< March 2 March 4 >

March 3

Template:Subject bar

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

The result of the discussion was procedural close. I understand the intention of opening this discussion (and this is after all Templates for discussion) but the content is more appropriate for either the template's talk page or a more technically-minded forum such as WP:VPT in order to change the fundamental way this template operates. Primefac (talk) 15:12, 31 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Please read .....My intent is not for out right deletion but rather a remedy to a mobile view problem. This template is not used (seen) in mobile view....that in itself is the norm as portal and book templates are also not seen in mobile view (unless the inline versions are used ;-) 😉). However Wikimedia sister links are always seen as per the Wikimedia Foundation implementation of Sister links templates in mobile view. So when this template is used it hides sister project links to 50% of our readers (those using mobile view) against the foundations intent to have these links seen. We need to fix this problem or come to the realization the template is decrepit. Moxy (talk) 22:26, 3 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

As the author of this template, I agree that it needs to be brought into the modern era, though I lack the time, skills, and motivation to do so. I still think it's worth keeping for how it consolidates so many Wiki links. – Maky « talk » 23:01, 3 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
I am hoping someone can fix it because we have a sh#t load of pages that sister links are not being seen in mobile view. Manually having to convert all these to working templates would be a daunting task for any group of editors. But we can't have so many articles were sister projects are not seen by 50 percent of our readers.--Moxy (talk) 02:20, 4 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
I find the template extremely useful in consolidating the various floating wiki boxes found on so many pages, esp. some of the military ones I have been working on of late. I've seen some pages now where they have both - which is a solution but duplicates content - but that is not really addressing the main issue in fixing the template at source. Would be extremely beneficial to create a solution for this template. Hiding sister sites for a large proportion of readers isn't a great UX. Londonclanger (talk) 17:59, 4 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Greetings, As one of the people who has placed "thousands" of those "Subject bar" templates, here are my thoughts & comments. In my archives (not on WP), I found some of my past research about Subject bar vs. Portal-inline.

And after testing this morning I see how "Mobile view" does not show the Subject bar at all (example Pope Francis article). On Desktop view, subject bar has the advantage of combining portals, and Sister projects into a single unified template.

Going back to the drawing board, (examples Christian Conrad Blouin and Cathedral of San Vicente, El Salvador articles) for Mobile view, placement of Portal-inline into "See also" section makes them visible. Here is the Moble view code example: ((left | ((Portal-inline|Architecture)) ((portal-inline|Catholicism)) ((Portal-inline|El Salvador)) ))((clear)) Note that "Portal bar" template is not visible in Mobile view.

Think your missing the point here...we want all to see them (not just thoses on a PC)...we should not go out of our way to hide theses links from more then 50 percent of our readers. Accessibility is the concern here...template should be fixed or sister links moved to a real template. How something appears in mobile view Is the perfect reason to fix,,,,ignoring is how we got to this point. -- Moxy (talk) 12:12, 8 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Greetings (again) - after my above posting, I modified the Portal-inline example to include the "((dot))" seperator. This is helpful for accessiblity, especially when it appears in mobile view. Here is a "See also" section example.

 · icon Middle Ages portal  · icon Architecture portal  · icon Catholicism portal  · flag El Salvador portal

While this wikicode is lengthy, in my Notepad (plain text) file for Copy-and-paste, I made a plain shell without specific portals. So it's still easy to paste into articles. Cheers! JoeHebda (talk) 19:56, 8 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

If we just remove the navbox class from the module, we get: 

((User:Hawkeye7/Sandbox5|portal1=Biography|portal2=United States Air Force|portal3=United States Marine Corps|portal4=United States Navy|portal5=Spaceflight|commons=y))

Which works on mobile devices. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 21:25, 8 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

User:Hawkeye7 - Good idea. Only thing I noticed in mobile view is that the portal icons do not line up properly in front of each portal name. Is this a one-time change to "Subject bar"? So no need to update the thousands of articles. JoeHebda (talk) 02:38, 9 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
This is the solution !!! great job!!--Moxy (talk) 03:15, 9 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Could someone add the solution to Normandy landings so I can see it in action and also use on other articles? Thx. Londonclanger (talk) 13:03, 9 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
We just have to wait till the posting has run its course and the changes implemented in the template. Then we can restore your version.--Moxy (talk) 15:57, 9 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

Unused Latest stable software release

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

The result of the discussion was delete unused templates, noting that some of them have been put back into use. As a note of full disclosure, I nominated a similar set of templates two years ago; the consensus here is pretty strong, but I will re-open this discussion without prejudice should anyone have issue with that conflict. I will also recuse from deleting any of these templates if/when they are deemed to be deletion-ready. Primefac (talk) 15:27, 31 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Unused custom versions of ((LSR)). If these are needed, they should be called directly from the page, not created as subpages to a redirect. (Note that ((Latest stable software release)) redirects to ((LSR))). --Zackmann (Talk to me/What I been doing) 20:20, 3 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion when that mechanism was introduced appears to be here. The rationale was given as

