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Thus unsurprising that it comes from French so-called 'cinema theory'. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.12.18.195 (talk) 14:38, 28 March 2022 (UTC)
There are several quotes from Truffaut (particularly under "Truffaut's development") that are said to be taken from "Une certaine tendance du cinéma français". I can't find either of these in the actual text and there are no references to follow...
A fundamental problem with this page -references to irony, which are in fact, not ironic, just coincidental etc. Someone with knowledge of film and semantics could tidy
Just a nit-pick; despite what the introduction says here, "auteurism" is a method of critical study, while the Auteur Theory is indeed an actual theory, namely (as the article goes on to explain) the theory that the director is (or should be, depending on one's interpretation) a film's primary author.
Astruc's 1948 essay ought to be mentioned here. The idea of the camera stylo is a rather obvious precursor to the auter. Deleuze 20:08, 15 May 2005 (UTC)
I hope you don't mind such a complete rewrite; it just happens that I was reading on this subject recently.
Add anything that's missing, but please keep the first sentence, which is from your original--it is THE best brief statement of the auteur position that I've ever seen.
I don't mind at all; I didn't write the original but merely moved it from Auteur Theory Film. I didn't know anything about Auteur theory one way or the other, as film theory tends to bore me. And I do think the article is much better as it is, apologies to the original author....
I just did a major rewrite of this article and included the Astruc, plus Bazin and a section on post-war cinema. I have removed the following section (next paragraph) which I find too close to personal opinon. I am also hesitant about the final paragraph in the article (which I have left). Also, the comparison between Renoir and Delannoy in the first paragraph should be explained (why?) or removed. User:NYArtsnWords Aug 13, 2005
"The strength of this theory (and the logical penchant for directors to support it) has been blamed for the irrational lack of attention some early directors received during the heyday of film theory. Howard Hawks was argued to be a hack because he had too many movies across too many genres. Allan Dwan still has not received much critical recognition both because too few of his films are in circulation and he made too many without contemporary attention."
I think this article has been vandalized. What is 'Noirgger Theory'? I'm pretty sure this is racist nonsense. Can someone please confirm. Thanks. ..........Yes, this is vandalism, and I believe it was 76.169.224.40. Could someone please fix this article?
On your first and fundamental point, you are completely wrong. Auteur theory does not posit that the director is the film's author, it doesn't have to do that because we are defined as such in law. It almost does the opposite, making a distinction between those that are and those that are not, implying that studio hired directors are just baby sitters for a collective that make a film together. Like most film theory, evidence is based on deconstruction of the finished product rather than scientific analysis of the whole process, which is difficult due to both it's complexity and the esoteric nature. Filmmaker2011 (talk) 16:33, 13 February 2014 (UTC)
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Whoever wrote this article has no idea what the auteur theory was. The state " Howard Hawks was argued to be a hack because he had too many movies across too many genres." However, anyone with the slightest information on the theory would know Hawks was ranked as high as Hitchcock by the young Cahiers critics. Andre Bazin, thier mentor, jokingly called the Cahiers critics "Hitchcocko-Hawksians." One source for info: http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0001328/bio. Please fix this immediatly.
I'm not sure a merge of Auteur and Auteur theory is the best idea - Auteur serves a purpose right now, giving a working definition and a list of directors that work with Auteur theory well. -Seth Mahoney 19:26, Apr 3, 2005 (UTC)
Any critics of the Auteur theory out there want to add their 2 cents to this article? I read somewhere that Peter Bogdanovich films are often used as an example to debunk the theory since his early movies were masterpeices, and then everything he did after sucked amazingly. If the theory was true, he would have continued to make classics.
I justed posted the sentence below to the auteur theory page but removed because I see that there has been a lot of writing on this page and I do not want to mess up your work.
In recent years, the auteur theory has been contrasted with genre theory.
I do not want to contradict the auteur theory (it brought us some wonderful movies), but it bothers me that the auteur theory never brings up 'genre' directors like David Cronenberg or Radley Metzger or Roger Corman.
