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Uh, werewolves feature in horror films. They also feature in mythology, books and TV shows. So why Horror?
One word you. Dog Soldiers. Ok thats two. But its a movie about werewolves.24.144.137.244 23:18, 10 February 2007 (UTC)
There is a problem here -- the reference to James I doesn't make any sense -- it basically says that James I was vigorously hunting witches, and regarded werewolves as being figments of the mind. That doesn't really seem to make a whole lot of sense. Does anyone know which is correct?
validity.
why is all the research on were wolves and such riddled not with the tales that belong, but this crud about how to kill and how to hurt and how they hurt people? in truth they dont hurt anyone, you cant become a were wolf, your just born that way...
you are leaving out the non spiritual lycanthropes ( some of which are known to me) and the fact that wolves dont act like the portayed were wolves in those rather strange stories... GabrielSimon
the ones who can physically change, and arent sick... or delusional. email me if you wish to fiurthur discuss this...
Gabrielsimon 22:34, 17 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Does anyone know if any work has attempted to address why the werewolf is so vicious? Is it because of the pain of transformation, or the hunger (burns a lot of calories, maybe?) or both? Or is that just too ridiculous a question for most people to tackle? :-)
More relevant questions: if you become a werewolf by being bitten by a werewolf, what made the first one?
Why can werewolves only be killed with a silver bullet? How did people kill them in the centuries before guns? Silver arrows? And why silver?
Have any authors attempted to address these questions? Any folktales about them?
I've heard that some werewolves are created as the result of a curse, and not necessarily from being bitten by another werewolf.
Also, doesn't anything silver work? Silver daggers? -- corvus13
It is assumed legends of were creatures comes from the fear of witch craft. Stories of people turning themselves into ravinass monsters for the power. And its not just the full moon, it's the day of the full moon. Transformation was said to begin in the day and was long and painful. By night you were an ugly beast. And if the clouds covered up the moon for a moment you would not revert back to human form until the clouds past. I have no idea when that stupid statement began. Some interesting facts is that in African instead of werewolves they have hyena men and were bears originated in America and that the Werewolf is actually a European legend. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.54.155.11 (talk • contribs)
My personal recommendation is to stay indoors and not go out during times of the full moon. I have so far been successful in avoiding all lycanthropes in this manner... sjc
AFAIK, all silver should word, even the touch causes skin burns. I can't remember the source, though. Also, in contrast to vampires, werewolves can enter your house, without being invited. For home safety, I always keep a herd of silverfish ;) --Magnus Manske
Too funny. About the article, how much "supposedly" do we want in here? Shouldn't it be obvious they're not real, or do we want to keep reminding people anyway? --Koyaanis Qatsi
I think the article is self-evident, and contains sufficient caveat with the introduction of the word mythology. sjc
Montague Summers ("The Werewolf") believed that the Werewolf was just plain evil (Satanic even). My own belief is split between Crichton's ("The Eaters of the Dead") in that they were so vicious that the survivors of their attack believed that they had mystical abilities to turn into animals and the fact that shamans merge with animals in Dreamtime. That would have been the Neuri of Heroditus ("The Persian Wars") and the Cynocephalids and Cananeans of the Greeks and Romans. Then again, the fact is, as is often true, quite different from the myth. People of the Were community are not vicious at all unless seriously provoked. In fact, they tend to be somewhat altruistic. Also note Harry A. Senn, "Werewolf and Vampire in Romania" for a more positive view of Wereism and see Carlo Ginzburg's "The Night Battles" for the history of Thiess the Werewolf". (Wolf VanZandt, WolfVanZandt@webtv.net)
By the way, according to Adam Douglas in his "The Beast Within" the connection between Werewolves and silver and also the strong connection between Werewolves and the full moon is a modern invention and can be credited to Hollywood (or, at least, the movies). It's not hard to verify his contention. Just try to find references to the moon and silver in anyting before "The Wolfman" in any guise but atmosphere. Werewolves are much more strongly connected to water in the old records. (Wolf VanZandt)
