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I'm in the process of finding and adding cites, and removing spurious "Fact" tags.
El - ironically enough, you will need to cite some of your counterclaims.
Speaking of counterclaims - I have moved some of your material (excellent as it was) to the media bias article, and provided a link to it. It seems more appropriate to link to extensive (heh) counterarguments than to have them in each and every article to which they arguably apply.
Mitchberg 12:53, 29 July 2006 (UTC)
This page, as it stands now, is making assertions but sourcing none of them. It appears an attempt to write history via personal research and opinion, which is not valid for a Wikipedia entry. If the claims made are not substantiated, they will be (rightly) removed. I have entered two paragraphs of text sourced to David Halberstam's The Powers That Be, which is a researched, objective volume with pages of citations and footnotes. I look forward to seeing further objective sources on this page, and to the removal of conjecture. Eleemosynary 10:00, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
Here are some things that are currently "perceived" by some members of society:
Thus, we see the ridiculousness of claiming something is true just because it's "perceived."
Terms such as "perceived liberal bias" are torn right from the pages of shabby journalism. They attempt to state opinion as fact, and are not encyclopedic. A similar tactic is "some people say," a cheap attempt to lend credence to an unproven assertion via an anonymous, nonexistent chorus.
Please demonstrate, via legitimate sources, who is making the claim that a liberal bias exists in the media. "Perceived" is an unproven assertion, and will be removed as unencyclopedic. Eleemosynary 10:39, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
Mitchberg, your straw man arguments and personal attacks will be ignored. No doubt you'd like anyone who disagreed with you to "recuse" themselves from this topic. It's not going to happen. For someone who claims to be a member of a "movement" to then ask that someone else not edit the page because that person is "too close" to it is amusing in its irony, though.
You're not going to get away with stating something something is "perceived" in an encyclopedia article and leaving it at that. You're going to need to back up your claims with sourced references. Wikipedia does not allow personal research, no matter how strongly one believes he is saying. Back up your claims.
As for keeping things "informative rather than partisan," no, you don't. You are trying to draw direct causality between the actions of bloggers in your "movement" (many of whom, it seems, are your colleagues and friends) and the outcome of American and Canadian elections, among other events. It's grandstanding. It's cheerleading. And, unless you can show an independent news source demonstrating it, it's not encyclopedic, and will be removed. (But I suppose, by the tortured conspiracy you're suggesting, the "liberal media" would do anything to undermine anything a conservative blogger did. Seems like a pretty self-fulfilling prophecy: If you can't find a news article, hey, that's just another example of the evil liberal media).
As for substantiating "the existence of God," you're making a straw man argument. All one would need to do is show an independent news article or historical text showing that people who believe in God did indeed exist for it to merit encyclopedic inclusion. Not too hard to come by. But thanks for drawing an analogy between the existence of your "movement," and the existence of God. It's a succinct example of unhinged hyperbole that will be helpful in future disputes.
You're in serious pot/kettle territory with your accusations of nonobjectivity. Not a new Wikipedia occurrence, to be sure. I don't "demand" anything; Wikipedia's guidelines demand that someone needs to show sourced facts showing that such a "movement" exists from some source other than the self-appointed members of that "movement."
A "movement" is hardly a handful of bloggers and radio hosts declaiming something until they're blue in the face. Wishing won't make it so. "New Media" is a branding slogan that Hewitt has been trying to get off the ground for a few years now. Wikipedia is not an advertising site. Nor is it a chance for the intellectual heirs of Spiro Agnew to rewrite history.
I'll be continuing to edit this page. Expect counterpoint. Eleemosynary 20:07, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
...I know the bar for ethics on Wikipedia is vanishingly low, but is it common practice to copy and paste entire sections of existing Wikipedia articles without attribution?
"Eleemonysary" pasted the following into this article:
Compare that with the first three paragraphs in Fairness Doctrine.
I know that "Rules" on Wikipedia are merely suggestions, but this seems a little squishy.
