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The result was keep. postdlf (talk) 01:33, 17 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

List of American ethnic and religious fraternal orders[edit]

List of American ethnic and religious fraternal orders (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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Unencyclopedic. This article has serious bias issues that cannot be corrected in its current format, and I don't think we should be creating lists like this in the first place. It also has errors in information because 98% of it is sourced primarily from three out-of-date books. Here are some examples:

1. The author placed all the Jewish fraternal orders in the "Ethnic" category. I think that's open to debate, as it is a difficult issue, especially with respect to fraternal orders, and it's not something we should be debating here on WP.
2. There's both a "Hispanic" and "American Indian" section - we don't use those terms here. Likely the result of direct lifts from old texts, and not enough attention to fix it.
3. Examples of categorization issues of groups - The Knights of Pythias are not African-American; this list says they are. The Association Canado-Americaine is listed as "French", but it is obviously Canadian from the name, and in fact is said to be heavily Catholic, which might make it a) French-Canadian, or b) Catholic. The characterization of this list is causing this sort of interpretive problem.
4. The Teepee Order of America is listed as "American Indian", and then says it accepted anyone besides blacks and European immigrants, "Indian or non-Indian" (also a good example of the cut-and-paste work prevalent in the article). Also, the verbiage used, "Alleged Blackfeet Indian" is not correct.
5. African-American fraternal orders are often heavily influenced by specific religious beliefs, but that distinction is not made here either.
6. The author did, however, make sure to discriminate between three groups of Slavs. I am reasonably sure that was a personal distinction, as well, not present in the texts.
7. The Ruthenian section under one of the Slav headers is basically "Greek Catholic", so those groups have the same problems here as with the Jewish ones, where ethnic and religious aren't separable.
8. Extraneous information from sources where the author did something not germane to this article. "Attempts to contact by mail in the 1890s failed." "Attempts to contact in 1923 failed" etc.
9. Errors: Galilean Fishermen in African-American section: "Founded in 1856 in Washington, DC by Anthony S. Perpender. One of the oldest orders of its kind," except Prince Hall Freemasonry, also listed, dates to 1775!

The issues are pervasive and not correctable. MSJapan (talk) 23:28, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

OK, here is my point by point response:

1. The author placed all the Jewish fraternal orders in the "Ethnic" category. I think that's open to debate, as it is a difficult issue, especially with respect to fraternal orders, and it's not something we should be debating here on WP.

Jewish fraternal groups come in both religious and secular forms - ergo the Workmans Circle, which identifies itself as ethnically Jewish, but is a secular group as far as I am aware; see the larger discussion about Jewish ethnic and religious identity at Who is a Jew?

1. There's both a "Hispanic" and "American Indian" section - we don't use those terms here. Likely the result of direct lifts from old texts, and not enough attention to fix it.

Actually no, I choose those names. And there is no official WP that I am aware of to use different names.

1. Examples of categorization issues of groups - The Knights of Pythias are not African-American; this list says they are.

The Knights of Pythias link goes to an African American order of the Knights of Pythias. They were like the Prince Hall version of the K of P.

1. The Association Canado-Americaine is listed as "French", but it is obviously Canadian from the name, and in fact is said to be heavily Catholic, which might make it a) French-Canadian, or b) Catholic. The characterization of this list is causing this sort of interpretive problem.

This is a matter of semantics. "Association Canado-Americaine" was an organization of people of French descent (mostly Canadian) that was also Catholic. Its seems kind of pointless to distinguish between French American and French Canadian American. I believe that their primary ethnic self - identity is French;

1. The Teepee Order of America is listed as "American Indian", and then says it accepted anyone besides blacks and European immigrants, "Indian or non-Indian" (also a good example of the cut-and-paste work prevalent in the article). Also, the verbiage used, "Alleged Blackfeet Indian" is not correct.

I would refer you to the Historical dictionary of American Indian Movements, where I got this information, for the issues relating to this order.

1. African-American fraternal orders are often heavily influenced by specific religious beliefs, but that distinction is not made here either.

The same could be said for the European immigrant groups that often overlapped with sectarian identities ergo, Irish Catholic, German Lutheran etc.

I do not know what you mean by "specific religious beliefs" - none of these African-American fraternal orders were ever tied to any specific denomination that I am aware of, other than the Catholic Knights of Peter Claver

1. The author did, however, make sure to discriminate between three groups of Slavs. I am reasonably sure that was a personal distinction, as well, not present in the texts.

That is because there were alot of orders relating specifically to the different Slavic ethnic groups. Particularly Slovaks.

1. The Ruthenian section under one of the Slav headers is basically "Greek Catholic", so those groups have the same problems here as with the Jewish ones, where ethnic and religious aren't separable.

"Greek Catholic" also known as Uniate Catholic or Eastern Catholic is not an ethnic but a religious term - many of the Ruthenians were also members of Uniate Churches. When they immigrated to America alot of ethnic groups were tied closely with specific religious denominations, as were their fraternal order - the Irish Catholic Knights of Equity etc - these orders were for Ruthenians (also called Rusyns, Carpatho Russians etc) who were also members of the Greek Catholic rite; See Ruthenian Catholic Church

1. Extraneous information from sources where the author did something not germane to this article. "Attempts to contact by mail in the 1890s failed." "Attempts to contact in 1923 failed" etc.

Whats wrong with that? I went to the last time an attempt was made to contact the order, giving the reader a time frame in which it must have dissolved.

1. Errors: Galilean Fishermen in African-American section: "Founded in 1856 in Washington, DC by Anthony S. Perpender. One of the oldest orders of its kind," except Prince Hall Freemasonry, also listed, dates to 1775!

Yes it was one of the oldest orders of its kind - an African American fraternal order not linked to an earlier order such as freemasonry or Oddfellowship (Grand United Order of Oddfellows)

As for the sources, I'll admit Axelrod 1997 has its flaws, but Schmidt 1980 was a scholarly publication. Preuss and Stevens were the source for much of the information in both. When I could, I went to their sources. Whats the problem?--Bellerophon5685 (talk) 02:09, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The problem is the article, period. The sources are problematic and out-of-date. The classification is problematic to the point of not working at all. Justifying why something was the way it was still does not make it correct or in keeping with Wikipedia's policies. Referring me to an outside source in an AfD discussion to clarify something in the article doesn't make the article "correct", nor is it really an appropriate response - no one else reading the article is going to run to the original source either. Linking entries to the wrong pages and then making mistakes because of that is a problem - as with Freemasonry, there are two branches of Knights of Pythias, and the whole group was classified incorrectly because the article creator did no go far enough to verify the material. There's no justification there - it is absolutely incorrect. My concern is that much of the information I can verify from within the article or within WP, I have found to be wrong. What about the material I can't verify?

Also, as it is impossible that he personally was a member of all of these groups, the classification by the author (because this is essentially a one-person endeavor) of whether a group was more "ethnic" or "religious" is actually pretty arbitrary in those cases where there is overlap. Arbitrary classification of ethnic, religious, or fraternal groups is bias - end of story. The Workmen's Circle, by the way, isn't a Jewish fraternal order and never claimed to be - read the about page of one of the local ones - they specifically say religious background is irrelevant, and that they focus on social issues and cultural education. Claiming it as a "secular Jewish fraternal organization" and a reason to make the others ethnic as a result has no bearing on this article. Who is a Jew? is an article about self-identification, and isn't germane to this article either, because this isn't a self-identification problem. The Jews are only one example of the overlap problem - I've mentioned others, and have a few more below. It's very simple: if a group has a specific religious qualification, then it is religious. If it has a specific ethnic qualification, it is ethnic. If it isn't clear and can't be figured out, don't guess, because that's original research.

Now, the reason I pointed out the African-American orders as having religious components is because many of them are strongly tied to shared religion as an essential cultural component - as a result, there's less religious diversity in those groups without it being a specific religion's group. There is specific religion invoked in these groups, but it just so happens that that's culturally the way it is, so there's no overt religious qualification; it becomes such as the result of the underlying cultural assumptions. Why am I picky about French-Canadian? Because the term exists for a reason and claims its own distinct culture from the rest of Canada, as they go to great lengths to indicate. It is also a heavily Catholic group. The rest of Canada is primarily British and a mix of other religions. Again, it's an issue where religion and ethnicity may not be separable, but they've been separated here. Ancient Order of Hibernians? Listed as Irish here, but it's not; it's Irish Catholic only, so no Irish Protestants will be joining that organization.

