Kurieeto 12:36, 25 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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Category:Nazi concentration camp survivors to Category:Survivors of the Holocaust

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The result of the debate was Keep - TexasAndroid 13:37, 2 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

If further reorganizing needs to be done, it can be done outside the scope of this rename debate. - TexasAndroid 13:37, 2 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The latter category is more accurate to describe the ordeal of those who escaped from ghettos, or those who survived the Holocaust outside of Nazi concentration camps, like Roman Polański, who is currently categorized as a Nazi concentration camp survivor. The term generally used for a victim of the Holocaust is "Holocaust survivor," not "Nazi concentration camp survivor." - 67.72.98.87 21:08, 24 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

It's a touchy subject with lots of interpretations. Some people place the organized extermination of homosexuals and gypsies in the "Holocaust" domain, and that's certainly reasonable. But I think it stretches the definition to put Soviet or British soldiers in that categorization, for example, since the Nazi ethnic cleansing mandate didn't extend that far (yet). And certainly many victims of, say, Kristallnacht would consider themselves Holocaust survivors even if they didn't go to camps, and I can't imagine begrudging them that label. So I think the two categories are overlapping, but it's more accurate (and respectful) not to make them identical unless the uber-category is as broad as category:Survivors of Third Reich oppression. But boy, is that big.--Mike Selinker 03:15, 26 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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Category:R&B Icons

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The result of the debate was Delete. Vegaswikian 23:55, 1 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Vaguely defined category, the term "icon" is inherently non-NPOV. See Wikipedia:Categorization_of_people#Clearly_define_the_category. Big Smooth 20:50, 24 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

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Category:Mountains of Luxembourg to Category:Mountains and hills of Luxembourg

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The result of the debate was rename. Conscious 08:29, 2 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

According to most definitions, there aren't any mountains in Luxembourg (highest peak is 559 m altitude: way below the 610 m prominence required by Encyclopaedia Britannica). On the other hand, there are several hills that would warrant articles, and would thus populate this category (Kneiff, Gehaansbierg, Helperknapp, Haerebierg, Napoleonsgaard, Schwarzen Hiwel, Ginzebierg, etc). When it comes to another country that has few mountains and plenty of hills (the UK), this is the formula of the category name (Category:Mountains and hills of the United Kingdom). Bastin8 19:51, 24 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

That would seem to make sense. Though it would also imply either that we recategorise it, or rename Category:Mountains of Europe to Category:Mountains and hills of Europe. The advantage of the 'mountains and hills' name, however, is that it neatly avoids the question of what constitutes a mountain and what is just a hill - as the names are not well defined. --David Edgar 10:36, 30 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]
I agree with David Edgar. Although most definitions of what makes a mountain rule out any of Luxembourg's pathethic peaks, others include them. Ordnance Survey's old definition (305 m altitude) would define most of Luxembourg as 'mountainous'. It is because it is most definitely a grey area that I believe that this category needs to include both 'mountains' and 'hills' in their titles. Thus, I would also agree with the proposal to move other such categories (Netherlands, Belgium, the Republic of Ireland, etc) to 'Mountains and hills' . Bastin 12:16, 30 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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Category:Homophobes

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The result of the debate was Delete. Vegaswikian 23:56, 1 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Inherently and irreparably POV. Golbez 19:18, 24 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

i disagree, george bush is against gay marriage, the pop says that homosexuality is immoral and disturbing, the moron from the westboro baptist church parades around with signs reading wholesome slogans like God Hates Fags and Faggots will burn in hell, REPENT i dont think that is speculative or at all a POV issue. if people were added to the category simply because they were members of the republican party catholic church or muslims and whatnot that would be —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Qrc2006 (talk • contribs) 11:28, May 24, 2006 (UTC).

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Category:Southwest Asian Charicters

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The result of the debate was Delete. Vegaswikian 23:58, 1 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

See: Category:Fictional Arabs, spelling, also note Iago (Aladdin) is a parrot. -- ProveIt (talk) 18:31, 24 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

but fictional arabs, excludes turks, iranians, pakistanis, many israelis (jews, europeans, etc.) so what, hes an arabic parrott... hes not chinese or brazilian —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Qrc2006 (talk • contribs) 11:28, May 24, 2006 (UTC).

