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To-do list for Anna Wintour: Things to do to prepare this for an FA nom:
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How is she 'English-American' just because she lives in America ? She was born in the UK to parents who were both UK citizens and for lack of evidence to the contrary, is a UK citizen herself. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.107.150.25 (talk) 23:56, 15 July 2009 (UTC)
We could (and this wouldn't be original research) look at the voter rolls in either New York or Suffolk County and see if she's registered (assuming Greenwich Village and Mastic Beach are her only residences) and since when. I am willing to change the wording (Originally, it had been something closer to "English immigrants to the United States" because that article (I think) existed at the time; it's subsequently been merged to the current article.
As far as "assiduously micromanaging" this article goes, I do it for three reasons: one, it's on my watchlist; two it's a biography of a living person and is thus supposed to be closely watched per that policy; two, I put a lot of work into researching and writing this and consider it a responsibility to maintain the article's integrity. Daniel Case (talk) 14:42, 10 November 2009 (UTC)
Forbes lists her as a U.S. citizen here. Seems to settle this. How she became a citizen is less important. Daniel Case (talk) 13:25, 23 March 2011 (UTC)
If she's an American citizen, why was she awarded an OBE by the Queen? Sorry just curious here.210.24.86.146 (talk) 05:14, 14 December 2011 (UTC)
This section doesn't feel well organized. I also have a problem with the last paragraph about the "interview footage." I've seen tons of interviews (albeit soundbites) of Anna Wintour at various fashion weeks around the world. So I wish the author would clarify what is meant by "Many believe this to be the only video interview footage of Anna Wintour available on the internet." --Jhlynes 20:53, 25 September 2006 (UTC) I had the pleasure to wait on Anna Wintour this past Saturday ay J.Press Inc..I found her attractive,personal,polite and charming.Ed Evans. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.190.45.20 (talk) 18:16, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
Considering that Google is littered with an endless number of photos of Anna Wintour why isn't there one here? The Fading Light 17:54, 20 October 2006 (UTC)
While I am not the nominator, I have done most of the work on this article, probably the best biography within WP:FASHION, a category full of sorry ones. It has been peer-reviewed; if you missed the link under the Biography project banner the archived version is here.
I certainly second the nomination (as I was planning eventually to nominate it myself), but while I naturally think it's a Good Article already, I have done that reviewing myself and know what you would be looking at. So I will pre-emptively address possible concerns:
I would be the first to include pictures of the younger Wintour if we had them. Jerry Oppenheimer doesn't seem to have found any; he mentions two key ones from the early 70s that can be found in the appropriate magazines. I will be looking for them whenever I think an FA nomination is viable.
That's all for now. Enjoy your review.
(And, by the way, if you do pass it please restore the assessment to A-class, where it was before the nomination. Daniel Case 03:55, 14 April 2007 (UTC)
Although I am not a part of the good article wikiproject, I thought I'd add my 2 cents.
Overall, this is an excellent article. Kudos to the contributors who have developed this.
I have a few minor suggestions for consideration: 1. In the lead section, the third sentence, "After dropping out of school at 16...." is very long. Any chance that can be broken up a bit? 2. In general, the article's grammar relies on the passive voice – maybe too much. I've made a few edits here and there, but you may want to reconsider verb choices.
3. While the article does not include many images, it might be helpful to find some of the covers from her early reworking of Vogue. May require some additional legwork to a library or used magazine store, but would add a lot.
4. The present section starts and stays at 2004. That's three years ago. Any chance that can be updated to 2006-2007? Also, some of the future events referenced that section may have already happened.
5. The references include repeated uses of "Ibid" when sourcing from Oppenheimer. As I recall, this approach is discouraged since future editing may change the order of references which could make it difficult to trace the original sources. For instance, the Dextroamphetamine article has an excellent reference structure that was set up by SandyGeorgia.
There are also several small grammatical issues that I'll take on personally. Mattnad 22:35, 15 April 2007 (UTC)
This article has been languishing on the nominations page for far too long, therefore I have decided to review it. There are a few issues I have with the article.
