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I've removed [1] the section based on the peshavil (pamphlet) because it's not a reliable source. It doesn't have any reliable publication data etc & is effectively the same as a random personal website. Could someone also find more info about the stuff added about from Daniel Biton before that goes back in? More generally I think there might be a bit of an original research problem with the two factions stuff ie. do the sources actually justify the claims about leaders, splits & size of various factions. Misarxist (talk) 15:13, 6 May 2010 (UTC)
Intrafighting
The larger branch of Neturei Karta, led by Rabbi Zelig Reuven Katzenellenbogen, issued a strongly worded condemnation of the radical branch, after several of its members had visited Iran to participate in the "International Conference to Review the Global Vision of the Holocaust." Below is a rough translation.
To clarify and to enlighten
It is now close to 60 years since the Zionists established their rule over Eretz Yisroel (the Land of Israel) by founding the impure Zionist state, which brazenly stole the name "Israel" and has waged a full and open war against God through its mere existence...
And this new path, which has never been the path of our forefathers and our rabbis, to replace the study of the Jewish viewpoint regarding the exile with matters of state and political affairs, and to mingle with the peoples, and to try to bring about the dismantlement of the Zionist state by force...
And because of this we have found it to be our duty to clarify:
That these actions go straight against the views of the leadership of Neturei Karta,
And it is the total opposite of the ways of Neturei KartaWe must clarify how much we have been hurt by the huge desecration of God's Name caused by these actions and it is impossible to remain silent on this issue.
Rabbi Daniel Biton, a Beit Shemesh-based Neturei Karta scholar, published a book in which he severely criticized the radical faction for their deep involvement in “the Internet and the international media,” secular media they use to advance their message, and more importantly, for their “partnership and connection to Arab, Muslim, and Palestinian politics which involves serious transgressions.” In response refutations to Rabbi Biton's book were subsequently published by a number of Neturei Karta scholars and sympathisers both in Israel and the diaspora.
If we can't provide a source for the peshkavil we should try and use Rabbis Call to Excommunicate Neturei Karta Members in Iran and Satmar court slams Neturei Karta. Chesdovi (talk) 15:32, 6 May 2010 (UTC)
An image used in this article, File:Members of Neturei Karta Orthodox Jewish group protest against Israel.jpg, has been nominated for speedy deletion at Wikimedia Commons for the following reason: Copyright violations
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A contribution to the discussion on he-interwiki would be appreciated. -- Prokurator11 (talk) 05:30, 4 March 2012 (UTC)
Moshe Friedman is nothing more than an opportunist who has used his sect's religious and political views on Israel and Zionism to establish relationships within questionable or fringe groups of anti-Semitic or anti-Israel (or both) communities in order to advance his own business deals. He has proven, even among those people, to be less than reliable and even dishonest. At best, his bio is worthy of a notation on the Neturei Karta's wiki page and not his own. He is neither the founder, nor the leader of the anti-Zionist group, and at best is just a sidenote. This article should be incorporated into that page and deleted as its own MosesYisroel (talk) 20:25, 31 December 2012 (UTC)
Will start today but needs many good sources. Will start leaving some random sources for others also http://www.timesofisrael.com/conference-of-presidents-time-to-cut-off-neturei-karta/ http://www.commentarymagazine.com/2012/01/09/ron-paul-zionism-advice-neturei-karta/ http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4247444,00.html
as Neturei Karta gone too far? A recent visit by the ant-Zionist sect’s representatives with Hezbollah officials in Lebanon has mainstream US Jewish leaders calling for “all parts of the Jewish community to denounce and disassociate from those who embrace the enemies of Israel and the Jewish people.”
A statement released Tuesday by Richard Stone, chairman, and Malcolm Hoenlein, executive vice chairman, of the Conference of Presidents of Major American Jewish Organizations, said “The Jewish community should act collectively now to cut off the extremist group and end these repeated acts of betrayal that embarrass the community and undermine its vital interests.” Tellyuer1 (talk) 20:16, 5 January 2013 (UTC)
This is the disputed sentence, which I think violates NPOV:
An anti-Zionist vigilante group with what Ynet calls "loose links" to Neturei Karta called Sikrikim gained worldwide attention in 2011,<:ref>"ZAKA founder slams haredi violence". YnetNews. February 3, 2012. Retrieved March 6, 2012.</ref> when they violently protested in front of a girls school in Ramat Bet Shemesh.<:ref name='Guardian'>Sherwood, Harriet (October 31, 2011). "The Battle of Bet Shemesh". The Guardian. Retrieved November 7, 2011.</ref>
The problem I see with this version is that the sentence is about Sikrikim rather than NK. It uses "loose links" to associate NK with the violence of Sikrikim.— alf laylah wa laylah (talk) 11:48, 11 January 2013 (UTC)
The first source is used to make the connection. The second source is used to cite the violent protest story. Since the first source reaffirms the undeniable connection between the two, we can move on. The footnotes are appropriately placed. Again, I went ahead and cited the policy. The second source is not used to reaffirm the connection between Neturei Karta and Sikrikim, because the first source is sufficient for that. The second source is for the protest story. Two parts, two sources, the burden is met.
