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March 29

Category:China and the Russian invasion of Ukraine

Relisted, see Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2023 April 8#Category:China and the Russian invasion of Ukraine

Category:Democratic Socialists of America politicians by state

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: Rename/Merge all - So there's a consensus to merge these to the first target, but no consensus about the "by state" target. It sounds like most would like a new/separate nom for that. So to not lose the "by state" separation of these in the meantime, I'll kick the can down the road and rename them to Category:Members of the Democratic Socialists of America from X. Feel free to renominate at editorial discretion. - jc37 07:49, 7 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: The Democratic Socialists of America are a political non-profit, not a political party in any sense of the term. Categorizing those endorsed or who buy membership in the organization as DSA politicians is a misnomer. They are all elected as Democrats. User:Namiba 21:33, 29 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I don't see the value in separating elected members of a non-profit. If it were a political party, then yes. However, DSA is an activist non-profit whose members sometimes run for elected office. It is a non-defining intersection just like any other occupation would be. Would we have category:Musician Democratic Socialists of America members?--User:Namiba 02:17, 30 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Arguably their elected members are the only defined subcategory in reliable sources, but I understand the concern. TulsaPoliticsFan (talk) 02:52, 30 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]
  • No, they should see politicians by (socialist) political party. Marcocapelle (talk) 14:38, 31 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Unfortunately, not all socialists are in socialist political parties. Since World War II, most well-known socialists in the United States (such as Bernie Sanders and Michael Harrington) are members of a decidedly not-socialist Democratic Party. Socialism is a political philosophy which some people believe can be maintained within non-socialist parties in the United States. Besides, most socialists are not politicians. They're often trade unionists, academics, social activists etc.--User:Namiba 14:57, 31 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Hard to understand this argument without cogent facts.
  1. We have articles describing Democratic socialism and Social democracy. Note that these are different.
  2. Bernie Sanders is not a member of the Democratic Party; he is an independent who caucuses with them. He does not describe himself as a "social democrat", but various ignorant observers incorrectly describe him as such in otherwise Reliable Sources.
  3. Michael Harrington was a founder of Democratic Socialists of America. He also does not describe himself as a "social democrat". As a political science professor, he seems to have a firm grasp on these terms.
  4. Thomas Jefferson was an advocate of child education in public schools and ending child labor, progressive taxation, public parks, rural development and equality of pay for farmers, national roads and a national post office. So he was mostly a Marxist Communist (other than slaveholding and opposition to a national bank). But we don't categorize him as a Marxist or a Socialist, because those terms came after his time, and he didn't self-identify as such.
  5. We should never cram people together with others whom they loathed, such as Marxist-Leninists, Trotskyists, etc. Self-identification is incredibly important here.
William Allen Simpson (talk) 11:24, 1 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Most of what you just wrote is a non-sequitur and really has nothing to do this discussion. Whether certain people dislike each other or not is not material to categorization on Wikipedia. Until we delete Category:American socialists, it is only logical to group all those who self-identify as such. If you want to nominate Category:American socialists by state for deletion then we can have a discussion on that. The political beliefs of Thomas Jefferson are totally ahistorical and non-material to this.--User:Namiba 17:11, 1 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Agreed. For DSA, membership in this mass organization is obviously notable for founders and official leadership like Michael Harrington and for those closely linked to it like Bhaskar Sunkara. However, looking at for most members, being part of DSA is a footnote and not core to their defining characteristics. However, in the short term, we have dozens of categories in Category:Members of political organizations and they're not up for discussion today. There seems to be a consensus that the politicians category should not exist and merging it to the members category is the way to go for now. The question is whether these articles should be moved to the subcategories of Category:American socialists by state. A more thorough discussion is needed specifically about these categories and I don't think this is nomination is going to build a broad-based consensus. That is why I proposed to merged them both as is the current practice. I'd be happy to take part in a discussion about the socialists by state category if someone nominates it.--User:Namiba 11:57, 2 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
William Allen Simpson (talk) 08:31, 4 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Dukes of Carniola

Relisted, see Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2023 April 8#Category:Dukes of Carniola

Category:Bear dogs

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: rename to Category:Amphicyonidae. (non-admin closure) –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 11:39, 13 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
  • Propose renaming Category:Bear dogs to Category:Amphicyonids
Nominator's rationale: "Bear dog" is a colloquial term, it is not often regularly used as a term in paleontological studies compared to simply "amphicyonids," typical of the family name + -ids/-theres/-odonts/etc. Renaming it to "amphicyonids" would be more proper especially since other prehistoric mammal family categories are referred to similarly. — Preceding unsigned comment added by PrimalMustelid (talk • contribs) 19:55, 29 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Messianic Jews

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: keep. (non-admin closure) –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 11:40, 13 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: Messianic Judaism is a type of Christianity, not a denomination of Judaism. Messianic Jews are not Jewish simply for believing the Messianic theology. The title should be changed to avoid giving readers the impression that adherents of Messianic Judaism are necessarily Jewish. Bohemian Baltimore (talk) 19:32, 29 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:LGBT state governors of the United States

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: keep. (non-admin closure) –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 11:40, 13 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: per WP:NONDEF. Maedc (talk) 18:46, 29 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:LGBT presidents of regions of Italy

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: upmerge to Category:LGBT governors and heads of sub-national entities. (non-admin closure) Nagsb (talk) 16:15, 22 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: per WP:NONDEF. Maedc (talk) 18:46, 29 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:LGBT King's and Queen's Commissioners of the Netherlands

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: upmerge to Category:LGBT governors and heads of sub-national entities. (non-admin closure) Nagsb (talk) 16:15, 22 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
  • Propose deleting Category:LGBT King's and Queen's Commissioners of the Netherlands (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)
Nominator's rationale: per WP:NONDEF. Maedc (talk) 18:45, 29 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Time loop

Relisted, see Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2023 May 8#Category:Time loop

Mongols (continued)

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: rename, purge, and re-parent. (non-admin closure) –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 11:41, 13 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: rename, purge and re-parent, Mongolia did not exist yet, the categories refer to Mongols as an ethnic group. In addition, the 20th- and 21st-century categories should be purged i.e. moved directly under Mongolian people/women. The top category should be re-parented to Category:Mongols. This is follow-up on this earlier discussion. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:57, 29 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Jacksonville Naval Air Station Fliers football

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: rename. (non-admin closure) –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 11:44, 13 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: Per contemporary newspaper sources, while "Flyers" was sometimes used, "Fliers" was the most common name for this team; see sources at 1942 Jacksonville Naval Air Station Fliers football team and 1945 Jacksonville Naval Air Station Fliers football team. Jweiss11 (talk) 02:11, 29 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:History of Imperial China

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: No Consensus - jc37 08:02, 7 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: merge, as Imperial China is part of history, the differences between the two categories is unclear. Based on what criterion would you put e.g. Academies of Classical Learning in one category or the other? Marcocapelle (talk) 01:57, 29 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]
  • Again, this question is confusing, because the premises are wrong.
    1. Dragon Throne is a throne of Imperial China (either physicial seating or referring to a person), not a throne of the History of Imperial China.
    2. Academies of Classical Learning is not in Category:History of China, why repeat that? The system of academies was dismantled during Imperial China, so History of education, and Category:History of Imperial China is correct.
    3. Imperial China is a parent of History of Imperial China. It does not belong in a "History of" category. Putting both in Category:History of China by period is flagged as Overcategorization by Cat-a-lot.
William Allen Simpson (talk) 05:33, 2 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
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