1) Sometimes the prose is very confusing. For example, I would avoid sentances like this:
The quote is nice, but not saying the name of the friend. Her name is not important. Then when I came to the next sentance I couldn't figure out who Lasky was until I went back. Any references to the quotes of unimportant people should be removed andreplaced with something generic like friend.
Barbara Amiel, who's mentioned in the text several grafs earlier. I expect that people will be able to keep track of a recent second reference and I hate reusing names ... it tells the reader you don't think they're that intelligent. But I'll smooth it over. You may have a point.
2) The article is too long. Here are some suggestions on how to shorten it.
3) A slight suggestion on cutting down. Get ridof mentions of unremarkable people that are not important to the article. Here are some examples:
I am putting the article on hold. Please do not hesitate to ask me any questions. Zeus1234 20:29, 10 May 2007 (UTC)
I agree that Oppenheimer's biography is well researched. It does, however, portray only a single frame of mind. There is quite a large amount of info on the internet (concerning Anna). Also, do not hesitate to have designers and co-workers comment - with Anna EVERYONE has an opinion. Moreover, everyone has a bit of little known Anna experiences. Getting even just one person of notable status to share their comments and bits of info would contribute massively to the article (anonymously, of course :-> ). Have you (Daniel) had a look at Coddington's new book? Valentino's offices might just have a little something to add, if approached correctly. Also, do not hesitate to email current co-workers, you might just get VERY lucky (which is not as far-fetched as it sounds).—Preceding unsigned comment added by Princessconzuella (talk • contribs)
As for personal interviews, Wikipedia is an encyclopedia which reflects what others have written and published and thus cannot be the reporter of first instance. To contact people and ask for comments and facts would be considered original research and thus ineligible for inclusion in a Wikipedia article. In addition, it is explicitly prohibited by our verifiability (how easy would it be for any member of the public to call up and ask someone if they said something?) and reliable sources policies, which are both in the case of an article like this complicated even more by the biographies of living persons policy. Therefore we can't use personal conversations or things like most blog postings. We are mostly limited to what has been published in books or by established media sources. Daniel Case 19:36, 8 July 2007 (UTC)
I suggest a reconsideration on my persistent efforts to edit the "Politics" section so as to reflect her full quote regarding Clinton's decision to back out of Vogue. The quote you have is truncated and misrepresents the intention of Wintour's statement. I placed the Media Matters link because it was the only one I can find that has the quote in its entirety, and the Media Matters link also exposes how Wintour's comment has been misrepresented to unfairly criticize Senator Clinton. 71.104.133.133 (talk) 11:02, 31 January 2008 (UTC)
These points might not be at all relevant to the article, but I'm wondering whether it is worth writing about the pressure from Wintour to reorganize Milan Fashion Week to suit her better? It seems to have caused a bit of a stir. This information might be suitable under Fashion industry power broker. (Moore, Malcolm; February 22 2008; "Dolce & Gabbana slams Milan Fashion Week"; The Daily Telegraph; retrieved February 23 2008.)
There's also been loads in the media about the situation where Armani made a criticism about Wintour in her presence. He basically implied that Wintour much prefers French and American designers compared to Italians designers. This would possibly be able to go under personal fashion preferences. (Cartner-Morley, Jess; February 21 2008; "Armani's cutting remarks about Vogue editor"; The Guardian; retrieved February 23 2008. and Peck, Sally; February 21 2008; "Giorgio Armani attacks Vogue's Anna Wintour"; The Daily Telegraph; retrieved February 23 2008.) Just thought it might be worth noting. Eagle Owl (talk) 14:35, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
For this reason, if space has to be wasted on PETA's drama campaign it should be on their various pathetic actions that have received actual serious media coverage. That doesn't mean interviews with drama queens or passing mentions in articles about crazy rapists. But of course if you think Braunstein's support for PETA would be appropriate in that article, add it there. John Nevard (talk) 01:29, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
Pamela Anderson is a notable figure whatever you think of her, and as someone at least tangentially involved in fashion her statements about a figure such as Anna Wintour are relevant if they are not only as sharply critical of her as they are but also if they make an allegation that she forces the use of fur on those who don't want it.