Water? What connections are there to water? Never heard of that. Adam Douglas is right that the silver link was popularized by movies, but silver was thought of as an effective weapon against witches and other beasties (late wendigo stories after European influence, for example) before that. Silver appears to be in the stories after someone evidently decided that iron (as in "cold iron") wasn't fancy enough anymore. (Dan Norder, dannorder@aol.com)
Off hand I can think of three "werewolf" stories in which the element figures prominently. In Pliny' Natural History (book 8, chapter 22), the author relates that the werewolves of Arcadia swam across a lake before changing into a wolf. In Petronius' Satyricon, the soldier who changed into a wolf first stripped and then urinated in a circle around his clothes to change them into a stone and, thus, conceal them. St. Christopher did not cross water before changing into a wolf, but he did cross water before his conversion. Christipher. before his conversion, was a Cananaen named Reprobus. The Cananaens are equated by Pliny in his Natural History to Herodotus' Neuri who were said to change once a year into a wolf. Another werewolf figured in the early church. Andrew was said to have evangelized the Cananaens and began with one named Abominable. Since he (Peter's brother) was the first to evangelize the Cananaens, that seems a much more sensible explanation for why werewolves were called St. Peter's wolves during the Middle Ages than the old tale that Peter tried to create a man in imitation of God and ended up with a werewolf instead. (Wolf VanZandt, WolfVanZandt@webtv.net)
What is the justification for:
Point 2) sounds like historical revisionism, and point 1) like a trick to disguise point b. There is immense evidence of not merely the existence of Wehrwolf, but of its organisation, internal politics, and many of its operations, e.g. the assassination of the anti-Nazi mayor of Aachen. It was certainly smaller than its creators hoped, but largely because Wilhelm Keitel spent the last few weeks of the war trying to shut it down. I will change both in a couple of days unless I hear a reason not to do so. Securiger 01:24, 22 Dec 2003 (UTC)
This was posted right at the bottom of the page. Charles Matthews 08:21, 25 Oct 2004 (UTC)
How to identify Werewolves Ways to identify werewolves are: birthmark on the palm shaped like a star, wolfish tuffs of hair or caul at birth. The cildren born with such were belived to possess magical powers of second sight and metamorphisis.
I will not try to prove to you that werewolves are real, because it always ends in fighting, but, you can become a werewolf by being bitten, or being born that way, no on knows for sure about the first. Silver is a natural allergine, sever enought to kill then, they can also be killed be exterem damage to the brain or heart. There are two kinds of werwolves: Canis Lupins(non spiritual) and lycanthropes (spiritual). For more information from a werewolf expert, my email & Yahoo messanger ID: azenrot@yhoo.com
I edited the "Origins" section to reflect the fact that the word "werewolf" derives from English's Germanic (and ultimately, its Indo-European) linguistic root stock. The previous version mistakenly asserted that were- comes from Latin vir, when in fact the two are independently cognate via Proto-Indo-European (rather than one deriving from the other). --Ryanaxp 05:40, Nov 26, 2004 (UTC)
What is the source for saying that the Old English 'warg' was used in the same way we might use 'serial killer'? The concept of a serial killer is rather modern, and I would prefer to see the definition given on the Warg page ("evildoer, criminal, outcast") here. Jess Gordon 11:04, 23 April 2006 (UTC)
A lot of people like to come here and add information about some TV show/book/film etc. that has some werewolf in it somewhere. In the past it got to be way, way too much information. The space it took up outweighed everything else on the page. The articles Werewolf films and Werewolf novels were created so that there'd be a place for all sorts of trivial mentions that do not advance the main werewolf topic. Now the fiction references are creeping back. Please take it to the appropriate articles. DreamGuy 19:46, Apr 4, 2005 (UTC)
I would have to point out that the fiction references are relevant to the article, as werewolves in fiction is in fact a component of the article. Thus, while the references should not be something that takes up three 'pages' worth of space, they do deserve to be mentioned, especially if they are relevant to that particular section of the article. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 69.204.185.96 (talk • contribs) .
