[[[1]]]

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White House architectural plan

Reason

High resolution file of an architectural design for an early expansion upon an important structure. Restored version of File:Latrobe White House.jpg.

Articles this image appears in

White House, Benjamin Henry Latrobe

Creator

Benjamin Henry Latrobe

• Support as nominator --Durova^Charge! 05:26, 23 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support - good ev, high quality image. I'd love to see later ones as well showing the progression from this to it's current appearance if anyone has those... Gazhiley (talk) 11:30, 23 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment Only the first floor?--HereToHelp ^{(talk to me)} 13:29, 23 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • My understanding of the caption's description "Principal Storey" means just that - it's for the first floor... As the nom's description states this was due to a planned extension - if it was only affecting one floor it would only include one floor... Ronseal? Gazhiley (talk) 16:38, 23 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
    • This is the equivalent of the current State Floor, which includes the Blue Room, Red Room, Green Room, and State Dining Room. This can be determined by the doorways at the north and south porticos, which today are on the State Floor. Note: When viewing the South Portico, this would be considered the "second" floor. The ground floor exits directly to the blacktop drive on this side. On the north side, this floor would be considered the "ground" floor. ~ ωαdεstεr16_«talk^stalk» 04:20, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment Of the 211 architectural designs by Benjamin Henry Latrobe in the Library of Congress's collection, only a tiny number are available in high resolution digitized format. The restoration on this one took several days' labor. I've also been working on a 118.9MB .tif file of his presentation for the United States Capitol. It suffered much more extensive damage and I've been reconstructing sections of the facade. After 35 hours' labor on the other image I realized that restoration was only half finished, so turned to this. It would be wonderful if LoC scanned all the Latrobe material at high resolution. By featuring one or two, perhaps we could persuade them to do more. Durova^Charge! 23:21, 23 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Lovely — use it on 20 January 2009. Cheers, Jack Merridew 06:10, 24 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Weren't there plans for a Barack Obama FP to be used? Spencer^{Merry Christmas!} 20:50, 24 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
    • Yes, Barack Obama will be the FP that day. Durova^Charge! 21:03, 24 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support. Nice restoration and an interesting subject that a historical floorplan adds a lot of EV to. Diliff | (Talk) (Contribs) 23:40, 29 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Intothewoods29 (talk) 23:52, 29 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Weak Oppose because it sounds like Hoban not Latrobe designed the actual porticos, making it unclear what if anything this design was used for. I'm not sure I want to feature this picture if it was not a design that was actually used (though it is still pretty interesting). Fletcher (talk) 02:57, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment - I very much want to support this for its exceptional EV and high quality (and I will if I get a clear answer), but I'm wondering what's going on:
  1. Latrobe's article states he designed the east and west colonnades, but I'm not aware of east and west colonnades on the White House. I thought the only colonnades were the north and south ones (which are labeled as porticos, but the stacks of columns supporting the porticos are colonnades). I'm assuming these colonnades (porticos) are those shown in the images at right, the north and south porticos of the White House. Now if that's the case, the article needs changing (and referencing).
  2. If Latrobe did only design the colonnades, then this image is misleading b/c the caption implies that he designed the architectural plan, even if he is the creator of this blueprint. I think that should be mentioned in the caption.
  3. Also, as much as I like the image, I'm well aware that it is not the current floor plan of the first floor of the White House. Being the case, this should be mentioned in the caption so it is clear that this was either overridden, or possibly replaced (maybe the destruction during War of 1812? - I can't see the Truman renovations completely changing the floor plan, but maybe?).

Granted this will need a long caption to be complete. But on that note, I'd like to see what FPC reviewers have to say about captions by commenting here. ~ ωαdεstεr16_«talk^stalk» 04:20, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I believe the Colonnades, in this context, refer to the structures now connecting the main building (Executive Residence) to the East and West Wings. (The colonnades Latrobe did preceded the two wings; the White House article says they were used for utilitarian purposes like laundry and stables.) See diagram here. Fletcher (talk) 23:52, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• Support, but it's huge. Wonderful find, and it looks great. But why is it 23 MB? Surely it could be a small fraction of that without any noticeable quality loss.--ragesoss (talk) 04:22, 1 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Promoted File:Latrobe White House cropa2.jpg --Wronkiew (talk) 04:21, 1 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

A Brush for the Lead

Reason

In the holiday spirit and the lyrics of "Sleigh Ride", we can nearly be like a picture print by Currier and Ives. Best wishes, whatever it is that you celebrate. Restored version of File:Brush for the lead.jpg.

Articles this image appears in

Sleigh Ride, Currier and Ives

Creator

Currier and Ives

• Support as nominator --Durova^Charge! 08:00, 24 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Marvellous. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 16:46, 24 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Strong Support Awesome image. Good EV. Season's greetings! Makeemlighter (talk) 22:31, 24 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Very clear lines/good resolution and a good pic :) Orderinchaos 23:14, 24 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support However, the description under "Other versions" should be changed to "This is a restored version of File:Brush for the lead.jpg. To generate the present version the original was rotated and cropped, dirt and scratches removed, depigmented areas replaced, histogram adjusted, and desaturated." The current text implies that the other version is the restored one.StN (talk) 06:20, 25 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Promoted File:Brush for the lead2.jpg --Wronkiew (talk) 05:11, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Waldorf-Astoria Hotel, original site

Reason

A depiction of the original (destroyed) Waldorf-Astoria Hotel, New York City. Restored version of File:Waldorf-Astoria 1904-1908.jpg.

Articles this image appears in

The Waldorf-Astoria Hotel, Joseph Pennell

Creator

Joseph Pennell

• Support as nominator --Durova^Charge! 20:48, 24 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Strong Support Another excellent image. Strong EV in two articles. Makeemlighter (talk) 22:32, 24 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose - IMO the image does not have a lot of EV in either article. A sketchy, perhaps smudged drawing of a building does not effectively illustrate how the building used to look. As for the Joseph Pennell article, I believe the other image on the page (of the Bond ad) is much more valuable since it is mentioned in the article and reflects on of the things Pennell is known for. Also, Pennell (according to the article) spent a lot of his time and did a lot of his work in San Francisco, not New York, which is where the hotel is located. Yes, some of these flaws can be attributed to the stubby article, but I don't think it has "strong EV in two articles" at all. Intothewoods29 (talk) 00:07, 27 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Can you find any other image of the original Waldorf-Astoria? Much less one at this resolution? Durova^Charge! 01:31, 27 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • I feel it has EV in The Waldorf-Astoria Hotel since it shows the original hotel. Sure, it doesn't have the kind of detail you'd find in a photograph, but the picture definitely gives a sense of the magnificence of the original building. It has EV in Joseph Pennell since it represents his work as an illustrator. Makeemlighter (talk) 06:28, 27 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support - partly for its EV, partly because I like the medium. Xavexgoem (talk) 01:38, 27 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support - per Xavexgoem, excellent image. Epson291 (talk) 17:30, 31 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support. An excellent composition in an under-represented medium, well-restored, that has sufficient EV and is well-used in both articles.--ragesoss (talk) 04:17, 1 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Promoted File:Waldorf-Astoria 1904-1908b.jpg --Wronkiew (talk) 05:20, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The Adoration of the Magi

Reason

Very encyclopedic image.

Articles this image appears in

Adoration of the Magi (tapestry)

Creator

Designed by Edward Burne Jones with details by William Morris and John Henry Dearle

• Support as nominator --Bewareofdog 18:18, 24 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose blurred on left hand side. --Leivick (talk) 21:41, 24 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose Blurred on left, cut off on top. Makeemlighter (talk) 22:25, 24 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Not promoted --Wronkiew (talk) 05:21, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Ukiyo-e dragon

Reason

Dragon. Japanese woodcut. Dark and mysterious and fearsome. Also a high resolution file in good condition. Restored version of File:Ukiyo-e dragon.jpg.

Articles this image appears in

Dragon, Woodcut

Creator

unknown

• Support as nominator --Durova^Charge! 00:25, 25 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Good restoration. Question: Is it me, or does this appear to be slightly tilted? Spencer^T♦C 17:30, 27 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • A lot of older works have borders angles that are slightly off from true 90 degrees. So rotating to get one edge at horizontal or vertical leaves the others tilted. Cropping and rotating these things is an act of compromise. Durova^Charge! 19:35, 27 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support per Spencer Noodle snacks (talk) 00:46, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose. Made some time over a 150-year span (the main period over which ukiyo-e developed stylistically) by an unknown artist... there just isn't enough known about it to properly contextualize it. For me, it lacks sufficient encyclopedic value.--ragesoss (talk) 04:11, 1 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose I agree with Ragesoss: this just doesn't have the EV to be featured. Makeemlighter (talk) 05:33, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Not promoted --Noodle snacks (talk) 09:18, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Housefly mating

Reason

Good quality image depicting an important part of the life cycle of the fly.

Articles this image appears in

Housefly

Creator

Muhammad

• Support as nominator --Muhammad(talk) 18:56, 25 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support original Disgusting. Durova^Charge! 19:31, 25 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support original and Durova's input. ~ ωαdεstεr16_«talk^stalk» 18:48, 27 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support - For its obvious EV and despite the less than optimal lighting -- Alvesgaspar (talk) 21:49, 27 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support What is it they are on, the top of a fence or something? I'd prefer a more natural (romantic?) setting, but it's still a quality, encyclopedic photo. Fletcher (talk) 23:07, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • They are on top of a metal wire which is used to hang clothes to dry. Muhammad(talk) 06:16, 31 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Weak Oppose lighting isn't flattering, it isn't particularly sharp and the background is noisy (which is pretty easily treatable via selective NR). EV is good per above though. Noodle snacks (talk) 09:39, 1 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Promoted Image:Housefly mating.jpg --Noodle snacks (talk) 09:21, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Alstroemeria aurantiaca

Reason

One of the better known species in the Alstroemeria genus. It replace a poorer quality taxobox image of the same species in the article. Shows the typical arrangement of flowers for this species. This isn't the same image or species as my previous unsuccessful Alstroemeria nomination.

Articles this image appears in

Alstroemeria

Creator

Noodle snacks

• Support as nominator --Noodle snacks (talk) 13:50, 25 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Another good one. Focus, framing, depth of field. Well done. Durova^Charge! 19:33, 25 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Very nice. Excellent quality specimens too. ~ ωαdεstεr16_«talk^stalk» 19:44, 25 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Exceptional focus on all flowers and good details. Good replacement over the old picture. Muhammad(talk) 20:17, 25 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Stunning picture! --Massimo Catarinella (talk) 00:49, 26 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Strong Support Very well done. — Aitias // discussion 02:28, 27 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Promoted Image:Alstroemeria aurantiaca.JPG --Noodle snacks (talk) 09:22, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Sprekelia formosissima

Reason

Adds value to its article, a beautiful flower. Merry Christmas to all!

Articles this image appears in

Sprekelia

Creator

Noodle snacks

• Support as nominator --Noodle snacks (talk) 13:41, 25 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Would prefer slightly larger, but meets all the technical specs. I like the pollen on the petals. Durova^Charge! 19:35, 25 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support - I'm not the biggest fan of the pollen, but it's still an exceptional photo. ~ ωαdεstεr16_«talk^stalk» 19:50, 25 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment Do you have an uncropped version with a little more room on the top? The cropping feels a little tight on that end to me. Thegreenj 22:33, 25 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • No room to be had at the top unfortunately on that particular image. There is an alternate though which I have attached. Noodle snacks (talk) 00:21, 26 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support original --Massimo Catarinella (talk) 00:50, 26 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support well done. — Aitias // discussion 02:30, 27 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support original. Agreed that it was cropped a little too tight at the top though. And based on the reflections on the leaves in the background, doesn't the light source seem a little cold? Diliff | (Talk) (Contribs) 15:14, 29 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Promoted Image:Sprekelia formosissima 1.JPG --Noodle snacks (talk) 09:22, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Bethlehem Steel

Reason

Early depiction of the Bethlehem Steel plant in Bethlehem, Pennsylvania. Watercolor by Joseph Pennell, May 1881. Restored version of File:Bethlehem Steel Pennell.jpg.