The underlying classification scheme of this list simply doesn't work. When the distinctions in this list go away, the article becomes nothing more than a meaningless infodump from old books, and has no encyclopedic value.MSJapan (talk) 16:38, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

The Knights of Pythias link did not go to the overall K of P article, but to the section of that article about the Afro-American version. The Workmans Circle has always been a secular Jewish ethnic fraternal order. They may now allow non-Jews to join, like the Sons of Norway allow non-Norwegians to join, but that is what it is. Read World of our Fathers by Irving Howe. The cultural education you mention is of the Yiddisheit - the Eastern European Yiddish speaking ethnic Jews. They come from a heritage of socialist thought that was popular among them in Europe in the late 19th century and was brought over to America. I do not know if they consider themselves socialists anymore, but the divide between religious apolitical and non-religious socialist Jews was very real and was a factor in the creation of the order in the first place. In any event, all of the orders listed were founded for ethnic Jews.

Now you make a point about religious and ethnic overlap- if you knew anything about the history of European immigration to the US in the nineteenth and early 20th centuries then you would realize this is a red herring - different ethnic groups tied their cultural identities closely with their denominations - Scandinavians were Lutherans, Irish Catholic etc. However there were also religious minorities in these groups and secular ones. For instance, most Lithuanians were Catholic, but there was also the Lithuanian Workers Alliance which was secular, most Slovaks were also Catholic, but there was also one for Slovak Protestants; St. Patricks alliance was open to all Irish regardless of faith, while the other two were open only to Irish Catholics. All of the ethnic orders are listed based on their ethnic identities. When an order was open to all ethnicity of a certain religion then they are under religious orders. (In any case, many of these orders that are still around are now required to admit anyone, which has alot to do with changing laws, attitudes and assimilation of European immigrant identities - however they were founded to preserve and help these specific ethnic and/or religious groups. They are an important part of American history and that is why I created the page.)

I am still not quite sure what you are trying to say about the African-American orders relation to religion - some of them had religious aspects, like how the Masons use Biblical imagery, some were led by clergy which was important structure for the Black community then (and now), but I don't think any one of them was a specifically "religious" group. As for the difference between French-Americans and French-Canadian Americans - it still just strikes me as hairspliting and semantics. Most of the French ancestoried people in the US could probably count as French-Canadian Americans - the Cajuns who trekked from Acadia to Louisiana, the French communities in Vermont and New Hampshire - there are two French American orders, do you really think we need to split that into two category headings?

I really don't get what your point is. Yeah, ethnic and religious identity often over lap, but it is clear from looking at the list that orders that serve one ethnic group are in that ethnic category regardless of religious affiliation, those that serve religious groups regardless of ethnicity are under religion. What is so difficult to understand?--Bellerophon5685 (talk) 19:24, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

What is so hard to understand is that you say "orders that serve one ethnic group are in that ethnic category regardless of religious affiliation, those that serve religious groups regardless of ethnicity are under religion." and that is absolutely not the case in this article at all. Hibernians and The Order of the Teepee are clearly misplaced by your criteria for different reasons, and there are many groups that serve an ethnicity and a religion, not one or the other. However, I also see you're trying to turn this into a content dispute, and it isn't. I don't doubt that what you copied out of the books was what the books said. what I have a problem with is that you devised an arbitrarily wide division scheme to create a listdump article, and that scheme is the problem. MSJapan (talk) 19:40, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

The Order of the Teepee and the Ancient Order of Hibernians were created to serve the needs of specific communities. Yes, they began to allow others in, but that does not change what they were founded for. Read any history of the Workmens Circle - it was founded to help and preserve the culture of secular, socialist East European immigrants. The link that you send in fact says that it is a JEWISH CULTURAL center. By law or by custom most of these groups are open to and have to serve other communities, but that is beside the point. Like anyone can join an Asian Club at my University - its a law - but the reason the Asian Club was founded was to serve the Asian community. So whats your point? Yeah, some of these orders were related to a specific denomination and an ethnic group, but it seems rather logical to put all of the ethnic groups together, then the ones that serve entire religions. Else the list would be cluttered and less user friendly. Perhaps this is arbitrary, but I was Wikipedia:Be bold. That I have created an article where I repeat information gleaned from published sources? Well, I cannot do Wikipedia:Original research, and their websites are usually not WP:RS. Every thing is true according to the sources that I list. So times I can refer your to those sources because they are out of copyright and on the internet ergo Stevens and Preuss and Fortnightly Review. Other times I can only refer you to a published source for my information. What is that I have do wrong? If this is an "infodump" then wikipedia itself is a giant infodump.--Bellerophon5685 (talk) 19:58, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• COMMENT - I share some of MSJapan's concerns. In some of the orders listed (such as Prince Hall Freemasonry), the order was founded to serve a specific ethnic group... but may have subsequently changed or expanded its focus. And the line between religiously focused orders and ethnically focused orders definitely needs better clarification. I am not sure if the list deserves to be completely deleted... but if it is to be kept, it will need an extensive re-thinking and re-working to better define its scope and inclusion criteria. For example, if the article were moved and re-worked as: American Fraternal orders founded to serve specific ethnic groups I think it might help give clarity as to what belongs on the list, and where. Blueboar (talk) 23:45, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

How about we split it into two - one for ethnic, including ethno-religous, and the other for purely religious orders. There is also National Fraternal Society for the Deaf which was neither, but which was set up and modeled after the ethnic orders.--Bellerophon5685 (talk) 00:00, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep - We're not here to discuss whether this or that term is preferred for this or that ethnicity, or whether there is an error here or there with the information presented, or whether it might be better to split this up into two lists instead of one — only whether this list is encyclopedic and helpful. It clearly is. Material is well documented with footnotes and this is a subject of considerable academic interest and study. The presentation of a more or less comprehensive listing is also in no way novel; see, for example: Albert C. Stevens, The Cyclopaedia of Fraternities: A Compilation of Existing Authentic Information and the Results of Original Investigation as to the Origin, Derivation, Founders, Development, Aims, Emblems, Character, and Personnel of More Than Six Hundred Secret Societies in the United States (1899) and Alvin J. Schmidt, Fraternal Organizations (1980). A very bad notability challenge, in my estimation. It should also be noted that this page provides a useful index for articles already in existence and redlinks for work needing to be done. Everything else is an editing matter: play nice. Carrite (talk) 01:49, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep As Carrite has pointed out the nomination doesn't actually give a valid reason for deletion. As for whether there are flaws with it , well it isn't my subject area, but taking "One of the oldest orders of its kind," except Prince Hall Freemasonry, also listed, dates to 1775!" from the nomination; If the article had said "The oldest order of its kind," then it would make sense to correct to "One of the oldest orders of its kind,". An assertion by one editor that something has errors that are uncorrectable does not mean that errors are uncorrectable by others, or indeed even errors. ϢereSpielChequers 14:15, 14 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep. This is great to have as a list-article for purpose of identifying gaps (red-links) in Wikipedia coverage, besides for usual purpose of providing a comprehensive index (which Wikipedia is great for doing). I am surprised there are so many redlinks; it is random that there is Danish Brotherhood in America but not others like it. Bellerophon5685 thank you for developing it.

It's an obviously notable topic as there exist books on the topic. --doncram 17:57, 14 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Rlendog (talk) 14:33, 18 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Impact of humidity on particulate matter measurement[edit]

Impact of humidity on particulate matter measurement (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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Unencyclopaedic essay. Also, there are citations, but no actual references. Adam9007 (talk) 23:20, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• Delete. Close to a speedy G1. This reads like a low-quality machine translation of a copyvio, but I can't find the original. Regardless, it is totally unencyclopedic (I assume the word the nominator meant). —David Eppstein (talk) 07:00, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Lol, yes I did mean unencyclopaedic. Don't know how I missed that! Adam9007 (talk) 15:29, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete as essentially original research. Bearian (talk) 19:38, 15 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Spartaz ^Humbug! 15:00, 20 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Bob Doyle (inventor)[edit]

Bob Doyle (inventor) (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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Largely an autobiography, lacking independent sources and making inflated and - ahem - not entirely mainstream claims. Guy (Help!) 22:29, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• Weak Keep This guy might be notable, but the article doesn't do a very good job proving it. I think instead of delete maybe tag for references. valereee (talk) 20:26, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Weak keep - probably notable, but article needs improved to show it. VMS Mosaic (talk) 10:45, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete I'm going to go out on a limb and say that this guy, while he has an illustrious CV, does not really meet our notability requirements. He has held some academic positions that don't seem to meet WP:PROF. He has self-published at least one book, but it hasn't received wide critical attention - Free Will[1] gets discussed on some blogs but I can't find more serious coverage. He has been awarded patents and been involved in various technological advancements, but there's nothing to say how significant his work is. The best source I could find was Harvard Magazine, which may be generally reliable but probably will tend to cheerlead for Harvard faculty.[2] --Colapeninsula (talk) 13:03, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• Keep Interesting guy, intellectual, kind of article people who read encyclopedias would like to know about. Wikipedia has articles on cricket players, train stations, comic book characters who are less interesting than Bob Doyle, but no one bothers to get rid of them. His electronic games were best sellers. Simon? have you not seen Simon? Maybe you're too young. Rest of electronics described in article. His informationphilosopher website is REPLETE with good stuff to read. So what it's not conclusive; philosophy never is. He's working at the edge of physics and philosophy where a lot of people are writing and exploring in the last several decades, about info theory and limits of physics. So what he is not accepted as correct yet, it's too early to finally evaluate this stuff, but it's the kind of stuff people want, (the kind of people who want this stuff.) In my opinion. GangofOne (talk) 09:34, 13 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

