- The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.
The article was promoted by Laser brain 03:55, 31 January 2011 [1].
Nikolai Kulikovsky (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)
- Nominator(s): DrKiernan (talk) 15:28, 13 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Short article on a minor figure: the cavalry officer second husband of Grand Duchess Olga Alexandrovna of Russia, who escaped revolutionary Russia and lived in exile in Denmark and Canada. DrKiernan (talk) 15:28, 13 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Comments - sources look okay, links checked out with the link checker tool. I ran the article through Coren's tool and Earwig's tool and nothing showed up in regards to plagiarism with those tools. (Earwig's tool showed a possible violation at http://www.absoluteastronomy.com/topics/Nikolai_Kulikovsky but I'm pretty sure I've run across this as a scraper site before, but it wouldn't load at all for me when I tried to check this) Ealdgyth - Talk 16:41, 13 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- It's a wikipedia mirror. See Wikipedia:Mirrors and forks/Abc#Absolute Astronomy. DrKiernan (talk) 17:24, 13 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Why have you been unable to find an image of the subject? Fasach Nua (talk) 21:26, 13 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- I did searches at the Library of Congress, Library and Archives Canada and National Portrait Gallery; I couldn't find any. The ones available from websites or scanned from books are not provably free, and most likely are not. DrKiernan (talk) 21:35, 13 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- The simple act of copying them is not grounds for copyright, if the original image was
taken published before 1923, then they should be okay to use Fasach Nua (talk) 21:57, 13 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Published before 1923. J Milburn (talk) 02:36, 14 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Maybe a fair use image would do? Eisfbnore talk 19:32, 25 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Disambig/External Link check - no dabs or dead external links. --PresN 22:00, 13 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
CommentsSupport: A very thorough article which does not seem to miss out too much. One or two little niggles.
- "During World War I, Olga eventually obtained a divorce and she and Kulikovsky married. They had two sons." Not sure about the short sentence here, but only a personal preference.
- Early life: Three consecutive sentences begin with "he" and the other two in the first five sentences in the paragraph begin with "Nikolai Kulikovsky" and "His"; this part could be tightened a little.
- "The younger brother of Tsar Nicholas II, Grand Duke Michael, was the regiment's honorary colonel." Maybe it would be better as "Grand Duke Michael, the younger brother of Tsar Nicholas II, was the regiment's honorary colonel."
- Similarly, I feel the structure of the sentence would work better if "the youngest sister of Nicholas and Michael, Grand Duchess Olga" was reversed.
- Two consecutive sentences begin "By 1906..." and "In 1906". Could this be altered for variety?
- Maybe re-emphasise that Duke Peter was Olga's husband in the second paragraph of this section as it is quite a big thing that Kulikovsky moved in with Olga and her husband here?
- Not sure about the word "society" here. How do we know this and who are we classifying as society? I think that needs spelling out.
- Marriage and revolution:"her brother refused because he believed marriage was for life": presumably for religious reasons?
- "society (including Olga and the Tsar) was scandalized." Society again and I think the emphasis is wrong here. Should it not be "When their brother, Grand Duke Michael, eloped with his mistress, Natasha Wulfert, the Tsar and Olga were scandalised along with the rest of society." (Assuming society has been tightened earlier)
- "granting Olga a divorce": Would "granting a divorce to Olga" flow better?
- "In 1916, after visiting her in Kiev, the Tsar officially annulled her marriage to Duke Peter..." Any reason for the change of heart?
- Is there anything about how the Soviets reacted to the family? What were their plans and how did the rivalries prevent their execution? It might also be interesting to know what the "official" Soviet view of Kulikovsky was at this time.
- "rescued the Dowager Empress Marie and some of her family from the unstable Crimea..." May be better to say "from the Crimea, which was unstable" and unstable in what way? Politically? Militarily?
- "After two weeks, they were evacuated to Belgrade in the Kingdom of Serbs, Croats and Slovenes where they were visited by Regent Alexander Karageorgevich, later to become King Alexander I of Yugoslavia, who offered them a permanent home there." Long sentence.
- "Kulikovsky and Marie did not get along. Kulikovsky resented his wife acting..." Maybe merge the short sentence at the beginning of this?
- "Marie's fabulous collection of jewellery" Maybe a little fussy, but "fabulous" seems a little POV or peacock.
- "She decided to move her family across the Atlantic to the relative safety of rural Canada. A decision with which Kulikovsky complied." The second sentence is incomplete.
- Later life: "Olga's devoted companion" and "After a rough crossing": too detailed?
- "and her former maid": we have already been told her relation to Olga.
- Second paragraph of this section seems more about Olga than Kulikovsky; not sure what can be done about it except cut some of the detail about Olga. --Sarastro1 (talk) 21:20, 17 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Thanks, I've made some changes [2]. The rumor among the "peasants", according to Olga, was that Nicholas OK'd the annulment because Oldenburg was a German name.
I haven't added that yet, as I'd like to check it further. I'm going to check the death sentences passed by the Crimean Soviets too, but IIRC there was a turf war between them and neither would accept the authority of the other. DrKiernan (talk) 22:10, 18 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- The rumor is the only thing I've found on the annulment. Nicholas doesn't seem to have recorded the detail of why he changed his mind. I've changed the death sentence bit to something hopefully clearer [3]. DrKiernan (talk) 12:58, 19 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Great work on this article, a very interesting read. Switched to support now. --Sarastro1 (talk) 21:14, 19 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Comments
- Can you sort out Old Style/New Style dates for his birth date? Russia used Julian calendar before Revolution.
- Maybe some other reviewers might comment on this, but could it be reasonably argued that their wedding photo (which seems to be online) was published before 1923 -- which would make it PD-US and acceptable to upload to WP (but not Commons)?
- 93,000 Canadian dollars as of 2010[56]).[57] looks weird to me (stylistically) -- maybe just both refs after the period?
- I've tweaked a few small things -- I think a few might be overlapping with Sarastro1's comments, so if you don't find something that's been pointed out that's probably why.
- I'm probably going about this a bit backwards, but was anything stumbled upon that was in Russian? The article relies very heavily on two sources, Vorres and Phenix. If there was something, I could take a look.
Maxim(talk) 02:48, 18 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Thanks for the copy edit. On your specific points:
- It's Julian. This is in the article as a hidden comment.
- I was unable to find proof that the photographs were published before 1923.
- I've amended the ugly footnotes.
- Those changes are great, thanks. I'll get to Sarastro1's other comments later today or tomorrow.
- There are some Russian sources listed at the Russian wikipedia article on his son, but I didn't think they provided any relevant new information for this article, on Kulikovsky senior. DrKiernan (talk) 09:14, 18 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Support. Looks good. A well-written, engaging article. Maxim(talk) 01:55, 21 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Comment — the following three sentences at the end of the third paragraph of the Marriage and revolution section are unreferenced: On 12 August 1917, Olga and Kulikovsky's first child and son, Tikhon, was born in the Crimea. He was named after one of the Grand Duchess's favorite saints, Tikhon of Zadonsk. Although the grandson of an emperor and the nephew of another, Tikhon received no titles because his father was a commoner. Maybe the son's naming doesn't need a citation, according to WP:BLUE, but the first line with the birth date and the third with the title allegation certainly do. Eisfbnore talk 19:30, 25 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- I've added a reference that covers the first and second sentences, since the second sentence says "favorite saint" which ought to have a citation. DrKiernan (talk) 20:48, 25 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Thanks. Support now. Eisfbnore talk 21:21, 25 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Thanks for the support. DrKiernan (talk) 10:25, 26 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.