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Text and/or other creative content from this version of Mohammad bin Salman was copied or moved into Human rights in Saudi Arabia with this edit on 23:31, 19 April 2018 (UTC). The former page's history now serves to provide attribution for that content in the latter page, and it must not be deleted as long as the latter page exists. |
If there is a specific, ongoing, NPOV dispute that justifies the tag on the front page then this should be made clear on this page or else the tag should be removed. 152.91.9.115 (talk) 22:53, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
"Implementation of a government resolution supporting expanded employment opportunities for women met resistance from within the labor ministry[3], from the religious police [4], and from the male citizenry[5]." the links doesn't exist i hope someone bring the References or it will be deleted and not from memri because it's famous for being anti-arabArabian soul 15:57, 18 August 2007 (UTC)
"Foreigners are forced to conform to Muslim practices in public, ..." It is only a reasonable courtesy to the Muslim people to refrain from smoking, eating, and drinking in public during Ramadan. Is this so unreasonable? From sun up to sundown, these people go without food or other refreshments. To partake of these in front of them is truly unfair. It's just typical western (especially American) arrogance to say that you are being forced to accept another culture's practices when you are merely being asked to behave decently and responsibly in a foreign culture. --LesAldridge 21:11, 25 Jan 2005 (UTC)
You are advocating their strict laws which is irrelevant to the article which simply states that the laws are strict. Whether the law is justified is out of the scope of the article but to call a spade a spade it is in fact humar rights violation not to allow basic needs such as eating or drinking no matter how obsessed the subjects of the country are in keeping with their traditions. It's simply the lack of choice that renders it so, because the locals choose to starve but the foreigners are forced to eat and drink in hiding. All countries have traditions but none of the developed ones force these traditions upon the foreigners. You would be allowed for instance to consume meat during fasting period in a Western country. The article therefore stands correct that foreigners are forced to conform (because they do) and there is absolutely nothing inaccurate about it. - Nick 15/07/06 15:20 GMT
"... this place is worse than the past Taliban Controlled Afganistan ..." In what way is it worse? Hotter in summer? Yes. More sand? Yes.
But, to say this has a worse human rights record than the Taliban is patently nonsense. The writer does not make any attributable references to prove this crazy assertion. Has the writer spent any time, as I have, in Saudi Arabia? While Saudi Arabia does have a poor human rights record, especially in it's treatment of women, overall it is far freer than the Taliban regime. --LesAldridge 21:19, 25 Jan 2005 (UTC)
I agree with LesAldridge, that it is quite simply a lie to say that Saudi Arabia is worse than Taliban-ruled Afghanistan. If that were the case, why are there tens of thousands of Westerners and other foreigners currently living there? Many foreigners, including Westerners, have lived in Saudi Arabia for decades. While I will not deny that Saudi Arabia has a poor human rights record, it is not nearly as bad a place as JoeHenzi alleges it to be. I know this for a fact as I lived there for several years.
"It is absurd ..." Crown Prince Abdullah ... in New York City, New York on 6 September.
But which year? --Liberatus 23:17, 10 July 2005 (UTC)
I don't know where the writer found that Saudi Arabia prohibits Satellite TV. I'm a saudi arabian living in Saudi Arabia, the goverment itself airs four diffrent satellite channels. Burning phoneix 09:24, 2 May 2006 (UTC)
I have also lived in Saudi Arabia and I'm of South Asian descent. Satellite dishes are commonplace and people watch channels from the South Asian subcontinent without penalty. (UTC)
Please clean up the introduction. Seperate your run-on sentences. Should the West be discussed in the first or second line? Does that represent a worldwide view? I don`t mean to reprimand or anything, but I`m honestly not sure where that stands with Wikipedia policy. Also I doubt ``The Muslim World`` supports SA completely, as laws in the Muslim world are generally far more lax than to justify that sweeping statement. (Jiggssaw)
The testimony of a woman is not regarded as fact but as presumption. The reasons women are forbidden to testify in criminal proceedings are (quote):
No source is given for this quote. Also references 1-4 lead to unavailable pages. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Bakashi10 (talk • contribs) 14:11, 12 May 2007 (UTC).
Here is a source: http://www.jeansasson.com/LawandGovernment.htm just do a google source.