The auteur theory is another instance of the cult of personality of the great man theory which tends to exclude the excellent work of some directors of escapist fiction. Do you think a link to genre studies deserves a mention in the article? --Jahsonic 16:27, 25 August 2005 (UTC)
In the above paragraph I had linked studio system to hollywood Hollywood|studio system. After comments from NYArtsnWords, I wrote this on NYArtsnWords's talk page. It is, I believe, of relevance here.
I believe that these two articles are discussing the same topic. Could someone who is knowledgable in the field please merge them? --M@rēino 04:01, 13 February 2006 (UTC)
I just did a clean-up of the Criticism section. I removed the whole paragraph about "psychoanalytical film criticism" because it was overly detailed, abstruse, and seemingly irrelevant. For one thing, I don't see how an emphasis on the "unconscious" of the director as contributing to the meaning of a film actually contradicts the auteur theory! Clconway (talk) 15:26, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
I'm sorry to sound totally ignorant, but I am on this subject, so there you go. After reading the article, I still didn't know what auteur theory really is. OK, in auteur theory, the director is the "author", at least in the case of directors who follow auteurism. (I think.) Based on this article, I couldn't say with confidence if a given director, say Ron Howard, is a follower of auteur theory. Likewise, I couldn't say if Roger Ebert is a critic who follows auteur theory. Some of the comments on the talk page were helpful. I think including contrasts to other theories, such as genre theory would be helpful. Also, a history of what preceded auteur theory would be helpful. Finally, why do we need auteur theory? I'm not asking about the article itself, but rather why did somebody think it was important to view movies this way? Lon of Oakdale (talk) 14:56, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
The auteur theory states that the director is the primary author of the film; according to the theory, this is just the way it is, and a director doesn't have to be a "follower" of the theory for it to apply, just like whether we evolved from other forms of life is true or false regardless of whether one is a follower of the "theory of evolution." As for critics, to use your example, Ebert does follow the auteur theory; one can tell by reading his reviews and noticing his tendency to praise or criticize directors, while leaving screenwriters relatively undiscussed. As for why we "need" the auteur theory, we need the theory for the same reason we need any theory on art, cinema, or literature: it helps us better understand the medium. Hope that answers your questions. Minaker (talk) 21:47, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
To answer some of the points here and as a justification for the section I added (criticism in perspective), Autuer theory is something that whilst being fairly marginal in terms of current academic interest (being seen mostly as part of a specific historical milieu within film ie part of the French New Wave) is relevant to anyone serious about producing quality film. To put it another way it is probably more relevant to filmmakers (directors) than a lot of what exists as 'audience' theory because it deals with the relationship of the process to the finished product. Other areas such as genre studies deal with the choices made and their perception by audiences rather than defining wherein lie the 'sources' of quality. A major issue with this article in my opinion is it's focus on the question of who is the author. Take for instance the work of Andrew Sarris which has only the briefest of mention in the article next to Pauline Kael (who's motivation as a writer was to catch peoples attention on the subject of specific films for mainstream newspaper articles, not to advance autuer theory through debate). Upshot is that to me this article is incomplete for something that is and always will be of importance, if only to filmmakers, and it should contain more information and examples about the 'signatures' of respected directors. I would be grateful for any assistance in improving (with examples) the section 'criticism in perspective' and would welcome a debate here upon this and other sections of the article. I intend to add more for instance on Andrew Sarris, without generally removing or changing anything within it's current form, which is factual but incomplete or not comprehensive enough in my opinion. --Filmmaker2011 (talk) 09:21, 23 April 2011 (UTC)
'The thing to do is always, as you have done, to begin by explaining why you disagree and also (where possible) addressing any legitimate concerns they may have. You should add sources as soon as possible; while Wikipedia:Verifiability encourages tagging content that is in dispute before removing it'
