April 30
File:Author Russ Banham.jpg
File:People's Archaeologist.jpg
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The result of the discussion was: Delete; deleted by BethNaught (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT⚡ 09:06, 8 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- File:People's Archaeologist.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Jamshedhkk (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).
Image may have been taken from Navhindtimes.in. The image was posted by Navhind Times on 12 November 2015 with no photo credit. The same image was uploaded here on 3 December 2015. Given the lack of history from the uploader I consider it more likely that they did not create the image. Salavat (talk) 07:08, 30 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the discussion was: keep. — ξxplicit 11:41, 13 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- File:Queeg A.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Centpacrr (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).
- Examination of the trailer shows that there is no clear shot of Bogart that is not either part of a "dissolve" from the preceding scene or covered with lettering. This is plainly a screen capture from the copyrighted film, just as is this photo which also he uploaded, claimed to be a "trailer screen shot," and also does not appear in the trailer.
- The text ("as CAPT. QUEEG") is cropped out of the screenshot which is the last frame before it switches to Greenwald (see file history which I included to show this); Screen shot of Hi Res image comes from a DVD of trailers of multiple movies of the era, not the lo res version of the trailer on line. As is typical of trailers of this era it has not copyright notice. This frame in the film is cropped differently than in the trailer, stopping at the top of Queeg's hat. In the trailer sky above his hat is visible. Centpacrr (talk) 14:35, 14 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- NOTE: A later frame-by-frame examination shows that there are actually two frames in the sequence with no text at all. (Comment added here out of sequence) Centpacrr (talk) 18:07, 23 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- I'd have more confidence in your explanation if you showed that same evolution in the high-res image. Be that as it may, if the contents of the DVD are copyrighted, than so is any image taken off the DVD. Also I think that your multi-project forum shopping needs to be resolved. We are engaged in the identical discussion in two projects, here and Commons, on this photo and the one below. Coretheapple (talk) 15:02, 14 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- Under The Bridgeman Art Library Ltd. v. Corel Corporation, 36 F. Supp. 2d 191 (SDNY 1999), Meshwerks v. Toyota, 528 F.3d 1258 (10th Cir. 2008), Feist Publications, Inc., v. Rural Telephone Service Co., 499 U.S. 340 (1991), Eastern America Trio Products v. Tang Electronic Corp, 54 USPQ2d 1776, 1791 (S.D.N.Y. 2000), the Berne Convention Implementation Act of 1988 §3(a) and §4(a), 17 USC §101 et seq, and Nimmer on Copyright, uncopyrighted and PD materials (such as pre-1977 trailers of motion pictures without a copyright notice) can't be retroactively copyrighted by the producer of a DVD or other medium on which they are digitally or otherwise duplicated and published as they constitute "slavish copies" and thus do not reach the threshold of originality required for claiming copyright protection. Centpacrr (talk) 18:22, 14 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- OK. Are you going to make that point on Commons too? It's a bit confusing, having this discussion in two places. Coretheapple (talk) 19:59, 14 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- You should feel free to delete the versions in Commons. I much prefer to have them here for use on in the English WP. Centpacrr (talk) 21:17, 14 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- You don't just upload a photo there, claim PD, and then upload the same photo here and claim PD after it's copyright status is challenged. That's gaming the system. Coretheapple (talk) 13:50, 15 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- It is my understanding that copyright and PD criteria are different in Commons than in here (en:Wikipedia). Centpacrr (talk) 13:56, 15 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- The image deleted in Commons was done so (as noted above) without my objection as it is a unneeded duplicate of this one I added later to the en:Wikipedia image database. As I also noted above, Commons has somewhat different and more restrictive copyright criteria although I do not necessarily believe that one was a copyright violation outside the US. The deleted Commons version also did not contain in its history the images of the identical frames copied from the inferior on line version of the pre-1977 trailer which was published in 1954 without a copyright notice that this one has that shows that this image is of an identical frame from a hi res version the same PD trailer that is not published anywhere on line. Centpacrr (talk) 21:48, 20 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- It was deleted because it's not a free image, not because you were silent. Coretheapple (talk) 16:04, 21 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- I did not object to the deletion of this image in Commons for the reasons I stated above (being duplicative, etc) while I do support retention in the en:Wikipedia image database as having been first published in a trailer in 1954 without copyright notice, they are PD under the Berne Convention for the Protection of Literary and Artistic Works (Paris Text 1971), Article VII(8); the Berne Convention Implementation Act of 1988, §3(a) and §4(a); 17 USC §101 et seq; and Bridgeman Art Library v. Corel and the other cases I cited above. Also once published in any means, format and/or context without copyright protection, identical images cannot be subsequently copyrighted retroactively when slavishly republished in another context. Centpacrr (talk) 17:20, 21 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- A review of the WikiProject-Film "talk" archive reveals that this very issue was discussed and resolved nine years ago at "WikiProject-Film Talk Archive #12 (§10): Free Images for Films" (April, 2007) which concludes that under US Copyright Law (Title 17 USC) that: "Trailers are considered to have been "published" without copyright notice, so any content that was first released to audiences in the form of the trailer (from before 1964) is considered free. In other words, those brief parts of the film constituting the trailer content are in the public domain. Of course, it doesn't matter whether a screenshot is physically taken from the film itself or the trailer, so long as there is solid documentation that the particular frame was a part of the original trailer." This image meets all these criteria and thus, just like hundreds of other similar pre-1964 US movie trailer screenshots hosted in both the en:Wikipedia image database and Commons, and used in WP articles, is in the Public Domain. Centpacrr (talk) 05:02, 22 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- Next you'll be citing the Universal Declaration of Human Rights. Simple situation. Not on the trailer. Look at the Youtube video. Look at the link to the "yellow stain" image that was deleted that this account also claimed was from the trailer, but nothing remotely like it on the trailer.[1] More bad-faith legal smoke-blowing. But give us some more. Pile on the wall-o-text. Done here. Coretheapple (talk) 11:58, 22 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- Actually, Coretheapple, this image clearly is from the trailer as is also affirmatively demonstrated by the three versions contained in its File History. The first low resolution version of the PD frame includes the text "as CAPT. QUEEG" that identifies it as being from the on line version of the trailer can be seen HERE, the low resolution version of that same frame in which that text is cropped out is HERE, and the high resolution version of the identical PD frame is HERE.