First, I erred, Doyle did not create Simon (game), he created Merlin (game). "best selling game" of 1980. Check that article to see if it has significance, which would reflect on Doyle, as well as the other 6 games that were put on the market by Parker Brothers. GangofOne (talk) 21:19, 14 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Sadly, It's interesting is not considered reason for keeping a Wikipedia article. Almost anything is interesting to somebody. WP:FRINGE may also be relevant, which he appears to fail. Colapeninsula (talk) 10:02, 13 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I suspected calling him "interesting" might trigger WP-is-neutral,-not-interesting rule. I hoped others would get interested. Isn't this the kind of article/person an encyclopedia should be about, not accounts of sport figures/political buffoons? Maybe that's just me. GangofOne (talk) 21:19, 14 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

article changes as we speak; be sure to look at What Links Here, to see how he's connected. I see Two-stage model of free will is also up for deletion, fyi. ‎ His main feature is not that he's FRINGE, it's that he's an academic AND he's a successful electronic game designer/inventor AND he's a philosopher. We need not evaluate the philosophy, that is too much to ask. As far as inventing the podcast , I see his article is the main reference. The inventor part not good enough in combo with the rest? I maintain my KEEP vote. GangofOne (talk) 09:38, 18 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• delete Sourcing indicates a lack of out-of-the-fringe notability. Mangoe (talk) 13:14, 13 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete. I too could only come up with that piece in Harvard Magazine. I agree he is an interesting guy, and his ideas on free will has received some attention, but I can't see evidence of "significant impact in their scholarly discipline, broadly construed, as demonstrated by independent reliable sources", or any other of the specific notability criteria for academics. Vesal (talk) 21:13, 14 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• keep Largely because he didn't invent the podcast, but in the US-history version of the web (which is wrong, but the received wisdom on WP), he did so, along with Dave Winer. The early career in astronomy with NASA was new to me, but seems like it ought to pass the notability bar in itself. Andy Dingley (talk) 00:27, 15 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep. Some of the content will need to be removed. Doyle isn't notable as a philosopher or as an academic but I think the game design work, for example, makes him notable. Roches (talk) 02:27, 15 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

  You think? What about providing some actual evidence? If he played an important role in podcasting or gaming, why isn't he profiled more extensively? There is currently almost zero independent sources about him. That doesn't bother any of you? All we can do is copy his own web page. What's the point in doing that? Vesal (talk) 02:49, 15 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I've had to listen to Winer / Doyle / Winer / Curry / Winer being listed as "the inventors of podcasting" for 15 years now. Tonight I'm off to a Labs reunion with some of the people who did it a few years earlier. I suspect Microsoft had done it two years before that with CDF. Except we don't even exist because a "Wikipedian in Residence" wrote us (and a $2M project) out of history. History, especially on WP, is controlled by the victors. Doyle was part of the group that became the official WP history of the web. To be fair, I think they probably did invent it independently in RSS 2.0 (just not first) and Doyle deserves some credit for that. Andy Dingley (talk) 11:28, 15 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Are there any independent reliable sources to back this up? Rlendog (talk) 21:17, 18 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• keep Article is weak but seems to be enough to build on and has room to grow. I say keep right now and review later. Ozzyland (talk) 16:32, 15 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete. I don't see any room to build on here Peter Damian (talk) 17:11, 15 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete Many of the references around have copied each other. VandVictory (talk) 23:01, 15 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete Very poor references, and only the Harvard Magazine one that could be considered a RS. The article has been around since 2008 and the presumed notability reaches back to the 1960's, so I don't think that there is anything to wait for. LaMona (talk) 04:49, 17 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete His standing in science is low. Yes he did get a PhD in 1969 then work for NASA for a couple of years until 1972, but that is pretty un-exceptional. As far as I'm aware, he has not been involved in academia since then and has no current position at Harvard. While he self-publishes his ideas about philosophy, he seems to have no standing among academic philosophers. A lot of the claims on his websites about his status in science and philosophy are highly dubious. (I'm not commenting on his career in IT/gaming and patents since that's not something I know about.) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.147.6.175 (talk) 14:25, 17 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

consider Merlin (game). Take look at all aspects GangofOne (talk) 09:38, 18 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep Probably notable enough with some of his inventions. Maduwanwela (talk) 14:41, 20 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. (WP:SNOW). North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 23:17, 16 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Ian Anderson (soccer)[edit]

Ian Anderson (soccer) (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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Soccer player but fails WP:NSOCCER , having neither played in an International nor played in a fully professional league.  Velella  ^{Velella Talk}   22:20, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete: as per nominator, fails WP:NSOCCER, no play as professional or international. Tapered (talk) 07:30, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• Delete - clearly fails both WP:GNG and WP:NFOOTBALL. – Michael (talk) 18:11, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete - He has not played in a fully pro league or received significant coverage, meaning the article fails WP:NSPORT and WP:GNG. Sir Sputnik (talk) 20:40, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• Delete - fails WP:GNG and WP:NFOOTBALL. GiantSnowman 18:36, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete. Does not meet WP:BIO. --Inother (talk) 21:39, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete Does not meet WP:NSOCCER or WP:GNG. AlbinoFerret 02:46, 13 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete per all above. Does not meet the notability guidelines. Ashbeckjonathan (talk) 01:54, 15 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was speedy delete as hoax. — RHaworth (talk · contribs) 08:31, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Endurance (2023 Film)[edit]

Endurance (2023 Film) (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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2023 Film? No evidence filming has started, appears to fail WP:NOTFILM. reddogsix (talk) 22:01, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Speedy delete as a hoax by "Newryst Studios", for which I can find nothing and which itself was speedily deleted. It started filming now and is expected to be released in 2023? That would take superhuman endurance. Clarityfiend (talk) 23:38, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• Speedy delete What film financier is insane enough to allow a film to take eight years to complete?! Also, film synopsis sounds like it describes a video game in the Gamestop bargain bin. Nate • (chatter) 01:22, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

"Studio":(Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)

"Founder:(Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)

"Founder":(Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)

"Planned:(Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)

• Delete for (at most polite) being waaaaay too soon, if at all. Lacks any verifiability in reliable sources. Its "production campany" has already been deleted. This should go too. If these youngsters ever do make a film and if it gets the requisite coverage in eight years, a recreation can be considered. Schmidt, ^{Michael Q.} 05:23, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Speedy hoax Per above. Lugnuts ^{Dick Laurent is dead} 06:48, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. As this is the third time this has been deleted I am also WP:SALTing it. Beeblebrox (talk) 21:28, 18 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Jon Phillips[edit]

Jon Phillips (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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Non notable per WP:BIO. Not seeing the kind of media coverage we look for when determining notability. Also it's been deleted twice before. Only not a speedy because those deletes were a long time ago. Agtx (talk) 21:33, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete First 3 refs are defunct links. Other refs don't corroborate the main claims to notability in the article. Ergo fails WP:N.

• Keep, is part of Free Culture and Freebassel campaign. Chengsi258 (talk) 15:42, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Looked at the Independent sources, add CNN, and some industry specific independent reviews, Artslant, etc. Chengsi258 (talk) 17:14, 13 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep Jon Phillips is notable in the Free Software/Free Culture arena. As Free Culture is in competition with MainStream Media, it is not surprising there is little media coverage. --Bob (talk) 03:58, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• Delete Does not appear any of the current refs provide WP:INDEPENDENT and significant coverage of Jon Phillips as required to meet WP:GNG and WP:BIO. Being part of "Free Culture" and the non-notable Freebassel campaign means nothing for his notability. A creator of Inkscape doesn't make someone a notable figure in Free Software, and unsubstantiated conspiracy theories about mainstream media refusing to cover someone based on their opinions don't provide Jon Phillips with notability either. He does not inherit notability from Inkscape. To those arguing keep, by all means provide a source that meets WP:GNG requirements and any of the WP:BIO criteria, and I'll be happy to change my vote. ― Padenton|✉   18:48, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Weak delete There is very little in the references that support notability. I only see one actual article about him: #3 the interview [3], and I have no idea of this article can be considered a RS. The links to conference announcements are not substantial, mentions are not substantial, and videos of Phillips speaking, etc. are not third-party sources. LaMona (talk) 05:09, 17 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 00:13, 18 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Jessica Remmers[edit]