These are two short grafs in a long article that is, indeed, a biography of its subject. I don't see why you seem to imagine the entire article has been taken over by them. Daniel Case (talk) 16:01, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
When I was researching this article I combed through dozens of critical and non-critical statements about Wintour; there are many I didn't include because they came from non-notable people or didn't add anything to things that had already been said or reported. If you're not going to read the things people write in response to you, and instead just find ways to reiterate what you so obviously love to read yourself typing, would you please go find something else to do? My good faith is slowly ebbing here. You are coming across like an extremely sophisticated troll. Daniel Case (talk) 12:36, 26 February 2008 (UTC)
{post by troll user removed)
All sniffing at the laundry basket aside, I will admit I should have said "allegation of fact" to avoid any suggestion that I necessarily believe it (I don't, but that's not relevant to whether it should be in the article IMO). Daniel Case (talk) 16:50, 26 February 2008 (UTC)
(post by troll user removed)
"Most of us read Vogue not with the intention of buying the wildly expensive clothes, but because doing so educates our eye and hones our taste, similar to the way eating gourmet food refines the palate. This is a pleasure enabled by Wintour's ruthless aesthetic, her refusal to participate in the democratizing tendency of most of her competitors. To deny her that privilege is to deny her readers the privilege of fantasy in the form of beautifully photographed Paris couture.[46]"
Does anyone else agree that this para sounds like it's just lifted straight from the source? It doesn't sit well with the NPOV of the rest of the artice - not very 'encyclopedic'. Perhaps it could be included as a quote if the source is notable, rather than straight text. However, I am new to editing so I may be wrong.Geneth (talk) 10:30, 7 May 2008 (UTC)
I personally think that the prevalence of "in popular culture" material in Wikipedia is way overdone, but since we have such a section in this article...
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/85/Anna_Wintour.jpg
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Edna_Mode.jpg
I wonder whether this is more than coincidence. (Obviously, we wouldn't include this in the article without a cite.) -- 201.37.230.43 (talk) 13:32, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
Starting GA reassessment as part of the GA Sweeps process. Jezhotwells (talk) 12:33, 9 August 2009 (UTC)
On hold for seven days for above issues to be addressed. Major contributors and projects will be notified. Jezhotwells (talk) 13:28, 9 August 2009 (UTC) OK, all done now. keep GA status. Jezhotwells (talk) 15:52, 16 August 2009 (UTC)
When Anna Wintour was 16, that would have been perceived as a legitimate school leaving age, particularly for someone who didn't intend to go to college. The standard school leaving ages in the UK were 16 or 18; so unless she didn't bother with O levels or CSE's it's not really fair to say that she "dropped out" which to an American reader has the connotation of failing to graduate high-school, a concept that doesn't really translate across the Atlantic. pcrtalk 06:11, 5 May 2010 (UTC)
I know nothing about Anna Wintour, but may I strongly support what pcr said above. Sixteen was the normal, most usual, school-leaving age in the UK in the 50s and 60s. North London Collegiate is and was a highly academic school, so one presumes that Wintour took a number of Ordinary Level GCE (General Certificate of Education) exams, and then, because she did not wish to go on into the sixth-form, left. This was not 'dropping out' at all, but the normal course of action for those who did not plan to go to University. Far, far fewer people went on to University at that time anyway. Those who had good 'O' level results had many job opportunities open to them at 16, as well as further education opportunities in vocational institutions such as art schools and secretarial colleges. Plenty of pupils left school at 16 without any 'O' levels whatever — and even they could get jobs in those days! Sixth form and the academically challenging 'A' Level exams (Advanced Level GCE) were for those who planned university and/or a more scholarly type of eventual career. It was all very different from today's system in the UK, let alone that of the USA. AgTigress (talk) 12:16, 23 September 2010 (UTC)
Fair enough; obviously none of us knows for certain! :) But even if she left at 16 without even taking any 'O' levels (which seems slightly unlikely at that date in a direct grant school, though not at all unusual in a Secondary Modern or Comprehensive school), or having failed any that she did take, she was still not 'dropping out' in the American sense of 'not completing' her education: she was simply 'leaving school' at the standard minimum legal age for doing so, with or without any GCE qualifications. (I think that by 1965, the minimum age was 16: when I was at school, about a decade earlier, it was still 15). It does sound to me as though the author of the biography simply did not understand the British system at that time, and assumed that leaving school at that age was abnormal and/or shameful, when it was actually quite common and unremarkable for a pupil whose interests were other than academic. I bet Vivienne Westwood doesn't have a bunch of 'O' Levels either. I shall now go and look her up (she is the same age as I am)! :) AgTigress (talk) 21:48, 23 September 2010 (UTC)