- As for the claim that no frame in the trailer of this scene of the change of command exists in the trailer without text, you can see on line HERE and HERE that there are two such frames with no text does that exist (at 0:11) immediately before switching from Bogart to Ferrer. Also the image of this scene in the film is cropped at the top of Queeg's hat whereas in the trailer (which is a different aspect ratio) the top cropping is higher up. There are also multiple trailers in existence for this film only two of which (viewable HERE and HERE) appear to be available on line on YouTube.
- The image "Queeg A.jpg" therefore meets all the PD criteria accepted on WP for a frame from a pre-1964 uncopyrighted US movie trailer long in use for hundreds of similar image files on WP as set forth in WikiProject-Film in April, 2007 at "WikiProject-Film Talk Archive #12 (§10): Free Images for Films" (April, 2007). This PD status applies equally to a frame taken from a low resolution on line version of such a trailer, from a high resolution off line version of the same trailer, or of the identical frame even if it were to be captured from the film itself.
- As for your repeated sarcasm ("Next you'll be citing the Universal Declaration of Human Rights.") and usual "hang up" in a thread you started, while that may be modestly amusing, again with respect it is also ultimately an unhelpful practice in building the project. (And as for your repeated "wall-o-type" complaints, please look at your own WP contributions log and ask yourself if that isn't exactly what it reflects you do far more than I.)
- That being said, I hope you can finally see now that screen shots of specific images that were first published in uncopyrighted US motion picture trailers released before 1964 (and if still not registered after that up to 1978) are in the Public Domain. That being the case it has therefore long been the policy and practice for WP image databases (including Commons) to allow such images to be used in the project without reservation. As such specific images are already PD, it also does not matter what the subsequent source is from which each one is retrieved, i.e., the original uncopyrighted trailer, the otherwise copyrighted film, a magazine, book, newspaper or other print publication, a publicity photo, an on or off line digital file, or anywhere else. Once such an image was first published before 1978 without a copyright notice it is PD in perpetuity and not subject to later retroactive copyright protection. I trust now that you know this is how such image files are treated on WP, you won't be challenging other such files in the future either in the en:Wikipedia image database of in Commons. Centpacrr (talk) 15:42, 22 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- Two comments. First, although it is true that many trailers were issued without the required copyright notice, some did have notice and so, at least on Commons, we cannot assume beyond a significant doubt (the Commons standard of proof) that a frame from a trailer is PD unless it can be shown that the trailer in question actually did not have the required notice. Second, if an image is, in fact, PD, then the WMF policy is that it should be uploaded to Commons and not to WP:EN. That makes it available to all projects, including those that do not accept local file uploads. . . Jim - Jameslwoodward (talk to me • contribs) 14:46, 23 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- While some pre-1964 (and pre-1978) trailers may have copyright notices, none of the 1954 trailers for The Caine Mutiny carry such a notice. Also while posting PD images in Commons may be recommended, it is also not mandatory and I have found doing so can (as it did in this case) lead to unjustified challenges and faulty deletions of such qualified PD images. For that reason I often do not post image files there although they can always be moved later if deemed useful.Centpacrr (talk) 15:16, 23 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- Keep. In this URL, provided in the other discussion just below, we have solid evidence that this specific trailer lacks a copyright notice. As long as this scene appears in the trailer, it doesn't matter whether it appears in any later-published work; such appearance is the republication of a public-domain work, not and it doesn't make the original copyrighted — otherwise one could say that the Mona Lisa is under copyright, because it's been featured in lots of copyrighted works published in recent years. And finally, because trailers get projected onto screens far larger than this image would represent, the resolution isn't an issue: the original work in question is the physical film, and accurate digital copies of it are merely slavish copies of the original, as noted above. Nyttend (talk) 03:09, 27 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- NOTE: All of the above comments by myself, as well as Jameslwoodward and Nyttend (both of whom are also identified on their userpages as being Sysops), relating to his image as being PD apply equally to the accompanying image "Queeg B.jpg" listed below. Centpacrr (talk) 04:36, 27 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- KEEP and PROMPTLY CLOSE: I am puzzled as to why this was "relisted" or needs "more thorough discussion and clearer consensus" when when such consensus to keep the file as in the Public Domain had clearly been achieved already as, per established WP policy noted in the discussion above, WikiProject-Film "talk" archive reveals that the issue raised was discussed and resolved nine years ago at "WikiProject-Film Talk Archive #12 (§10): Free Images for Films" (April, 2007) which concludes that under US Copyright Law (Title 17 USC) that: "Trailers are considered to have been "published" without copyright notice, so any content that was first released to audiences in the form of the trailer prior to 1978 is considered free. In other words, those brief parts of the film constituting the trailer content are in the public domain. It also doesn't matter whether a screenshot is physically taken from the the trailer, the film itself or any other source, so long as there is solid documentation that the particular frame was a part of the original trailer" as is clearly demonstrated HERE. (See also HERE.) This image therefore meets all the necessary criteria just like hundreds of other similar pre-1978 uncopyrighted US movie trailer screenshots hosted in both the en:Wikipedia image database and Commons used in WP articles, is therefore clearly in the Public Domain, and this listing should have already been closed weeks ago as "KEEP". Centpacrr (talk) 13:34, 30 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the discussion was: keep. — ξxplicit 11:41, 13 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- File:Queeg B.jpg (delete | talk | history | logs).