Jessica Remmers (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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Non-notable individual lacking non-trivial independent support. reddogsix (talk) 21:22, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete non-notable actress failing WP:ACTORBIO, also promotional based on inline external link.--☾Loriendrew☽ ☏(ring-ring) 22:13, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• Delete - Nothing to suggest she's notable at all and her roles aren't exactly the best with the longest being a 6-episode show Vanya. Of course, multiple searches instantly found nothing good. SwisterTwister talk 06:19, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete - Whilst several sources point to an entirely different, yet similarly named individual, others mentioning her aren't reliable and the vast majority is nothing more than DVD download/rip sites; otherwise, the movies in which she had roles in aren't notable either - fails WP:ACTORBIO. lavender|^{(formerly HMSSolent)}|lambast 07:50, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was redirect to List of minor planets: 1001–2000. North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 00:43, 18 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

1666 van Gent[edit]

1666 van Gent (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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This doesn't seem to meet WP:NASTRO or WP:GNG. As it is a low-numbered asteroid, I have taken it to a full discussion rather than a unilateral redirect or a prod. I think it should be deleted; or (as NASTRO recommends) redirected to List of minor planets 1001-2000. Boleyn (talk) 21:06, 10 May 2015 (UTC) Boleyn (talk) 21:06, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• Redirect. Nothing of interest found on Google scholar. —David Eppstein (talk) 07:20, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Procedural Keep: Boleyn appears to be on a deletion spree without allowing consensus to develop on the asteroid articles they have previously nominated. AfD is overhead and this is an abuse of the system.--Milowent • ^hasspoken 13:35, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Redirect per WP:DWMP: sources are insufficient to build a decent article about this object. It doesn't satisfy WP notability requirements. Praemonitus (talk) 19:07, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Redirect per WP:NASTRO (WP:NASTCRIT) No significant coverage found on this object itself. Everything on google scholar is a paper listing several asteroids (explicitly mentioned in NASTCRIT #3 as not meeting notability) ― Padenton|✉   21:41, 17 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was redirect to List of minor planets: 1001–2000. North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 00:45, 18 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

1838 Ursa[edit]

1838 Ursa (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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This doesn't seem to meet WP:NASTRO or WP:GNG. As it is a low-numbered asteroid, I have taken it to a full discussion rather than a unilateral redirect or a prod. I think it should be deleted; or (as NASTRO recommends) redirected to List of minor planets 1001-2000. Boleyn (talk) 21:05, 10 May 2015 (UTC) Boleyn (talk) 21:05, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• Redirect. Part of one group lightcurve study [4] but I don't think it's enough. —David Eppstein (talk) 07:21, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Procedural Keep: Boleyn appears to be on a deletion spree without allowing consensus to develop on the asteroid articles they have previously nominated. AfD is overhead and this is an abuse of the system.--Milowent • ^hasspoken 13:36, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Redirect per WP:DWMP; concur with D. Eppstein. Praemonitus (talk) 19:40, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Redirect per WP:NASTRO (WP:NASTCRIT) No significant coverage found on this object itself. Everything on google scholar is a paper listing several asteroids (explicitly mentioned in NASTCRIT #3 as not meeting notability) ― Padenton|✉   21:51, 17 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Beeblebrox (talk) 21:22, 18 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Anal Gestapo[edit]

Anal Gestapo (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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Article about a cover band which does not satisfy WP:GNG with lack of coverage by third party reliable sources. Since they are a tribute/cover band they lack any songs of their own and make it difficult for them to meet any criteria of WP:Band except for the ones already covered in WP:GNG. - McMatter ^(talk)/_(contrib) 21:04, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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In Serbia, music press does not exists, so I can not present this kind of evidence of importance to Wikipedia. However, check Youtube and their videos, and number of people at concerts. Last, Wikipedia has number of tribute band articles, and I see no reason not to include this one.Rockunion ^(talk) — Preceding undated comment added 21:20, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Online articles about Anal Gestapo

http://ck13.org/141

http://www.komandantadam.com/2006.htm

http://blog.dnevnik.hr/muskat/2007/12/1623772968/live-report-ili-kako-sam-doiveo-i-preiveo-koncert.html

Rockunion ^(talk)

• No view on notability, but this group sounds like a bunch of Nazi assholes. Newyorkbrad (talk) 02:03, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete. Holy f%ck that was an unpleasant google search. I'm stll not sure if they're nazi assholes or flamboyant trolls. Not sure I want to know. Earflaps (talk) 03:20, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Both "nazi assholes" and "flamboyant trolls" sound very pejorative and offensive. Is it expected to tolerate this language on Wikipedia? Rockunion (talk)
    • "N.a." is a pun based on the name of the group. Newyorkbrad (talk) 14:18, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Neither nazi or asshole is a curse word, and I fail to see how 'flamboyant troll' is in any way pejorative (frequently being one myself, though I keep my trolling off wiki). But even if they are an All Leather type snark/shock band, doesn't change the fact that they have basically no coverage in english. Earflaps (talk) 17:10, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Turbonegro, Turbojugend, Anal Gestapo, and everything associated with Turbonegro is *very anti-fascist oriented*. Check Turbonegro for more info. Do not make wrong conclusions before digging more deep. Rockunion (talk) — Preceding undated comment added 12:34, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • btw, noticed now you contributed heavily to teh article - however the discussion goes, you want want to make sure your research doesn't go to waste by transferring some of it to Turbonegro, if you built a 'cover bands' or 'legacy' section lower on the page (example) Earflaps (talk) 17:28, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
    • There is already a link at Turbonegro page to Anal Gestapo page. But I do not think we should be putting more information there. Rockunion (talk) — Preceding undated comment added 01:07, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• I'd say Delete as well, for the same reasons that McMatter gave. Three web-pages in Serbian are hardly enough for “coverage by reliable third party sources” (two of them look like they are simply billing calendars). And explaining a lack of sources by saying there is no music press in Serbia (ie there's no-one interested enough to write that kind of stuff, or else there's no-one interested enough to read it) is a circular sort of argument.

Also, this is (it would appear) a Serbian tribute band covering stuff by a Norwegian outfit; why then is the article on the English WP? The logical place would be the Serbian, or maybe the Norwegian, WP. And there is a music press in the English-speaking world; if this lot had any notability for an English-speaking readership then there would be some coverage, somewhere.

I would suggest, regardless of how this AfD goes, it would make more sense re-writing it in Serbian (or Norwegian, or both) and posting it on the relevant WP. Swanny18 (talk) 22:23, 13 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• The page is in English, so it can be read by other Turbojugend members who mostly communicate in English. Not many understand Serbian nor Norwegian, and having an article in English seems adequate.

I am not trying to prove this entry is crucial for Wikipedia or the World in general, how could I? But it will matter to Turbojugend members or people interested in this kind of music. This could be a minority in the World, but if minorities should not be represented in Wikipedia, then Wikipedia should only write about Justin Bieber.

I am not an advocate, the links I provided above were first few links that came out in my search. Rockunion (talk) — Preceding undated comment added 19:56, 14 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was keep. Rlendog (talk) 14:37, 18 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

1663 van den Bos[edit]

1663 van den Bos (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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This doesn't seem to meet WP:NASTRO or WP:GNG. As it is a low-numbered asteroid, I have taken it to a full discussion rather than a unilateral redirect or a prod. I think it should be deleted; or (as NASTRO recommends) redirected to List of minor planets 1001-2000. Boleyn (talk) 21:04, 10 May 2015 (UTC) Boleyn (talk) 21:04, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• Weak keep. The subject of a single-object study [5] and a group study [6], and mentioned in several other studies. —David Eppstein (talk) 07:38, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Upgrading from weak keep to keep because of the unusually long period. —David Eppstein (talk) 03:16, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Procedural Keep: Boleyn appears to be on a deletion spree without allowing consensus to develop on the asteroid articles they have previously nominated. AfD is overhead and this is an abuse of the system.--Milowent • ^hasspoken 13:36, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Disagree. In fact maybe 50 of these discussions have already reached consensus and been closed (look at the history of Wikipedia:WikiProject Deletion sorting/Science). It is not premature to continue nominating more of these. —David Eppstein (talk) 18:35, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Agree: Boleyn has about 255 AfDs for low numbered asteroids. All he cares about is CAT:NN and AfD is not cleanup. Deleting too many borderline asteroids is harmful to the project. -- Kheider (talk) 12:20, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
    • It's previously been agreed (and the results of the already-closed recent AfDs confirm) that most asteroids are not notable, even in this range of numbers, and that the non-notable ones should be redirected. It's also been previously agreed that mass AfDs or bold redirection won't work; we have to take each one to an individual AfD. Now you seem to be arguing that individual AfDs are also not ok. Frankly, this looks to me as some sort of an attempt at filibustering the process and blocking the consensus that has developed among other editors, to force your minority preference for keeping all of these over the consensus that had previously developed. —David Eppstein (talk) 15:10, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
    • Although AfD is not Articles for discussion; as per above, bold redirection won't work, as there may be notability. Redirect proposals or talk page consensus take a long time to gain consensus, even if a RfC is opened. So AfD is probably the only plausible venue, and for good cause. See WP:ADHOM (this is not an rebuttal on the actual nomination) and Assume good faith. Esquivalience ^t 02:42, 14 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep: It has a notably long rotation period of 740 hours. -- Kheider (talk) 15:57, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep per above. Also apparently there was a minor discrepancy on the brightness prediction. Praemonitus (talk) 19:00, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep: In fact, it has the 14th longest rotation period of any known solar system object, and may be as high as 9th on the list due to error in the rotation period lengths of the others. exoplanetaryscience (talk) 14:29, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was redirect to List of minor planets: 1001–2000. North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 00:46, 18 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