P.S. sorry i'm not very good at editing wikipedia :( 68.104.246.73 18:59, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
Here are two more sources i found that looked pretty good: http://everything2.com/index.pl?node_id=1286471 and http://www.yourish.com/2006/10/23/2176 68.104.246.73 22:05, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
“ | ... the testimony of a woman is not regarded as fact but rather as presumption. The court may decide whether the testimony is valid according to the circumstances.
Why Women Are Forbidden to Testify in Criminal Proceedings There are four reasons given why women's testimony is not valid in a Saudi court: 1. Women are much more emotional than men and will, as a result of their emotions, distort their testimony. 2. Women do not participate in public life, so they will not be capable of understanding what they observe. 3. Women are dominated completely by men, who by the grace of God are deemed superior; therefore, women will give testimony according to what the last man told them. 4. Women are forgetful and their testimony cannot be considered reliable. |
” |
Thank you--Victor falk 21:42, 22 July 2007 (UTC)
To discuss the proposed merge please go to Talk:Allegations_of_Saudi_Arabian_apartheid#Proposal Lothar of the Hill People 02:41, 9 August 2007 (UTC)
What are we talking about here? Physical capability? Or actual knowledge? I doubt the latter since you don't learn to drive without practice. So unless someone brings some reference for that (and possibly even: how) women learn to drive, I'll delete the phrase. (It's already marked with "citation needed", but those tend to be in articles forever before anything ever happens...)
As for apartheid, I don't see any reason for having that section in its current form: It's some odd assortment of different topics, partly already covered in other sections of the article. And I simply don't see what informational value it has whether something is called "apartheid" (or "holocaust" or whatever). What interests is, in my opinion, whether the human rights are infringed (which they seem to be here) rather than what somehow calls that. If anyone believes that the section on women somehow profits from adding that this is considered apartheid--feel free to add it there. Else I would simply delete that part and all that talks about "apartheid" and rename the entire section "Religious and ethnic minorities".
I feel that the first section is actually an intro to the article, so I'd like to delete the section header (so that the section becomes the article intro). If someone has objections, please suggest a different header as the current one seems misleading, being identical to the article title--logically, it would suggest that the rest of the article talks about something else.
As always, I'll be happy to hear different views and/or get convinced otherwise, else I wouldn't write these lines.--Ibn Battuta 04:36, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
The article makes a note of literacy between men and women under "Women's rights". What does this have to with women's rights? Women are allowed to learn. If they choose not to because of social circumstances, that is deplorable, but it is not like their rights are being violated. Bless sins (talk) 19:37, 20 April 2008 (UTC)
In terms of human rights, in some aspects Saudi Arabia is more dictatorial and backward than North Korea (in Kim Jong Il’s tragic kingdom, at least formally, there is an elected parliament, political parties, secularism, freedom of religion and equality between men and women).
The fact that sometimes Saudi Arabia appears “more modern” or “beginning to achieve political openess” is because the country has a very good international PR, and it has always been one of the “staunch allies” of oil-hungry United States (first, against “Godless Communism”, after 1991 against “Middle East Instability”, and after 2001, against “International Islamic Terrorism”).
I know the declaration above is POV, but anyway, I think that at least some of these aspects could be included in a NPOV way inside the article.
I'm not sure if the politics and government template should be here.
If we look at articles like Human rights in Albania, Human rights in Canada, we see the template is not present. Other articles, though, have it: Human rights in India, Human rights in Turkey. Still others have a totally different template: Human rights in France.
"Human rights" is generally not an article on the template.
Thoughts?
VR talk 18:41, 5 November 2009 (UTC)
Should these two sections be merged?Cptnono (talk) 05:47, 6 March 2010 (UTC)
Beheading is the punishment for sorcerers, apostates, wizards, murderers, rapists, drug traffickers and armed robbers, according to strict interpretation of Islamic law.
In D&D, a wizard studies magic, while a sorcerer casts spells through innate powers, like dragon's blood. I don't think this is what is being referred to. Can we replace both of these with "witchcraft?" In the Christian tradition, a witch is a blasphemous magic-user (no offense to the wiccans, etc.)
Is the use of these two different words a reference to some finer points in Sharia law. I know that fortunetelling is specifically forbidden in Islam, but I don't know which, if either refers to this. I think both sorcerer and wizard are poor word choices for describing blasphemy or what in English is usually called witchcraft.