Aye, but beginning the history section with a statement about Lycans (that is terminology from the Underworld movie - right?) being known to the Underworld as "Daywalkers" is rather inappropriate unless someone can come up with a reference that places this information within the realm of history instead of fiction. WolfVanZandt 06:53, 16 May 2006 (UTC)
All those requests for citations are making the article look ugly. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 142.59.154.142 (talk • contribs)
The Loup-Garou was described as much larger than a wolf, much more vicous and deadly, and much more likely to target human prey. it was also described as a "man beast." It would appear that when the novel "Werewolf of Paris" was made into one of the first successful werewolf films "Werewolf of London" (change of venue), the characteristics of the French Werewolf were retained. Therefore, the characteristics of the French Werewolf became intnisic to most pop culture depictions of werewolfes. WehrWolf 19:12, Apr 6, 2005 (UTC)
"Werewolf of London" was released in 1935 (based on a novel that's even older). Since you didn't know that, either you're not the "expert" you claim to be, or you're several hundred years old and 1935 seems recent to you. Either way, you're being quite the jerk. WehrWolf 19:41, Apr 6, 2005 (UTC)
You must have a very twisted view of reality. I've read your posts, and you're quite rude. Bringing this to your attention is hardly a personal attack. If you will demonstrate civility, so will I. WehrWolf 22:15, Apr 6, 2005 (UTC)
This statement "French Loup-Garou was described as a man-wolf" does not mean that it resembled a man-like wolf at all. It refers to a man who could change into a wolf, like what the word werewolf means. You are reading things into it based upon your modern ideas.
And the statement "humans suffering from porphyria, rabies and other diseases obviously resembled men more than wolves" is irrelevant, because the idea that werewolves came from people with porphyria or rabies is a modern theory based upon modern fictional ideas of what werewolves are like and unsupported by the original legends.
I will give you that werewolves were thought to be bigger and more vicious, but you have yet to give a source to support the idea that when changed they were man-wolf in appearance. If you get a legitimate reference for that, by all means add that. Until you do that part does not belong in the article. DreamGuy 19:31, Apr 6, 2005 (UTC)
I found the following at http://www.timberwolf.org/html/werewolf.html WehrWolf 18:20, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Human Wolves
An eigth-century text Liber Monstrorum - The Book of Monsters - describes a strange race of people living off the edges of the civilized world which feasted on human flesh. This text most likely quotes Plini - who earlier on describes a race known as the Cynocephali or 'Dog-Headed' people.
The folk of the time believed that animals and people were composed of vital essences. To some degree, these were compatible with each other and this placed a heavy burden and resposibility on the individual to preevent monsters such as the Cynocephali on a moral and religious basis. During the middle ages, myths about monsters brought about by the unatural union of man and beast were very popular. One can only speculate that these might be artifice of overactive imaginations to feed our curiosity for the exotic and a fascination with the grotesque - similar to our modern love afair with horror movies and haunted houses. From classical mythology, Middle Ages people inherited a host of human-animals who were part a strange amalgams of the human, the animal and the divine. These beings were the antithesis of humans - often covered with hair, keeping a feral diet mostly consisting of raw foodstuff, lacking speech and using only primitive tools. These people were commonly refered to as "Wild Folk" and people had trouble classifying them as either human or animal.
One such example was Grendel in Beowulf who is described as descended from Cain (and therefore human) but having animal-like qualities - such as extraordinary strength, a penchant for human flesh and antipathy towards humans (whom he considered prey). It's easy to see how these "Wild Men" could in turn give rise to the werewolf myth.
Bestial qualities were not only birthright. They could also be induced. In 1880 a Dr. MacGowan - allegedly a reliable and objective reporter - claims to have witnessed operations in China whereby the hides of dogs and bears were grafted onto the bodies of children. The process was gradual and excruciatingly painful - usually driving the victim mad - which was just as well because it made the subjects appear fiercer and wilder. It is said that vocal chords were severed so that the child was only capable of voicing the gutural barks and growls of the creature he/she was intended to resemble. Joints were broken to force the would-be animal to walk on all fours. [end of quote]
I didn't say these particularly dog heads or wolf head types were Werewolves. Just some interesting information. WehrWolf 17:20, 21 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Does anyone know of a Silver Bullet reference older than this one? (1921) WehrWolf 18:02, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)
The Werewolf of Hüsby
Karl Müllenhoff In Hüsby near Schleswig there lived an old, stingy woman. She offered her farm hands but little to eat, although there was fresh meat every Sunday. The household wondered about this, because the old woman never bought any meat. A young farm hand wanted to discover the woman's trick, so one day he hid himself in the hayloft instead of going to church with the rest of the household. Suddenly he noticed how the woman pulled out a wolf strap and put it around herself. She immediately became a wolf, ran out into the field, and soon came back with a sheep.
"If she can get meat that easily," thought the boy, "then she can be more generous with us. As the woman put meat into the pot, she sighed and said, as was her custom, "Oh, dear God, if only I were with you!"