1781 Van Biesbroeck[edit]

1781 Van Biesbroeck (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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This doesn't seem to meet WP:NASTRO or WP:GNG. As it is a low-numbered asteroid, I have taken it to a full discussion rather than a unilateral redirect or a prod. I think it should be deleted; or (as NASTRO recommends) redirected to List of minor planets 1001-2000. Boleyn (talk) 21:04, 10 May 2015 (UTC) Boleyn (talk) 21:04, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• Procedural Keep: Boleyn appears to be on a deletion spree without allowing consensus to develop on the asteroid articles they have previously nominated. AfD is overhead and this is an abuse of the system.--Milowent • ^hasspoken 13:36, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Disagree. In fact maybe 50 of these discussions have already reached consensus and been closed (look at the history of Wikipedia:WikiProject Deletion sorting/Science). It is not premature to continue nominating more of these. —David Eppstein (talk) 18:34, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Agree: Boleyn has about 255 AfDs for low numbered asteroids. All he cares about is CAT:NN and AfD is not cleanup. Deleting too many borderline asteroids is harmful to the project. -- Kheider (talk) 12:23, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
    • See my comments at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/1663 van den Bos. If we can't redirect without an AfD, and can't mass-AfD, then these individual AfDs are absolutely necessary. —David Eppstein (talk) 15:14, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Redirect per WP:DWMP: I couldn't locate suitable references; there are a few mentions, but nothing substantial. Praemonitus (talk) 18:58, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Redirect. Nothing of interest found on Google scholar. —David Eppstein (talk) 19:00, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Redirect per WP:NASTRO (WP:NASTCRIT) No significant coverage found on this object itself. Everything on google scholar is a paper listing several asteroids (explicitly mentioned in NASTCRIT #3 as not meeting notability) ― Padenton|✉   21:48, 17 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was redirect to List of minor planets: 1001–2000. North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 00:48, 18 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

1945 Wesselink[edit]

1945 Wesselink (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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This doesn't seem to meet WP:NASTRO or WP:GNG. As it is a low-numbered asteroid, I have taken it to a full discussion rather than a unilateral redirect or a prod. I think it should be deleted; or (as NASTRO recommends) redirected to List of minor planets 1001-2000. Boleyn (talk) 21:01, 10 May 2015 (UTC) Boleyn (talk) 21:01, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• Procedural Keep: Boleyn appears to be on a deletion spree without allowing consensus to develop on the asteroid articles they have previously nominated. AfD is overhead and this is an abuse of the system.--Milowent • ^hasspoken 13:37, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Disagree. In fact maybe 50 of these discussions have already reached consensus and been closed (look at the history of Wikipedia:WikiProject Deletion sorting/Science). It is not premature to continue nominating more of these. —David Eppstein (talk) 18:34, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Agree: Boleyn has about 255 AfDs for low numbered asteroids. All he cares about is CAT:NN and AfD is not cleanup. Deleting too many borderline asteroids is harmful to the project. -- Kheider (talk) 12:31, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
    • See my comments at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/1663 van den Bos. If we can't redirect without an AfD, and can't mass-AfD, then these individual AfDs are absolutely necessary. —David Eppstein (talk) 15:13, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Redirect per WP:DWMP: insufficient reliable sources. Praemonitus (talk) 18:50, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Redirect. Nothing of interest found on Google scholar. —David Eppstein (talk) 20:23, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Redirect per WP:NASTRO (WP:NASTCRIT) No significant coverage found on this object itself. Everything on google scholar is a paper listing several asteroids (explicitly mentioned in NASTCRIT #3 as not meeting notability) or too little coverage to provide significant commentary on the object. ― Padenton|✉   21:56, 17 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was redirect to List of minor planets: 1001–2000. North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 00:18, 18 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

1950 Wempe[edit]

1950 Wempe (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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This doesn't seem to meet WP:NASTRO or WP:GNG. As it is a low-numbered asteroid, I have taken it to a full discussion rather than a unilateral redirect or a prod. I think it should be deleted; or (as NASTRO recommends) redirected to List of minor planets 1001-2000. Boleyn (talk) 21:00, 10 May 2015 (UTC) Boleyn (talk) 21:00, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• Procedural Keep: Boleyn appears to be on a deletion spree without allowing consensus to develop on the asteroid articles they have previously nominated. AfD is overhead and this is an abuse of the system.--Milowent • ^hasspoken 13:38, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Disagree. In fact maybe 50 of these discussions have already reached consensus and been closed (look at the history of Wikipedia:WikiProject Deletion sorting/Science). It is not premature to continue nominating more of these. —David Eppstein (talk) 18:34, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Redirect per WP:DWMP: insufficient sources available; just one photometry study. Praemonitus (talk) 18:49, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Redirect. Part of one 14-object study [7] and other than that only brief mentions found. —David Eppstein (talk) 20:24, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Redirect per WP:NASTRO (WP:NASTCRIT) No significant coverage found on this object itself. Everything on google scholar is a paper listing several asteroids (explicitly mentioned in NASTCRIT #3 as not meeting notability) or too little coverage to provide significant commentary on the object. ― Padenton|✉   21:58, 17 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was redirect to List of minor planets: 1001–2000. North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 00:19, 18 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

1352 Wawel[edit]

1352 Wawel (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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This doesn't seem to meet WP:NASTRO or WP:GNG. As it is a low-numbered asteroid, I have taken it to a full discussion rather than a unilateral redirect or a prod. I think it should be deleted; or (as NASTRO recommends) redirected to List of minor planets 1001-2000. Boleyn (talk) 20:58, 10 May 2015 (UTC) Boleyn (talk) 20:58, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• Procedural Keep: Boleyn appears to be on a deletion spree without allowing consensus to develop on the asteroid articles they have previously nominated. AfD is overhead and this is an abuse of the system.--Milowent • ^hasspoken 13:34, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Disagree. In fact maybe 50 of these discussions have already reached consensus and been closed (look at the history of Wikipedia:WikiProject Deletion sorting/Science). It is not premature to continue nominating more of these. —David Eppstein (talk) 18:34, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose Notability is in question for all of these, and consensus on deletion is not required before taking it to AfD. There is no deletion spree, there is AfD spree, where consensus has certainly been allowed to develop. ― Padenton|✉   20:24, 17 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Redirect per WP:DWMP: only one photometry study found; there's insufficient references to build a decent article. Praemonitus (talk) 18:47, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Redirect. Part of one group lightcurve study [8] but I don't think it's enough. —David Eppstein (talk) 20:26, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Redirect per WP:NASTRO (WP:NASTCRIT) No significant coverage found on this object itself. Everything on google scholar is a paper listing several asteroids (explicitly mentioned in NASTCRIT #3 as not meeting notability) ― Padenton|✉   20:18, 17 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Although HP can be an RS, there is consensus here that even counting that there is not enough significant coverage to meet WP:N. Rlendog (talk) 14:47, 18 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Zack Knight[edit]

Zack Knight (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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Unreferenced biography of a living person. No indication of notability; Google News show just enough coverage to verify that he exists, but no detailed reports about him or his work. I could find no evidence that he created "a huge buzz in mainstream / Asian media" as the article alleges. Huon (talk) 20:55, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Weak Delete Best I could find was this blog and dozens of trivial mentions such as this. For what it's worth (little), he has a music video with 2.5 million views. Winner 42 Talk to me! 21:15, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete for being in the UK, I'm having a surprisingly difficult time finding news published about this bloke (under both birth and stage name), and mostly finding info about a tennis player in the USA. Primefac (talk) 00:49, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• Delete I, too, was only able to find the HuffPost article, and I assume HP isn't generally considered a RS. Hopefully, he'll gain more attention and will be added when there are sources to be referenced. LaMona (talk) 05:17, 17 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 00:22, 18 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Lauren Jiggins[edit]