Articles this image appears in

Bethlehem Steel, Bethlehem, Pennsylvania

Creator

Joseph Pennell

• Support as nominator --Durova^Charge! 05:57, 26 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Yet another excellent image. Not as much EV as some of the others you've nominated lately, but still good enough. Keep up the good work! Makeemlighter (talk) 06:37, 26 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support - I wish I could use watercolors like that... VX!^~~~ 05:25, 27 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support - Excellent image and EV. But maybe it is superfluous in the second article. -- Alvesgaspar (talk) 21:46, 27 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support per Alvesgaspar. Lovely, interesting painting.Fletcher (talk) 03:09, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support - I think this is a very good work with high EV. I also think it works well in both articles. One minor question though: is this tilted clockwise by a couple degrees or is it supposed to be like that? ~ ωαdεstεr16_«talk^stalk» 04:23, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • His original watercolor was tilted and the smokestacks are not parallel. One doesn't expect the shoreline to come out horizontal because this appears to have been a diagonal view across the river. This restoration has been rotated for correction, and due to the nature of the tilt there's a necessary loss of foreground. It's an act of compromise because the more one corrects the tilt, the more of the sky and foreground get sacrificed. Durova^Charge! 04:39, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
    • I see what you mean. Thanks for the thorough response. Still support. ~ ωαdεstεr16_«talk^stalk» 05:54, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment I geocoded this with some degree of precision as the article didn't have coordinates. I consequently discovered that Ram-Man had a bunch of images geocoded in Bethlehem and have asked him if he can improve the precision. Noodle snacks (talk) 11:54, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Promoted Image:Bethlehem Steel Pennellb.jpg --Noodle snacks (talk) 01:22, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Common Bluetail Damselfly

Reason

High quality shot with good EV

Articles this image appears in

Damselfly, Ischnura heterosticta

Creator

Fir0002

• Support as nominator --Fir0002 05:05, 26 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support well done. — Aitias // discussion 02:27, 27 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support and Question, any idea what Image:Unidentified Damselfly 6171.jpg or File:Unidentified Damselfly 6142.jpg is? I found dragonfly/damselfly heaven the other day, it has literally hundreds of them swarming everywhere and I recognise the nominated species. I rigged up a mt24ex rip off yesterday with some aluminium and the radio triggers. I have half a dozen species to capture yet. I also tried stacked extension tubes on my 400mm, but ditched it in favour of the 200mm because I thought the lighting wouldn't be so good. The results turned out to be excellent back on the computer though and the huge working distance is likely to be really useful. The only downside to the 400mm for damselfly/dragonfly hunting is the weight (very close to 3kg with batteries and battery grip). Noodle snacks (talk) 09:28, 27 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Answer: I'm by no means a biologist so I can't really help you with the IDs - I find Brisbane Insects a useful site and you can also use the Victorian Museum/Australian Museum to help with IDs. But yeah awesome that you've found a nice spot! How is the autofocus with the extension tubes? Because they would be very handy with a 400mm's working distance. The lighting on this seems a bit odd though - cyan cast. --Fir0002 08:53, 28 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
    • Lighting is probably just a white balance issue there. Those two are with the 70-200mm though. Autofocus was good, there is quite a bit of range that it works over (maybe 1.5m) and it still seems to have the accuracy and speed that the 400mm seems to be known for. For these small damsel flies a bit more magnification would be handy (another box of tubes or one of those 500D magnifiers instead). It isn't at maximum magnification but File:Unidentified Damselfly 6171 2.jpg is a 400mm shot from approx 2 meters away with my diy flash rig. The image is a 50% crop. Noodle snacks (talk) 09:09, 28 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose - The article is little more than a chaotic gallery of images. Pictures cannot (should not) be evaluated independently of the articles they illustrate. How can we stamp a seal of high EV to an image in these conditions, without perverting the ultimate goal of FPC? Commons FPC is the right place for this particular image. -- Alvesgaspar (talk) 11:51, 28 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • The image is used in Damselfly as the taxobox image and is demonstrative of Damselflies in general (being a fairly common species in at least one part of the world). In my book a high quality image of a species has pretty easy EV regardless of article usage. Either way I created Ischnura heterosticta, where it more specifically serves to display what the male of the species looks like. Furthermore the FPC criteria don't really mention the state of the article, to allow for future growth one should really be asking would the image be of use if the article was of featured quality. Noodle snacks (talk) 12:17, 28 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • I gave damselfly a bit of a clean and removed about 50% of the images. Noodle snacks (talk) 12:32, 28 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
    • Much better now. But I'm still opposing as this picture (in the gallery) has better quality and resolution. Also, this FP was removed from the taxobox to insert the present picture. Although it still remains in another stub, I wonder if this is a good practise. Alvesgaspar (talk) 12:53, 28 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
      • The first image you linked to is Ischnura senegalensis (The Common Bluetail article is about that species), this image is of Ischnura heterosticta. The two are found in geographically distant locations and are probably just a case of Convergent evolution. To resolve the ambiguity I had already tagged the image for renaming, which will happen when the bot gets around to it. The old FP is fir's image, so I doubt anyone is going to get insulted. It looks to me as if its due for delisting. Noodle snacks (talk) 13:48, 28 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
        • I'd like to echo what NS said above - I think that an image's enc value is almost entirely independent of the content of the article; it's an intrinsic attribute of the image. Furthermore I'd argue that an image has even greater EV in a stub because it is essentially doing the work of the (missing) text and thus the 1000 words are put to good use. --Fir0002 11:59, 29 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
        • Well, that is certainly not the spirit of WP:FPC. If it were, pictures would be evaluated only on the basis of their intrinsic quality and potential EV (like in Commons FPC and VIC), and the need to be part of an article wouldn't make sense. In the limit, your final argument justifies the existence of articles consisting of image galleries only. -- Alvesgaspar (talk) 14:54, 29 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
          • On the contrary, this is precisely in the spirit of FPC: Taking the adage that "a picture is worth a thousand words," the images featured on Wikipedia:Featured pictures should illustrate a Wikipedia article in such a way as to add significantly to that article. If the article already has a detailed description of a damselfly then the accompanying image adds less to the article than if the article had no text (note this doesn't mean that I think an article should just be comprised of images!). --Fir0002 22:45, 29 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support for quality and EV. WRT the above, the picture must contribute significantly to an article to have EV, but at the same time the photographer is not responsible for writing articles or fixing their problems (unless he causes them...). Fletcher (talk) 03:29, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support - I think Fletcher said it best and I agree with that assessment. ~ ωαdεstεr16_«talk^stalk» 04:26, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment - Before being photographers, we are all editors here and thus share some responsability for the quality of the articles we edit. Using them with the sole purpose of showing our photos or serving our nomination interests may (and does) cause damage to the encyclopaedia. The profusion of image galleries is a significant sign of that practise. In this particular article (Damselfly) a FP was removed from the taxobox with the purpose of hoisting the present candidate, not noticing that this other FP, which is in the gallery, has a much better quality and resolution. Alvesgaspar (talk) 12:13, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Neutral IMO Alvesgaspar raises some important points. The purpose of FPC is to recognize pictures that contribute well to articles. The damselfly infobox should have the best quality and resolution, which IMO is not this image. That said, the creation of the stub is IMO good as it facilitates the image and will probably be better written by future editors. Muhammad(talk) 15:53, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • I'd actually disagree slightly, in my view the taxobox image should be the clearest representation of the subject at thumbnail size. Noodle snacks (talk) 08:01, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose per arguments by Alvesgaspar and Muhammad. This has been a problem for some time now. Papa Lima Whiskey (talk) 13:17, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Promoted Image:Ischnura_heterosticta02.jpg --Noodle snacks (talk) 01:25, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Greenbottle fly eating

Reason

A good quality image illustrating both the fly and and feeding. IMO aesthetically pleasing as well, for those who like bugs :)

Articles this image appears in

Blow-fly, Chrysomya, Chrysomya albiceps, Chrysomyinae

Creator

Muhammad

• Support as nominator --Muhammad(talk) 20:10, 25 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Question What is it eating? Papa Lima Whiskey (talk) 22:21, 25 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • There was some rotting meat mixed with sand. Muhammad(talk) 05:16, 26 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Weak Support. I like the quality - focus, lighting, DOF is pretty good. I like the action captured. The Green bottle fly article could do with some love though, but the biggest issue is no species ID which affects EV. Change to full support if you can get a full ID. --jjron (talk) 16:43, 28 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Species identified. Muhammad(talk) 10:08, 29 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Apparently its not a green bottle fly. I have made the required changes. Muhammad(talk) 11:45, 29 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
    • D'oh. Have changed to full support, with the assumption ID is now correct. --jjron (talk) 11:06, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
      • Two users from diptera.info confirmed Muhammad(talk) 15:47, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support per jjron. Hope no one is eating when they click on this. Fletcher (talk) 03:42, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Weak Support Slightly too much dead space on the RHS for an encyclopedic shot. Also seems like the WB is a bit out? Seems a little warm to me but could be wrong. --Fir0002 04:25, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support - surprising clarity and disgustitude. Intothewoods29 (talk) 04:30, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Promoted Image:Chrysomya_albiceps_eating.jpg --Noodle snacks (talk) 01:25, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Lattice steel pylon

Reason

Good quality image showing details of the structure. It also shows the insulators and vibration dampers in good details.

Articles this image appears in

Electricity pylon, Lattice steel pylon

Creator

Muhammad

• Support as nominator --Muhammad(talk) 07:20, 31 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose In my view details like the insulators would be better served with individual telephoto shots. The shot itself is sharp but the background is very distracting. I'd try and find one on the top of a hill somewhere so you can just get sky as the background. Also, I think it is tilted. Noodle snacks (talk) 07:32, 31 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Weak Oppose - I agree with Noodle Snack's assessment of the background. Using the sky would make this a much better shot. ~ ωαdεstεr16_«talk^stalk» 19:32, 1 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose The composition is poor as the lattice structure itself isn't emphasized and gets lost in the background of trees and indistinct sky. Madcoverboy (talk) 09:40, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose For a common subject such as this, I think we want a really compelling photo. Lighting here is kind of flat and the background is busy, as noted. I think it seems to be leaning to the right as well. It's a nice sharp image though and pretty good EV. Fletcher (talk) 23:58, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Not promoted . --John254 00:58, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Mount Baker Panorama

Reason

Awesome quality and EV, +wow with that snow falling off the top. This image really shows how much snow falls on Mount Baker.

Articles this image appears in

Mount Baker

Creator

Wsiegmund

• Support as nominator --₪Ceran →(cheer→chime →carol) 15:49, 29 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment I think the caption would read better if the "annually huge" was changed - perhaps "The annual snowfall on the mountain is huge" or something along those lines. 16:23, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

• Ok, changed. ₪Ceran →(cheer→chime →carol) 16:55, 29 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• Support - has good EV, as do several of the other pics in the article. :) Intothewoods29 (talk) 04:33, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Not promoted --Noodle snacks (talk) 00:12, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Frozen Pinecone

Reason

Good quality image, interesting composition. Sharp, detailed.

Articles this image appears in

Conifer cone, Ice storm, Winter storms of 2008–09, Eastern White Pine

Creator

Redmarkviolinist

• Support as nominator --ṜedMarkViolinist^{Drop me a line} 23:22, 28 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment Good photo, needs a description. Not sure how much encyclopedic value it adds at the article where it appears. Seems like it would be more relevant to ice storms or something along those lines. Durova^Charge! 00:44, 29 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for the suggestion. I have expanded the description and added the picture to other pages. Cheers, ṜedMarkViolinist^{Drop me a line} 02:43, 29 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Actually it needs a description on the image hosting page. The location, species of pine, etc. would be good. I'm leaning toward borderline support here, yet it might fare better at Wikimedia Commons FPC where evaluation is more purely on photographic merit. Durova^Charge! 18:09, 29 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Okay, species is Pinus Strobus, or White Pine. I've filled in the description and added the picture to the page. ṜedMarkViolinist^{Drop me a line} 17:28, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• Support per dialog above. Durova^Charge! 03:06, 31 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose I just disagree with the EV of this image. The ice obscures the view of the cone, detracting from its EV of conifer cone, and for ice storms I think the larger-scale pictures of the effect on trees, power lines, etc. are more encyclopedic. It's a pretty interesting to see the cone wrapped up in ice, but not that encyclopedic IMO. Fletcher (talk) 17:25, 29 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment it might have EV if the species that is covered in ice has evolved to cope with it. I'd like to see proper identification per Durova though. Noodle snacks (talk) 00:13, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • I'm not sure that being able to cope would make it in any way unique though. If trees couldn't cope with below zero temps/ice, they'd all die over the winter. ;-) Diliff | (Talk) (Contribs) 01:08, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    • Well tomatoes for instance pretty much die when exposed to frost. I do recall hearing about some specific evolutionary traits of conifers that allow them to survive in heavy snow regions, particularly the tapered shape and lack of branches in the trunk. Noodle snacks (talk) 11:26, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
      • Yeah, true, although my point was almost all trees native to the cold climates must by definition be able to survive sub-zero temps or the hills would be bare. I'm sure they have evolved some defences, but nothing unique to this particular tree. Diliff | (Talk) (Contribs) 13:37, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose. Adds very little value to the articles. As Fletcher said, larger scale images of the effects of ice storms provides more information than a lone pinecone. Diliff | (Talk) (Contribs) 01:08, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose Despite the above I was only able to find one rather dubious reference (link removed) as far as evolution of pine cones goes so oppose since the ice obscures the cone, and since the limited framing obscures the effects of ice storms. Noodle snacks (talk) 11:26, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Yeah very dubious. It only relates to the shape of the pine cones and the weight of snow, nothing to do with ice or sub-zero temperatures per-se. And it specifically denies evolution! Diliff | (Talk) (Contribs) 13:43, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    • Its a religious website. What else can you expect? Muhammad(talk) 17:08, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Not promoted --Noodle snacks (talk) 00:11, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

London, 1616

Reason

A high resolution (14.2MB) panorama of London as it appeared in the early seventeenth century. Restored version of File:London panorama, 1616.jpg.

Articles this image appears in

History of London, Stuart London

Creator

Claes Janszoon Visscher

• Support as nominator --Durova^Charge! 17:36, 28 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment I can't definitively decide whether or not to support this, but at least on my end the entire image looks quite blurry. Much of the text can't be read and a lot of the details are also compromised due to this. If the text at least was more legible, I would be more inclined to support this. -- mcshadypl ^TC 05:50, 29 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I've taken the liberty of sharpening the original with a deconvolution algorithm (edit 1), which has brough out a bit more of the detail (though I'm not sure the writing is any more legible). Unfortunately it's also brough out the JPEG artifacts from the original, but it was saved with quite high quality so that's not a huge problem. Time3000 (talk) 16:04, 29 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• Reluctant Oppose I really want to support this, but the unreadable text just takes too much away from the image. Makeemlighter (talk) 05:40, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Week Support Edit 1 Per above, most of the the text is readable though, the top left bit is unreadble, so weak support. Otherwise a beautiful and historical photo (and hi-res). Epson291 (talk) 17:28, 31 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Not promoted --Noodle snacks (talk) 00:11, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

New Year's Eve fireworks display in Melbourne

Reason

Happy New Year everyone! This was my first time that I was in Melbourne for NYE and it was pretty crazy - trains were packed to the very brim and all roads were just solid with people! Anyway a high quality photo with good EV - one of my last images of 2008!