I think "blasphemy" would be best, since this covers a wide variety of crime from divination to magic missiles... Modinyr (talk) 00:41, 8 August 2011 (UTC)
That was some good editting. Excellent sources, especially Twilight in the Kingdom. Putting Wizards and Sorcery together was a good idea. I'll retract my recomendation of the words witchcraft and blasphemy. My hat is off to you, sir. Modinyr (talk) 22:03, 8 August 2011 (UTC)
A ban on Jews being in Saudi Arabia makes that country an apartheid state, so why not label it what it is, an apartheid state? 198.151.130.37 (talk) 02:01, 26 September 2011 (UTC)
>> Migrant dies in Saudi detention centre riot >> Saudi accepts 181 UN human rights proposals(Lihaas (talk) 18:59, 3 March 2014 (UTC)).
There seems to be a new Saudi human rights organisation, presumably partly based (presumably for security reasons) outside KSA: the European Saudi Society for Human Rights - http://esshright.blogspot.de . If RS's exist, it should be worth an article along with other Saudi human rights organisations. Boud (talk) 23:38, 15 October 2014 (UTC)
You'r likely not going to believe me, but I found an article that states that even the Muslim world actually is disturbed by the public beheadings that occur in Saudi Arabia. Perhaps and article could be made on how the rest of the Muslim world views what goes on in the country. I could be wrong, but I think it's worth mentioning. http://www.vox.com/2015/1/19/7559007/saudi-arabia-punishments — Preceding unsigned comment added by Graylandertagger (talk • contribs) 18:20, 19 January 2015 (UTC)
I just removed a sentence from the article that said that importing Bibles (actually, it said "bibles") into Saudi Arabia or carrying them carried the death penalty due to a newly passed law. This cited a December article in an evangelical Christian web site and a November article in an anti-death-penalty web site, which both derive from a November article in a Christian missionary web site, which says in bold letters at the top, "The information in this article is not confirmed by any official sources," and only says that "[the] government may have imposed new laws requiring the death penalty for the illegal smuggling of Bibles into the country." It, in turn, derived its information from an article in Arabic at CoptsToday, a site for the predominantly-Christian Coptic ethnic minority in Egypt, which, if Google Translate is to be believed, cites a statement which doesn't mention Bibles at all by the Egyptian consulate in Jeddah about a new Saudi law, "الصادر بالمرسوم الملكي رقم م 42 بتاريخ 18/10/1404هـ", and is addressed to Egyptian travelers in Egypt. It would be very helpful if someone who speaks Arabic could tell us what that law actually says. The original missionary-site article now includes a note from a Saudi Arabian Christian explicitly denying this claim, but the other sites have not updated their articles to reflect this.
The human-rights situation in Saudi Arabia is genuinely bad, particularly with respect to freedom of religion, but we should be very careful to avoid the inclusion of this kind of inflammatory falsehood, especially at times like this.
Kragen Javier Sitaker (talk) 21:00, 25 January 2015 (UTC)
would it be more accurate to move this article to "Lack of human rights in Saudi Arabia"? Spacecowboy420 (talk) 11:29, 27 November 2015 (UTC)
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Hello all. The article currently contains a high number of citations to Press TV, an Iranian-state sponsored media outlet that has been deprecated by the community, as it has been shown by editors to publish false and fabricated information, as well as to publish conspiracy theories. I also see at least one citation to RT's youtube account; RT is similarly deprecated by the community. It might take a bit of work to rewrite portions of the article without these sources, but currently it may well be the case that the page contains claims that are not supported by reliable sources. I'm going to remove the items for which I can't find citations to reliable sources, though I want to leave this note here just to explain this before I do so. — Mikehawk10 (talk) 06:23, 27 June 2021 (UTC)
Hello, can you tell me which paragraphs has Press TV or RT sources ? Aziz bm (talk) 04:52, 9 July 2022 (UTC)
The following Wikimedia Commons files used on this page or its Wikidata item have been nominated for deletion:
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An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect Saudi Arabia and the apartheid analogy and has thus listed it for discussion. This discussion will occur at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2022 August 30#Saudi Arabia and the apartheid analogy until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion. Iskandar323 (talk) 10:44, 30 August 2022 (UTC)