Currently, because of every "latest software release version change" the whole article has to be changed. If we would make templates (Template:Latest_stable_release/Mozilla_Firefox) and link them like "| ((Latest_stable_release/((PAGENAME))))" in this infobox, the articles aren't edited that often and by "Related changes" there would be a list of new software releases of the last xy days,... Furthermore we wouldn't have to change it in the infobox and the article itself and additionaly on pages like Comparison of web browsers. We just have to place "((Latest_stable_release/xySoftware))". So we could do three things with one edit! --84.156.100.195 16:08, 22 August 2005 (UTC)

If you disagree with that rationale, you might want to consider opening a discussion about this mechanism, to see if you can get it removed. Guy Harris (talk) 09:35, 4 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

Unused Latest preview software release

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

The result of the discussion was delete unused templates, noting that some of them have been put back into use. As a note of full disclosure, I nominated a similar set of templates two years ago; the consensus here is pretty strong, but I will re-open this discussion without prejudice should anyone have issue with that conflict. I will also recuse from deleting any of these templates if/when they are deemed to be deletion-ready. Primefac (talk) 15:29, 31 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Unused custom versions of ((LPR)). If these are needed, they should be called directly from the page, not created as subpages to a redirect. (Note that ((Latest preview software release)) redirects to ((LPR))). --Zackmann (Talk to me/What I been doing) 20:17, 3 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

((Latest preview software release/Microsoft Visual Studio)) is now used; the current stable release information for Microsoft Visual Studio was already in a "Latest stable software release" template, so I did the same for the preview release information. Guy Harris (talk) 20:37, 3 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per my !vote at #Unused Latest stable software release above. ((3x|p))ery (talk) 21:36, 3 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

Unused ISO 639 templates

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

The result of the discussion was delete all but 369-5 as it is a valid name for a redirect. Primefac (talk) 15:07, 24 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

All old, unused attempts to work with ISO 639. This functionality is now widely available via Module:ISO 639. No need for these old templates. --Zackmann (Talk to me/What I been doing) 20:14, 3 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

Unused Hazard/Hazmat Templates

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

The result of the discussion was Delete -FASTILY 05:11, 11 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Unused templates that are just plaintext or imagelinks. No reason for these templates, the text can just be directly inserted when needed. --Zackmann (Talk to me/What I been doing) 20:11, 3 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

Unused Block Templates

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

The result of the discussion was Delete -FASTILY 05:11, 11 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Appear to be an attempt to make tables of special characters? In any case, not used. --Zackmann (Talk to me/What I been doing) 20:08, 3 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

They were used in GB2312 Blocks, part of a (not very good and not very usable) list of GB 2312 characters (old national character encoding of the People's Republic of China). In any case, the information is more easily accessible elsewhere, so delete. —Kusma (t·c) 20:41, 3 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

Unused population database templates

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

The result of the discussion was Delete -FASTILY 05:11, 11 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

All are unused. Not entirely clear where/how they would be used. Appear to be an attempt to bulk store population data. This is what Wikidata is for. Regardless, they are unused. --Zackmann (Talk to me/What I been doing) 20:05, 3 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

Unused CTB Minutes

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

The result of the discussion was Delete -FASTILY 05:11, 11 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Unused custom versions of ((CTB minutes)). If they are needed, should just call ((CTB minutes)) directly from the page in question. No need for custom templates. --Zackmann (Talk to me/What I been doing) 20:00, 3 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

Bs Team Links

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

The result of the discussion was Delete -FASTILY 05:11, 11 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

All are unused plainlinks to pages. Not sure what the point is of having templates for these when a simple link works just fine. --Zackmann (Talk to me/What I been doing) 19:57, 3 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

Rus Links

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

The result of the discussion was Delete -FASTILY 05:11, 11 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

All are unused plainlinks to pages. Not sure what the point is of having templates for these when a simple link works just fine. --Zackmann (Talk to me/What I been doing) 19:53, 3 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

The Hop S-line templates

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

The result of the discussion was delete. (non-admin closure) Zackmann (Talk to me/What I been doing) 21:16, 10 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Single transclusion replaced by Module:Adjacent stations/The Hop. Mackensen (talk) 15:34, 3 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

Template:Infobox air cadet squadron

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

The result of the discussion was delete. (non-admin closure) Zackmann (Talk to me/What I been doing) 21:16, 10 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Unused infobox and unlikely to be needed, articles on indiviudal cadet units do not normally pass notability threshold and consensus at AfD discussions is normally that they are deleted. MilborneOne (talk) 14:02, 3 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

MWC old style railway line templates

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

The result of the discussion was delete. (non-admin closure) Zackmann (Talk to me/What I been doing) 21:17, 10 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Propose deleting. These templates are part of the older system for railway line info based on ((S-line)). Use of that system for this rail network has entirely been replaced by the newer system based on Module:Adjacent stations. These templates are not transcluded anywhere in article space. htonl (talk) 12:54, 3 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

Template:Infobox FBI Ten Most Wanted

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

The result of the discussion was relisted on 2019 March 24. Primefac (talk) 15:01, 24 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

Template:Infobox former subdivision

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).