Articles this image appears in

New Year's Eve, Fireworks, Pyrotechnics

Creator

Fir0002

• Support as nominator --Fir0002 00:56, 1 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Neutral Looks good, but its got a lot of compression artifacts in the sky and around the fireworks. --Yzmo ^talk 01:25, 1 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose. I think the technical quality is sufficient, but it's on the small side for an FP and composition-wise I think this falls well short of a number of our (technically inferior) fireworks shots (e.g., this or this).--ragesoss (talk) 06:13, 1 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose. I know that fireworks are pretty difficult to shoot (and you don't get much time to change your exposure settings) but they look fairly overexposed to be honest as they're missing colour information in the middle. It isn't unavoidable, and generally the fireworks look much nicer, even if the scenery isn't as well lit. I don't have any particularly great fireworks shots myself from a compositional perspective (always difficult to get a good vantage point that isn't swarming with people) but I do have some where the colours are far less washed out, which I think is pretty important with fireworks. Diliff | (Talk) (Contribs) 00:58, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Hopefully some of the alts are more pleasing --Fir0002 04:17, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    • Unfortunately not really, as the colour is still pretty washed out by overexposure. What I think probably would have worked better was to stop down the lens a bit more (I used f/13 to f/22 at ISO 100 last time I tried, diffraction isn't really an issue in this sort of photography) and let the exposure go longer. That way the fireworks won't be as exposed as they last for a smaller percentage of the total exposure, but the background will still be exposed fairly well. (Examples: [2] [3] [4]. I know they're not great either and there isn't any interesting background to speak of, but you see the colour of the actual fireworks better, rather than just the glow around them). Ideally there isn't too many fireworks all at once though, as that potentially this means it'll be overwhelmed, so getting the balance right is sometimes really hard as you cannot predict how fast the fireworks will move, how many of them will explode in the next xx seconds, and even where in the frame they will explode. An unforgiving style of photography, to be sure. ;-) Diliff | (Talk) (Contribs) 12:29, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
      • Oh and this is just an idea that popped into my head a second ago. If you had the camera really steady on a tripod, you could actually take a frame before the fireworks started, with a much brighter exposure for the background. Then you could blend it with the fireworks frame to get them both exposed nicely. Never tried it before, but I can't see why it wouldn't work. I've got a little program that takes the brightest pixel in a series of images and combines them into one image. Works well for multiple exposures in star trail photography, so you can take sixty 1 minute long exposures to get an hour long star trail without the problems of hot pixels/noise. Only problem is when clouds are moving across the frame. You'll end up with the brightest bits of them all in the final image too which isn't ideal. Diliff | (Talk) (Contribs) 13:25, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose While pleasing, I fail to see the encyclopedic value (3b and 5b). It's not a particularly excellent example of fireworks nor an excellent rendition of the Melbourne skyline. Is Fir0002 starting to rest on his laurels?! ;) Madcoverboy (talk) 09:35, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Not promoted . --John254 00:35, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Nine-banded Armadillo

Reason

Very good picture of a nine-banded armadillo in the wild.

Articles this image appears in

Nine-banded Armadillo

Creator

Brian E. Kulm, Yiati

• Support as nominator --Why1991 (talk) 02:19, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Opppose Below minimum size requirements. Durova^Charge! 03:15, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Speedy Close Doesn't meet size requirements. Makeemlighter (talk) 03:21, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• speedy close per above. de Bivort 18:44, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment I reverted two edits to this nomination in which an IP changed votes and remarks. Makeemlighter (talk) 23:00, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Not promoted It is extremely improbable that this would pass given its size and softness. --Noodle snacks (talk) 02:02, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

World War I trenches at Dead Sea

Reason

Currently, none of the images at Wikipedia:Featured pictures/History/World War I depict the Middle Eastern theater of that war. It's time to correct that systemic bias and I believe this has more technical merit than some of the images already featured. Restored version of File:Turkish trenches at Dead Sea.jpg

Articles this image appears in

Dead Sea, Sinai and Palestine Campaign, Middle Eastern theatre of World War I

Creator

American Colony Jerusalem

• Support as nominator --Durova^Charge! 01:15, 27 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support I agree, this is a pretty good image and it's about time the Middle Eastern theater of WWII got some recognition. I don't think it has a place in the Dead Sea article though. I was there just now and there isn't a single reference to the war effort in there, and the image seems quite out of place there. If noone disagrees, I'll proceed with removing it from there. Mad Tinman _{T C} 21:37, 27 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Pretty good image of the Mid East theater of WWI. Agree with Mad Tinman about removal from Dead Sea article. ErikTheBikeMan (talk) 16:18, 28 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support - Quite an eerie photo, but a very good one that meets the criteria nonetheless. Cheers, Abraham, B.S. (talk) 06:08, 29 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support - This is a very moving photo, to say the least. I also agree with the view of Abraham B.S. above. Kevin Rutherford (talk) 22:02, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Weak Support Good image. Weak support only because its EV is good but not outstanding. Makeemlighter (talk) 05:37, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose I don't want to be disrespectful but seems a fairly mediocre example of a trench (see some of the photos trench article) and there's nothing in it (AFAIK) that makes this scene distinctive to the Middle Eastern theater of war.--Fir0002 07:58, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Well, yes. It is a mediocre example of a trench (which is why it doesn't appear at that article). The Ottoman Empire was in a tailspin. Quite illustrative for the Middle Eastern theater of WWI though. Durova^Charge! 08:24, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • But how is it illustrative for the Middle Eastern theater of WWI? Is there anything in this scene which is unique to that theater? To put it another way, if you were shown this photo with no other information could you identify it conclusively as coming from the Middle Eastern theater of WWI? --Fir0002 22:49, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Promoted File:Turkish trenches at Dead Sea2.jpg --Wronkiew (talk) 02:05, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Singapore Skyline Panorama

Reason

Pretty hi-rez, very dynamic, easily stands out, representative of the spirit of Singapore in many ways. (And the clouds are awesome).

Articles this image appears in

Singapore, Four Asian Tigers, List of tallest buildings in Singapore, Downtown Core, List of cities by GDP, List of cities in the Far East by population

Creator

Someformofhuman

• Support as nominator --Bubsty (talk) 06:41, 21 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• oppose looks oversharpened and oversaturated. de Bivort 18:43, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose. Oversharpened and a bit 'watercolour'ish looking. Good in thumbnail but not great at full size. Diliff | (Talk) (Contribs) 01:35, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose Lights are overblown. And the crane on the far left tower appears to be quite blurred. –  LATICS  talk  02:32, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose per above. Fletcher (talk) 00:00, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment & Oppose

The crane was blurred because it was moving. They were having late night construction.

I appreciate Bubsty for placing my image as featured candidates. (Didn't knew it until I checked today) But I wish it could be removed from the nominations list. There are a number of photo-graphical mistakes in my own picture in which why I never and wouldn't bother to nominate it, and in which I am embarrassed to explain. It'll be great if you had asked my permission to do so first the next time. And I oppose my own picture. Neither any of my pictures from Commons are deserved to be nominated at all. Someformofhuman Speak now! 04:34, 8 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Not promoted . --John254 03:40, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

White-faced Heron

Reason

High quality. Finally got close enough to this timid species.

Articles this image appears in

White-faced Heron

Creator

Noodle snacks

• Support as nominator --Noodle snacks (talk) 02:59, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment. While this is very good I personally find the taxobox image File:White-faced Heron.jpg a more engaging shot; unfortunately the focus on that looks to have just missed, otherwise I would be inclined to nominate it here. Another thing I was wondering though was whether you'd intentionally cropped at the bottom where it is; it's a strong reflection and I'd be interested to see how it would come up if we could see the whole bird in the reflection. If not, I'd possibly crop it a bit higher up, at least taking out the reflected neck feathers. --jjron (talk) 11:26, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • No room on the reflection, mostly because I was trying to keep the focus point on the eye. Attached an alternate with a slightly different pose, similar luck on the foreground reflection though and the lighting is imo inferior. Noodle snacks (talk) 11:35, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support original Greater realism with water ripples. Durova^Charge! 22:03, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support original as above, would prefer a slightly different crop as jjron Muhammad(talk) 10:10, 1 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment Good shot but I prefer either the one Jjron mentioned or File:IMG 8332 1000.jpg - less distracting backgrounds and better look at the feet. Makeemlighter (talk) 03:37, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• I'd guess I'll argue that a front on shot better shows the nuptial plumes (pink feathers in breeding plumage) on the the neck and that the photograph demonstrates a different type of feeding behaviour to the other images ("The White-faced heron uses a variety of techniques to find food including standing still and waiting for prey movement, walking slowly in shallow water, wing flicking, foot raking or even chasing prey with open wings"). Noodle snacks (talk) 00:08, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Yeah I've actually got quite a few of this bird myself (I've only got this one with me at the moment on my laptop though) which have nicer backgrounds. But I think NS has a good point too regarding illustrating feeding... --Fir0002 00:41, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Weak Support See comment above - I've seen/taken nicer shots of the bird itself but this one is pretty good for feeding --Fir0002 00:41, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Note. The lead image of the article has just been nominated. Papa Lima Whiskey (talk) 02:17, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Promoted Image:Egretta novaehollandiae Tasmania 3.jpg Enough support, no opposes and quite a lot of neutral --Noodle snacks (talk) 05:48, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Camera obscura

Reason

An early demonstration of camera obscura from a seventeenth century manuscript. Restored version of File:Camera obscura unrestored.jpg.

Articles this image appears in

Camera obscura, History of the camera

Creator

unknown

• Support as nominator --Durova^Charge! 23:06, 29 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Quality is good, and in showing both the input and output image, this drawing seems to illustrate the concept more clearly than the other pictures in the article. A good restoration, too -- the original looks like hell.  :-) Fletcher (talk) 23:27, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support - Great image and superb restoration. Fletcher's right, the original was in rough shape. Nice job, Durova. ~ ωαdεstεr16_«talk^stalk» 02:37, 31 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Thank you both. :) Durova^Charge! 03:09, 31 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Excellent restoration! I agree with Fletcher: this picture illustrates Camera obscura better than any of the others. Makeemlighter (talk) 05:40, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Promoted Image:Camera obscura2.jpg --Noodle snacks (talk) 05:48, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Jorge Martin Obras http://martinjorgee.wix.com/jorge-martin#!c%C3%A1mara-obscura

Juvenile Rufous Fantail

Reason

Sharp, well lit, clean background - in short a high quality image of a wild bird

Articles this image appears in

Fantail, Rufous Fantail

Creator

Fir0002

• Support as nominator --Fir0002 12:04, 29 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support This one is looking pretty good sharpness and lighting wise Noodle snacks (talk) 12:54, 29 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose I think the way the branch intrudes into the foreground is distracting, but more significantly, the talon on the right side is completely blurred, while the talon the left is sharp. It goes from blurry to sharp so quick that it looks more like a post processing thing than DOF transition or motion blur (?). Indeed the bokeh is really too strong for me; I think the lead image in Fantail looks more natural, showing some in-focus branches the bird is sitting on. Attaching the animal to its environment adds to its EV, in my view; I just want enough blur to keep the emphasis on the subject. Fletcher (talk) 16:58, 29 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • I think there is some motion blur on the wing actually, but otherwise it looks very sharp. The shallow DOF is mainly because the branch that the bird is perched on is almost in line with the view of the camera, which accentuates it. Diliff | (Talk) (Contribs) 21:42, 29 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
    • Yeah the DOF is entirely natural and is created in the way Diliff mentioned above (I was semi-hiding behind the tree trunk). The alternative shows part of a nearby tree if you prefer it. Also yes there is some minor blur on the wings (from memory it was startled by the sound of the shutter) despite 1/1600s --Fir0002 22:49, 29 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
      • I like the alt a bit more but don't think the FP should be obscured by the branch. Fletcher (talk) 23:12, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
        • I'm not sure that the branch is much of an issue: [5] [6] [7] [8]. Also I think your sentiments here are relevant, in that yes you could find fault with the branch, but realistically this is about as good as it gets for wild birds. --Fir0002 00:40, 31 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose Poor composition in both cases. The branch interferes in both photos. Makeemlighter (talk) 05:32, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support original despite the branch and some minor blurring. This photo illustrates the subject very well. The bird is easy to see against the background. Wronkiew (talk) 06:39, 31 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose alternative 1 it is not in any articles and should not be put into any articles as the original image shows the same subject matter but has greater encyclopaedic value - it shows more of the bird. Guest9999 (talk) 05:16, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • The general practise is to replace the original in articles with the Alt generally. Noodle snacks (talk) 05:57, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    • Images with less encyclopaedic value should not be used in articles because they could be featurable. The original image is a better depiction of the bird for use in the encyclopaedia and should be used in the articles it is currently present in over the alternative image; even if the alternative image has technical qualities that could make a difference at FPC. Guest9999 (talk) 06:49, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
      • The point of the alternative is to give people an option - whichever version people like most will go into the article. So if the majority thought the Alt was a better image then it would replace the original. If the majority thought the original was best then it would stay. So perhaps you could state your preference in a positive rather than negative fashion :) --Fir0002 08:55, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
        • An example: File:Poster-sized portrait of Barack Obama OrigRes.jpg is the lead image in Barack Obama, it is probably not featurable, File:Obama Portrait 2006 trimmed.jpg is a featured image of Barack Obama but it will never replace the other image in the article. Another example: remember that picture of a bird that received massive support a few months back only to be removed from the article it was in by the editors' who maintained because it showed an atypical pose? The factors that matter at FPC can differ from the factors that determine whether an image should be placed in an article and from the process of peer review that keeps that image in the article; since Wikipedia is an encyclopaedia and not just a collection of great pictures the former does not take precedence. I'm not trying to be negative and I think both images are very well taken shots, I am only unsure as to whether support the original because of the extremely high standard for this type of image that has been set by editors including yourself. Guest9999 (talk) 16:02, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
          • I think if that alternative had been listed in the nomination of the other image it would probably have been chosen instead which is the point here - to let others help choose which image should be the one to illustrate the article. And if you think that's the original then that's fine. You're welcome to your opinion on the matter but I would argue that this image is well up to standard for wild birds (note that it is unreasonable to demand the same quality for a wild bird photo as for an easily accessible flower in the same way it is unreasonable to demand that quality from a historical image) --Fir0002 00:47, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• I disagree that FPC is a place to set out article content or decide whether an image should be used in an article; it should be used to evaluate images used in articles against the criteria. An image of a bird is always going to have greater encyclopaedic value than one of that a bird partially obscured by a branch, especially when they are as similar as the images in this nomination. Guest9999 (talk) 03:35, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• Support--Avala (talk) 15:17, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose. Branch obscuring legs and lower (from gravity's point of view) part of abdomen. Motion blur on foreground wing. Beautiful picture, but damn. :\ The alt is good too, but it has too much obscured by the branch, and could use some more DOF. Papa Lima Whiskey (talk) 02:03, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • But nothing is obscured by the branch in the original...? Also refer to the examples I cited above to Fletcher - to me picking on the branch seems like looking at this nom from the perspective of finding an excuse to not support! --Fir0002 01:37, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    • You may find, if you look at your own images again closely, that the proportion of the bird covered by the branch in the original is much less than in the alternative. Regards, Papa Lima Whiskey (talk) 01:44, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

No Consensus --Noodle snacks (talk) 05:47, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Shea Smith

Reason

High quality image during an American college football game.