I'm not going to weigh in on the subtler issues being discussed. The anthem quote was an unambiguous copyright violation, and reinserting it will result in a block. As for the rest of this, discuss it, and stop reverting. This is not such a clearcut case that there is any unambiguous policy statement that forbids or permits the material, you have to seek consensus. More tug-of-war will result in blocks all around.—Kww(talk) 16:02, 22 January 2013 (UTC)
Does that page actually exist? I thought Talmud pages, at least in Bavli, were just 'a' and 'b', the front and back of the page. Is Yerushalmi different? Hagigah 76c is what the Neturei Karta list on their own site. --FeldBum (talk) 21:29, 15 April 2013 (UTC)
I've removed an old neutrality tag from this page that appears to have no active discussion per the instructions at Template:POV:
Since there's no evidence of ongoing discussion, I'm removing the tag for now. If discussion is continuing and I've failed to see it, however, please feel free to restore the template and continue to address the issues. Thanks to everybody working on this one! -- Khazar2 (talk) 14:14, 5 July 2013 (UTC)
I propose removing the ARBPIA banner from this page. I see no reason why this should apply to this page. There was also no editing in this area in the run up to its insertion here. Chesdovi (talk) 20:44, 1 August 2013 (UTC)
>> Israeli jailed for attempting to spy for Iran(Lihaas (talk) 07:32, 30 January 2014 (UTC)).
they not mention in the article but it said "Other Western “revisionists” presented what they called new facts about the Holocaust at the conference, which also attracted attendees from some ultra-Orthodox Jews belonging to anti-Zionist sects that reject the state of Israel" ome ultra-Orthodox Jews belonging to anti-Zionist sects that reject the state of Israel it clearly said the anti zionists ultra orthodox jews are holocaust deniers and the neturei karta belong to that sect the ny times say it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.246.133.127 (talk) 01:22, 16 May 2015 (UTC)
the ny times said they calling new facts about the holocaust. what do you think that mean calling new facts about the holocaust? " We aren't supposed to infer meaning from sources" calling new facts from the holocaust means exactly holocaust denial the ny times said exactly they called new facts about the holocaust which mean they denied the holocaust the meaning is obvious. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.246.133.234 (talk) 01:55, 16 May 2015 (UTC)
Yisroel Dovid Weiss said in an interview that they are not Holocaust deniers, they went purely to publicize their anti Zionist views. SupremeandGloriousLeader (talk) 08:26, 6 August 2015 (UTC)
Video evidence is a reliable source no matter where it is hosted.LazyTime (talk) 04:12, 21 July 2015 (UTC)
I understand Neturei Karta theology. Admittedly, there are some salient points I agree with sentimentally, if not factually. But even if they were 100% correct on both accounts, why collude with anti-Semites? Perhaps they see anti-Semitic forces as some Babylon-like tool G-d will use to chastise this supposedly false Israel? Many articles in Wikipedia document the anti-Semitic doings of Neturei Karta, but none address why they behave this way. Simply that they disagree with Zionism is causality, not explanation. Can anyone contribute to the article to address this? Jyg (talk) 01:18, 18 April 2016 (UTC)
To clarify and to enlighten
It is now close to 60 years since the Zionists established their rule over Eretz Yisroel (the Land of Israel) by founding the impure Zionist state, which brazenly stole the name "Israel" and has waged a full and open war against God through its mere existence...
And this new path, which has never been the path of our forefathers and our rabbis, to replace the study of the Jewish viewpoint regarding the exile with matters of state and political affairs, and to mingle with the peoples, and to try to bring about the dismantlement of the Zionist state by force...
And because of this we have found it to be our duty to clarify: That these actions go straight against the views of the leadership of Neturei Karta, And it is the total opposite of the ways of Neturei Karta
We must clarify how much we have been hurt by the huge desecration of God's Name caused by these actions and it is impossible to remain silent on this issue.