The boy, pretending to be God, answered, "You'll not come to me for all eternity."
"Why not, dear God?"
"Because you put too little into the pot for your people."
"Then I'll do better."
"Yes, that's my advice to you."
From now on she put a much larger piece of meat into the pot. But the boy could not remain silent, and in the village he talked about what had happened. When on a Sunday morning the woman again turned herself into a wolf, the people were on guard. However, no bullet could harm her until they finally loaded a flintlock with a silver bullet. From that time to the end of her life the woman had an open wound that no doctor could heal. She never again showed herself as a werewolf.
Source: Karl Müllenhoff, Sagen, Märchen und Lieder der Herzogtümer Schleswig, Holstein und Lauenburg, neue Ausgabe von Otto Mensing (Schleswig, 1921), no. 370.
>>>>>>This one doesn't mention bullets, but references silver buttons.(from 1840)
D. H. Temme Two hundred years ago for a time there was a frightfully large number of werewolves in the city of Greifswald. They were especially prevelant in Rokover Street. From there they attacked anyone who appeared outside of their houses after eight o'clock in the evening. At that time there were a lot of venturesome students in Greifswald. They banded together and one night set forth against the monsters. At first they were powerless against them, until finally the students brought together all of the silver buttons that they had inherited, and with these they killed the werewolves.
Source: J. D. H. Temme, Die Volkssagen von Pommern und Rügen (Berlin: In der Nicolaischen Buchhandlung, 1840), no. 259, p. 308.
Actually, DreamGuy, Pliny links the Dogheads back to the Neuri of Herodotus and those were Werewolves in a very modern sense in that they were said to change into wolves once a month. I tend to say that the Werewolves after the 15th century were not Werewolves in the original sense.
If you look at descriptions of Werewolves, there are drasic discontinuities around the fifth and fifteenth centuries and currently. Before the fifth century (Herodotus, Pliny, Pausanias) have them as rather blood-thirsty and violent people. After the fifth century (Marie de France (and the other Werewolf pomances of the time), the Elder edda, Giraldus, Iacobus de Voradrine) Werewolves may have been good or bad but they were generally regular people who happened to be either cursed or gifted, After the fifteenth century, Werewolves were described as either demonic or insane. Then, currently, Werewolves are described as fairly normal people with not-to-terribly obvious differences. I suspect that the change around the 5th century has mostly to do with acculturation. During the fifteenth century, Werewolves were demonized by the church and most of the victims of the Werewolf trials were not the same people at all but were either mentally ill or were the target of grudges in the community. The shift in understanding of lycanthropy to a clinical model didn't greatly change the popular image of the Werewolf. Neither did fictional accounts. Up until recently, Werewolves were described by others. More recently, descriptions are coming from the Therian community to describe themselves (the term "Werewolf" is actually falling out of favor somewhat due to connection with movies and post-15th century lore and the Therian designation is becoming more popular). These people tend to be fairly well adjusted, intelligent students, professionals, and working class individuals that are far from insane or blood-thirsty.
Thank you, Wehrwolf. That's the early example of a silver bullet I've seen exccept for the fact that the Beast of Gevaudan was killed by a silver bullet, but I think the later case was not focusing on the silver so much as it was melted down church furnishings that had been blessed.
(Wolf VanZandt)
______________________ Therianthropy and Spiritual Therianthropy _________________
The contention that Therianthropy is the same as Spiritual Therianthropy as mentioned in the article is erroneous. There are quite a few modern Therians that do not believe that Therianthropy is related to the possession of an animal soul. There are both physiological and psychological theories that do not comment at all on spirit.
(Wolf VanZandt)
if you have to ask, then youll never realize just how sad that image is... relaly man its pathetic.