From an American perspective leaving school at 16, then as now, is perfectly legal but even then the term had a bit of a stigma (we once had her categorized as a high-school dropout but then that category was deleted for the implied pejorative). The question is, I guess, are there other Old North Londoners of that era who chose a similar career start? Daniel Case (talk) 03:11, 24 September 2010 (UTC)
Yes, but I feel sure that the ethos of North London Collegiate was chiefly to encourage girls to develop their own particular talents to a high degree, rather than to force them into a career that did not interest them. If an individual's talents lay in an academic direction, this meant university, even though, as I have mentioned, the proportion of school-leavers who went on to university was much, much smaller in the 1960s than it is now (there were far fewer universities, for a start). Also, universities did not yet teach the more vocational types of courses that are commonplace these days. It is hard to see why any reasonable person would have expected a degree in traditional humanities subjects to have substantially enhanced the career prospects of an individual whose interests lay in fashion and popular culture. The same applies to those whose future careers were in acting or in the fine arts. Also, maybe Wintour's father, who belonged to a class and generation that would have seen Oxbridge as a standard social rite of passage for males rather than a proof of academic excellence, was one of the many who still thought that university education was unnecessary and otiose for women. There are complex issues of social history and class involved here.
It's quite possible that Wintour did indeed have a disastrous academic record at secondary school and left without a single 'O' Level to her name, but my point is simply that the fact that she left at 16 does not, in itself, imply that at all. She might equally well have had 8 or 9 excellent 'O' level passes, for all we know. There were undoubtedly many girls who left North London Collegiate and other comparable schools (such as St.Paul's Girls' School, Haberdashers' Aske's Acton (as it then was), Camden High School for Girls, James Alleyn's Girls' School, etc. etc.), in the 1950s and 1960s who went straight into employment at 16 and then went on to become highly successful in their chosen fields without formal tertiary education. General employment opportunities were lavish at that period — there was plenty of work available. One of the things that all such Old Girls (and Old Boys of the equivalent boys' schools) had in common at that time was a high degree of natural intelligence, because they wouldn't have got into those schools at age 11 without it, and of general literacy, which was determinedly taught throughout the 5-7 years they were there. Even without a single pass in a public examination, they were generally able to write more coherently than some young people today who have higher degrees...
Anyway, you get the point. :) There is nothing that I can see, from the perspective of exactly the same culture and a slightly older generation, in the bare facts that we have about Wintour's adolescence, that implies that she was in any way 'unsuccessful' at school, and left at 16 for that reason. :) AgTigress (talk) 10:17, 24 September 2010 (UTC)
Do you think we should find some way of providing the context you have in the article text? Daniel Case (talk) 15:01, 24 September 2010 (UTC)
I don't think that anything in the article needs to be altered, and it seems to me an excellent, objective article overall. I just weighed in, really, in support of the contributor who noted that 'dropping out' was not an appropriate term, and as that is no longer in the article anyway, I was just adding some extra information. Naturally Wintour hated the school uniform: all girls at those kinds of schools have ALWAYS hated the uniform, which had essentially changed very little since the 1920s, even if they are planning to become dull old academics rather than celebrities in the world of fashion! :) Assuming North London Collegiate was like my own school in that era (and I'm sure it was), the rules relating to the uniform were exceedingly strict, covering not only the styles and colours of the garments, but also details like exact skirt length, style of shoes, and the angle at which hats (felt in the winter, panama in the summer) were to be worn. My own uniform was a much nicer colour than North London's brown, but I still cannot bear to wear that colour today, over 50 years after I left the institution. No jewellery was permitted, with the exception of wristwatches and, rather grudgingly, a religious pendant such as a cross or Star of David, and hairstyles were also carefully scrutinised; they had to be 'off the face' and tidy.