Articles this image appears in

Armed Forces Bowl, American football, History of Air Force Falcons football, Shea Smith

Creator

U.S. Air Force photo/Mike Kaplan

• Support as nominator --–  LATICS  talk  22:01, 28 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Seldom enough that we get good sports photography under free license. Durova^Charge! 00:47, 29 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Weak opposeI think the composition could be much better, particularly if the player's entire body was shown. It's also detrimental that the background on the right side of the photo was left in since the opposing player is completely blurred anyway. The photo doesn't adequately show the QB's body positioning prior to the pass since the framing only focuses on the upper body. I would likely change my vote if the player's entire body was shown. -- mcshadypl ^TC 05:44, 29 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Weak Support both, preference to jjron's Edit1 Per Durova, these are probably hard to get. We do have a good picture showing the QB's whole body and footwork, which is good for EV. But arguably, this picture puts the emphasis on his head and arms as he prepares to pass. I also don't mind the background blur, as it is just enough to give context while emphasizing the QB. My main reason to support is that this picture seems likely one of the best we have, and it is hard to get these. I don't think a FP necessarily has to be the absolute best we have, or best possible shot. Fletcher (talk) 17:42, 29 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment. I would support if there was a realistic article on this particular player, but as is I tend to oppose on EV as I don't think it has huge value for any of the articles it's in. So that leaves me pretty neutral overall. --jjron (talk) 15:58, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Au contraire... :) (Yes, I just created it.) –  LATICS  talk  04:11, 31 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• OK then, Support (preference for Edit1), good job on the article BTW, even if done on the fly - hopefully the article will remain! FWIW I've added what I think to be a slightly improved edit. --jjron (talk) 13:07, 1 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support - I like "action" shots like this and think they can be just as or even more EV than whole-body shots of the player. Good job. Intothewoods29 (talk) 04:32, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support pref edit 1 I think readers will know what the legs would look like, so the crop is unimportant. I prefer the selective focus; Having everything in focus tends to make it difficult to know what to look at. Noodle snacks (talk) 11:48, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Weak Oppose Both Pretty good photo, but IMO doesn't have enough EV to be featured. Also, the completely-blurred right side is pretty distracting. Makeemlighter (talk) 03:26, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support original, oppose edit 1 because of sharpening artifacts. Diego_pmc ^Talk 18:11, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Promoted File:Shea Smith-edit1.jpg --Noodle snacks (talk) 05:49, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The Dakota, 1890

Reason

One of the more famous New York City apartment buildings, notable (among other reasons) as the location where John Lennon was killed. One of the earliest surviving landmarks on the Upper West Side of Manhattan, photographed from an angle that would have been impossible a few decades later due to subsequent development.

Articles this image appears in

The Dakota, Upper West Side

Creator

Historic American Buildings Survey

• Support as nominator --Durova^Charge! 00:11, 31 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support - Wow, compare to what surrounds it today. ~ ωαdεstεr16_«talk^stalk» 02:39, 31 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment - I'm not sure it deserves FP status but I put it as lead picture in the 1st article -- Alvesgaspar (talk) 03:01, 31 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support That is an impresive photo, both in quality/historicalness. It really gives you a feel how much it has changed today. Epson291 (talk) 17:24, 31 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support: Partly because of the quality and historical significance, but mainly because it's related to John Lennon, the second-best Beatle. Dendodge Talk^Contribs 01:50, 1 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Neutral. Good restoration of a strong photo, but I think it has been cropped too aggressively. The extra foreground and the poles across the road on the right, missing in the restored version, add a lot to the context. And as others note, that context and the drastic change in context from then to now is a big part of the image's appeal.--ragesoss (talk) 06:21, 1 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Considering that the foreground is almost entirely road and the far right is Central Park (which had already been fully developed before this photograph was taken), it didn't seem like a great liberty to crop out phone and power lines which are generally viewed as problem elements in photography. Nearly all of the neighborhood that saw subsequent development remains in the image. Durova^Charge! 01:26, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support per above; caption might make note that we are looking at the south facade (I think). Fletcher (talk) 23:32, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Promoted File:The Dakota 1890b.jpg --Wronkiew (talk) 06:13, 8 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Impact Sprinkler Mechanism in Action

Reason

After this failed nomination I retook the shot with the water flow adjusted to a point just below where the sprinkler would spin, therefore keeping my camera relatively dry and hopefully fixing the aforementioned sprinkler bias issue by providing an image of one in operation.

Articles this image appears in

Impact sprinkler

Creator

Noodle snacks

• Support as nominator --Noodle snacks (talk) 08:04, 31 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• support Wladyslaw (talk) 14:34, 31 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Bravo, I wasn't sure this could be done. From reading the previous nom, I think people were forgetting this thing spins and no doubt vibrates when it's turned on. But you found a way to shoot it. While the photo is fantastic, the caption could be more detailed to explain what's going on (noting there was a previous request for a diagram). I take it the left side nozzle is the "spreader" nozzle as described in the article? Fletcher (talk) 19:54, 31 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Well done, although I'd like a little more space to see the water to the right.--HereToHelp ^{(talk to me)} 22:47, 31 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Still Support - Supported the first nom, and I still support this. The water adds a cool effect to it as well. ~ ωαdεstεr16_«talk^stalk» 19:30, 1 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Quality shot --Fir0002 07:57, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support amazing. I can really see the "wow" in this image. Nice work. --Kanonkas (talk) 11:36, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• Weak Oppose I am going to go against the flow (groan) on this one. Its is much better with the addition of water compared to the old nom, but I think that this limited degree of water flow, whilst making the subject easier to photograph, fails to demonstrate the sprinkler in operation. I like that this new version also shows water coming out of the opposing nozzle, but none of the water is actually sprinkling, its more like an impact trickler :) Noting that it is in Noodle snack's back yard and that he has a number of lens choices, I think an attempt could/should be made to capture the device in full operation with a fast enough shutter speed to freeze the action and the spray in full flow. Mfield (talk) 17:36, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support I have to disagree with Mfield. I feel if it showed the spray in full flow, there would be much less emphasis on the sprinkler itself. This image, IMO, depicts the water, but still manages to be the subject. Spencer^T♦C 17:39, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Very nice. (: --Ashleyy osaurus 17:48, 2 January 2009 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Ashleyy osaurus (talk • contribs)
• Oppose. I still think this subject is poorly served by a photograph. It requires at least a slow motion video clip, but ideally an animation, to be featurable. Very good photograph, but inferior EV for a subject whose essence lies in its motion. Papa Lima Whiskey (talk) 01:57, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment Shouldn't it be sprinkler, not sprinker (title of nom and caption)? TerriG —Preceding unsigned comment added by 149.155.96.6 (talk) 11:59, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Quite right, a repeatedly copy and pasted typo, fixed now. Noodle snacks (talk) 00:23, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Weak Support Very good picture. As for EV, it gets only weak support since we really need to see this in action to understand what an Impact sprinkler is all about. Unlike an animation or video, however, this still shot allows us to examine the mechanism for more than a moment, so I think it's worthy of being featured. Makeemlighter (talk) 04:34, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support per nom. Spikebrennan (talk) 14:41, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose It's a high quality image, and it looks pretty cool. However, as Papa Lima Whiskey pointed out, it does very little to clarify how the object works mechanically. As that is the main goal (and problem) of the accompanying article, I'm opposing because I feel it fails to add any real value to the article it appears in. A slow motion animation would do much more to clearly show how it works. Furthermore, the caption is meager at best. Fransw (talk) 21:38, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Weak Support — Aitias // discussion 03:15, 7 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Promoted File:Impact_Sprinkler_Mechanism_2.jpg --Wronkiew (talk) 06:15, 8 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Cohoes Falls

Reason

High quality panorama of Cohoes Falls during winter, showing the old electric plant (currently owned by Brookfield Power) on the left. It shows the flow of meltwater during a warm spell in winter. Complete with a partial rainbow on the right.

Articles this image appears in

Cohoes Falls, Mohawk River, Cohoes, New York, The Great Peacemaker, Downtown Cohoes Historic District

Creator

ωαdεstεr16_«talk^stalk»

• Support as nominator --ωαdεstεr16_«talk^stalk» 00:59, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment: I'm only going to comment on usage right now (monitor issues), and I'd like to note that it has rather weak enc. in The Great Peacemaker and Downtown Cohoes Historic District. It's fine in the others, though. Spencer^T♦C 01:53, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose The composition isn't very good, you either need to find a spot where you just get the waterfall, or alternately pick a vantage point where you can include both the power station and the waterfall. Technically there is periodic banding across the top of the image, visible at thumbnail size, probably caused by exposure variations across the frame (set your camera to manual). None of the verticals are straight. I believe the program you are using will let you define vertical and horizontal control points in order to fix this sort of distortion. Noodle snacks (talk) 09:08, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• weak oppose a lot of detail there. A bit drab to shoot it in the winter. Feels tilted CW. I think I can see different tones in the segments of the sky. de Bivort 18:49, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose Good observations by Noodle Snacks. The far left in particular is really too soft and distorted IMO. Fletcher (talk) 00:24, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Not promoted . --John254 00:33, 9 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Crested Tit

Reason

details, natural light, natural environment

Articles this image appears in

Crested_Tit

Creator

Luc Viatour (talk)

• Support as nominator --Luc Viatour (talk) 15:47, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support - A bit small, but good Ev. ₪Ceran →(cheer→chime →carol) 16:15, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

sorry, I have to correct and send a larger version! --Luc Viatour (talk) 16:30, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• Comments - this image is in a gallery, and I much rather prefer the image in the infobox of the article. Whichever image passes, it should be the head image for the article. Intothewoods29 (talk) 22:38, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose - Somewhat soft, and it has blown highlights on the neck.--ragesoss (talk) 01:30, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose - a good shot but it's agallery image that adds little value to the article because a similar but superior - in terms of encyclopaedic value - image which shows a greater proportion of the bird (tail, wing, legs) is used in the main body of the article (). Guest9999 (talk) 05:03, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Except the auto-iso seems to have killed that one. :( Papa Lima Whiskey (talk) 02:06, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• I agree that it's not feature picture quality but in terms of an encyclopaedic illustration of the bird it is superior to the image nominated. Guest9999 (talk) 03:28, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• Agreed. Papa Lima Whiskey (talk) 16:51, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• Weak Oppose Missing tail, and quality is good but not great. Fletcher (talk) 00:12, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Not promoted . --John254 00:34, 9 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hot Springs of Pamukkale Turkey

Reason

Extremely high detail, amazing EV. This has incredible wow, it's fascinating. This is one of Mila's best, plus it's an FP on Commons as well.

Articles this image appears in

Pamukkale

Creator

Mbz1

• Support as nominator --₪Ceran →(cheer→chime →carol) 14:27, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Edit 2 Good photo and good demonstration of scale. Durova^Charge! 21:56, 30 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose. The location has plenty of wow but I'm not convinced this photo does as the sky is very bizarrely coloured. I've seen better angles/composition in Pamukkale than this one. Diliff | (Talk) (Contribs) 09:36, 31 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Support --Aycan (talk) 10:47, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

* Oppose per diliff, the edit has a wierd looking sky. The person in it does give a useful sense of scale in this case. Noodle snacks (talk) 11:45, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment - Second original added. ₪Ceran →(cheer→chime →carol) 02:04, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • You may want to nominate that separately, as this nomination would be due to close shortly. Papa Lima Whiskey (talk) 13:18, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    • Still oppose the Original 2. I've noticed a pattern in Mbz's images. They're visually interesting, but the quality/editing is often a bit suspect. In #2, the background is still extremely dark - darker than it should be IMO, even allowing for underexposure for the foreground. Diliff | (Talk)(Contribs) 13:56, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

      Diliff, may I please thank you for taking your time to comment on the images? Here's the original (not post processed image)File:Hot springs of Pamukkale origibal.JPG in case you have a wish and time to make it look better.--Mbz1 (talk) 01:34, 7 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment. I wonder what that cable in the lower right hand corner is. Spikebrennan (talk) 14:42, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I am not sure what this cable is.--Mbz1 (talk) 01:34, 7 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Mila-- welcome back, I hope. Spikebrennan (talk) 15:08, 8 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• Support Edit 2.After Mbz's comments, I've gone back and edited the original unprocessed image to bring out the definition and I think it is infinitely better than what was originally nominated here. I had to improvise on the sky as it was fairly dull and I'm not sure if I overdid it, but it looks fairly natural to me and I probably wouldn't pick up on it if I didn't know it had been adjusted. Also, I didn't crop it to the same proportions as the original nomination as I think it is slightly more informative as-is, but I wouldn't oppose the crop either if that's what people wanted. In fact if I were to crop it similar to the original, I'd probably also crop the bottom to remove the cable and the darker patch on the bottom left. I suggest we keep this open a bit longer to give others the chance to change their vote if they want to do so. Diliff | (Talk) (Contribs) 17:35, 7 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • On second thoughts, I do prefer the crop as described above as it looks much less messy, and I have replaced it as Edit 2. See here if you want to compare to the uncropped version. Diliff | (Talk) (Contribs) 18:15, 7 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    • Thank you,Diliff! It does not matter if the image will get promoted or it will not. What matters that you found the image interesting enough to spend your time on it.--Mbz1 (talk) 19:55, 7 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
      • No problem. When I saw the original unprocessed image, I realised how much potential there was in it. Perhaps try not to increase the contrast too much in future though? ;-) Diliff | (Talk) (Contribs) 20:05, 7 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
        • Maybe better yet to post my nominations together with the originals right away in the hope thay you will help me to make my images look better. ;-)--Mbz1 (talk) 21:02, 7 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Edit 2--Mbz1 (talk) 19:55, 7 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Edit 2 Looking realistic now Noodle snacks (talk) 01:39, 8 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

More discussion on the alternates please. Wronkiew (talk) 06:08, 8 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Promoted File:Hot springs of Pamukkale edit cropped.JPG --Wronkiew (talk) 01:40, 9 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Soviet Wehrmacht Soldier

Reason

This image meets most of the criteria outright. Although "small" (not 1,000px²), the image has a good composition and I did some work to get rid of major scratches. This is one of the better quality images donated by the Bundesarchive to Wikipedia Commons. The image is historic and so I know that a number of images have been passed without meeting the minimum resolution requirements given their historic value. As if to underscore the historic value of the image, this image is fairly popular in published books; this is a well known image to WWII Eastern Front historians. This is amongst Wikipedia's best work relative to the subject it represents; the photograph cannot be retaken, and there are few images available for Wikipedia on Russians who fought for the German Army during the Second World War. It has a free license, adds values to three articles (insofar) and is accurate.