- Screen shot of Hi Res image comes from a DVD of trailers of multiple movies of the era, not the lo res version of the trailer on line. As is typical of trailers of this era it has not copyright notice. Centpacrr (talk) 14:39, 14 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- See Queeg A reply. Have you uploaded this to any other projects or just here and Commons? Coretheapple (talk) 15:03, 14 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- The image deleted in Commons was done so (as noted above) without my objection as it is a unneeded duplicate of this one I added later to the en:Wikipedia image database. As I also noted above, Commons has somewhat different and more restrictive copyright criteria although I do not necessarily believe that one was a copyright violation outside the US. The deleted Commons version also did not contain in its history the images of the identical frames copied from the inferior on line version of the pre-1977 trailer which was published in 1954 without a copyright notice that this one has that shows that this image is of an identical frame from a hi res version the same PD trailer that is not published anywhere on line. Centpacrr (talk) 21:48, 20 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- See above. Same answer. Coretheapple (talk) 16:04, 21 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- I did not object to the deletion of this image in Commons for the reasons I stated above (being duplicative, etc) while I do oppose deletion in the en:Wikipedia image database as having been first published in a trailer in 1954 without copyright notice, they are PD under the Berne Convention for the Protection of Literary and Artistic Works (Paris Text 1971), Article VII(8); the Berne Convention Implementation Act of 1988, §3(a) and §4(a); 17 USC §101 et seq; and Bridgeman Art Library v. Corel and the other cases I cited above. Also once published in any means, format and/or context without copyright protection, identical images cannot be subsequently copyrighted retroactively when slavishly republished in another context. Centpacrr (talk) 17:20, 21 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit sniffing glue. Coretheapple (talk) 18:45, 21 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- With respect, sir or madame, you just do not seem to have actually looked at the provisions of US copyright law (Title 17, United States Code) and the related case law as it applies to materials first published in the US prior to December 31, 1977 without copyright registration. If you disagree with how I have related it, you are, of course, free to say so (as you apparently have), however as I have you also need to provide some basis other then your personal opinion to support your position. Centpacrr (talk) 19:52, 21 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- Could you repeat yourself again? You've only made this wall-o-text seven inches long on a high-def screen. You haven't met your quota. Coretheapple (talk) 21:40, 21 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- I must observe that I find your repeated "wall-o-text" complaints here and elsewhere a bit hypocritical when a review of your contributions page reveals that vast amounts of what you post on WP constitutes hundreds of lines of text on this and various other user, talk or forum pages on the project. I certainly hope those postings are more responsive and relevant to the specific issues raised there than what you have failed to do here. As for my as yet unresponded to comments on this issue, again see supra. Centpacrr (talk) 23:00, 21 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- A review of the WikiProject-Film "talk" archive reveals that this very issue was discussed and resolved nine years ago at "WikiProject-Film Talk Archive #12 (§10): Free Images for Films" (April, 2007) which concludes that under US Copyright Law (Title 17 USC) that: "Trailers are considered to have been "published" without copyright notice, so any content that was first released to audiences in the form of the trailer (from before 1964) is considered free. In other words, those brief parts of the film constituting the trailer content are in the public domain. Of course, it doesn't matter whether a screenshot is physically taken from the film itself or the trailer, so long as there is solid documentation that the particular frame was a part of the original trailer." As does Queeg A.jpg above, this image also meets all these criteria and thus, just like hundreds of other similar pre-1964 US movie trailer screenshots hosted in both the en:Wikipedia image database and Commons, and used in WP articles, is in the Public Domain. Centpacrr (talk) 05:02, 22 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- Next you'll be citing the Universal Declaration of Human Rights. Simple situation. Not on the trailer. Look at the Youtube video. Look at the link to the "yellow stain" image that was deleted that this account also claimed was from the trailer, but nothing remotely like it on the trailer.[2] More bad-faith legal smoke-blowing. But give us some more. Pile on the wall-o-text. Done here. Coretheapple (talk) 11:58, 22 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- Actually, Coretheapple, this image clearly is from the trailer (at 0:42) as is affirmatively demonstrated by the two versions contained in its File History. The low resolution version of the PD frame can be seen HERE and HERE, on line HERE, and the high resolution version of the identical PD frame is HERE. The image "Queeg B.jpg" therefore meets all the PD criteria accepted on WP for a frame from a pre-1964 uncopyrighted US movie trailer long in use for hundreds of similar image files on WP as set forth in WikiProject-Film in April, 2007 at "WikiProject-Film Talk Archive #12 (§10): Free Images for Films" (April, 2007). There are also multiple trailers in existence for this film only two of which (viewable HERE and HERE) appear to be available on line on YouTube. This PD status applies equally to a frame taken from a low resolution on line version of such a trailer, from a high resolution off line version of the same trailer, or of the identical frame even if it were to be captured from the film itself.