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Category:Bangladeshi soccer players to Category:Bangladeshi footballers

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The result of the debate was Rename. Vegaswikian 02:46, 2 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

To match other Category:Football (soccer) players by country. -- ProveIt (talk) 17:37, 24 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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Category:Villians in the pokémon series to Category:Pokémon villains

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The result of the debate was renamed. Conscious 05:34, 25 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

In general, shorter is better ... -- ProveIt (talk) 17:07, 24 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you, I've fixed the nomination as well -- ProveIt (talk) 20:30, 24 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Well, since the creator already said he's all for it, I'll just go ahead ... -- ProveIt (talk) 02:10, 25 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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Category:Automotive part retailers of the United Kingdom

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The result of the debate was no consensus. Conscious 08:31, 2 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Non-populated category, which was created by James020 (talk · contribs) as a place to put a spam article he also created that has since been deleted. Argon233 T C @ ∉  16:08, 24 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

  • Comment - I second the comment above. There is no need split-up Category:Retailers of the United Kingdom, especially for this very narrow subject. -- Argon233 T C @ ∉  00:02, 31 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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Category:Trubetsky to Category:Trubetskoy

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The result of the debate was Merge/catredirect - TexasAndroid 13:46, 2 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The rename is not in line with other subcats of the parent cats to this one. Renames to "XXX family" should likely be done by an umbrella nomination. - TexasAndroid 13:46, 2 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Duplicate category, the latter conforms WP:RUS. Conscious 15:35, 24 May 2006 (UTC).[reply]

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Category:Types of wager

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The result of the debate was Delete (still empty after 3 weeks) --William Allen Simpson 01:58, 1 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Unused. Conscious 15:30, 24 May 2006 (UTC).[reply]

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Category:User cat-language

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The result of the debate was Delete (empty) --William Allen Simpson 01:58, 1 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

These two empty categories look like a joke. Conscious 15:29, 24 May 2006 (UTC).[reply]

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Category:Visitor attractions in Paris

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The result of the debate was Keep (repopulated) --William Allen Simpson 01:58, 1 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Was merged with Category:Tourism in Paris. Conscious 15:17, 24 May 2006 (UTC).[reply]

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Category:Wikify from May 23

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The result of the debate was Delete (empty) --William Allen Simpson 01:58, 1 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

((Wikify-date)) sorts article by month, not day. Conscious 15:14, 24 May 2006 (UTC).[reply]

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Category:1954 FIFA World Cup players to Category:FIFA World Cup 1954 players

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The result of the debate was Rename. Vegaswikian 02:47, 2 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

All siblings of this category use the "FIFA World Cup XXXX players" format. Conscious 14:54, 24 May 2006 (UTC).[reply]

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Category:Phi Beta Kappa

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The result of the debate was Delete (empty) --William Allen Simpson 01:58, 1 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Most entries were people who actually belong in Category:Phi Beta Kappa members. I moved those. The only other entry is the society itself, and it is redundant and unnecessary to have a category with one sole entry, the article. Avi 14:37, 24 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Done. See [1] -- Avi 14:19, 26 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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Category:Transportation in Kazakhstan to Category:Transport in Kazahkstan

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The result of the debate was Rename. Vegaswikian 02:48, 2 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Kazakhstan is partly in Europe and I would have included it when we renamed all the European national categories to consistently use "transport" if it had been in category:Transport in Europe at the time. "Transport" is used for the other four former Soviet Central Asian republics, Russia and nearby South Asia. CalJW 13:49, 24 May 2006 (UTC).[reply]

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Category:Wikipedians who Recycle

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The result of the debate was speedy deleted as the creation of the sockpuppet of a banned user. Mackensen (talk) 12:29, 25 May 2006 (UTC) Unused. Conscious 13:32, 24 May 2006 (UTC).[reply]