Mitchberg 13:20, 29 July 2006 (UTC)
There are many WP:ATT, WP:POV and WP:OR problems with this article, but I stuck to fixing what I felt were general copy-editing fixes. I cut out some significant portions, and you can find these cuts and my rational in Talk:Alternative media (U.S. political right)/cutting_room_floor. Here's a diff of all my changes. My re-write of the lead is an attempt to make it more neutral, but I might have over-done it. Please keep in mind, though I have views on this subject, I tried not to make those views a part of my copy-editing. Caveat emptor. --Otheus 23:14, 1 April 2007 (UTC)
Apologies in advance, I've only got time right now for a quick comment & question. I stumbled on this article more or less by accident; however, "the media", both mainstream & alternative, is a subject I am knowledgeable about. (PS - "media" is plural, NOT singular.)
First the quick comment: the new, rewritten intro, as it stands, is quite simply... absurd. In no way is it correct to say that "Alternative media" ... "is [sic] rooted in the conservative movement's presumption..." etc., etc. Psssst: the "Alternative media" (as we currently use the term) are fundamentally an outgrowth of left-wing dissent, dating largely to the underground press of the 1960s. At least the older version of the intro, whatever its flaws, made better sense in that regard. I would take a stab at re-editing the intro, but...
There's a much larger question that needs to be addressed. To wit: what exactly is properly meant by the term "Alternative media (U.S. political right)"?? As far as I'm concerned, right-wing talk radio is itself a large segment of the mainstream media, so how does it possibly qualify as "Alternative media"? I could go on, but I'm not sure there's much left to the notion of "Alternative media (U.S. political right)" once talk radio is taken out of the picture -- possibly not even enough to merit an article, though I'm reserving judgement on that.
Okay, gotta run now. I'll check back for responses in the next day or two. Cgingold 08:01, 16 April 2007 (UTC)
Why isn't this just called "right-wing media in the United States" or something like that?Prezbo (talk) 02:12, 19 May 2010 (UTC)
Since Alternative press (U.S. political right) and Alternative media (U.S. political right) deal with very closely related topics, I see no reason why we can't merge them into one article; that would be less redundant. Stonemason89 (talk) 00:47, 11 June 2010 (UTC)
This article lists not a single paper or magazine. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.227.157.66 (talk) 14:10, 19 June 2014 (UTC)
It seems this TP has no recent activity on it. If anyone sees this, I think it's a good idea to remove Fox News, as they are obviously not defined as alternative media in WP's definition, or any.--Intellectual Property Theft (talk) 01:59, 10 August 2018 (UTC)
Can anyone find sources for The Alternative Media Outlets section of this article? There's nothing in the article as of right now verifying that these outlets are alternative right-wing media. I'll try to collect some sources when I have free time, but I thought I would ask here in case anyone else can start bolstering the list with citations.
And I have a question: I know Wikipedia is not a place for WP:ORIGINAL research, but if a media outlet is to be added, does a source need to call that media outlet "alternative" (and also politically "right"-leaning) for it to be included on this list? I assume so, so I just wanted to point it out on the talkpage so that people can discuss here if they agree/disagree. Because I would suspect then that most of these outlets cannot be included, since it seems like maybe a lot of the media is added as WP:SYNTHESIS. - Whisperjanes (talk) 17:12, 5 March 2020 (UTC)
Where is the list of U.S. political right alt news online programs and podcasts? There are nearly 2 dozen listed under /Alternative_media_(U.S._political_left). If we can ignore the question of what news is accurate or fakenews for a moment, let's remember it's important to have a depository of the alt news sites influencing the right. We need to know what others are thinking to have a functioning democracy. I would suggest including a list with the likes of:
Breitbart News The Daily Wire The Hill Ben Shapiro Sargon of Akkad Dave Rubin Stefan Molyneux Milo Laura Southern
and yes, even Alex Jones' notorious Infowars.
Thoughts or criticisms?
100.15.100.48 (talk) 23:12, 15 July 2021 (UTC)
"McCormick family newspapers (particularly the Chicago Tribune) remained staunchly conservative until the late 1960s" A bare few paragraphs later your article states the Chicago Tribune remained conservative until the late 1980s. "After Nixon's resignation and until the late 1980s, overtly conservative news outlets included the editorial pages of The Wall Street Journal, the Chicago Tribune, the New York Post and The Washington Times." Seems someone is trying really hard to push an agenda. 2600:8801:BE28:A800:8B7:2C3E:74C8:F3A9 (talk) 18:39, 24 May 2024 (UTC)