- As for your repeated sarcasm ("Next you'll be citing the Universal Declaration of Human Rights.") and usual "hang up" in a thread you started, while that may be modestly amusing, again with respect it is also ultimately an unhelpful practice in building the project. (And as for your repeated "wall-o-type" complaints, please look at your own WP contributions log and ask yourself if that isn't exactly what it reflects you do far more than I.)
- That being said, I hope you can finally see now that screen shots of specific images that were first published in uncopyrighted US motion picture trailers released before 1964 (and if still not registered after that up to 1978) are in the Public Domain. That being the case it has therefore long been the policy and practice for WP image databases (including Commons) to allow such images to be used in the project without reservation. As such specific images are already PD, it also does not matter what the subsequent source is from which each one is retrieved, i.e., the original uncopyrighted trailer, the otherwise copyrighted film, a magazine, book, newspaper or other print publication, a publicity photo, an on or off line digital file, or anywhere else. Once such an image was first published before 1978 without a copyright notice it is PD in perpetuity and not subject to later retroactive copyright protection. I trust now that you know this is how such image files are treated on WP, you won't be challenging other such files in the future either in the en:Wikipedia image database of in Commons. Centpacrr (talk) 15:42, 22 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- KEEP and PROMPTLY CLOSE: I am puzzled as to why this was "relisted" or needs "more thorough discussion and clearer consensus" when when such consensus to keep the file as in the Public Domain had clearly been achieved already as, per established WP policy noted in the discussion above, WikiProject-Film "talk" archive reveals that the issue raised was discussed and resolved nine years ago at "WikiProject-Film Talk Archive #12 (§10): Free Images for Films" (April, 2007) which concludes that under US Copyright Law (Title 17 USC) that: "Trailers are considered to have been "published" without copyright notice, so any content that was first released to audiences in the form of the trailer prior to 1978 is considered free. In other words, those brief parts of the film constituting the trailer content are in the public domain. It also doesn't matter whether a screenshot is physically taken from the the trailer, the film itself or any other source, so long as there is solid documentation that the particular frame was a part of the original trailer" as is clearly demonstrated HERE. (See also HERE.) This image therefore meets all the necessary criteria just like hundreds of other similar pre-1978 uncopyrighted US movie trailer screenshots hosted in both the en:Wikipedia image database and Commons used in WP articles, is therefore clearly in the Public Domain, and this listing should have already been closed weeks ago as "KEEP". Centpacrr (talk) 13:35, 30 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]
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File:Larence Chamberlain and Thea Rasche 1928 circa.jpg
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The result of the discussion was: Delete; deleted as F8 by Explicit (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT⚡ 13:13, 13 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- File:Larence Chamberlain and Thea Rasche 1928 circa.jpg (delete | talk | history | logs).