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Category:Wikipedians who are Cool

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The result of the debate was speedy deleted as the creation of the sockpuppet of a banned user. Mackensen (talk) 12:29, 25 May 2006 (UTC) Unused. Conscious 13:32, 24 May 2006 (UTC).[reply]

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Category:Wikipedians who drink Coca-cola

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The result of the debate was speedy deleted as the creation of the sockpuppet of a banned user. Mackensen (talk) 12:29, 25 May 2006 (UTC) Unused. Conscious 13:29, 24 May 2006 (UTC).[reply]

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Category:Wikipedians who support Legalization

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The result of the debate was speedy deleted as the creation of the sockpuppet of a banned user. Mackensen (talk) 12:29, 25 May 2006 (UTC) Unused. Conscious 13:27, 24 May 2006 (UTC).[reply]

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Category:Wikipedians who support Userboxes

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The result of the debate was speedy deleted as the creation of the sockpuppet of a banned user. Mackensen (talk) 12:29, 25 May 2006 (UTC) Unused, has potential to be used for wikipolitics. Conscious 13:26, 24 May 2006 (UTC).[reply]

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Category:Wisconsin musicians

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The result of the debate was Keep --William Allen Simpson 01:58, 1 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Unused. Conscious 13:21, 24 May 2006 (UTC).[reply]

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Category:Zoroastrian mythology

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The result of the debate was no consensus to delete 2 year old category, repopulate --William Allen Simpson 01:58, 1 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Empty. There is Category:Persian mythology. Conscious 13:19, 24 May 2006 (UTC).[reply]

With respect to "Zoroastrian and Persian are not equivalent terms", that is correct, but besides the point: All the figures in Zoroastrianism are also figures in Persian mythology, and that would be continue to the case even if "Zoroastrian mythology" (ack, spit, iggit, choke) were populated.
-- Fullstop 10:17, 29 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]
That would be weird. Every single mythological thing to do with Persians is also Zoroastrian? What about mythological creates that post date the Islamiziation of Persia? Or pre-Zoroastrianization of areas of Persia? Or local area mythology in regions of Persia? 132.205.93.89 21:05, 31 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]
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Category:Islamic India to Category:Islam in India

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The result of the debate was Rename to Category:Islamic rule in India. Vegaswikian 02:50, 2 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The correct name of the category should be Islam in India, or something similar (maybe Islamic rule/history in India). The name of the category gives a false information, and is highly unencyclopedic. The proposed title is also consistent with the Category:Islam by country categorization. Msiev 13:02, 24 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

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Category:Historical research in India to Category:Historiography of India

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The result of the debate was Rename. Vegaswikian 02:52, 2 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The old title is not named very well. The proposed title is more appropriate. It is also consistent with the Category:Historiography of the United States category. Msiev 12:55, 24 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

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Category:Public radio personalities to Category:American public radio personalities

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The result of the debate was rename per nom. Conscious 08:33, 2 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Two member category with a name that just won't do. It is an American category, and there are hundreds if not thousands of people who work on what Americans call public radio that have articles, but outside the U.S. this distinction is of little or no relevance. Therefore rename category:American public radio personalities, though I would have no objections to simply merging it into category:American radio personalities. Bhoeble 11:29, 24 May 2006 (UTC).[reply]

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Category:Quackery

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The result of the debate was no consensus. Conscious 08:39, 2 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

POV-ery. Delete, or at the very least rename and re-focus. I found this because the much-maligned Gillian McKeith has been entered in the category. Is it really appropriate to put biographical articles, especially regarding living people, in this cat? I note that there is not a Category:Quacks. Mais oui! 02:32, 24 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Comment I would have thought Gillian McKeith stating that "foods which are orange in colour [...] have similar vibrational energies and even similar nutrient makeup." counts as quackery - so giving a child a carrot to chew on is going to be as good/health/dentally-safe as an orange lolly - please :-) David Ruben Talk 01:43, 26 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Comment. This is a vote on the category, not the article. I have no issues with the article or a well referenced list of quacks and quack medicines. Colin°Talk 10:49, 24 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