Articles this image appears in

Wehrmacht, Russian Liberation Army, Heer (1935–1945)

Creator

Waidelich; retouched by Catalan

• Support as nominator --JonCatalán^(Talk) 18:40, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Note -- I tried increasing the resolution. JonCatalán^(Talk) 19:46, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support - Spiffing. 82.0.93.62 (talk) 20:27, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• oppose interesting composition and subject. The image quality is low though - it has lots of compression artifacts. There is no way to "increase resolution" without going to the original data or negative. de Bivort 20:19, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I know, but I was hoping that the historical value of the image would supersede the obvious lack in image quality given the conditions the image was taken in and who the picture was taken by. JonCatalán^(Talk) 20:21, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• Oppose. The issue with the image quality is not something relating to the conditions the image was taken in. It is a digital reproduction issue. Also, you can't just 'upsample' the image to 1000 pixels to make it through FPC. The alternative image looks fairly awful as a result. The original film/print would have far higher quality than this. Whether it is obtainable, I don't know, but this version will not pass at this res, IMO. Diliff | (Talk) (Contribs) 22:26, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Note. In that case, withdraw the nomination. :) JonCatalán^(Talk) 22:28, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • For what it's worth, it is a pretty good photo. Only the size and image quality stop me from wholeheartedly supporting it. ;-) Diliff | (Talk) (Contribs) 22:32, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Regretful oppose for technical reasons. The type of image I call a heartbreaker during archival searches: encyclopedic, interesting composition, but just too short on technical specs to consider for featured picture candidacy. Keep up the good work and do continue searching, please. Historic FPs are rare finds, even with restoration. About 1 in 1000 has the right stuff. Best wishes, Durova^Charge! 03:33, 8 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Not promoted - Withdrawn by nominator. --jjron (talk) 13:30, 9 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

T-37 Solo Student Pilot

Reason

High Resolution Image with apropos applications in Wikipedia

Articles this image appears in

T-37 Tweet, Air Education and Training Command, Oxygen mask

Creator

— BQZip01 — ^talk

• Support as nominator --— BQZip01 — ^talk 08:48, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• oppose white look significantly blown out, blacks are not very dark. de Bivort 18:42, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment Can we remove some of the haze, please? Papa Lima Whiskey (talk) 02:08, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Much better now. I'm going to be neutral because the image has quite a lot of noise, but it also exceeds the resolution requirement by some amount. At the same time, downsampling is not an option due to the small but significant text on the edge of the ENJJPT coat of arms. The white paint may well be blown out, but that's somewhat forgivable as it's not the central subject. The whitish halos around the pencil (?) and some other objects bother me a bit more, though. The composition overall is fine, even if the photographer should have been invisible to make it really perfect imho. Papa Lima Whiskey (talk) 18:39, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose EV is somewhat weak, spread over three articles. Shows little of a T-37; does serve to identify the student pilot but is not very educational about the topic, though admittedly it is a hard one to illustrate; does show an oxygen mask but again, not an extremely informative view. Fletcher (talk) 23:57, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Reluctant oppose per the above comments. Particularly agreeing with Fletcher about the oxygen mask. It's a reasonably good photograph but not ideal for any of its encyclopedic uses. Durova^Charge! 17:04, 7 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Not promoted . --John254 02:50, 10 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Social dance

Reason

A high resolution illustration of historic social dancing with good demonstration of context: active dance poses, musicians, and nearby figures drinking and socializing. Tonight I'm gonna party like it's 1799. ;) Restored version of File:Il Ballo.jpg.

Articles this image appears in

Dance, Social dance

Creator

Giuseppe Piattoli

• Support as nominator --Durova^Charge! 01:46, 1 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support. Well-restored, high-resolution, and it is well-used in illustrating social dance (especially since social dance today often looks so different).--ragesoss (talk) 05:56, 1 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support, but isn't it "Tonight I'm gonna party like it's 1699"? Spencer^T♦C 17:32, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• weak oppose Don't especially like the look or composition of the thumb, and I'm not sure what this version shows that a modern photo wouldn't. I thought the social dance article might be specific to old dancing, in which case the old rendering would help, but it wasn't. de Bivort 19:05, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support - Shows what a 18th-century social dance is like, in a way that a modern photograph would not. Historic views are still important to show the development. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 18:02, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Weak Support Good, but not great, EV. It'd be better if the articles talked more about the history/development of dance. Moreover, a description of what they're doing would be nice. Sure, it looks like they're dancing, but I can't tell much about the actual dance. Makeemlighter (talk) 04:39, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Promoted File:Il Ballo2.jpg --Wronkiew (talk) 05:16, 10 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Caledonia, New York 1892

Reason

High resolution historic aerial depiction with legible labels of village landmarks. Restored version of File:Caledonia, New York aerial2.jpg.

Articles this image appears in

Caledonia (village), New York, Livingston County, New York removed from article (for now) - see note below. Guest9999 (talk) 05:19, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Creator

Anonymous (published by Burleigh Litho. Co., Troy, N.Y.).

• Support as nominator --Durova^Charge! 02:04, 1 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support. Fantastically detailed image. Despite the huge file size, it seems like there are artifacts throughout (especially noticeable around the typed characters) that are in the unrestored version as well. But it's such a large, detailed and attractive image, with more than enough detail to read all writing and significant bits, that the artifacts don't really matter.--ragesoss (talk) 06:06, 1 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Strong Support - This is an exceptional image. I don't think I could say much beyond what ragesoss mentioned - other than the fact that it was published in my home town! :-) ~ ωαdεstεr16_«talk^stalk» 19:27, 1 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Note I have removed the image from the second article it was as it was poorly positioned and the context for its used was not established either in the image's caption or the article's text. Guest9999 (talk) 05:19, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Great image that provides a good historical look at the city. Makeemlighter (talk) 04:42, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Promoted File:Caledonia, New York aerial2.jpg --Wronkiew (talk) 05:12, 10 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Snells Law Wavefronts

Reason

This file is not only public domain; it's also open (MATLAB) source. It's at least as elegant and informative as a prior winner: Pi-unrolled-720.gif. It's also made by a Wikipedian with many contributions to the commons.

Articles this image appears in

Snell's law, Index of Refraction

Creator

Oleg Alexandrov

• Support as nominator --Clarknova (talk) 06:51, 1 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Simple yet informative.--HereToHelp ^{(talk to me)} 17:41, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Is there a way to turn it off? Durova^Charge! 19:31, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Hit 'Esc'. Oleg Alexandrov (talk) 23:45, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    • Seriously, it might be a good idea with some of these animations to include a shutoff option for people who suffer from epilepsy, migraines, or other neurological conditions. Durova^Charge! 00:26, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
      • Or who will... Fletcher (talk) 04:38, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support but I don't see why the caption need be restricted to refractive indicies and light since Snell's law can be applied to other waves too. Noodle snacks (talk) 11:43, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • That's the most used case, and there is no need to be fully general. As long as the reader is given a simple and clear explanation, that should be good enough even if it is not the most all-encompassing. Oleg Alexandrov (talk) 15:57, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    • Actually I agree with Noodle Snacks. When I first read the caption, "speed of light" irked me because it makes the image sound like it is only applicable to light waves. This could leave some lay readers to think it doesn't affect any other type of wave, including every other type of radiation wave. I would suggest a minor rewrite:
      Wavefronts from a point source in the context of Snell's law. The region below the gray line has a higher index of refraction and proportionally lower wave velocity than the region above it. (Previously used commas unnecessary)
      I feel as if the red dotted line should also be mentioned in the caption, but I don't know how to incorporate it. I also added the image to index of refraction, where it now sits nicely as the main image of the page. I will support this image if the caption can be updated and generalized. ~ ωαdεstεr16_«talk^stalk» 18:39, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
      • You still have to be careful as the refractive index is only applicable to the light case. I'd reword the caption for Snell's law to generalise it by omitting the refractive index, or moving to the end a "In the case of light...". Either of the current proposed captions would work fine as is in Refractive Index. Noodle snacks (talk) 23:36, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
        • Index of refraction clearly states that it is applicable to sound waves as well. Snell's Law states it is applicable to "light or other waves". Granted both articles are poorly referenced, but if I remember correctly from college physics, Snell's Law and index of refraction are not limited to light. And if it is (and proven), using the term light is a bit loaded and should be replaced with electromagnetic radiation since I also don't remember a limitation set to the visible spectrum. ~ ωαdεstεr16_«talk^stalk» 06:46, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
          • Quite right, I do apologise as I am somewhat ill. Noodle snacks (talk) 07:02, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
            • Snell's law is applicible to just about any type of wave who's velocity is dependent on the medium the wave travels through. As to the inclusion of the red line in the caption, I propose this as caption:
              Wavefronts from a point source in the context of Snell's law. The region below the gray line has a higher index of refraction and proportionally lower wave velocity than the region above it. The dotted red line is perpendicular to the wavefronts and thus represents a Fermat-shortest path from the source to a point in the lower medium.
              If it is somehow possible to incorporate the fact that the wavefronts in the lower medium are hyperbolic rather than spherical, I'm all for it. Fransw (talk) 21:24, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Promoted File:Snells_law_wavefronts.gif --Wronkiew (talk) 05:07, 10 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Mazda6/Mazda Atenza

Reason

OK, so like with recent noms some people will say 'it's just a car', but I personally think this goes beyond requirements for car photos - please view fullsize. Sharp across the vehicle at 17 megapixels, clean car and photo, good setting, good composition, good use of DOF, good details (you can see individual flecks in the metallic paint!), pleasant reflections on the vehicle, etc, along with full encyclopaedic details of car (model, year, etc). Far higher res than I usually upload - you could print this as a poster - but I'm guessing the only people likely to use this commercially are Mazda, and surely they'd take their own photos :-).

Articles this image appears in

Mazda Atenza

Creator

jjron

• Support as nominator --jjron (talk) 13:17, 1 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment There are a few dust spots/birds that need cloning: Above and slightly left of the antenna, left and horizontally inline with the rear spoiler, two either side of a line going vertically up near the RHS intersection between A-Pillar and bonnet. There is also a faint stitching? band in the sky just to the left of the front mazda logo with another splodge on its left. You also probably need to tastefully apply a little blur in the foreground to hide the stitching lines due to the change in focus point with each shot. All easily fixable. I'll support after that, my only real criticism is the front of the car being in shade. Noodle snacks (talk) 20:31, 1 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • I agree about the couple of dust blobs, but I don't see a stitching band in the sky. What I do see is a stitching error on the driver's side pillar. Not a significant one, but probably worth fixing. Also, I find the shadow detail on the bonnet a bit dark (more so in the thumbnail than at full res though). Did you shoot RAW and if so, could you perhaps lighten it? None of this is enough for me to oppose, but hey, they're fairly easily fixed so I can ask, can't I? :-) Diliff | (Talk) (Contribs) 22:22, 1 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    • Here is a small contrast enhanced version which highlights the band. I can't see the drivers side error, I can only see possible a stitching error on the passenger side A-Pillar but I think it is just the intersection of two trim pieces. Noodle snacks (talk) 07:41, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
      • Ah yeah, I see it, very slight though. Stitching error on the driver's side B pillar is here. Oh, and what are those three blobs sitting on the top of the bonnet just to the left of the clouds? They don't look like dust as they're not quite circular, and it would be a coincidence for three to be sitting in a row on the bonnet like that. They look more like the effect of the clone tool clipping the bonnet, but I could be wrong. Diliff | (Talk) (Contribs) 11:38, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support. More than enough detail, good angle. Very reminiscent of Capital Photographer's baptism of fire nomination, actually. ;-) Good luck, product shots seem to attract a lot more scrutiny than the average FP. I guess being easily shot, they need to be almost perfect. Diliff | (Talk) (Contribs) 22:22, 1 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support per Diliff. Was it taken on sloping ground? Durova^Charge! 18:28, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment Agree with above suggestions on exposure: the hood (bonnet?) seems too dark, and I can just barely make out the metalwork of the lower grille - some of it may be altogether black. Otherwise would be inclined to support. Fletcher (talk) 04:35, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment What's with the focus transitions on the ground? Was the focus adjusted between shots? Thegreenj 06:09, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Good quality, resolution and EV. Is it tilted or shot on a slope? Muhammad(talk) 15:42, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Weak support, but support nonetheless. A pretty image, and certainly valuable as a hi-res image. But I don't like how the car is tilted down the hill. I assume that the steering wheel is on the right-hand side of this car since it is in Australia, but I can't tell from the angle of this shot. Spikebrennan (talk) 14:41, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Replies - sorry, had not been on since nominating this until last night. Thanks for comments (and pedantic observations!). Have uploaded a 'corrected' version over the top of the original (I don't think that's a problem since it was just touching up minor errors). From the top:
  • I don't think the spots identified by NS were that significant but have fixed them regardless - FWIW they weren't dust spots, there were a lot of insects about and the 'spots' were mostly out of focus bugs flitting through the shot, some frames (I took more than just this set) had birds in the bg too as suggested, I fixed some before uploading, but must have missed those ones, so well picked out.
  • Re the stitching band in the sky I honestly can't make that out without cranking the contrast right up (perhaps you have a 'contrastier' monitor or something), and even then it's minor, so in the end I haven't changed that because I can't see it.
    • If you could be bothered (and I doubt you can), you can use an adjustment layer in photoshop to jack the contrast so you can see what you are doing, without effecting the image itself. I believe my monitors are accurate and fairly well calibrated. Noodle snacks (talk) 02:33, 10 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
      • Yeah, I thought of that today actually, but uploading this takes about an hour on my connection, so you're right, I can't really be bothered :-). Your monitors are probably fine, but nonetheless different well adjusted monitors can display a bit differently seemingly. That Diliff couldn't really make it out either indicates that it's pretty minor. Or maybe you've just got sharp eyes. --jjron (talk) 14:14, 10 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Not sure what you wanted done with the foreground, I didn't find it too significant, but have applied a small feathered Gaussian blur across the bottom to try to make it a more consistent transition. Re Thegreenj, yes focus was adjusted across the shot, otherwise it would be like other car photos where the focus falls off across the image. Shooting from this angle relatively close to an object and then stitching is quite a different matter to a 'normal' stitch where you're usually distant from the object and/or stitching lengthways across the object.
  • Yes, Diliff was right re the stitching error on the B-pillar (dammit, I actually fixed another one just near that so don't know how I missed that one!), I have fixed it up, hopefully to your liking.
  • Re the shadows, yes it was shot in RAW, but I find lightening it up makes the brightly reflecting parts too bright, and I'm not really expert enough in editing RAW to alter just the shadow areas. Lifting them much beyond this in Photoshop tends to bring in too much noise, so this was what I eventually settled on. As Diliff said, I think it 'seems' more of an issue at smaller sizes than it really is.
  • Re the proposed stitching error on the passenger side A-pillar, as suggested that is a join in the interior trim (I saw that before uploading the first time and actually went and rechecked not the just the original photo but the car itself).
  • Re the three blobs on the bonnet to the left of the clouds, I'm not sure what you were referring to - there were three grey blobs/streaks which were there in both the original photos that overlapped in that section of the stitch, I wondered what they were too, but I think it was some grey cloud just poking up behind the bonnet, they did look a bit odd even if natural, so have edited them out.
  • Re the ground, yes it was sloping slightly, I don't think the shot's tilted (the clouds look level). As can be seen this is at the top of a hill. To get the background I wanted without distracting trees etc there was only a pretty limited angle of shot, and using the 100mm I was already back in the bush heading down the other side of the hill. Bringing the car forward onto flatter ground meant I couldn't take it with that lens and thus lost the effect. This limited angle also affected the lighting. I agree I would have preferred the front around a little more into the sunlight, but doing so meant that either I took the car almost front on, rather than the preferred 3/4 front/side angle, or I shifted the camera around and lost the clean background. And this is about as good as I'm going to get it there, this is looking north/north-east and was taken late afternoon within a day or two of the summer solstice, meaning that this as far south as the sun's going to provide the ideal lighting. I would have used some fill flash if I had the gear, but atm can't shoot flash off-body.
  • Re Spike - yes right hand drive. In fact you can see both the instrument panel 'hump' in front of the driver (even at image page size) and the steering wheel itself, and I think you can tell which side they're on (but then again I know where they are).