I don't think any of the information I have waffled about here needs to go into the article. If I had attended North London Collegiate itself rather than a very similar school, specific points about it would probably be worth adding. I suppose one could make a general point that in the 1960s, the very strict traditionalism of that type of school would have been particularly galling to a young person who wanted to be part of all the changes that were taking place in social mores, fashion and popular culture — even more galling than it had been to those of us who were teenagers in the generally much more austere and non-swinging 1950s. :) AgTigress (talk) 16:11, 24 September 2010 (UTC)
Hello- I have been researching a little known controversy and since it involves Anna Wintour I decided to make a place for it on the page where criticisms already appear. I have tried to keep it as short, dry, and unbiased as possible, though I agree with the force of the criticism, that a vogue editor should have known better. I will watch here for comments in case anyone wants added details or sources hat I may be able to add from my research. Ultimately I hope it contributes to interesting reading, drawing more users to Wikipedia.124.157.179.70 (talk) 08:35, 28 November 2010 (UTC)
Perhaps you do not know the importance of Haute Couture verses Pret au Porter, but I assure you that it is very serious if a Vogue editor of so many years does not know the difference. In fact it is far more important than some of the Oppenheimer gossip about personalities. I feel your unilateral decision to remove the factual details of Anna Wintours attendence at Le Bal du Crillon (which is appropriately cited on the organizers website, and news channels) to be improper. Whether or not the informative / educational link to a blog about haute couture is included does not matter. There is a similar version on Wikipedia actually which could be substituted... the key is that fashion industry persons, and those researching Anna Wintour from the fashion world point of view would find it interesting to know that she participated in a bogus haute couture event. The facts are that she attended a bogus event about Haute Couture. The scandal speaks for itself.I think a third party should adjudicate the decision. maybe an even more dry statement can be added about her attending.70.89.102.53 (talk) 20:32, 20 December 2010 (UTC)
I should say also that I have not found anyone else writing about this. I don't doubt that you think this very important. It may well be. But we are not the publisher of first instance for this sort of thing. Daniel Case (talk) 04:47, 21 December 2010 (UTC)
I noticed that the character Photo Finish is based on her. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.72.71.179 (talk) 07:44, 21 July 2011 (UTC)
"With her trademark (trademark?) pageboy bob haircut and sunglasses, Wintour has become an institution (what does this mean? according to who?) throughout the fashion world, widely praised (by who?) for her eye for fashion trends and her support for younger designers. Her reportedly (by who?) aloof and demanding personality has earned her the nickname "Nuclear Wintour". I don't find much support for that later in the article.
I suppose I could find plenty of reliable sources using exactly those words if you really wanted (or maybe you could have been a real Wikipedian and gone and found some yourself. As for her "aloof and demanding personality," there is an entire section, with many footnotes. "Reportedly" is to preserve NPOV, something you seemed to care about when you started posting. Perhaps you were so eager to get over here and make sure that everyone could see your brilliant editorial comments that you forgot to read that far? So eager that you forgot to sign your post? Daniel Case (talk) 03:02, 8 June 2012 (UTC)
I say there's a useless link in the "Film Adaptation" section that promises "External images: Photos comparing Wintour's office and Miranda Priestly's in The Devil Wears Prada" but when I click on it I just get a page that says "Nothing found for Blog wp-content office jpg." I say that's not at all useful, but two other people "Daniel Case" and "Eyesnore" put it back in when I took it out. Anybody else have an opinion on how useful that link is? Greenbeanhunting (talk) 00:45, 20 January 2013 (UTC)
With her trademark pageboy bob haircut and sunglasses, Wintour has become an important figure in much of the fashion world, widely praised for her eye for fashion trends and her support for younger designers. Her reportedly aloof and demanding personality has earned her the nickname "Nuclear Wintour".
I'm sorry but that reads ridiculous and has no sources to any of those claims. Who has widely praised her? Who says she is important? And the word reportedly, reportedly by whom? Where is a source for her nickname? Is her pageboy bob really trademarked?
Also the following-She is the eldest daughter of Charles Wintour, editor of the London Evening Standard. Her father consulted her on how to make the newspaper relevant to the youth of the era.