That's it. --Piz d'Es-Cha (talk) 15:41, 21 April 2016 (UTC)
Anti Zionist Jews who do not go up to Israel but choose to settle in Iran december 2021
In December 2021 a anti-Zionist Jewish Community deceided not to go up to Israel but to settle in Iran[1] — Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.49.186.88 (talk) 15:25, 5 December 2021 (UTC)
References
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From this article, "By contrast, US-based Jewish NGO the Anti-Defamation League describe them as "the farthest fringes of Judaism". A serious question here. Why isn't there any sentence in the article for the Anti-Defamation League that indicates the Neturei Karta opinion of the ADL?
Hello, somebody around who is able to find a source confirming נָטוֹרֵי קַרְתָּא is Jewish Babylonian Aramaic? --> Neturei Karta. Thank you for your time. Lotje (talk) 11:05, 16 June 2018 (UTC)
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Change the URL for the link in the "External links" section to http://www.nkusa.org. The URL currently listed for Neturei Karta International goes to an old page on the Wayback Machine Internet Archive. Djh2dc (talk) 15:11, 6 April 2019 (UTC) Djh2dc (talk) 15:11, 6 April 2019 (UTC)
The article's 2nd paragraph includes "The Jewish Virtual Library puts their numbers at 5,000" but the JVL's sole indicated source is "GNU Free Documentation LicenseWikipedia article "Neturei Karta"Neturei Karta". Can the citation be replaced by an independent source? Mcljlm (talk) 23:59, 1 May 2019 (UTC)
Why does this mention require a quote from Farrakhan? If people want to see what the man has said, they can click the blue link and read his article. Ouf. 142.198.135.212 (talk) 22:07, 20 May 2023 (UTC)
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In the sentence, "The name Neturei Karta literally means "Guardians of the City" in Aramaic and is derived from a narrative on page 76c of Tractate Hagigah in the Jerusalem Talmud," change "page 76c" to "pages 6a and 6b." 76c is not a page in Tractate Hagigah in the Jerusalem Talmud. In fact, no page in the Jerusalem Talmud has a side c, as pages can only have two sides. The narrative described can actually be found on pages 6a and 6b, as seen from this edition (or any other) of the Jerusalem Talmud: https://mechon-mamre.org/b/r/r2b01.htm Askerm1 (talk) 20:49, 4 June 2023 (UTC)
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Change
"While the Neturei Karta describe themselves as true traditional Jews, the more secular
The Anti-Defamation League has described them as "the farthest fringes of Judaism" and a group with long history of "extremist statements" and support for notable anti-Zionists and Islamists.."
to
"While the Neturei Karta describe themselves as true traditional Jews, the more secular, the Anti-Defamation League has described them as "the farthest fringes of Judaism" and a group with a long history of "extremist statements" and support for notable anti-Zionists and Islamists." PorousWhale (talk) 15:47, 10 October 2023 (UTC)
There’s a cut off sentence right before the info box.
”While the Neturei Karta describe themselves as true traditional Jews, the more secular” 156.205.115.140 (talk) 21:38, 10 October 2023 (UTC)
The Aramaic name should be vocalized as follows: נְטוּרֵי קַרְתָּא. The correct transcription is nəṭūrē qartā. 2600:8801:9A2B:9400:55E6:2E1D:C4E1:D100 (talk) 19:41, 2 November 2023 (UTC)
The encyclopedic word for this is "Mosaic." "Torahic," "pentateuchal," or even "Halakhic" could fit as well, but Mosaic refers directly to the 613 commandments derived from the Law of Moses as recorded in the Torah. "Torahnical" is not a word. Cheeftun (talk) 04:29, 15 December 2023 (UTC)
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− | members it | + | members it has |
The word employs would mean that the members of Neturei Karta are labouring in exchange for money. In the case of membership of a religious group such as this, the word "has" would better convey the proper meaning. Apologies for suggesting such a textually minor edit on a controversial page, but the meaning of each word is substantially different.
David18426 (talk) 09:31, 10 January 2024 (UTC)
References
What exactly does this add to the article? 142.126.167.40 (talk) 19:28, 25 July 2024 (UTC)
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Change "not by self-determination.[citation needed]" to "They also believe that until that time arrives, only Jews who are especially observant like themselves should be allowed to live in the Torah described land of Israel."
[1] RCSCott91 (talk) 20:43, 22 August 2024 (UTC)