You should become a little more familiar with the protocol and atmosphere of the community before you start policing others hard work and good intentions. Your initial labeling of vandalism is wholly inappropriate (it shows in your history) and also displays a lack of balance in your approach, which ironically calls on guidelines whose sole purpose is as arbiter of balance. It is not I that looses out, I am not defending what I wrote out of egotism or stubbornness (I don't get a byline here), it is AT itself, wikipedia and those who can make use of a better understanding. Theories have no use unless they can be applied, if they are in doubt years after their formulation then they should be confined to minor a minor historical reference.--Filmmaker2011 (talk) 08:26, 26 April 2011 (UTC)
i havent and wont have time to fully investigate this today, but I will point out that the argument "sources exist" is not sufficient. When challenged, as this content has been, the sources must actually be produced and supplied before content can be readded WP:BURDEN. Active Banana (bananaphone 12:21, 13 May 2011 (UTC)
Filmmaker2011, please understand that no one is discouraging you from contributing to the encyclopedia. We need all the editors we can get and that anyone is interested in improving the material here is a good thing. Please don't be discouraged, or indeed, distracted from developing material for the article by the discussion here. This page exists for us to improve the article and to discuss editing practices, not the editors or the subject of the article. Neither do we want to overwhelm you with rules and procedures. Removing the section for the time being is the most appropriate course of action, but that in no way means that the material does not belong in the encyclopedia. The problem is that it doesn't provide citations from reliable, third-party sources, it appears to me also to not be written in a neutral, encyclopedic tone, and looks like "original research". I know all those policies can seem a bit much when you begin. But this isn't the place for any of us to argue about our opinions. If someone else, in the kind of source we're talking about, has made the arguments that you're making, then great! We can include them and attribute them. If not, however important, valuable, or correct they may or may not be, they shouldn't be here. Wikipedia is a work in progress, so the fact that something isn't in the article doesn't mean it shouldn't be, only that an interested editor hasn't yet included it with appropriate citations to substantiate the claims. It is interesting, and relevant, for example, if it is true that the director is universally regarded as the legal author of a film, with regards to copyright. But for that information to appear here, it needs a good citation. As someone has mentioned in an old talk page comment, genre theory is a major criticism and needs to be mentioned. That approach is not a proposal to prioritise the screenwriter over the director. It's not a version of New Criticism either. Nor do the practitioner/critic/academic/audience hierarchies hold water. The arguments about "where the quality" etc. lie are part of auteur theory and suffer just as much from its limitations, which apply equally to the director's work as to the audience's appreciation. It's not something that is organised along a theory/practice distinction. None of this is meant to discourage you, however! Only, rather, to indicate that it's a more complex subject.
We want your contributions! I recommend that you consider two options. The first is for you and Lindhorst to stop arguing and instead to try to collaborate! You are both interested in the subject of this article and your energies would be better spent improving it together. This could be done by creating a sub-page of this talk page, such as this one: Talk:Auteur theory/Criticism draft. There, you can place any material you like and begin to add citations for it. Lindhorst, if interested, could check that you're accurately representing those sources and add any material of his/her own too, again with citations. When you're both happy with the shape of the section, you could post a notice here and on the Wikiproject talk page and seek some outside opinions on whether it's ready to move into the main article. Hey presto, the article gets improved and everyone is happy. I appreciate that this might be a tricky process, but the final form of the material will be vastly better. The second option would be for you to create your own user page draft, such as this one: User:Filmmaker2011/Auteur. There, you could go through the same process but without collaborating until you reach the point that you feel it can be assessed by other editors. Then, post a link to it here and on the project page and have it confirmed that it's ready.