- The Leslie Jones collection is available as cc-nc-nd, which is incompatible with our licensing.[3] Magog the Ogre (t • c) 02:23, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- keep PD not renewed per [4] note there is no record for this photographer renewing his photos, so it applies across all his work, in the collection 198.24.30.111 (talk) 15:44, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- I have not searched through that document, but note that PD-US-not renewed requires evidence of publication, which we currently do not seem to have. Also, if the pictures were created for a book, magazine or newspaper, then you also need to check if the book, magazine or newspaper was renewed. If the book, magazine or newspaper was renewed, then the photograph is typically covered by that renewal, and then you won't find the photographer's name in the Catalog of Copyright Entries. --Stefan2 (talk) 21:34, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- Published in 1927. See [5], complete with view of the reverse, the 1927 caption and the stamp of Wide World Photos. (AFAIK, Commons users and the LoC [6] haven't found subsisting copyrights for WWP photos from that era.) By the way, is the original photo by Jones? I doubt it. It was taken in Europe, right? The BPL image looks like a photographic reproduction of a photo. Jones may have made a reproduction and the BPL may have the negative of the reproduction, but the original would still be a WWP photo by an unidentified photographer. That could be the case also for other photos that have been collected in the collection but are not by Jones originally. This other image looks like an obvious example: [7]. The photographer of the reproduction might have owned a copyright, if any, for taking a photo of the frame, but not on the original photograph. (It can be noted also that the BPL website dedicated to the Jones collection [8] has the subtitle "Boston Herald Traveler: 1917-1956", which suggests that the photos were published in that newspaper.) -- Asclepias (talk) 15:23, 28 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the discussion was: keep. — ξxplicit 11:41, 13 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- File:Police Commissioner Sullivan and bishop at cardinal funeral.jpg (delete | talk | history | logs).
- The Leslie Jones collection is available as cc-nc-nd, which is incompatible with our licensing.[9] Magog the Ogre (t • c) 02:24, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- keep PD not renewed per [10], [11], [12], [13] note there is no record for this photographer renewing his photos, so it applies across all his work, in the collection 198.24.30.111 (talk) 15:46, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- I have not searched through that document, but note that PD-US-not renewed requires evidence of publication, which we currently do not seem to have. Also, if the pictures were created for a book, magazine or newspaper, then you also need to check if the book, magazine or newspaper was renewed. If the book, magazine or newspaper was renewed, then the photograph is typically covered by that renewal, and then you won't find the photographer's name in the Catalog of Copyright Entries. --Stefan2 (talk) 21:34, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the media's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
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The result of the discussion was: keep. — ξxplicit 11:41, 13 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- File:Aviator Wilmer Stultz 1928.jpg (delete | talk | history | logs).
- The Leslie Jones collection is available as cc-nc-nd, which is incompatible with our licensing.[14] Magog the Ogre (t • c) 02:24, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- keep PD not renewed per [15] note there is no record for this photographer renewing his photos, so it applies across all his work, in the collection 198.24.30.111 (talk) 15:48, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- I have not searched through that document, but note that PD-US-not renewed requires evidence of publication, which we currently do not seem to have. Also, if the pictures were created for a book, magazine or newspaper, then you also need to check if the book, magazine or newspaper was renewed. If the book, magazine or newspaper was renewed, then the photograph is typically covered by that renewal, and then you won't find the photographer's name in the Catalog of Copyright Entries. --Stefan2 (talk) 21:34, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the media's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
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The result of the discussion was: keep. — ξxplicit 11:41, 13 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- File:Guggenheim and Doolittle 1930 circa.jpg (delete | talk | history | logs).
- The Leslie Jones collection is available as cc-nc-nd, which is incompatible with our licensing.[16] Magog the Ogre (t • c) 02:24, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- keep PD not renewed per [17] note there is no record for this photographer renewing his photos, so it applies across all his work, in the collection
- I have not searched through that document, but note that PD-US-not renewed requires evidence of publication, which we currently do not seem to have. Also, if the pictures were created for a book, magazine or newspaper, then you also need to check if the book, magazine or newspaper was renewed. If the book, magazine or newspaper was renewed, then the photograph is typically covered by that renewal, and then you won't find the photographer's name in the Catalog of Copyright Entries. --Stefan2 (talk) 21:34, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the media's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
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The result of the discussion was: keep. — ξxplicit 11:41, 13 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- File:Maurice Bellonte and Dieudonne Costes1930.jpg (delete | talk | history | logs).
- The Leslie Jones collection is available as cc-nc-nd, which is incompatible with our licensing.[18] Magog the Ogre (t • c) 02:24, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- keep PD not renewed per [19] note there is no record for this photographer renewing his photos, so it applies across all his work, in the collection 198.24.30.111 (talk) 15:50, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- I have not searched through that document, but note that PD-US-not renewed requires evidence of publication, which we currently do not seem to have. Also, if the pictures were created for a book, magazine or newspaper, then you also need to check if the book, magazine or newspaper was renewed. If the book, magazine or newspaper was renewed, then the photograph is typically covered by that renewal, and then you won't find the photographer's name in the Catalog of Copyright Entries. --Stefan2 (talk) 21:35, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
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File:Leverett Saltonstall 1938.jpg
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The result of the discussion was: keep. — ξxplicit 11:41, 13 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- File:Leverett Saltonstall 1938.jpg (delete | talk | history | logs).
- The Leslie Jones collection is available as cc-nc-nd, which is incompatible with our licensing.[20] Magog the Ogre (t • c) 02:24, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- keep PD not renewed per [21] note there is no record for this photographer renewing his photos, so it applies across all his work, in the collection 198.24.30.111 (talk) 15:54, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- I have not searched through that document, but note that PD-US-not renewed requires evidence of publication, which we currently do not seem to have. Also, if the pictures were created for a book, magazine or newspaper, then you also need to check if the book, magazine or newspaper was renewed. If the book, magazine or newspaper was renewed, then the photograph is typically covered by that renewal, and then you won't find the photographer's name in the Catalog of Copyright Entries. --Stefan2 (talk) 21:37, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the discussion was: keep. — ξxplicit 11:41, 13 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- File:Ernest K. Warburton with his 575HP pursuit plane at East Boston Airport.jpg (delete | talk | history | logs).