Thanks again for everyone's time. --jjron (talk) 12:07, 9 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• Support Still one splodge on the sky seam line though :P Noodle snacks (talk) 02:33, 10 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Promoted File:2003 Mazda6 GG Classic Hatch, McMillans Lookout, Vic, 21.12.2008.jpg --Wronkiew (talk) 05:07, 10 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Singel, Amsterdam

Reason

A restored image of a famous part of Amsterdam, which can't be rephotographed. Except for the Munttoren and some merchant's houses in the background all buildings have been broken down in the last century and replaced.

Articles this image appears in

Amsterdam, Singel and Munttoren

Creator

Massimo Catarinella

• Support as nominator --Massimo Catarinella (talk) 15:46, 1 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment Lovely photochrom. Please upload the original version under a separate filename, link to it from both the nomination and the restored file, and include notes on the specific types of edits performed. Use File:Archangel reindeer3.jpg or File:St Alexander's Church2.jpg as examples. Restored featured picture nominations should always be carefully documented. Durova^Charge! 19:09, 1 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I did as you requested me to. --Massimo Catarinella (talk) 20:19, 1 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Support Thank you very much. Fine restoration. :) Durova^Charge! 01:18, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• Support (although does not like the caption on the bottom of the image)--Caspian blue 08:11, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment can anybody crop the bottom line ? M.K. (talk) 13:06, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I can, but it is part of the EV... --Massimo Catarinella (talk) 14:50, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I know other FP's have kept it for enc, as well... I can't find it right now, but I remember it was a synagogue. Spencer^T♦C 22:53, 9 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Here: Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/Synagogue at Nuremberg. Spencer^T♦C 22:54, 9 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• support nice fake colors! de Bivort 19:01, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• support GerardM (talk) 18:30, 8 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Pretty houses in the back. Spencer^T♦C 03:06, 10 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Promoted File:AmstelAmsterdamNederland.jpg --Wronkiew (talk) 04:57, 10 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Gothic plate armour

Reason

A period illustration of a knight in Gothic plate armour. From a hand tinted woodcut, late fifteenth century. Restored version of File:Gothic armor.jpg.

Articles this image appears in

Knight, Gothic plate armour, Gorget

Creator

Anton Sorg

• Support as nominator --Durova^Charge! 01:49, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support --Massimo Catarinella (talk) 21:22, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Weak Support Great picture. Weak support because EV not as strong as an actual photo of a Gorget or Gothic plate armour would be. Makeemlighter (talk) 03:32, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • What period illustrations show better than anything else is how the armor was worn, and with what accessories (or lack thereof). Surcoats and tabards were standard in some eras, unused in others. Durova^Charge! 03:52, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    • But that's nothing that a modern photograph that gave dated its portrayal couldn't show. I honestly don't think that older illustrations have greater EV for their subjects. Greater appeal, perhaps, for matching and the historical value, but not necessarily better value for showing the equipment itself and how it was used. Thegreenj 04:09, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• oppose per makemlighter. The extra detail of the full rez over the thumb does not tell us about armor, or even accessories. If you found an article for it along the lines of medieval watercoloring then I think it would have high EV. de Bivort 18:56, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support - We want a variety of sources so we can look at this from many perspectives. We can have a watercolour, and still have a picture. Both will add value. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 18:09, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support, per nom. If you can believe it, the Knight article only has two illustrations (including this one). Spikebrennan (talk) 14:37, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Promoted File:Gothic armor 2.jpg --Wronkiew (talk) 04:54, 10 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Jamison Valley, Blue Mountains

Reason

High resolution and encyclopaedic view along the Jamison Valley on a sunny day, showing the exposed cliffs and the dense bushland common to the Blue Mountains in Australia.

Articles this image appears in

Blue Mountains (Australia) and New South Wales

Creator

User:Diliff

• Support as nominator --Diliff | (Talk) (Contribs) 16:54, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support --Massimo Catarinella (talk) 21:22, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support excellent view of the geography. Fletcher (talk) 23:37, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support very nice detailed photograph. —Krm500 ^{(Communicate!)} 01:04, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support per all the above. Durova^Charge! 03:17, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Good quality and EV. Much better than the old version :) Muhammad(talk) 11:34, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Promoted File:Jamison Valley, Blue Mountains, Australia - Nov 2008.jpg --Wronkiew (talk) 04:52, 10 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Scandinavia in winter

Reason

High resolution, high quality NASA satellite photo

Articles this image appears in

Ice age, Scandinavia, Scandinavian Peninsula, Climate of the Nordic countries, Östersund

Creator

NASA

• Support as nominator --Spencer^T♦C 17:26, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Lovely. Durova^Charge! 19:26, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support --Massimo Catarinella (talk) 21:20, 2 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support - Nice, you can almost see my house. ;) TheLeftorium 00:16, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support - Most definitely ~ ωαdεstεr16_«talk^stalk» 00:17, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support - Very nice, sharp as heck too. Would prefer without the border line though. --Chasingsol^(talk) 21:52, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support - Beautiful image with high quality.--Caspian blue 08:10, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support - nice image, M.K. (talk) 13:03, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support. Large, detailed, and informative. NauticaShades 20:42, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support useful and informative image with a good caption (even if it was borrowed from NASA). Fletcher (talk) 00:29, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Though edited for space, clarity, and excessive detail. Spencer^T♦C 01:04, 7 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• Support. Gorgeous. Spikebrennan (talk) 14:35, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support & Question It's an absolutely stunning image in terms of detail. The question part is this: Off the coast of norway, in the patch of ocean not covered by clouds, there are several straight lines visible (best at full resolution). Are these image artifacts, or something else? Fransw (talk) 21:01, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Well, unless they are perfectly parallel waves, they are probably due to image stitching. vlad§inger ^tlk 00:54, 7 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I considered that already, but they do seem to be (near)perfectly parallel. They are indeed, as Vladsinger states, not very noticable at normal size viewing, but they do become clearly noticable on fullsize view. Fransw (talk) 22:29, 7 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• Support above issue hardly noticeable. vlad§inger ^tlk 00:55, 7 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Promoted File:Scandinavia.TMO2003050.jpg --Wronkiew (talk) 04:52, 10 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

American Empire

Reason

A high resolution historic caricature with encyclopedic value in several articles. Restored version of File:Puck cover2.jpg.

Articles this image appears in

Spanish-American_War#Aftermath, American Empire, Puck (magazine)

Creator

Ehrhart, S. D. (Samuel D.), ca. 1862-ca. 1920, artist. (from Dalrymple, Louis, 1866-1905, artist.)

• Support as nominator --Durova^Charge! 00:12, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Very nice. Good EV in Puck (magazine) and American Empire. Makeemlighter (talk) 03:29, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support cute EV for American Empire, does well in the thumb too. de Bivort 18:51, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support per Makeem. Fletcher (talk) 00:20, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support very good image Wandalstouring (talk) 08:28, 7 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Promoted File:Puck cover2.jpg --Wronkiew (talk) 04:43, 10 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Black Soldier flies Mating

Reason

Good quality, high resolution with encyclopedic value, contributing to an article which previously had no images showing this stage of the insect's life.

Articles this image appears in

Hermetia illucens

Creator

Muhammad

• Support as nominator --Muhammad(talk) 11:04, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Good EV and reasonable quality but I think you can achieve greater sharpness in this and your other insect contributions given your equipment and settings. Are you using the "bicubic sharper" algorithm when downsampling? You might also try a small amount of 1px radius smart sharpening. If you are at all the practical type then a homemade softbox for your flash would soften the lighting and improve the quality of these shots too. Noodle snacks (talk) 11:39, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • I use the bicubic (best for reduction) {best for smooth gradient) option. Would you reccomend the bicubic sharpening? Muhammad(talk) 17:05, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    • Bicubic Sharper (Best for reduction) is how it is written in photoshop, maybe try a little sharpening post downsample then. Noodle snacks (talk) 23:23, 3 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    • Yeah, the bicubic {best for smooth gradient) would give pretty soft results in comparison to the other algorithm. Noodle snacks (talk) 06:43, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support. Good, detailed image. Shadow doesn't really affect the central subject. Papa Lima Whiskey (talk) 11:57, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• weak support good enc, lighting would be greatly improved with some flash more diffusion. de Bivort 18:47, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support - Given the difficulty of the shot, I think we can overlook the slight flaws related to the flash. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 18:01, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Weak Support Another one where the lighting is a bit strong -- but EV is even stronger. Fletcher (talk) 00:17, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support great capture! 20:44, 10 January 2009 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by TAway (talk • contribs)

Promoted File:Black soldier flies mating.jpg --Wronkiew (talk) 06:25, 12 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Cannon with gabions

Reason

When illustrating historical concepts it's informative to have illustrations from that period. This comes from an engineering treatise published in 1588. Restored version of File:Sixteenth Century Cannon.jpg.

Articles this image appears in

Cannon, Siege#Age_of_gunpowder, Gabion

Creator

Agostino Ramelli

• Support as nominator --Durova^Charge! 03:10, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support for the encyclopedic value. M.K. (talk) 13:00, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• support, should the darks be made a bit darker? One wonders how they could get the perspective so off. de Bivort 18:44, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • You've never seen one of my drawings then...--HereToHelp ^{(talk to me)} 00:25, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Good technicals and enc value.--HereToHelp ^{(talk to me)} 00:25, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Excellent restoration work, and this is from before perspective was really understood, (at least, widely). Most art from this period appears like this - basically, the mind is very good at rotating objects, so that we can identify, say, a chair from any angle - but an artist needs to turn that automatic ability off in order to get perspective right. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 17:57, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support I like the quality and EV. Fletcher (talk) 00:04, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Good encyclopedic value. A302b (talk) 09:39, 10 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Promoted Image:Sixteenth Century Cannon2.jpg --Muhammad(talk) 06:11, 12 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Pin tumbler locks

Without a key in the lock, the driver pins (blue) are pushed downwards, preventing the plug (yellow) from rotating.

When an incorrect key is inserted into the lock, the key pins (red) and driver pins (blue) do not align with the shear line; therefore, it does not allow the plug (yellow) to rotate.

When the correct key is inserted, the gaps between the key pins (red) and driver pins (blue) align with the edge of the plug (yellow).

With the gaps between the pins aligned with the shear line, the plug (yellow) can rotate freely.

Reason

I feel that this image shows how pin tumbler locks in a very easy-to-understand way. I am proposing these images as a ((FeaturedPictureSet)).

Articles this image appears in

Pin tumbler lock

Creator

--Pbroks13^talk?