I hope that's useful. It's very common for our early contributions to the encyclopedia to be not quite what they should be--that was certainly the case for my own efforts. It's very tempting to promote our own opinions (and prejudices?). But those "pillars of wikipedia" are there for a reason, and I'm certain that my own ideas have improved considerably from the experience of trying to improve my editing practices to make them more like what they 'should' be. I, too, have wasted a lot of time discussing on a talk page when the better solution would have been to go to the sources and improve the article with them. Most articles here are incomplete, and they'll only get better from the efforts of editors like yourselves. So, happy editing! • DP • {huh?} 14:46, 13 May 2011 (UTC)
Lindhorst, you do not entirely disagree with my 'views' and you cannot find any criticisms from any of the other myriad departments of production (in information theory a lack of data in a defined set is information). You point out that nobody has had anything to say regarding the 'arguments', which includes you, there are glaring contradictions in what you have written. It seems that you are all a bit wrapped up in the authority of policing and no one wants to deal with the complexity of the subject itself. The only reason the section was awkward is because of the inherent and complex problem with the criticism section in the first place which is in a nutshell is a real theory vs claptrap. 'Schreiber theory' - do me a favour! where are the third party citations for the legitimacy of that? I would equate this with CERN vs end of the world conspirators - where is their section on the CERN page? Plenty of citation from 'reliable' sources). However, I notice that because of my illegal 'common sense' arguments (which contained at least one legitimate example of proof) the criticism section has been toned down (not torn down though), so I suppose my obviously biased efforts weren't completely wasted. The film and film making task forces are at the level of sunday paper review sections, if a little more comprehensive. I'd hoped to input on difficult and neglected areas of theory starting with AT. Whilst I appreciate the kind words of encouragement, unfortunately due to the lack of debate on anything other than the rules, I am out of place here as a content producer and will refrain from any further input ('editing') to wikipedia for the time being. --Filmmaker2011 (talk) 09:33, 23 May 2011 (UTC)
It's been settled for quite some time now that there is currently a major movement in the Japanese gaming industry - where creators, renowned and revered for their craftsmanship and creative vision, have split away from the AAA behemoths that have funded them in the past in order to return to their roots and produce games that reflect their own personal artistry. This has been referred to the "Auteur Movement" in a few places now and it seems reasonable to include a section on this in the article. While it's not strictly film-related, the Auteur Movement appears to carry the same spirit as Auteur theory: the creative owner being in a directing-overseeing role, a rejection and revolt against the idea of a piece of media being nothing more than a commercial commodity, and well-known personalities imposing their will on a media and saturating it with their distinct character.
The most digestible description I can find of this would be from the Extra Credits video titled The New Future of Japan - The Auteur Movement, which can be found at this link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XUWFH17Q3Aw[1]
What do you guys think?
67.6.11.179 (talk) 09:47, 28 December 2015 (UTC)
I can't believe ol' Shiggy isn't mentioned in this article. The article on him even references a 'The New Yorker' article that refers to him as an auteur. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 192.151.173.219 (talk) 21:58, 5 April 2017 (UTC)
References
The result of the move request was: page moved. Andrewa (talk) 11:31, 5 November 2016 (UTC)
Auteur theory → Auteurism – Opening sentence states "Auteur theory is a theory ... " which I found rather redundant. Then I thought: don't these sorts of topics usually end with "-ism"? Formalism, romanticism, eclecticism, structuralism, deconstructivism, the examples are endless... Searching "auteurism" shows that numerous books use the term, sometimes even in the title. Google Books also pulls up 500+ more results than if I searched "auteur theory". Ilovetopaint (talk) 16:30, 27 October 2016 (UTC)
was just wondering why Shigeru Miyamoto was absent from the video game auteur list? when he definitely fits the definition, and is considered by many one of the fathers of modern gaming, and is also a much bigger name than some that do appear on the list, just seems weird that you've got the might and magic guy and Ragnar Tørnquist (who I've never even heard of or any of the games he's made either) but no Shigeru Miyamoto — Preceding unsigned comment added by 58.6.237.158 (talk) 06:47, 20 August 2018 (UTC)
I'm sorry, but calling Nomura a videogame auteur while not mentioning Suda51 in the same category is just absurd. Not to mention, Nomura is credited here for the Final Fantasy series, but he has never directed a FF game. Even if he had, he's definitely not an auteur. He likes edgy anime tropes and puts belts and zippers all over his character designs, that's literally it. Did a Kingdom Hearts fan write this? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dipitinsht (talk • contribs) 15:52, 25 February 2019 (UTC)
Instead of cramming them all here, there should be a List of video game auteurs. I will create the article myself if I ever have the time to do it. ili (talk) 22:28, 14 March 2022 (UTC)