- The Leslie Jones collection is available as cc-nc-nd, which is incompatible with our licensing.[22] Magog the Ogre (t • c) 02:25, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- keep PD not renewed in 1958 per [23] note there is no record for this photographer renewing his photos, so it applies across all his work, in the collection 198.24.30.111 (talk) 15:56, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- I have not searched through that document, but note that PD-US-not renewed requires evidence of publication, which we currently do not seem to have. Also, if the pictures were created for a book, magazine or newspaper, then you also need to check if the book, magazine or newspaper was renewed. If the book, magazine or newspaper was renewed, then the photograph is typically covered by that renewal, and then you won't find the photographer's name in the Catalog of Copyright Entries. --Stefan2 (talk) 21:37, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the discussion was: keep. — ξxplicit 11:41, 13 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- File:Miss Harriet Quimby, Boston girl aviator who lost her life trying to entertain the public at Squantum.jpg (delete | talk | history | logs).
- The Leslie Jones collection is available as cc-nc-nd, which is incompatible with our licensing.[24] Magog the Ogre (t • c) 02:25, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- keep PD not renewed in 1939 per [25] note there is no record for this photographer renewing his photos, so it applies across all his work, in the collection 198.24.30.111 (talk) 16:00, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- I have not searched through that document, but note that PD-US-not renewed requires evidence of publication, which we currently do not seem to have. Also, if the pictures were created for a book, magazine or newspaper, then you also need to check if the book, magazine or newspaper was renewed. If the book, magazine or newspaper was renewed, then the photograph is typically covered by that renewal, and then you won't find the photographer's name in the Catalog of Copyright Entries. --Stefan2 (talk) 21:37, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the discussion was: keep. — ξxplicit 11:41, 13 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- File:Miss Helen Hicks, 18-year-old golf star, and Elinor Smith, 17-year-old aviatrix, at Fairchild Field, Farmingdale, N.Y.jpg (delete | talk | history | logs).
- The Leslie Jones collection is available as cc-nc-nd, which is incompatible with our licensing.[26] Magog the Ogre (t • c) 02:25, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- PD not renewed in 1956 per [27] note there is no record for this photographer renewing his photos, so it applies across all his work, in the collection 198.24.30.111 (talk) 16:03, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- I have not searched through that document, but note that PD-US-not renewed requires evidence of publication, which we currently do not seem to have. Also, if the pictures were created for a book, magazine or newspaper, then you also need to check if the book, magazine or newspaper was renewed. If the book, magazine or newspaper was renewed, then the photograph is typically covered by that renewal, and then you won't find the photographer's name in the Catalog of Copyright Entries. --Stefan2 (talk) 21:37, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the discussion was: keep. — ξxplicit 11:41, 13 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- File:Wiley Post and Harold Gatty in Boston East Boston Airport 1931.jpg (delete | talk | history | logs).
- The Leslie Jones collection is available as cc-nc-nd, which is incompatible with our licensing.[28] Magog the Ogre (t • c) 02:25, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- keep PD not renewed in 1959 per [29] note there is no record for this photographer renewing his photos, so it applies across all his work, in the collection 198.24.30.111 (talk) 16:05, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- I have not searched through that document, but note that PD-US-not renewed requires evidence of publication, which we currently do not seem to have. Also, if the pictures were created for a book, magazine or newspaper, then you also need to check if the book, magazine or newspaper was renewed. If the book, magazine or newspaper was renewed, then the photograph is typically covered by that renewal, and then you won't find the photographer's name in the Catalog of Copyright Entries. --Stefan2 (talk) 21:37, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the discussion was: keep. — ξxplicit 11:41, 13 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- File:Bonney Gull before it crashed & killed its maker, Curtis Field, N.Y.jpg (delete | talk | history | logs).
- The Leslie Jones collection is available as cc-nc-nd, which is incompatible with our licensing.[30] Magog the Ogre (t • c) 02:25, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- keep PD not renewed per [31] note there is no record for this photographer renewing his photos, so it applies across all his work, in the collection 198.24.30.111 (talk) 15:43, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- I have not searched through that document, but note that PD-US-not renewed requires evidence of publication, which we currently do not seem to have. Also, if the pictures were created for a book, magazine or newspaper, then you also need to check if the book, magazine or newspaper was renewed. If the book, magazine or newspaper was renewed, then the photograph is typically covered by that renewal, and then you won't find the photographer's name in the Catalog of Copyright Entries. --Stefan2 (talk) 21:36, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the discussion was: keep. — ξxplicit 11:41, 13 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- File:Gov. Hurley throws out the first ball as Joe Cronin and McCarthy watch, at Fenway.jpg (delete | talk | history | logs).