The result of the discussion was no consensus. There are a few points of contention, one being the typical concern that combining two templates together will create a franken-template that will be harder to maintain than the two separate ones. While this is usually not enough to cause a template merger to fail, in this particular case two factors play in to do just that. First, the parameters of ((infobox former subdivision)) are (as mentioned in the first oppose) much more similar to those of ((infobox country)) than ((infobox settlement)). Second, there is the debate about whether an article on a "subdivision" should have a template for a "settlement" on it. We can debate syntax, definitions, and "current common uses" until the end of time, but point in hand there are more people who feel that this merger causes more problems (semantically) than it fixes. There is no prejudice against a renomination if the merger target is ((infobox country)) (in fact, I'd probably encourage it, given the similarities), but a discussion may be necessary beforehand to minimise the amount of debate about the exact definitions and usage of the templates. Primefac (talk) 23:28, 3 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Propose merging Template:Infobox former subdivision with Template:Infobox settlement.
I'm curious as the whether it makes sense to simply merge this to Infobox Settlement. it seems like the majority of parameters overlap. The few that don't can quite easily be added. Zackmann (Talk to me/What I been doing) 07:30, 19 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Pigsonthewing Please clarify how the first argument is "wikt:bogus reasoning". So far, it is only unqualified drive-by judging, not adding an argument.
Re your partial quote from documentation. For starters, by template names, "settlement" pertains to "settlements", and "country" pertains to "countries". Probably this documentation detail is substandard, and not a normative point anyway just descriptive especially not re other templates. In this guideline (i.e., a much tougher policy), it says "country subdivisions (states or provinces), such as States of Austria, ...", the link redirecting to Administrative division, which to me very clearly and flawlessly says it is about country organisation, not settlement features. -DePiep (talk) 14:11, 20 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
"only unqualified drive-by judging" I believe you've been warned before, more than once, about making unwarranted insinuations of bad faith against fellow editors. Desist. Andy Mabbett (); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 23:49, 21 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Pigsonthewing "unqualified" is a judgement of the argument you used (while accusing another editor of being illogical without base, so far). So please reply. -DePiep (talk) 05:40, 22 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Now stuffing all parameters and formatting and layout and priorities for two different concepts into one template does not help anyone. It's good enough to use similar parameters (like population number), but that does not mean they should be applied the same (eg, order position in the infobox). There is no need to do so, it only leads to compromises that are unhelpful for the reader (and also confusing for the article editor having to trawl scores of parameters with wide descriptions & limitations; and that is when the documentation is up to date & complete). What is the end? One "universal" infobox for the whole of enwiki, and let the editor search?
The notice that 'documentation says so' and 'it's being used like that' is not an argument, but a bug. Why would a province be primarilly described as a settlement? Why would a cross-border metropolitan area (=settlement) be primarilly tied to a single country?
The opposite, an example. I work with templates ((Infobox drug)), ((Chembox)), ((Infobox element)). All for chemicals, and no one seriously wants to merge them. That is because sure there are similar parameters (think, in a Venn diagram), but design requirements are different by concept (e.g., for a drug, chemical poperties are way less important so are below). -DePiep (talk) 10:13, 29 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Infobox country, Infobox settlement, Infobox former subdivision - each is meant for a territorial entity. The differences are small. In the case of the latter, it is only adding information about the end of the entity. There is only Template:Infobox person, no Template:Infobox former person. 78.55.20.3 (talk) 20:39, 4 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Usage of infobox templates for articles in Category:Administrative territorial entities
Namespace Category:Administrative territorial entities by type Category:Former administrative territorial entities (Current) Category:Proposed administrative territorial entities
Category Category:Countries Category:Former countries Category:Proposed countries
Template ((Infobox country)) ((Infobox country)) ((Infobox country)) ((Infobox country))
Category Category:Country subdivisions Category:Former subdivisions of countries Category:Proposed country subdivisions
Template ((Infobox settlement)) Two infoboxes are used:

((Infobox former subdivision)) - less than 1800 transclusions[1]
((Infobox settlement)) - at least 79 calls by other templates (wrappers cf. Category:Templates calling Infobox settlement), ca. 500 000 transclusions

((Infobox settlement)) ((Infobox settlement))

77.13.148.190 (talk) 16:54, 5 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Discussion for this seems to still be ongoing.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Steel1943 (talk) 21:17, 6 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Plastikspork ―Œ(talk) 00:12, 20 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Perhaps it is a generic bug but I've never seen it before. What I see is

Russ   The template infobox former subdivision is being considered for merging. <cr> sian America (Russian: Русская Америка, Russkaya Amerika) was the name of the Russian colonial possessions ...

I had hoped that the problem arose because of the way that someone had tagged the template. I guess you are saying that this is not the case and that it is just unfortunate collateral damage? --John Maynard Friedman (talk) 20:01, 28 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Tested that page on mobile with Android OS with Chrome browser and I see the page correctly. --Gonnym (talk) 20:05, 28 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Final relist
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Hhkohh (talk) 03:51, 3 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
So I fail to understand why this is even a debate. CLEARLY a former subdivision can be covered by settlement. --Zackmann (Talk to me/What I been doing) 21:09, 16 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review).
More