*Keep and rename to Category:Pseudomedicine. Quackery implies deliberate fraud, and I fear that many practitioners of what the category now contains genuinely believe that what they do will benefit their patients. Emphatically do not rename to Category:Alternative medicine, that term implies that these are accepted therapies. Dr Zak 19:48, 28 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

You can't just throw words at a database and count hits, you have to think about what they mean and in which context they are used. I think the point is mute. Quackery is (1) widely used (2) well known to the public (3) defined sufficiently to be of value (4) used by medical practioners to describe ineffective treatments sold to unsuspecting patients that are often in despair (as is clear if you read stuff obtained by using the above searching strategies (Google, PubMed)). Nephron  T|C 04:46, 30 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]
The difference between quackery and medicine is evidence (see evidence-based medicine) and/or theoretical considerations (based on science). If there isn't evidence-- as is the case in a lot of medicine, there is some sort of physiologic reasoning. Quackery fails the test on evidence and theoretical considerations (i.e. drinking water to reduce blood pressure isn't going to work based on how the medical and scientific community (physicians, physiologists) understand blood pressure regulation-- I dunno if someone touts drinking water as cure for high BP... but I can tell you it fails the physiology test). Alternative medicine is medicine that is outside of the purview of the (dominant) medical establishment (medical establishment being the dominant/mainstream/largest medical organization/group & its group of licencing bodies, e.g. the American Medical Association and the licencing apparatus assoc. with AMA members-- state medical boards[6]). Examples of alternative medicine practioners are chiropractors, acupuncturists-- (both of which have good evidence to suggest they work for somethings). Alternative medicine practioners are sometimes licenced... but they are licenced by different boards.[7] Alternative medicine is something completely different than quackery. Nephron  T|C 05:14, 30 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]
I guess I'm questioning the wisdom of keeping Category:Quackery and Category:Alternative medicine separate. Alternative medicine denotes belief systems and practices outside conventional medicine, [8] and Quackery denotes therapies of doubtful efficacy. For practical purposes the two often overlap. One could of course clean up Category:Alternative medicine to contain only bona-fide belief systems, such as Ayurveda, Traditional Chinese Medicine and Osteopathy, but where does the mess of therapies go? Dr Zak 17:16, 30 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Alternative medicine denotes belief systems and practices outside conventional medicine, [8] and Quackery denotes therapies of doubtful efficacy. For practical purposes the two often overlap. I think it makes sense to keep them separate and I believe is possible to differentiate between the two.
I see value in some alternative medicine treatments; acupuncture and chiropractic are both proven to have benefit in RCTs-- I don't think they are quackery. The distinction between quackery and alternative medicine is in part cultural (see cultural relativism) and in part historical. The division isn't always going to be clear-cut and neat. It is like terrorism... one peoples' terrorists is another peoples's freedom fighters. The above said-- there are features that are useful to help differentiate... one is "Quacks quack!" Also, I'll point-out that quackery does not necessarily imply deliberate fraud.[9] Nephron  T|C 02:02, 31 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Quackery as defined by QuackWatch does not necessarily imply deliberate fraud. I'm using the common meaning, see dictionaries, including Wiktionary. I've just discovered that the Quackery article also uses Barrett's definition - I'm not sure that's a good thing (a single source, however notable, does not change the meaning of a word) but have no time to delve into it. Perhaps later, or perhaps there are more sources. (But I do know calling someone a quack is libelous unless you can prove if it's true - and you may well have to prove it in court, which means it's a rather sensitive categorization. Even obvious quacks/quackery is/are not usually called quacks/quackery in the media - they know the price). AvB ÷ talk 20:38, 31 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

Category:Hangings to Category:Deaths by hanging

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the category above. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was Rename. Vegaswikian 02:54, 2 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Rename to Category:Deaths by hanging. Not all hangings are fatal, but the category is only for ones that are. -Sean Curtin 02:15, 24 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the category's talk page (if any). No further edits should be made to this page.
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