• Support as nominator ----Pbroks13^talk? 08:47, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support. Fairly easy to understand, particularly with the captions. A good diagram set and very informative. Diliff | (Talk) (Contribs) 12:41, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Excellent illustration of the concept. Durova^Charge! 18:18, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support though I would prefer a rasterized format over unreliable svg. de Bivort 18:39, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Why do you say that vector images are unreliable? --Pbroks13^talk? 19:13, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    • SVG renders differently on different browsers and has font embedding isssues. Your images looked ok on my screen though. de Bivort 23:48, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
      • We just delisted raster versions, although now we can make higher-rez rasters.--HereToHelp ^{(talk to me)} 00:31, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
      • That is very true, SVGs do tend to have font issues; however, they can be eliminated quite easily. Overall, SVG images are considered superior to (most) raster images. --Pbroks13^talk? 03:59, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
        • People always say this, and then it's easy to find person X with browser Y that can't see half the fonts, or they render ugly. Raster is easier, and I don't really care about *infinite* scalability. de Bivort 17:08, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
          • Yeah I agree with you, although it is also fairly trivial to render a raster image at at least 3000x2000ish, making it more than enough for just about any practical publishing use, a lot of people seem to create them at unreasonably low res. Diliff | (Talk) (Contribs) 18:42, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Very enc, informative SVGs.--HereToHelp ^{(talk to me)} 00:28, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Per above. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 17:51, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support per Diliff. Fletcher (talk) 23:46, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support impressive. Spencer^T♦C 01:49, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment I think these images can be, and should be, made into 1 or 2 images. You would lose nothing on technical grounds, and the sole page they are used on looks cumbersome. smooth0⁷0₇ (talk) 04:26, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Strong Support Hey! I understand the Pin tumbler lock now. Makeemlighter (talk) 04:44, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support - Nice and clear -- Alvesgaspar (talk) 15:12, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support But I'd like to see the colour of the incorrect key changed, IMHO there isn't enough contrast between it and and the rotated correct key directly below (since the lighting makes that dark grey) Noodle snacks (talk) 01:07, 7 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support - very descriptive images. Jauerback^dude?/_dude. 14:42, 7 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose this as a featured set (and the concept of featured sets), Support if it is merged into a single image. It's far more usable, both in articles and as a reference for users to download if it's just one image. Can always link from the image page to separate images. --jjron (talk) 13:52, 9 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • That could work, but that would mean that the caption would be incredibly long. And, I think that the descriptive captions really help with explaining the images. However, if you can figure a way to make it work with one image, please let me know. --Pbroks13^talk? 19:16, 9 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    • Sure. Refer to my merged FP 'set' File:Nectarine Fruit Development.jpg and its article usage. If images really belong in a set, this is how I believe they should be done - as one image. For yours, being as it's such a prominent part of that article, there's no reason the article itself couldn't contain a lengthy description which refers specifically to this image (aka the caption). --jjron (talk) 15:11, 10 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
      • But how could you combine the zoom sequences of the Mandelbrot set|200px set? Mathematically, they are all part of the same subject, but I do not consider an such a large image (petapixels and gigabytes) a viable alternative. The community felt that the standalone image was iffy, but the zoom sequence was superb.--HereToHelp ^{(talk to me)} 18:13, 10 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Promoted File:Pin tumbler with key.svg --Wronkiew (talk) 06:32, 12 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

File:Pin tumbler bad key.svg

File:Pin tumbler with key.svg

File:Pin tumbler unlocked.svg

Were promoted as well. seresin ( ¡? )  09:58, 17 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Golden Stag Beetle

Reason

Sharp, well lit, good EV - all the attributes of an FP

Articles this image appears in

Stag beetle

Creator

Fir0002

• Support as nominator --Fir0002 10:55, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support. I'm assuming the 'armour' of the beetle is iridescent and so the colour is hard to get accurate, but it does look a bit peculiar. Other than that though, good capture. You certainly have a backlog of images from summer '07! Diliff | (Talk) (Contribs) 12:39, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Yeah it was iridescent (as de Bivort mentioned below) which made getting the lighting right very challenging! And yes I do have a large backlog from 07 and I'm keeping busy this summer too ;-) --Fir0002 00:37, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support big honkin' beetle with fearsome maws and near-glowing backside. Good work again, Fir. Durova^Charge! 18:17, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Suport - lovely. Re: Diliff - yes, many scarabs have physical iridescence. de Bivort 18:36, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Good details and lighting. Muhammad(talk) 21:00, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support DOF could have been more perfect, but the characteristic feature is very well captured. Papa Lima Whiskey (talk) 16:52, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Weak Support EV seems very good, although the lighting seems rather harsh. Fletcher (talk) 23:43, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support - DOF is good enough, lots of EV and I love how the lighting and iridescence work together; makes him look part Fabergé - Peripitus (Talk) 12:33, 9 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Weak Oppose The flash or lighting seems a bit strong to me. A302b (talk) 09:49, 10 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support another fine shot! TAway (talk) 20:49, 10 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support High quality and good EV. Makeemlighter (talk) 04:36, 11 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Promoted File:Golden stag beetle.jpg --Wronkiew (talk) 06:32, 12 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

George Washington Carver

Reason

Probably the most distinguished African-American scientist of the first half of the twentieth century. Insightful portrait from the end of George Washington Carver's life by Arthur Rothstein. The eyes speak volumes. Restored version of File:George Washington Carver unrestored.jpg.

Articles this image appears in

George Washington Carver

Creator

Arthur Rothstein

• Support as nominator --Durova^Charge! 19:41, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Good EV and flowers add to the composition. Muhammad(talk) 20:50, 4 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Seems fitting for a botanist. :) Durova^Charge! 01:47, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment Noisy at high res, particularly in the face. The suit, by comparison is (sadly?) captured exceptionally well. There are also several spots on the subject's face (especially one on the LHS, on the side of his head) whose providence is doubtful. They could be skin blemishes, but could easily be spots on the photograph as well. Shadows are lacking in contrast in spite of not being lifted much against the original. Also, I'm not a fan of this notion that glowing or otherwise remarkable eyes help in winning academic accolades, but that's irrelevant to the assessment of the picture. Papa Lima Whiskey (talk) 16:47, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Film grain. Durova^Charge! 17:33, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support His skin pores are fairly visible - typical of a man as old as he is - but I don't see overt "noise" beyond that necessary within a photograph of this era. George Washington Carver is, of course, highly important and encyclopedic - his research revolutionised agriculture, and pretty much directly led to all the peanut products that we now eat - in addition to all his other discoveries. A true genius, and a highly notable person. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 17:42, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support This is as much a question of how to view photos optimally on this page as a comment on the photo.First try as I might I can’t adjust my monitor and video card so that I can see 3 black blobs as apparently I should (though I remember I could do this on my old computer).Despite this I have spent the day fiddling with photos and the print out mostly as they look on the screen.This photo looks poor on my monitor with no shadow detail.Downloaded at full res and viewed in paint shop pro it immediately looks better without doing anything.The histogram shows there is a good range of tones.Take the gamma up to 1.15 and it probably looks as the photographer intended. The pin stripes in the jacket are just visible but the skin tones are still dramatic. Take the gamma any higher and it gets blander.How your monitor is set up obviously makes a big difference to this picture. Viewed as it should be it is a fine photo. I can see no grain at all. I agree the face is slightly pock marked but this adds character.So firstly I would vote for this as a featured picture my only doubt being a lot of people won’t be able to see it properly and secondly I would like to ask what I can do about my monitor (short of buying a more expensive one.)Dave59 (talk) 22:52, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

91.105.11.98 (talk) 22:23, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• • Hi, thanks very much for the comments. The grain is most visible on the brick wall at right. Try viewing at 200-300%. And I thought the jacket was a tweed. Best regards, Durova^Charge! 22:57, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Looks like an interesting, encyclopedic, high quality portrait. I don't think it's excessively grainy. Fletcher (talk) 23:42, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support per nom. Spikebrennan (talk) 14:33, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• weak support - i really don't like the composition. It seems too tightly cropped on both sides. de Bivort 23:01, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Weak Oppose I agree with deBivort about the crop being too tight. Also, I find the flower in the foreground very distracting. If this is such a great portrait, why isn't it the lead image in George Washington Carver? Makeemlighter (talk) 04:41, 11 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Because technical quality isn't the only factor when choosing a lead image. The lead image from the article shows Carver during a more active part of his career. This is the end of his life. Durova^Charge! 16:57, 11 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Promoted File:George Washington Carver2.jpg --Wronkiew (talk) 06:33, 12 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Richard Stallman

Reason

It's a valued image Wikimedia Commons

Articles this image appears in

Creator

ComputerHotline

• Support as nominator --ComputerHotline (talk) 17:41, 9 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Strong Oppose/Speedy Close - It may be a Commons VI, but without even being in Richard Stallman it fails the first hurdle for EV. It also needs renaming as it is named for the photographer not the subject and has no caption here. Mfield (talk) 17:47, 9 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose - not in article, needs English caption/description, harsh lighting, extremely unflattering. —Vanderdecken∴ ∫ξφ 18:21, 9 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose His katana is not visible. [9] Fletcher (talk) 23:29, 9 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose Distracting background, too. Spencer^T♦C 02:54, 10 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose that man is not photogenic at all, sorry. Pstanton 07:39, 10 January 2009 (UTC)

• Irrelevant, mean. de Bivort 01:44, 11 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• oppose good detail, resolution, but flash is unappealing and it is overall too snapshotty.

Not promoted --Muhammad(talk) 06:58, 12 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

White-faced Heron, alternative

Reason

jjron suggested that this might be a worthy competitor to the currently nominated Egretta novaehollandiae Tasmania 3.jpg, and I have to agree.

Articles this image appears in

White-faced Heron

Creator

Glen Fergus

• Support as nominator --Papa Lima Whiskey (talk) 02:15, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment I'm not going to vote on this one since I'd probably get accused of COI or something. But jjron did also say "unfortunately the focus on that looks to have just missed". It is either out of focus or just very soft, not to mention noisy, I don't think it is close to the technical requirements. The background of this shot is clearer, particularly at thumbnail size, this is why I submitted it over my own image when I did a 5x expansion of the article for WP:DYK. But I still think the pair are complementary. Noodle snacks (talk) 08:45, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Weak Support Even if technical quality isn't perfect, I think the background is more pleasing and less distracting, making this image stand out to me more. Fletcher (talk) 23:37, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Weak Oppose. Sorry, I think it's an excellent picture, but the focus isn't right so doesn't meet FPC criteria. To me this is a perfect candidate for VPC rather than FPC and would support it if I saw it there. --jjron (talk) 13:57, 9 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Regretful Oppose The loss of detail due to the soft focus is a problem, and the noise likewise. I would suggest WP:VPC. Elucidate ^{(light up)} 19:23, 9 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Nominated at VPC. Noodle snacks (talk) 01:51, 10 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support I agree that this one is a better version. The bird stands out more and is much clearer to see. A302b (talk) 09:40, 10 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose I have better shots of this bird in sharp focus which I'll try upload soonish --Fir0002 01:18, 11 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Not promoted --Muhammad(talk) 15:28, 12 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Beck's Mill

Reason

Depicts an 19th century grain mill that has seen better days and has been neglected.

Articles this image appears in

Beck's Mill, also used in two featured portal

Creator

Bedford

• Support as nominator --King Bedford I ^{Seek his grace} 01:49, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Weak support - It's aesthetically okay, but at 100% I'm not enjoying the composition. Without the EV I probably wouldn't be able to support this pic. ₪Ceran →(cheer→chime →carol) 01:56, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose Soft, blown highlights and bleeding, huge tilt, CA all over the place, it should be a WP:VPC candidate, not a FP one. The large number of images in google of this building suggest that a decent version in its original or unrestored state should be available somewhere. Noodle snacks (talk) 11:18, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• There are several pictures free to use on the article page. Would one of those be better?--King Bedford I ^{Seek his grace} 07:22, 7 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• Oppose per Noodle snacks. Papa Lima Whiskey (talk) 13:21, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose. Assuming that the building is still standing, I suggest re-shooting with a professional camera on a day with better lighting. Spikebrennan (talk) 14:31, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• The picture is before the mill was restored. It now looks like this.--King Bedford I ^{Seek his grace} 07:22, 7 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Wow, they restored that thing to death. Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 21:30, 8 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Yep, they did one heck of a good charge. Still, I can't believe they charge $5 to go into it. I'm glad I was able to get Before, During, and After photos nicely showing the changes.--King Bedford I ^{Seek his grace} 21:50, 8 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• Oppose per the points mentioned by Noodle snacks above. — Aitias // discussion 03:17, 7 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment Could be a good candidate for the valued image program? Durova^Charge! 17:02, 7 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose Yeah, shame about the blown highlights and chromatic abberation. I suggest nominating it at VPC, as it still has excellent EV. Elucidate ^{(light up)} 18:05, 8 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment Looks like no way this will pass. Oh well, it was my first attempt. I've uploaded over 800 pictures onto Wikipedia; one of them has to be FP worthy. Will definitely nominate to VPC.--King Bedford I ^{Seek his grace} 18:24, 8 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Do come back with your next good effort, or perhaps try picture peer review. Most of the regulars at FPC had a few misses when we started. Best wishes, and since you're MILHIST you might be interested in restoration? I've got plenty of material waiting for attention. Durova^Charge! 17:40, 9 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Not promoted --Muhammad(talk) 15:34, 12 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Nixon's Resignation Letter

Reason

In the aftermath of the Watergate Scandal President Richard M. Nixon lost the faith of the citizens of the United States, and after fighting a long and ultimately unsuccessful campaign to convince the public that he was not associated with the scandal Nixon yeilded to public demand and resigned the presidency, becoming the only serving U.S. President to do so. As such, this is the first (and to date only) letter ever submitted concerning the resignation of a president, a rare and historical find that I feel deserves an FP star.