- The Leslie Jones collection is available as cc-nc-nd, which is incompatible with our licensing.[32] Magog the Ogre (t • c) 02:26, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- keep PD not renewed per [33] or [34] or [35]. 198.24.30.111 (talk) 15:18, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- I have not searched through that document, but note that PD-US-not renewed requires evidence of publication, which we currently do not seem to have. Also, if the pictures were created for a book, magazine or newspaper, then you also need to check if the book, magazine or newspaper was renewed. If the book, magazine or newspaper was renewed, then the photograph is typically covered by that renewal, and then you won't find the photographer's name in the Catalog of Copyright Entries. --Stefan2 (talk) 21:36, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
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Jehoash tablet images
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The result of the discussion was: delete, applying the precautionary principle. — ξxplicit 11:41, 13 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- File:Detail of Jehoash tablet showing form of lettering in inscription.jpg (delete | talk | history | logs).
- File:Jehoash tablet, allegedly circa 800 BCE.jpg (delete | talk | history | logs).
This was the discussion for File:Detail of Jehoash tablet showing form of lettering in inscription.jpg prior to merging the discussions. The content here is essentially a duplicate of the discussion for the latter-nominated file.
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- The inscription was created prior to 1923, but the photo obviously was not. Since this is a derivative work since the photo is taken of the item at a specific angle, the photographer could claim a copyright for their zoom of the item. Also, if this is deemed non-free, per the information above, it would fail WP:NFCC#1. Steel1943 (talk) 22:50, 10 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- Steel1943, the photo is a simple front-on snapshot of the object. It shows no creativity or originality within the meaning of Feist Publications v. Rural Telephone Service. It is therefore unprotectable. In addition, the picture is used to illustrate an article about the tablet and is therefore a fair use. 23:49, 10 February 2016 (UTC)
- @PraeceptorIP: Yes, there is a free equivalent. A free equivalent would be you or I taking a photo of the tablet ourselves and then uploading it to Wikipedia with a free license. Steel1943 (talk) 23:55, 10 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- @PraeceptorIP: Actually, I have a question for that you may be able to answer to truly determine if a free equivalent can be created. See the discussion below. Steel1943 (talk) 00:02, 11 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- Steel1943, that is not a realistic alternative. The tablet (and thus the detail) is somewhere in Israel, secreted away by the alleged discoverer, Oded Golan (in "a secure, undisclosed location" - http://www.haaretz.com/blogs/outside-edge/.premium-1.591953), to whom the court awarded custody of the tablet after acquitting Golan of the charge of forging the tablet (see http://www.haaretz.com/blogs/outside-edge/.premium-1.591953). Even if the tablet were not hidden, it would be infeasible to go to Israel from the US to photograph it, even assuming Golan would cooperate in the project. If you are in Israel (which I am not) you are welcome to try to do this. There is another, not as good, photograph of the tablet at http://www.biblicalarchaeology.org/daily/news/verdict-not-guilty/ but you would make the same complaint against it that you already made. There is another photo of the detail (not the same) at http://www.haaretz.com/blogs/outside-edge/.premium-1.591953 but again you would make the same complaint against it that you already made. No reasonable alternative source exists. This is a fair use. PraeceptorIP (talk) 00:47, 11 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
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- This item may have been created prior to 1923, but the photo was not. This is a derivative work, so this th copyright belongs to the photographer. If this file were marked non-free, it would fail WP:NFCC#1. Steel1943 (talk) 23:06, 10 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- Steel1943, the photo is a simple front-on snapshot of the object. It shows no creativity or originality within the meaning of Feist Publications v. Rural Telephone Service. It is therefore unprotectable. In addition, the picture is used to illustrate an article about the tablet and is therefore a fair use. Also, there is no free equivalent available. If one existed I would have used it. 23:53, 10 February 2016 (UTC)
- @PraeceptorIP: Yes, there is a free equivalent. A free equivalent would be you or I taking a photo of the tablet ourselves and then uploading it to Wikipedia with a free license. Steel1943 (talk) 23:56, 10 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- @PraeceptorIP: Do you know where this tablet is currently located (in what facility, what country, etc)? This information may help determine if you or I taking a photo of the tablet would be considered free or non-free by default. (See Commons:Freedom of panorama.) Steel1943 (talk) 00:02, 11 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- Even if the tablet were not hidden, it would be infeasible to go to Israel from the US to photograph it, even assuming Golan would cooperate in the project. If you are in Israel (which I am not) you are welcome to try to do this. There is another, not as good, photograph of the tablet at http://www.biblicalarchaeology.org/daily/news/verdict-not-guilty/ but you would make the same complaint against it that you already made. There is another photo of the detail (not the same) at http://www.haaretz.com/blogs/outside-edge/.premium-1.591953 but again you would make the same complaint against it that you already made.
