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What if we added something like the following:
Conflicts of interest
Administrators who choose to edit topics where they have a financial conflict of interest, or a conflict of interest arising from employment or personal relationships, should follow the guideline and disclose their external interest, and submit edits on that topic for prior review via talk page proposals for existing articles or through WP:AfC for new articles. They may, like any other conflicted editor, revert vandalism or make noncontroversial corrections on those topics.
With regard to paid editing:
- In their RfA opening statement, candidates should disclose if they have edited for pay in any capacity, to ensure that this is discussed as part of the community deliberation.
- If someone who is already an administrator wishes to begin editing for pay commercially or on behalf of their employer (for example, someone at a university who is asked by their supervisor to keep content about the university updated as part of their work), they should obtain consensus for that activity at WP:AN before they commence doing it, and should abide by the close of that discussion. There is no need for an administrator to obtain prior consensus before taking on a role as a GLAM or Wikipedian-in-Residence editor but like other such editors they must be mindful not to promote the institution with which they are associated but rather use its resources to further Wikipedia's mission.
- An administrator must not use their administrative tools as part of any paid editing activity.
Thoughts? This is not an RfC but rather am looking for discussion that might lead to one. The goal here is not to ban paid editing by admins which as we have seen has failed to gain consensus repeatedly, but rather ensuring that this is discussed on a case-by-case basis -- to strike the balance between people being free to do stuff but obtaining and following consensus. There is no doubt that paid editing by admins is controversial -- that the community is divided, and it is just common sense cluefulness in WP to get consensus before starting to do something controversial. But this is something that apparently needs saying... Jytdog (talk) 19:58, 19 December 2017 (UTC)
Any external relationship—personal, religious, political, academic, legal, or financial—is intentionally very broad because it's tempered with "use common sense". When it's being made into a formal policy there's less leeway for common sense, as anyone holding a grudge against any given admin can—and will—claim that their interpretation is the common sense one. Retaining the broad definition has the potential to lead to a situation where practicing Christians could be hauled off to arbcom for writing about churches, or college graduates could be hauled off to arbcom for writing about alumni of the same college. Yes, the cases wouldn't go anywhere, but it would provide a mechanism for sustained harassment whilst still claiming to be acting in good faith, and you know there are at least some people on en-wiki whose minds work like that. ‑ Iridescent 20:43, 19 December 2017 (UTC)
expected to lead by example. The statement of COI for admins, and bullet #2, are the heart of the proposal for people who already have the bit. They are why I proposed this. Bullet #1 is really about establishing a process that is good and looks good; it really isn't necessary as this kind of stuff gets asked about, dug up, and discussed anyway. Bullet #3 is something that if anybody did it they would get pounded on anyway and is really legislating clue. What we should have is the COI thing and bullet #2 and they are why I proposed this. I thought the community was ready for them but perhaps I am wrong.
Point 2 would allow some admins to do paid editing and I am completely against that., this is just an odd thing to write, as any admin can start editing today for pay. There is no bar to that and to be frank I doubt there ever will be one. What Point 2 does is put some structure around that, and make that a case-by-case thing. Jytdog (talk) 17:06, 20 December 2017 (UTC)
The stuff below is copied from my evidence at the current arbcom case including some stuff not there, that I trimmed.
I only add content or modify content with information that is sourced directly from our publications and web-sites, or from accompanying articles.. That diff says that they gave up the bit and they did, but they asked for it back in Nov 2009 log). I think nobody cares as their activity has been so limited.
I have a WP:COI with this subject as well- "the subject" was Alex Zhavoronkov who is here in WP as Biogerontology as disclosed by that person earlier in that thread in this diff and elswhere, here. TParis disclosed on 10 Sept 2013 at the DYK nomination for Dennis Lo, here, that
Full disclosure: I was paid by a friend of the subject to write this article. However, this DYK nomination was an afterthought and not part of our agreement and done in good faith for the encyclopedia., and TParis also disclosed here on 5 Nov 2013,
Dennis Lo was written by me and published by someone else who paid me for it.. The Dennis Lo article was indeed created by user Biogerontology. I'll note that TParis has a section on their userpage about the hounding they received due to that disclosure. That hounding is a bad thing.
The purpose of laying that out, is to show that while the community cannot agree on a policy about advanced privileges and paid editing in abstract discussions, the issue is controversial, and there are a few (only a few) instances of admins editing for pay commercially, and all of those involved people not disclosing they were doing it when they got the bit, or started afterwards.
Also I did a search of RfA for "paid" and have looked through the results. here is what i found.
It is something frequently brought up in the questions - for example (these are links to whole RfAs - just search for "paid") asking what they think about paid editing and how to manage it, eg. here, here, and here, sometimes asking if the person ever edited for pay here. Saying that you are not opposed to paid editing, is not a death sentence, per this one and this one and this one. Although, in this one a relatively inexperienced editor had a userbox supporting paid editing (Template:Paid editing supporter) (added here) , and the those two things - inexperience + this support for paid editing, gave several "opposes" pause. Mostly failed due to inexperience/youth... I think.
Paid editing was extensively discussed in the questions at one of the most recent RfAs.
That is what i found. Jytdog (talk) 21:15, 19 December 2017 (UTC)
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The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion. Hereby I claim creation of page Template:Z (now salted) for chemical elements, WP:ELEMENTS, usage. This is not to open debate, this is to claim the name (first by date). Wiki usefulness?: it is to be used as the template that provides chemical element properties. Like: identities, wikilinks, chemical & physical properties, external links, and more. (today, those are done through sub-optimal things like Template:Infobox element/pronunciation/format &tc.). Z is the symbol for atomic number, the main organising principle of the periodic table. WT:ELEMENTS is a very active project/community and has produced 88% out of 121 elements being FA/GA. Expect creation & content for template:Z in a few weeks. RHaworth. -DePiep (talk) 19:59, 30 January 2018 (UTC)
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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From:
Right now I'm trying to make a list of discussion points that came up in these areas that either lack clear policy definition, or there were conflicting opinions regarding. Feel free to add to the list. This is not a vote, straw poll, rfc, or anything of the like. As usual, anyone is welcome to open an RfC as they wish. Please feel free to add to this list. — xaosflux Talk 17:05, 30 December 2017 (UTC)
Related: Wikipedia talk:Requests for adminship/Harrias 2#Removal from Category:Successful requests for adminship. --Guy Macon (talk) 01:00, 1 January 2018 (UTC)
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Based on the above proposal and leaving out point number 2. Should we do the following?
Under "Becoming an administrator" after the 2nd paragraph as a separate paragraph include:
"Administrator candidates must disclose in their RfA whether they have ever edited for pay."
And under "Misuse of administrative tools" as the 3rd sentence in the 1st paragraph, include
"Administrators may never use administrative tools as part of any paid editing activity, except when they are acting as a Wikipedian-in-Residence, or the payment is made by the Wikimedia Foundation or an affiliate of the WMF."
Smallbones(smalltalk) 22:44, 20 December 2017 (UTC)
I have, in the past, said I feel that paid editing and adminship do not mix. At least now, well over a year since I last looked at Wikipedia, there seems to be a solid consensus that admins can not be paid for admin action. Now we just need to get people to recognize that the admin bit is monetizable not just because of the tools but because of the actual and perceived authority they wield from the explicit endorsement of the community that a successful RfA brings. To me it is a 'God or Mammon' thing. Jbh Talk 03:53, 21 December 2017 (UTC)