So she was a newspaper consultant? I find it hard to believe that her Father,a grown man, would consult a youth on how to make a newspaper relevant to anyone. Where are sources for this? I guess I will start looking for sources and removing non sourced statements tomorrow. If anyone wants to help please help me. I have only read 2 paragraphs on this Wikipedia page about Anna Wintour, so I am wondering what else needs to be fixed. I will read more tomorrow.--98.87.94.167 (talk) 18:02, 22 February 2013 (UTC)
Despite the piece being full of fluff, my added paragraph, which was timely and had references, was removed because Daniel Case "didn't see the relevance"? Does that end the discussion? I thought that there was supposed to BE a discussion? I'm seeing this a lot--basically, "how dare you touch MY article." Avocats (talk) 09:06, 15 November 2015 (UTC)
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Winter is British by birth but also holds U.S. citizenship via "parentage". These links confirm:
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I've not participated in this article at all, but for what it's worth, I wonder why the current infobox photo has been chosen over others such as this one:
This one shows Winter's face much more clearly. I understand that her sunglasses are part of a trademark look, but even then, the current photo of her on her cell phone is a profile view that doesn't show much of her face. I know how sensitive editors can get over this so I don't want to start some sort of war, but I do wonder what the value of the current photo is versus the above one I've pointed out (albeit the latter being 3 years older). --Drown Soda (talk) 03:46, 30 November 2018 (UTC)
I planned to talk about each of the sources and how each source adds further information about Anna Wintour and her decisions have impacted fashion trends.
[1] The article mentions how Wintour is to be described as being 'integral to the future of the company's transformation', starting trends such as 'she has love for the company deeply'. Her journey of being editor-in-chief and a journalist of Vogue since 1988. Being listed as one of the most important/powerful women in the fashion industry.
[2] As we all know Wintour as being the woman who has a dominant say in the trends set within the '113-year-old brand'she has seized the moment and it become the'women's bible'. Anna Wintour brought her journalistic 'bent' and infused Vogue with news, culture to fashion via photo spreads for example in 1998, 'The Extraordinary Hillary Clinton' cover after the Lewinsky scandal. Her ideology behind doing risky content as such was "This is our readers' leisure time. Why should it be boring?" Beth Fidoten who is a senior VP-director of print services,states about Wintour when she started at Vogue she 'revitalized it'.
[3] Her 'steely demeanour and chilling reputation' recognises the pressure that is associated with social media and can lead to mental health problems. She speaks on the matter on the interview with Stella magazine, apart of the Telegraph, how her support with Youth Anxiety Center. She quoted "Mental health is an area where people are embarrassed."
HAlI290 (talk) 14:16, 13 November 2019 (UTC)
References
I'm not sure how we can call an article a GA if it has an entire section devoted to criticism for... being personally withdrawn? and a 'responses' section? theleekycauldron (talk • contribs) (she/they) 06:38, 25 April 2022 (UTC)
Even friends admit to some trepidation in her presenceimportant? Also, some parts are sourced to Page Six and the New York Post, neither of which should be considered reliable post-the latter's acquisition by Murdoch? theleekycauldron (talk • contribs) (she/they) 00:24, 26 April 2022 (UTC)
that it was more reliable in the period before it changed ownership in 1976? theleekycauldron (talk • contribs) (she/they) 04:00, 27 April 2022 (UTC)
With all the respect I have for Dave, both from online and personal contact, I don't quite get that out of the discussion. If I have to use a year as a cutoff point, I'd note that most of the examples given are post-2010, and as someone who lives on the outer fringes of the New York metropolitan area and thus often sees (and occasionally thumbs through; I make a point of not buying it) the Post on newsracks in the course of my daily business, I concur that it's gotten more stridently right-wing and willing to color its coverage than it was even then ... in fact, since that RfC the Post alienated a lot of its own staff when it went all in on the Hunter Biden laptop story, which keeps looking more and more like some elaborate Russian disinformation scam, something I can't imagine the Post having stooped to even in 2012.
However, outside of subjects with a potential political valence, as other participants in that RfC noted, I still think their coverage is good ... I mean, the Daily News has taken the opposite political tack (really funny given that 50 years ago both papers were on opposite sides), and they're still a competitor to the Post in every way, so for regular old local news they have to play it straight. Daniel Case (talk) 05:14, 27 April 2022 (UTC)