- No reasonable alternative source exists. This is a fair use. PraeceptorIP (talk) 00:53, 11 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- The pictures do not need to be replaced by you personally. There are lots of people in Israel who can take photos of objects. Compare with WP:NFC#UUI §1: a picture of a living person isn't 'irreplaceable' only because the uploader and the subject of the photograph are in different countries. That said, if the tablet is inaccessible, then the pictures may very well be irreplaceable. For example, photos of people are often irreplaceable if the person is in prison, and an object locked into someone's private home would presumably also be irreplaceable if there is no legal way to enter that person's home. --Stefan2 (talk) 18:31, 11 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- @Stefan2:Golan secreted the tablet in a secure, unknown location after his acquittal. http://www.haaretz.com/blogs/outside-edge/.premium-1.591953 It is therefore inaccessible. PraeceptorIP (talk) 22:01, 11 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- Not sure if File:Detail of Jehoash tablet showing form of lettering in inscription.jpg is copyrightable as a photograph, but the inscriptions are a bit like a coin, and per c:COM:ART#Photograph of an old coin found on the Internet, photos of coins need permission from the photographer.
- File:Jehoash tablet, allegedly circa 800 BCE.jpg shows more than just the tablet, and it's possible that the light effects on the tablet are caused by the photographer or that they are affected by how the camera is held. There is also some background stuff on the picture. It's maybe easier to claim PD-Art if the picture is cropped, but the light effects make me worried. Or maybe the light effects are not light effects but parts of the tablet? --Stefan2 (talk) 18:29, 11 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- My unprofessional IANAL opinion:
- On the first image: The border is problematic, yeah. On Commons non-free photos of PD paintings need to have the frame removed as a 3D frame adds a factor of copyrightability (c.f commons:Template:Non-free frame and relevant section on commons:Commons:When to use the PD-Art tag); the question here is whether the same principle would apply to a cropped photo of a coin; the policy page and linked explanation is not 100% clear.
- On the second image: If by "light effects" you mean the blue-orange colour, I am fairly sure photography machines cannot do that. Image alteration maybe, but that is much more likely to be the plate's original colour. The "non-free frame" point may apply here though.
That's my take, I am open to corrections.Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk, contributions) 16:26, 19 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]
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- Sorry I didn't see this discussion sooner. There are a lot of god reasons for that picture to be included in the article. That hug with Larry Doby is the most famous moment of Gromek's life. It is an early civil rights moment. While I was researching him and added the picture, I mentioned in a baseball discussion group that I was going to add that picture. All were for it. Apparently, none of us saw that this discussion was going on. You google Steve Gromek, you see that image.Johnny Spasm (talk) 19:44, 3 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]
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The result of the discussion was: delete--Ymblanter (talk) 11:41, 8 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- File:WideLoad(Band).jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Footballman9 (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).
Unused personal photo. Cloudbound (talk) 22:38, 30 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]
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File:Widzer joel CV 2006.jpg
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The result of the discussion was: delete--Ymblanter (talk) 11:39, 8 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- File:Widzer joel CV 2006.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Reagan0005 (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).
Unused photo. Looks to be non-free. Cloudbound (talk) 22:40, 30 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]
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File:Widgetbuddies 20080331105747.jpg
File:Wiki-logo.jpg
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The result of the discussion was: delete--Ymblanter (talk) 11:38, 8 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- File:Wiki-logo.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by AmandaMcC (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).
Unused logo, superceded by File:Fiserv logo.svg. Cloudbound (talk) 22:46, 30 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]
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File:Wikipedia's Original Future.jpg
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The result of the discussion was: delete--Ymblanter (talk) 11:36, 8 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- File:Wikipedia's Original Future.jpg (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by Evil Wendy Man (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).
Unused user image. Cloudbound (talk) 22:48, 30 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]
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File:SNLROMNEY2016.png
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The result of the discussion was: Delete; deleted by Explicit (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT⚡ 03:02, 9 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- File:SNLROMNEY2016.png (delete | talk | history | links | logs) – uploaded by LavaBaron (notify | contribs | uploads | upload log).
Used in the popular cutlure section, this image is essentially illustrating a single point of trivia. The relevance of this image and its associated trivia is a minor detail in the article. Whpq (talk) 23:49, 30 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- Keep image illustrates a major, critical moment in the popular zeitgeist; further context on fair use rationale in image description LavaBaron (talk) 00:19, 1 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- Remove: Omitting the image would not significantly undermine the reader's understanding of what's said: "Jason Sudekis made a guest appearance portraying Mitt Romney", and as such fails WP:NFCC#8. To LavaBaron: contextual significance needs to be established within the article and its text. The image description page is there to help this process (WP:NFCC#10), but currently its relevant section - Purpose of use in article - offers very little such reassurance. – Finnusertop (talk ⋅ contribs) 22:53, 1 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]
- Remove. Not essential to the reader's understanding of the topic of "Mitt Romney's March 3 speech". A reader's understanding of this real-life speech would not be negatively affected if an image of the SNL sketch was removed. Moreover, even if the topic of this article was the SNL sketch itself, a still of two guys in suits doesn't "significantly increase readers' understanding of the article topic". As such, fails WP:NFCC#8 any way you look at it. ~ RobTalk 12:31, 8 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]
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