Gabrielsimon 01:49, 21 May 2005 (UTC)
The opening paragraph of the article makes it seem as if in pre-modern folklore, the full moon was not an element in werewolf transformations. I will soon edit that mistake and provide references that prove what I'm saying. Decius 01:40, 2 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Yes, that's what I was intending to do. Observe that no editing was done on that topic....Decius 19:30, 2 Jun 2005 (UTC)
It's good though to see a person very concerned with references for all points, as I am also. I notice that there is no reference for the implied claim that the full moon was not an element in pre-modern folkore. I suspect that tidbit was based on only one or two references, which are likely wrong, because I remember credible written sources that say otherwise. Decius 20:42, 2 Jun 2005 (UTC)
It's not common knowledge, it's a common conception. And for sure the full moon was not a dominant factor (and I was not in any way implying that the full moon was always believed to enable transformations, I was just saying that in some attested pre-modern traditions or in some pre-modern cases the transformation was said to occur especially during a full moon): but any instance cited in pre-modern folklore of the full moon being directly associated with the transformation negates the sentence, no matter how one slices it. And I will backtrack and find it again, most likely. Decius 22:10, 3 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Wouldn't you know it, after writing that last comment of mine above I already found one such credible reference in a rather well-known and well-researched book, but just to seal the case I will most likely wait till I find a second reference. Decius 22:46, 3 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Till then, people should note that something that is commonly repeated in a number of references is not always correct. A common conception (promoted by most neo-pagans, etc.) is that before the influence of Judaeo-Christianity, witches in Europe were not associated with practicing evil magic. This is in fact a false conception, disproven by such instances as the witch of Lemnos who was executed in Athens for practicing malefic magic and further disproven by the case of Circe in the Odyssey---and other instances, etc. Decius 22:46, 3 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Okay, I found a second reference even better than the first. Next I'm going to name them, quote them, then edit the sentence at issue. Decius 01:14, 4 Jun 2005 (UTC)
First, the less conclusive but still credible reference: Colin Wilson in his 1971 work, The Occult (Random House Inc.) had a chapter titled Withcraft and lycanthropy. On page 441-442 of my 1973 editon (second edition, this time published by Vintage books, ISBN 0-394-71813-5) we find this paragraph:
Wilson goes on describing more. Okay, as you can see, the quote that is bolded is referring to the full moon being an element in the transformations of were-creatures in general. But I found a second reference which is the specific reference needed. Though note that if the full moon was not involved in werewolf transformations, a good researcher like Colin Wilson should have noted that at least in parentheses, but the way he states it implies that werewolves were included. Second reference will be quoted next. Decius 01:48, 4 Jun 2005 (UTC)
The second reference is Strange Stories, Amazing Facts 1976, a hardcover book published by the Reader's Digest Association Inc. The book had a section on werewolves titled Big Bad Werewolves. On page 435 we find this quote:
And there we have it. If that book is accurately quoting Gervase of Tilbury (and I have no reason to suppose it isn't), then there is the pre-modern instance. I remember other instances also, and other references mentioning that the full moon was indeed directly linked to the man to wolf transformation. I'll try to find additional references. For now, I'm inclined to view the statement in this Wikipedia article as mistaken, and I'm going to fix it. Decius 02:01, 4 Jun 2005 (UTC)
That Reader's Digest book most likely correctly quoted Gervase of Tilbury (ca.1200 ad). The Gervase quote is repeated on various websites, including this one [[1]. See Werewolves section, first paragraph. Decius 02:30, 4 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Oh wow, you really take this to the heart. I guess you are really into werewolves. The only thing I intended to show here is that the full moon was directly linked to the werewolf transformation in pre-modern lore. I don't give a fuck what you have to say further, and don't try to come off as some sort of werewolf expert. I was never implying that the full moon was a prevalent element. Yet it was mentioned as directly linked to the werewolf transformation in pre-modern lore. The article overlooked this. Decius 19:47, 4 Jun 2005 (UTC)
i know a lot about them, and your still wrong. how either start showing civillity or be banned. see, editing out your rudeness is good. you claming to be an expert?
oh and, since your wrong, it makes dreamguy right, too bad theres nothing to be done about it, because the truth is the truth. Gabrielsimon 19:54, 4 Jun 2005 (UTC)
I'm not claiming to be an expert, but I know that the full moon was related to the werewolf transformation in pre-modern sources in some cases. That's it. Decius 20:03, 4 Jun 2005 (UTC)
"some" doenst make it noteable. Gabrielsimon 20:06, 4 Jun 2005 (UTC)
That's your opinion. Both of you have misinterpreted this situation. I'm not claiming that the full moon was a prevelant factor in pre-modern lore---quote an instance where I said this. Nevertheless, even if one instance is attested (and I remember more), it shows that it was not invented in later fiction. That is notable. Decius 20:09, 4 Jun 2005 (UTC)
the number of times it was mentioned in premodern literature is too small to be noteable. Gabrielsimon 20:11, 4 Jun 2005 (UTC)
The reason it is notable is because it traces a well-known idea in pop culture further back than its supposed first appearance in fiction. It shows that it dates back into the older lore. Decius 20:13, 4 Jun 2005 (UTC)
in that light your gonna tell me that horrodatus was correct about the meathod of pyramid contriuction thaat was obviosuly bunk, but the lone source says its so, so we mus beleive?