Articles this image appears in

United States Secretary of State, Watergate scandal, Twenty-fifth Amendment to the United States Constitution, Richard Nixon

Creator

Richard Nixon / United States Government

• Support as nominator --TomStar81 (Talk) 03:11, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support I think this picture really portrays some of the history of the Watergate Scandal --jfk52917, future US Senator (talk) 03:34, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support - While the image is a bit small, I support it for its superior EV. I also added it to Richard Nixon, where it also belongs. ~ ωαdεstεr16_«talk^stalk» 04:32, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support alternative 1 Top EV. (Altering to support the higher resolution version). Durova^Charge! 09:14, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support alt #1Comment. I thought about nomming this myself, but it seems kind of blurry. Is this really the best resolution of the document available anywhere? Spikebrennan (talk) 15:19, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose Hang on guys, this is a bunch of text on a piece of paper. What about this could possibly be a featured picture? Papa Lima Whiskey (talk) 16:38, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • We have text FPs of the Declaration of Independence, the United States Constitution, the Edwin Smith papyrus, Emile Zola's J'accuse letter, and both the German and Japanese instruments of surrender from World War II. Durova^Charge! 17:48, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    • Consensus can change and be put to the test, and just because one document has been approved doesn't mean every one in that genre has to be featured. Papa Lima Whiskey (talk) 00:50, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Conditional Support - Only if we start a new FP category for Documents. Kaldari (talk) 19:07, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • I have no problem with a FP category for documents. Shall we work on consensus guidelines for featuring documents, as distinct from other kinds of images? Spikebrennan (talk) 01:26, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    • I think that would be a good way forward. Papa Lima Whiskey (talk) 02:05, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support. Superb EV. NauticaShades 20:39, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Strong Oppose per Papa Lima Whiskey. If the image showed the scene of Nixon signing the letter, or announcing it to people (with acceptable quality), I would definitely support, but just the text?? Nope. --Caspian blue 20:54, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Featured text pictures

c. 1600 B.C.	1787	1823	1898	1945	1945

Four featured text image are manuscripts while two images such as the German instrument of surrender and J'accuse are pressed by machines. The dates of them are also older than the 1974 image.--Caspian blue 23:17, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Half and half, Caspian. The Japanese document was written on a different sort of typewriter. And mere age doesn't make a historic image more or less important. This is the only United States president in history to resign from office. Durova^Charge! 06:10, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Well, I carefully checked the Japanese document, but I do not believe it was a production from a typewriter. Age is also an important factor to judge its value in historical and art pieces. Moreover I don't think the degree of the impact that the surrenders of Germany and Japan caused to the word is as same as the resignation letter of a president in a country.(of course, the country has been boasting her strong power after 20th century)--Caspian blue 18:57, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, it was a script typewriter. Here's a sample of how they produce.[10] Slightly different typeface on that model, but should convey the idea. Every instance of each letter is exactly the same; the indentations and lines are mechanically even. During the mid-twentieth century there were typewriters that didn't use courier typeface. Durova^Charge! 20:40, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The possibility of bias towards American topics is a valid concern, but the solution would be to expand our coverage of non-American topics, not to cripple our coverage of American ones. And I think you would be hard-pressed to argue the only resignation of a US president in over two hundred years was not a significant event in American history. Fletcher (talk) 00:14, 8 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Fletcher, if you've checked, the majority of our non-US text FPs are images I nominated. I'd certainly be glad to nominate other major historic resignations if they become available in high quality free licensed form. Durova^Charge! 02:18, 8 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, and there are plenty of heads of other states that have resigned in writing - some of whom will also have been the only one in their country to ever do so. Just to put some perspective back in. Papa Lima Whiskey (talk) 11:11, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• Oppose - Per above - Alvesgaspar (talk) 21:00, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support - An iconic letter with huge EV value. Skinny87 (talk) 21:08, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Oppose, too small for my liking (800px...), nominate for replacement and Support Alternative 1 - simply higher resolution, not sure why the original was the smaller version anyway. Obtained from the US Archives site. Caption needs to be enhanced, but undoubtedly an historic image. Even then a weak support, because it's only relevant next to a photo of him signing it - although the signed letter itself is more encyclopaedic than just the text of the letter. —Vanderdecken∴ ∫ξφ 21:20, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Strong Support This seems very encyclopedic. As for the concerns about it being just text, I would say that Nixon's handwritten signature, Kissinger's notation and initials, and the White House letterhead are graphical elements that give it historical impact it wouldn't have if it were just a plain transcription of the letter. However, the caption does need improvement: I was a little confused why it was addressed to Kissinger, which is only explained if you follow the link to the National Archives (or if you have, you know, independent knowledge). Apparently, Nixon's presidency officially ended when Kissinger penned the "HK" on that note. Fletcher (talk) 23:34, 5 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Strong Support Lots of EV here. Makeemlighter (talk) 04:47, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Vast amounts of EV and a very good quality scan mean that this meets the FP criteria. Nick-D (talk) 07:30, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support What next? The Dead Sea Scrolls are "just text"? Shoemaker's Holiday (talk) 13:04, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

  Your comment seems like pointing at me. Don't exaggerate your feeling to mock people in disagreement with you. If I did not highly think of such old and valuable "manuscript" in history, I would not even send my time searching and organizing the images in the table above.--Caspian blue 18:57, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment I challenge the people who claim "vast amounts" or "lots" of EV to show me EV in this picture that can't be represented by text, and goes beyond the two signatures. For instance, can we crop it to the two signatures and it retains its EV? What Fletcher has pointed out can be told in two sentences, which doesn't really impress me against the saying that "a picture's worth a thousand words". I don't think this meets the definition of a picture. Papa Lima Whiskey (talk) 16:08, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment A picture may be worth a thousand words, but I don't think every picture requires a thousand words' description -- sometimes a picture is effective precisely in its simplicity. This picture is effective in showing an official process (Nixon's resignation) commonly described in words, but not seen. The brevity of the letter allows it to be seen, rather than just read. Indeed had Nixon rambled on for five pages rationalizing his actions, it would be far less effective as a picture (or set of pictures), being so dominated by text, and would probably not be very interesting. It's the stark banality of the letter, juxtaposed with the effect it had, that makes it an historically significant picture.Fletcher (talk) 14:24, 7 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    • The question we are asking is not whether Nixon should have rambled on. The question is whether this is a featurable "picture", and nothing so far has convinced me of that. And I doubt your stark banality comment can be referenced, so it will have no utility anywhere else on Wikipedia. The huge difference between this and the other FPs listed above is, of course, that no article could be written about the subject of the here nominated picture, whereas all the others have one. Papa Lima Whiskey (talk) 16:44, 7 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
      • It may be a matter of how one regards at these things, PLW. When some editors see restorations of historic engineering designs they ask for vector diagrams and consider it a waste of time that I put so much effort into paper grain. My formal training is in history rather than engineering, so my goal is to bring the reader back in time and let them imagine--even for a moment--that they're a patent agent in a world lit by candles registering the very first light bulb design. I'm one of the youngest people who remembers Watergate, remembers the 'I am not a crook' speech, remembers the discovery of a missing 18 minutes on the presidential tapes. It was as if the political world was crashing down, and no one knew how it would end. Suppose for a moment it's 1974 and you're a reporter for the Washington Post, or Speaker of the House, or Gerald Ford himself: the surprise and relief and the wonder that the resignation actually happened, followed by thoughts of What next? When an encyclopedia reader can see such an important document for themselves it's easier to imagine it in one's own hand; it makes that history so much more vivid. Maybe you don't view the information that way, but to those of us who do that's enormously valuable. Durova^Charge! 17:21, 7 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
      • I've given my opinion and you are free to disagree with it, although I don't understand the basis for your disagreement. I do not need to source my opinions given outside of article space, so I find that objection somewhat odd. I also note that the Criteria do not require a Featured Picture to have a standalone article dedicated to the particular subject. Although many FPs do have such an article, some do not, such as File:Cicatrices de flagellation sur un esclave.jpg, a picture of a whipped slave used in historical articles, for which there is no article for that particular person; for our purposes, the "subject" can be interpreted to be the topic of the article in which the image is used, just as, in this case, we do not need an article about the actual letter. Rather, the image should add value to the articles in which it's used, and as explained, it is illustrative of an historical event (regarding Watergate scandal, Richard Nixon; and also in United States Secretary of State by visually depicting an abstract process described in the text. I see less EV for the Twenty-fifth Amendment). Fletcher (talk) 00:09, 8 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
        • Then let me be more clear. There is absolutely no precedent for this nomination being approved, as the other scripts that are featured all have their own article. Papa Lima Whiskey (talk) 11:01, 8 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
          • Do be more clear then. Bring forth diffs of any conversation before this one where the supposed imperative of a separate article for text FPs was discussed. Durova^Charge! 15:25, 8 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
            • Not quite. The absence of an article demonstrates that this document does not have the necessary notability to have an article of its own (if you want to prove me wrong, write one, and reference it well with reliable sources), in addition to not really being a picture in the first place. Papa Lima Whiskey (talk) 23:43, 8 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
              • I think you've got completely the wrong idea about EV here PLW. An FP doesn't have to have an entire article based around it, it merely needs to contribute to an article and I think this document probably contributes significantly to many of the articles. You might disagree about documents vs photos etc, but it certainly seems like consensus is against you on this one, judging by the supports. Diliff | (Talk) (Contribs) 15:28, 9 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
                • Please stick to criticising my actual statements rather than putting words in my mouth. I defeated the notion that any of the above-listed documents constitute any sort of precedent for this nomination. It's not featurable, because it's not a picture. It's a jpeg copy of what in the modern day would be a Word document. The assumption that in the case of the other documents, an exception was made due to their extreme importance and notability is highly warranted, and equally the assumption that such an exception should not be made for this document because it's notability has not been demonstrated to the same extent (and btw, the word document comment does not apply to all the above, since some of them include handwriting that may in itself be interesting, or thoughtful laying out (I don't like "layouting")). I do not believe this belongs in the image category at all. If you've read along carefully, you'll have noticed that I'm not opposed in principle to a "Featured Documents" or some such category of featured content, but it will take several more days (being optimistic) until such a process is going to be running. Let me remind you that the huge difference between the two categories is that the majority of pictures proper can be understood by the illiterate (e.g. disabled people, children, and huge but decreasing portions of the developing world), while documents will be entirely unintelligible to those groups. And btw, just because you can read does not entitle you to belittle those groups. Try and remind yourselves why you're contributing to this project. Hopefully, it's not for self-aggrandisement, or if it is, please do a convincing job of hiding it. I'm absolutely genuine, honest, firm, and serious in that request. Thank you. Papa Lima Whiskey (talk) 19:08, 9 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
                  • Since you asked me to stop putting words in your mouth without actually providing any examples of exactly where I did so, I find it hard to respond to your request. By the sounds of things though, you're just playing semantics here. You absolutely did say "There is absolutely no precedent for this nomination being approved, as the other scripts that are featured all have their own article" and "The absence of an article demonstrates that this document does not have the necessary notability to have an article of its own". Any reasonable person would paraphrase that to mean that you believe that it should have an article based around it for it to be notable enough to be a FP. If this interpretation is wrong, then I think you are being particularly obscure in your argument. If it is right, then where exactly have I put words in your mouth? Anyway, back to the rest of your reply. You say it isn't a picture. Well I had a look at the dictionary and it has two particularly relevent definitions: "visual representation of a person, object, or scene, as a painting, drawing, photograph, etc" and "any visible image, however produced". I suspect that based on that definition, it clearly is a picture. Besides, this is a scan of a physical document with an actual inked signature on it. Word document texts are by definition encoded with alpha-numeric characters, not pixels. Your analogy is therefore incorrect. I think you're just making yourself look ridiculous again by insinuating that because I don't see the problem with this document being featured, that I want to belittle the illiterate and aggrandise myself! Please get off your high horse, and I'm absolutely genuine, honest, firm, and serious in that request too. :-) Diliff | (Talk) (Contribs) 21:35, 9 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
                    • It seems to me that you are wilfully ignoring the particular combination of things at work here. It is not a picture and in addition, does not seem to have any exceptional notability that would permit us to make an exception, as evidenced by the fact that no article has been written about the piece of paper here depicted, in stark contrast to the existing FPs that might be seen to fall into a similar category. Papa Lima Whiskey (talk) 23:16, 9 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
                      • To be honest, I think you're wilfully ignoring the indisputable fact that it is a picture, among other things. I find it impossible to have a discussion with someone who simply isn't on the same plane of reality as the rest of us. I give up. Diliff | (Talk) (Contribs) 23:44, 9 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
                        • With all due respect to inclusionism, scanning in a piece of printed text and uploading it as a jpeg does not make it a picture. Papa Lima Whiskey (talk) 23:52, 9 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
                          • It's been explained above what's wrong with this point of view. Granted, you can be entertaining when you improvise new rationalizations (yes, we must oppose the image for the sake of illiterate children in Uganda!) but now you're becoming a broken record. Fletcher (talk) 00:57, 10 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
                            • PLW, you posted a challenge in boldface and italics for people to explain what EV exists here that cannot be replicated within the article body. Several people have. You have not acknowledged merit to any of these positions--even within the scope of 'we'll agree to disagree'. You posted this request, so please articulate what sort of response you would respect. Durova^Charge! 03:04, 10 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
                              • I'm afraid your request is self-contradicting. I don't ask questions that I already know the answer to. Papa Lima Whiskey (talk) 17:17, 10 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
                                • Actually it's fairly often when editors engage in open discussion that they initiate a question with some sort of idea of the lines along which reasonable responses may lie. They might not always be persuaded by those responses, but the terms in which you phrased this--first a 'challenge', then later an assertion that you 'defeated' a notion, suggests a competitive orientation rather than normal editorial dialog. Durova^Charge! 01:51, 11 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
                                • (edit conflict) I've been asking for EV other than the thinly-baked, "well, it's a president resigning and it has his signature under it". It hasn't convinced me and will not, no matter how many times you repeat it. If you have anything new and interesting that directly relates to the piece of paper here depicted, please bring it forward, but again, of course you can say anything you like in FPC but if you can't reference it in an article, it has no bearing on the encyclopaedic value. Papa Lima Whiskey (talk) 01:57, 11 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support - no ambiguity in my mind. de Bivort 17:03, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
• Support Although this may be a picture of ink and paper, it is the event solidified. All of these documents are what allows the world to function; this one is no different. Granted, typed letters and signatures alone are not impressive or important, but that is just a small aspect of the whole concept represented by this document. To those who oppose, consider all consequences that this one paper embodies. It is far more than letter; it is the physical manifestation of the ideas behind the events and thinking of that time. That’s what a good picture does; it communicates ideas to the viewer. This is why I hope those who oppose might change their mind. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.12.165.120 (talk) 07:42, 7 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]