Lauren Jiggins (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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Related to Lydia Marley-Lawson and similarly non-notable. No secondary source coverage. Agtx (talk) 19:49, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete, friends who have made a couple of YouTube clips. 88.112.50.121 (talk) 19:53, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete - non-notable individual. reddogsix (talk) 21:15, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete. Too soon for an article right now. They made their home newspaper, but that's not really enough for a Wikipedia article. We need significant coverage in reliable sources, which currently isn't quite there yet. NinjaRobotPirate (talk) 02:45, 11 May 2015 (UTC)>[reply]

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• Delete Non-notable. WP:TOOSOON. No evidence of meeting WP:DIRECTOR. ― Padenton|✉   21:30, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete Cant find anything to prove notability. AlbinoFerret 02:52, 13 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete non notable. WP:TOOSOON.Pharaoh of the Wizards (talk) 16:11, 13 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 00:24, 18 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Lydia Marley-Lawson[edit]

Lydia Marley-Lawson (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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NN person per WP:BIO. No secondary source coverage. Agtx (talk) 19:45, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete, friends who have made a couple of YouTube clips. 88.112.50.121 (talk) 19:54, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete - non-notable, unreferenced individual. reddogsix (talk) 21:12, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete. I'll copy and paste what I said in the previous nomination. Too soon for an article right now. They made their home newspaper, but that's not really enough for a Wikipedia article. We need significant coverage in reliable sources, which currently isn't quite there yet. NinjaRobotPirate (talk) 02:46, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• Delete Non-notable. WP:TOOSOON. No evidence of meeting WP:DIRECTOR. ― Padenton|✉   21:31, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Clear consensus for deletion relative to WP:NOTNEWS and WP:EVENT. North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 00:29, 18 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

2015 London general election protest[edit]

2015 London general election protest (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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Per WP:ONEEVENT, no "demonstrable long-term impact", no reason to keep. 1Potato2Potato3Potato4 (talk) 19:44, 10 May 2015 (UTC) I meant to use the policy WP:NOTNEWS, which firmly applies here. 1Potato2Potato3Potato4 (talk) 20:30, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

WP:ONEEVENT is not (despite its name) a policy regarding events, it is a policy regarding people. Policies which do actually relate to the notability of events which could be applied in this case as WP:DIVERSE and WP:INDEPTH. Furthermore although technically not a crime elements of the protest reached a stage where WP:N/CA could also be applied. This article should also be kept per WP:RAPID. Ebonelm (talk) 19:54, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, apologies for that. I had not included it in my initial talk page comment as I knew that, but I appear to have forgotten. Comment struck. 1Potato2Potato3Potato4 (talk) 20:29, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete Can't see how this is notable. WP:NOTNEWS is probably the most relevant thing here. Number 57 20:00, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete per WP:Notability (events), particularly WP:LASTING. JohnCD (talk) 20:20, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete as not notable nor newsworthy. A small and frankly predictable "protest" by a bunch of criminal-minded thugs. If it were considerably more substantial or in any way significant, it might warrant an article, but really an event like this needs to cross quite a high threshold to have an entire Wikipedia article of its own. Mind, if it were kept it should expound the disgusting vandalism to the war memorial as well as the unwarranted attacks on the police. I love the comment above by the only supporter of this article, "...technically not a crime..." - I think you'll find the protestors were committing a ton of crimes, hence why many were arrested. Don't make this a typical "drown out the delete request with technicalities" Wikipeida bun fight: it's obvious it should go. Let it go. Argovian (talk) 20:29, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Please keep your analyses neutral and avoid using this space as a forum. EvergreenFir (talk) Please ((re)) 07:32, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Especially since the published photos of the protest show rows of gleefully happy police with their batons raised. Tiptoethrutheminefield (talk) 20:59, 13 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete as non-notable protest. –Davey2010^Talk 21:21, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete: Another one of those small and unsuccessful protests blown up on social networks with "nobody is covering this, CENSORSHIP!". And before you ask, yes, right-wing groups make the same silly arguments too. '''tAD''' (talk) 21:55, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment - the initial rationale for the nomination was a misreading of the Guardian source, which said only 100 involved. Others claim 1000+ involved. AusLondonder (talk) 02:41, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Strong keep: Absolutely not in breach of WP:NOTNEWS. 'As Wikipedia is not a paper source, editors are encouraged to include current and up-to-date information within its coverage, and to develop stand-alone articles on significant current events'. This article is not written as a news report or in a journalistic style. This article also meets WP:EVENTCRIT - 'Events are also very likely to be notable if they have widespread (national or international) impact and were very widely covered in diverse sources, especially if also re-analysed afterwards (as described below).' AusLondonder (talk) 03:02, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete Argovian said it best. Mellowed Fillmore (talk) 04:52, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete or move to draft per WP:GEOSCOPE and WP:DIVERSE. As of right now, not notable enough. If it garners news coverage more internationally and survives the next week, I'd be more inclined to say keep. EvergreenFir (talk) Please ((re)) 07:32, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Comment - good point, it has already had significant international attention, so quite a lot of sources exist alreadyAusLondonder (talk) 07:36, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Can you add them to the article to demonstrate its notability? I only saw The Guardian and BBC cited. Both good sources, but coverage is local. EvergreenFir (talk) Please ((re)) 07:38, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Comment have now added international sources. Not all reliable sources, but establish notability (Euronews, ABC Australia, RT, Irish Independent and XinhuaAusLondonder (talk) 07:59, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete A non-notable event. Lugnuts ^{Dick Laurent is dead} 07:57, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete as non-notable. VMS Mosaic (talk) 09:27, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete per rational of my WP:PROD and LadyLeitmotif who raised a good point, 100 hooligans vandalising a cenotaph or memorial is not a full scale riot or long term protest. Had some cheeky begger not removed my PROD we would not be debating this.--Lerdthenerd wiki defender 19:34, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

With respect, User:Lerdthenerd, why are you relying on 'LadyLeitmotif' as a more reliable source than the Guardian article? AusLondonder (talk) 08:22, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I'm not, it's a good source but the coverage is too small, should this story gain more notice then it can have an article. My point wasn't the source but the facts, 100/1000 rioters vandalising a memorial is not news worthy.--Lerdthenerd wiki defender 16:56, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Strong Keep: Large number of UK and global media sources. Clearly meets WP:GNG. I feel many editors are misinterpreting WP:NOTNEWS, which states'For example, routine news reporting on things like announcements, sports, or celebrities is not a sufficient basis for inclusion in the encyclopedia.' This is nothing of the sort, and was a noteworthy protest. WP:NOTNEWS makes absolutely crystal clear: 'As Wikipedia is not a paper source, editors are encouraged to include current and up-to-date information within its coverage, and to develop stand-alone articles on significant current events' AusLondonder (talk) 08:22, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

@AusLondonder:, you don't get to !vote twice. The NOTNEWS sentence you quote refers to "significant current events", and what people are saying is that this was not significant. Also, read the whole of WP:GNG: the last bullet point says:

"Presumed" means that significant coverage in reliable sources creates an assumption, not a guarantee, that a subject should be included. A more in-depth discussion might conclude that the topic actually should not have a stand-alone article—perhaps because it violates what Wikipedia is not...

In other words, just being in all the papers is not necessarily enough. This is that "more in-depth discussion". JohnCD (talk) 08:43, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Apologies about 'keep vote' twice. What criteria is used to classify 'significant'? I don't believe this article fails WP:NOTNEWS because an example given is 'routine news reporting on things like announcements, sports, or celebrities is not a sufficient basis for inclusion in the encyclopedia' - this clearly is on a different level. AusLondonder (talk) 08:47, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

For "significant", WP:Notability (events) uses terms like "enduring historical significance" and "noted and sourced permanent effect"; but it's really a judgment call, and that's the question people here are giving (fairly unanimous) opinions on. JohnCD (talk) 15:08, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Merge to 2015 election article - this has good info, the protest was well covered, and five police were injured. It doesn't meet the criteria though for its own article based on WP:EVENT (as I don't see any follow-up coverage or analysis - this is what we mean about depth of coverage). I think it should be appended to United Kingdom general election, 2015. If it pops back up in the news for some reason (they try to make a law you can't be on Downing Street for 24 hours after the election because of it, the 17 people arrested are charged with terrorism, etc etc) it can be recreated. —Мандичка^YO 😜 09:35, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Merge as above. (United_Kingdom_general_election,_2015#Protests.) Fails notability per WP:EVENT (no "enduring historical significance"; "national coverage" very small compared to election/formation of government or some other protests; it's received some "international coverage" as part of coverage of the election but not huge international coverage on the level of e.g. Ferguson protests; not "very widely covered in diverse sources"; no "lasting effect" or long duration of coverage). WP:EVENT overrides WP:GNG by specifying how events which receive coverage in multiple sources could still be non-notable. Wikipedia:Notability_(events)#Alternatives_to_deletion suggests merging. The article is short and could easily be merged. Colapeninsula (talk) 13:22, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• Delete per WP:NOTNEWS, and failing WP:NEVENT criteria: routine news, no lasting effect, no persistence of coverage. Merge is inappropriate because there is no evidence this is even a significant protest and would therefore be deserving of even a short mention in the election article. The UK has 64.5 million people, nearly 8,500,000 of which live in the city limits of London. There are over 5,300 people per square kilometer in London, and the largest estimate from an independent source for the size of this protest is "a couple of hundred people" by a Reuters photographer and 200 people by TheGuardian for the results of a national election? ― Padenton|✉   20:45, 14 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete User:Padenton has summed it up well it is clearly not worthy of a stand-alone article. MilborneOne (talk) 13:14, 16 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was withdrawn by nominator (non-admin closure) Snuggums (talk / edits) 02:52, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