Gabrielsimon 20:25, 4 Jun 2005 (UTC)
One more thing, about the 'rudeness': I was doing my best to be polite yesterday and before, but his further comments did not warrant it. Decius 20:37, 4 Jun 2005 (UTC)
i can understand that, its just the profanity i disaproove of. Gabrielsimon 20:40, 4 Jun 2005 (UTC)
He reacted like I expected he would: with overuse of CAPS in his responses (the hallmark sign of a crank), cheap personal remarks in his comments on this talk page (I made no such comments towards him before his lame 'attacks'), and totally erasing mention of the pre-modern full moon element from the text. I can assure you all this amuses me, and is one of the added bonuses of Wikipedia. Decius 20:48, 4 Jun 2005 (UTC)
then report his lack of etiquette. there are measures that can be taken to provide some relief from this.
Gabrielsimon 20:50, 4 Jun 2005 (UTC)
i removed reference to premodern text, and allow it to be more ambigous (spelling?) so it can stay... i think
Gabrielsimon 21:25, 4 Jun 2005 (UTC)
And GabrielSimon, I don't mean to 'attack' you, but your previous statement above on this talk page that "werewolves in truth don't hurt anybody, they're just born that way", makes me seriously doubt your views on the topic. Decius 22:20, 4 Jun 2005 (UTC)
message filmbuff42 on YIM to discuss frther, should you wish to. Gabrielsimon 22:27, 4 Jun 2005 (UTC)
And if you're trying to impress people with your 'expertise', DreamGuy, you should note that Robert Graves wrote The White Goddess (1948), not Sir James Frazer (>The Golden Bough). When Wilson says in parentheses "the White Goddess again", Wilson is not referring to Frazer's book or Frazer's beliefs; Wilson was making his own connection, based on his reading of Graves. Your attempted summary of Frazer's beliefs is in fact a summary of Robert Graves' beliefs, which are irrelevant in a criticism of Frazer. Frazer posited not a "white goddess", but a sacred king as his prime concept, a totally different theory. Decius 23:46, 4 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Speaking of the moon in werewolf myths: Is anyone aware of a specific source for the idea of a person born under the new moon becoming a werewolf? -Sean Curtin 00:38, Jun 5, 2005 (UTC)
I'm somewhat sure that there is a specific written source for that. The same was also said of vampires, believe it or not (have that reference). In folklore, certain elements were often interchangeable between werewolves and vampires. Decius 00:47, 5 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Decius asked me to come weigh in on the debate over whether the full moon was involved in older werewolf legends, and although I'm not well-read on such things perhaps an outside view on the debate might help. It looks to me like heels have been dug in on both sides, but that the current wording of the article strikes a balance similar to those suggested for resolving POV disputes with both sides presented (an example of full moon involvement as well as the statement that full moon involvement was rare). How about letting it sit for a few days to let tempers cool on all sides? References have been presented and linked so the current version can at least be verified in future if it turns out to be inaccurate or incomplete. There's no hurry on this. Bryan 03:48, 5 Jun 2005 (UTC)
The problems we've had here could have been very easily avoided. Decius came in here claiming that the part about the full moon in the lead was wrong, but it wasn't. Then he said he'd give references but didn't, instead choosing to insult the knowledge of the people who put the correct information in the lead. Then he finally did come back with references, but they did not support the idea that the lead was wrong, just the way he in his head interpreted what the lead said. (And in the meantime gets off into more tangents, bragging about the alleged reliability of his sources when they are kind of the equivalent of a Dick and Jane Talk Werewolves coloring book). And then when he finally took the time to understand what the lead actually said, instead of saying, "Oops, my bad, I didn't read that right" he just says, "Oh wow, you really take this to the heart." (well, yeah, I take having a good encyclopedia to heart, if I didn't I would have given up on this place, as cleaning up after people who shouldn't be conributing to an encyclopedia in the first place is no fun at all) then "The only thing I intended to show here is that the full moon was directly linked to the werewolf transformation in pre-modern lore." (I never would have argued againt the idea that there was some minor reference to it somewhere, and I pointed this out to him a long time back) and then "I don't give a fuck what you have to say further, and don't try to come off as some sort of werewolf expert." (gee, sorry that my actually being an expert gets in the way of your attempts to pretend to be the only expert here). If he had come here and said, "OK, what's with that part in the lead about the moon, I don't get it" (instead of the it's wrong and you people don't know what you are talking about nonsense) and let people explain it to him, an edit to get in his minor bit of information in somewhere would have been trivial. DreamGuy 06:53, Jun 5, 2005 (UTC)
he does this every time, tjis dreamguy, never listens....
Gabrielsimon 20:17, 5 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Werewolves can hurt you but they won't go hurting random people unless they are a mass murderer. You can be born a werewolf or you might be able 2 become 1 (but no real method is known and most include banging your head on the ground). WolfStar
Someone recently went through and added some more trivial mentions of werewolves in movies and so forth, ignoring the articles on werewolf films and werewolf novels that had been created for this purpose. A comparison with the contents of this article and those two articles showed massively redundant information, including variant ideas on the many of the topics, with the articles that were supposedly there to be a full list of all such ficitonal works often not having anywhere the detail included on the article that was supposed to be about werewolves in general. These had basically became useless fork files. So, because I knew that people would just keep making the problem worse unless something was done about it, I was bold and moved the list parts and specifics to a brand new Werewolves in fiction article that is merged from the old (and ignored) novel and films articles and a bulk of this one. That article still needs to be cleaned up (needs television section, redundancies removed, etc.) so all the people who were only here to add fiction, now you have a place to channel your interest. Note that there still is a section here at least mentioning it, as the silver bullet thing is still important for overall knowledge of werewolves, but any significant expansion of that section should be placed on the new article instead. DreamGuy 19:24, July 24, 2005 (UTC)
Please vet this addition, from an anonymous passer-by: "Russia (volkodlak, vurdalak), Ukraine(Viy)" Are both these Russian words accurate? --Wetman 05:14, 26 July 2005 (UTC)
Copied from the article Ruvaush (now a redirect):
'''Ruvaush''' is the Romani-gypsy victim of Romani vampire witch who is doomed to become a werewolf. It is Periodically transform into Wolf-kings larger than the normal wolf.
I added information about the loup-garou. I also switched the order of the initial etymology (I didn't get rid of any info, I only moved it around) to reflect the fact that the 'were' of werewolf is definitely of Germanic origin, the only debate is exactly from which Germanic word. I think the information about PIE was confusing where it was so I moved it to a place that makes it more obvious that it pre-dates the Germanic (and Latin, Irish, etc.) forms and is hypothetical. Whoever originally did this did good research, but I think it is now more readable and comprehensible and reflective of the speculative nature of etymology. Hraefen 01:13, 11 November 2005 (UTC)
If you are looking for good info about the etymology of "werewolf", check out the paper on the subject presented by Earl Cawdor to the Rorburghe Club in 1832. It was reprinted in The Ancient English Romance of William & the Werwolf by Frederick Madden, published in 1970 by Lenox Hill Publishers of New York.
If you are going to edit the main article, please don't bury the table of contents by adding more and more sentences to the first paragraph. Doing that sort of thing makes it less readable. Two or three sentences for the first paragraph are good enough; add a section header after it, and let it go at that.
I made a slight modification to the comment about LSD and ergot in the 'Origins' section. I simply made it clear that LSD cannot be obtained directly via ergot but rather indirectly through the chemicals obtained from the fungus. Jonathan, November 30th.
As far as I'm aware, the only serious use of the word occurs in Underworld (2003 film). It's not an accepted word in any dictionary-type source I know of, and "define: lycan" on Google goes only to this page. I've only seen it used on Internet message boards, &c. a few times. It seems like the term is pretty clearly not a generic word, and doesn't mean much outside the context of that one particular movie. Shouldn't it redirect there? (That page, in turn, explains that it's the film's term for werewolves.)
The word Lycan comes from the Greek word Lykanos which means wolf. VilaWolf
Well the linking does make sense. Underworld's usage of the word is an obvious truncation of "lycanthrope" which is another word for werewolf.