BEACH VOLLEYBALL LEVAN AKHVLEDIANI[edit]

BEACH VOLLEYBALL LEVAN AKHVLEDIANI (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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While this article doesn't meet the qualification for a speedy, I don't believe that this volleyball coach is notable per WP:BIO. Agtx (talk) 19:10, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Withdrawn by nominator. Looks good to me on rewrite. Agtx (talk) 00:40, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• Keep but TNT. His name in Georgian + volleyball brings up numerous hits where he is the subject of the article. Meets criteria as a sport referee/president of national governing body and member of commissions for the International Volleyball Federation or whatever it's called in English. —Мандичка^YO 😜 21:08, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Article renamed - now at Levan Akhvlediani. —Мандичка^YO 😜 21:12, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• I rewrote the article entirely. Could use some more info like his hometown, and I think he got some award after Beijing, but I can't connect to the Georgian Parliament website. Anyway @Agtx: it seems like it should pass guidelines now, can you take a look at it and consider delisting? Thanks. —Мандичка^YO 😜 00:25, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Davewild (talk) 19:14, 17 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Macedonia 2015[edit]

Macedonia 2015 (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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This article reads more like an essay/blog post, and original research - no encyclopedic value. No citations whatsoever. Cahk (talk) 18:59, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete. Runs afoul of WP:NOTESSAY (especially the original version) and WP:NOTNEWS, and the title isn't something anyone would search for. If there's recent social unrest in that country that meets notability guidelines, there is nothing here whose preservation would benefit the hypothetical article on it. Egsan Bacon (talk) 16:31, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete clearly an essay and not an encyclopedic article. Mellowed Fillmore (talk) 15:22, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• Delete Lack of sources in article, little reason any will be found. AlbinoFerret 02:55, 13 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. clearly snowing... And salting... Which tends to leave a soggy mush in the real world. Spartaz ^Humbug! 17:01, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Rape jihad (5th nomination)[edit]

Rape jihad (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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This "topic" is inherently a polemic coatrack, a highly politicized neologism emanating from the right wing Front Page Magazine. It is not a scholarly formulation of the very real topic of use of rape as a political weapon, it is a made up term of demonization with which to tar enemies in an ongoing ideological war. This "topic" has been brought to debate at AfD three times previously, ending in resounding deletion (2013), deletion of a recreation (2015), and a no consensus decision (a bad close, 2015), followed by a 7-hour long non-administrative speedy close on procedural grounds (2015). Given the way that this POV zombie keeps coming back from the grave, in addition to deletion I am asking that this topic be salted to prevent facile recreation by a disgruntled editor. Plain and simple, this is a copiously footnoted political attack piece about a non-notable neologism. Carrite (talk) 17:39, 10 May 2015 (UTC) Last modified: Carrite (talk) 18:38, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment: So I, the article's re-creator, am "facile", is that it? Way to be uncivil right out of the gate. And being "a member of WikiProject Socialism" and emblazoning your user page with a Soviet/communist propaganda poster does not inspire confidence in your ability to stay neutral in this or any other tangentially political subject. Pax 19:48, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

@Раціональне анархіст: Nominator said nothing of the sort, unless you've already decided to recreate if this afd is closed as delete. Also, your personal attack on Carrite based on the contents of his user page, especially when no one here is likely to see the relevance to the topic at hand is absurd and uncalled for. Go calm down. ― Padenton|✉   19:54, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Your counter-argument appears to be (condensed version): "They're not calling you 'facile' now; they're simply speculating you might be 'facile' in the future!". Well that's just a lovely assumption. Otherwise, noting the plausibility of impartiality is not a personal-attack. Pax 20:10, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

@Раціональне анархіст: No, again, the nominator said " in addition to deletion I am asking that this topic be salted to prevent facile recreation by a disgruntled editor." There is no speculation there that you would. Take a chill pill. ― Padenton|✉   20:27, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

fac·ile 'fasəl 2. (of success, especially in sports) easily achieved; effortless. Carrite (talk) 03:31, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Disgraceful attack by User:Раціональне анархіст. The proponent of deletion is a member of wikiproject conservatism, which I notice you forgot to note when bring up the communism project. What that has to do with anything, other than another personal attack is unclear. AusLondonder (talk) 02:25, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment - Wikipedia's scholarly treatment of the topic seems to be at Wartime sexual violence. Carrite (talk) 18:11, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete and salt/RedirectMerge to Wartime sexual violence. Poorly used neologism, and Wikipedia is not for neologisms. Coined by director of "Jihad Watch" who used it in an opinion column, that's not notability. Not seeing any secondary sources meeting reliability standards. ― Padenton|✉   18:31, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Practically, there's nothing to merge, all content that should be properly included has been included in vastly better articles. --Fauzan^{✆ talk}_{✉ mail} 19:20, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Fair enough. Edited. ― Padenton|✉   19:45, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

1. The UK grooming scandals did not occur during a war.

2. The article must be kept if it is to be merged.

3. "Islamophobia" is an inherently polemical neologistic "political attack piece", and yet it has an article because sufficient RS are using the term. Pax 19:49, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

@Раціональне анархіст:

1. Doesn't matter. There's no rationale I can see to include it in this article to begin with.
2. I redacted merge from my statement long before you made your first comment on this afd.
3. I never said anything about "islamophobia". Show me where I have. ― Padenton|✉   20:17, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I didn't imply you did; I was merely making an analogy. There are sufficient RS using the term "Rape jihad", as there are "Islamophobia". Pax 20:22, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Viewing the page's history, I no longer think a redir will prevent us from being back here in another month, so just delete and salt. ― Padenton|✉   03:25, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• Delete and salt - Non-notable neologism that's only used within the Islamophobic echo chamber. I quickly checked a few of the pages's sources at random: sources which use the phrase (e.g. Gatestone Institute) are unreliable; and those which are reliable (e.g. BBC) do not use the phrase. Daveosaurus (talk) 18:42, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Are you suggesting that anyone who uses the term Rape jihad is an Islamophobe? You'd better tone down the personal attacks. And there is no consensus that Gatestone is unreliable. BeastBoy3395 (talk) 23:33, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete and salt per Daveosaurus. AlexTiefling (talk) 18:43, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete and salt. Aquillion and Bosstopher have done good work in getting the article to conform to policy, but their efforts only make it clearer that the article is without virtue. At this point it's obvious that the article is nothing but "here's what a handful of right-wing commentators have referred to as Rape Jihad". A WP:COATRACK that runs afoul of WP:SYNTH. There are articles that can handle the crimes of IS and Boko Haram, and Rotherham has its own article. This one has no need to exist. Ratatosk Jones (talk) 18:53, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Note: RatatoskJones has a history of section-blanking the article and been a topic-ban proposal subject in two unresolved ANIs regarding it. He has also repeatedly relayed the logically fallacious argument that a specific term is not "in" a source article if it is only (prominently) in the title of the sourced article; an argument which saw one of their "team" of edit-warriors (FreeatlastChitchat, who sadly won't be joining the !vote-stacking today) blocked for misleading edit summaries when he tried it that way, and review-declined. Pax 20:02, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• (pile on) Delete and salt as well, per my comments: 1 2. In short, it fails WP:NEO (again and again and again for the kryptonitillionth time). Most of the sources do not discuss the term at all, those who do are not reliable. The article as it currently stand is much less worse thanks to the recent uninvolved editors who did a good work, but nevertheless, the bottom line is, it flatly fails WP:GNG. It is a poor attempt to tie unrelated incidents which no reliable scholarly source has done. This article is well uhm... Ahh! my throat is dry, I need some water. --Fauzan^{✆ talk}_{✉ mail} 19:20, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Speedy Keep. Obvious attempts at censorship are obvious. This is the second of two spurious AfDs within a month. The article has been under constant assault by a small meat-puppet army (some of whom have been or currently are blocked within the last month) who use hypocritical arguments (e.g., the neologism argument, frequently while deploying "Islamophobic" in the very same breath). If the article looks ugly at any given second, it's because they made it that way hoping to get it deleted. This is my last edit version of the article, and as you can see it is neutrally-worded with no quotations or relayed condensed statements from any sources except ISIS and Boko Haram. Pax 20:02, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Meat-puppet is a serious accusation to make and you have provided 0 evidence to support your claim. A single editor being blocked in the page's history does not equal "some", nor an "army". And neutral tone isn't the only requirement in WP:NPOV. This article (including your preferred version of it) include far too much WP:SYNTH and this is a reeking WP:EXAMPLEFARM. ― Padenton|✉   20:14, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Evidence? Here you go. (And I didn't make that one.) Pax 20:32, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I'm afraid I have to agree with Padenton here, Pax -- I've been involved with the discussion since following a random RfC bot notice on another user's talk page and I haven't seen any indication of meat or sockpuppetry in the present discussions (and the ANI you linked didn't come to any conclusions of meat puppetry in the previous ones) -- most all of the involved editors seem to be known, experienced contributors who have come to the talk page through similar bot postings and several notices I've seen posted at various central community discussion spaces, attempting to draw attention to the matter (and this approach to getting further community insight on contentious issues is both well-advised and allowed under WP:CANVAS). The large amount of attention and talk page comments the article has attracted is probably a result of this completely acceptable and good-faith outreach. Furthermore, the previous AfD ended in a no consensus, so if some editors remained concerned that there were serious policy violations implicit in the continued existence and state of this article, it is permissible for them to start another one, especially if additional support from new voices on the talk page continue to argue strongly for a delete -- and looking at the several sizable discussions on that page, there is fairly landslide support for a delete or merger. Characterizing all of those comments as attempts at censorship which utilize bad-faith methods seems incredibly inaccurate in this instance. Snow ^{let's rap} 20:36, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete per the numerous issues with regard to WP:V/WP:RS, WP:SYNTH, WP:COATRACK, WP:POVFORK, WP:NEOLOGISM, and so forth; I advise respondents here to check out the talk page discussions for salient details. I think there remains some potential for a merge of some of the content into the articles Wartime sexual violence, Sexual slavery, and Slavery in 21st-century Islamism (to whatever limited extent the material which is properly sourced is not already located in those articles). I also feel that a general article on the topic of sexual terrorism (a more neutral and less inflammatory/coatrackish title for a topic whose notability and verifiability under available sourcing is undeniable) could be of immense value to the project's coverage of sexual violence. I would not only support such a move as a reasonable middle-ground approach, I'd volunteer as much time as necessary to helping get it off the ground, as its an important and broad topic upon which we have very little coverage at present. But I suspect that the acrimony attached to this article may preclude that route in the short term, as some may see it as an end-run around the delete that is likely to occur -- and the "salt" comments above tend to support this supposition, with everyone clearly tired of wrestling this neologism down. So while I think some sort of neutrally-approached article on the broader topic of rape utilized as a means of social control is not only well-advised but probably inevitable, at the moment my support goes to deleting this present article outright, as a non-neutral, inadequately sourced, and otherwise problematic mess. Snow ^{let's rap} 20:10, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete or Merge very selectively to forced conversion, wartime sexual violence, Slavery in 21st-century Islamism, and/or sexual slavery. Even if the term did get sufficient mainstream coverage, there's just not enough distinction from these other topics. There may be room to include a brief mention at one or more articles, and if it's predominantly used by particular groups, we can say as much. — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 20:30, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete and salt This article is nothing but a POV BATTLEGROUND - other articles like wartime sexual violence and Slavery in 21st-century Islamism have better content that has NPOV language fleshed out with academic SECONDARY sources and actually works towards a useful goal of encyclopaedic content. -- Aronzak (talk) 20:56, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete this article is a huge pile of original research propping up a neologism. This is the basic pattern: some article somewhere uses the term "rape jihad" to describe a case of an Islamist organisation or a group of Muslims sexually abusing people. This is used as an excuse to stick in a paragraph of text about that sexual abuse, usually copied from some other article about it and citing references which don't talk about "rape jihad" at all (in the case of the Darfur section the copyist hasn't even bothered to copy across the citations referred to in the footnotes). This is all linked up to conclude that these are all instances of some wider phenomenon called "rape jihad". Very few of the sources cited draw that conclusion, and the ones that do are of very low quality (the main ones are this which is a very unreliable source, and this, an opinion piece). Since the last AfD two paragraphs about the general history of rape in warfare have also been shoved in, despite the fact that the sources don't seem to talk about "rape jihad" at all. I advise against a merge as there is very, very little content that could be used and isn't already present somewhere else and given the history of recreations salting may be a good idea. Hut 8.5 21:08, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete, unsalvageable mess of WP:SYN and WP:COATRACK where the use of sources that do not discuss "rape jihad" is routine. Huon (talk) 21:37, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Strong Keep The only reason these editors have for deleting the article is because they evidently don't like it. This phenomenon has been going on for a while, and it has been described in many, many, many, reliable sources, and the term "rape jihad" has been specifically used. There is no reason to delete this page. The term has been used by many prominent writers across the world, and there were widely publicized incidents of it. Also, I think we should keep in mind the person who nominated this for deletion is a communist, look at his user page. His objectivity on this is dubious at best. BeastBoy3395 (talk) 21:50, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Skip the personal attacks please. If you do actually want this page to be kept then labeling people as "obstructionist", "biased", "rabidly pro-Muslim" and "communist" really does not help your case. (Incidentally expressing an interest in the academic study of communism does not make you a communist, nor does communism imply support for militant Islam.) Hut 8.5 21:59, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

The nom's political leanings are not in any way relevant to this discussion (and are not in any event explicitly disclosed on their user page). Please confine your comments to valid policy arguments, and leave assessments of the personal qualities of the involved editors out of the matter -- argue the point, not the qualities of the participants. Frankly your comments are so over-the-top and unacceptably antagonistic, that (combined with the fact that your account is two days old), I find myself wondering if this a plant and an attempt to discredit the "keep" votes by making them look unnecessarily combative; the tone and content of your arguments are working that strongly against the outcome which you nominally are supporting. Regardless, please be aware that persisting in non-germane personal attacks may lead to a block on your ability to edit. Snow ^{let's rap} 22:06, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Also, when you have made inflammatory comments which others have objected to, it is considered appropriate to strike those comments rather deleting/altering them as you did after other editors have already replied; altering your comments changes the way in which the replying editors' comments will be perceived and can be used to game the discussion. Snow ^{let's rap} 22:29, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete and salt per WP:COATRACK and WP:NEOLOGISM. MarnetteD|Talk 22:09, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete Despite very good efforts this remains an unsalvageable coatrack. Maybe leave a redirect, but I'd be fine with salting too. AniMate 23:01, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete and salt. Coatrack and inflammatory. GregJackP Boomer! 23:25, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete and salt; I can't believe this is up for the fifth time. Any encyclopedic information should be included in Wartime sexual violence. Miniapolis 23:30, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete and salt. Unsalvageable coatrack about a seldom-used neologism. --Guy Macon (talk) 00:25, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete and salt. The phrase itself seems refer to a fringe theory, primarily expressed by a small number of commentators on FrontPage Mag (such as Robert Spencer and Andrew C. McCarthy) which has spread to a few places of similar ideological bent; I don't feel that the term or theory are noteworthy enough (or having enough verifiable high-quality sources explicitly covering it) to support an article. Beyond that the article itself seems to have devolved into a WP:COATRACK for editors to gather WP:OR in support of that theory. Collecting every event they can find related to Islam and sex abuse and lumping them together under the title used for the pet theories of a few talking heads is WP:OR in that they're using article space to advance those theories. Any article on Rape Jihad (under such a controversial name, and therefore implicitly advancing Spencer's controversial theories and interpretations) would need high-quality, reputable independent sources discussing Spencer et all's theories specifically. Those don't seem to exist, so if you strip away the original research and synthesis, there's not enough left to support an article -- just a few references to places like FrontPage Magazine, the Gatestone Institute, and the English Defence League using the term or advancing the theory (but never in any really coherent depth.) Salting seems necessary given the article's repeated recreation. As my attempts to salvage it show, I'm not completely opposed to the idea of having an article that covers the sorts of anti-Islamic theories advanced by some of these sources (although I'm not sure these specific ones are noteworthy or widespread enough to cover), but it would need to be under another name and would need to be centered around reputable independent sources discussing and critiquing the theories directly rather than on the primary sources that created and advance them, which would mean a new article made from scratch. --Aquillion (talk) 02:18, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete and salt. This is one of the worst articles I have ever seen on Wikipedia. It shames us that we give credibility to English Defence League conspiacy theories and list the Rotherham scandal as evidence of rape jihad - it was absolutely nothing of the sort. This article is a breach of WP:NPOV, the sources are incredibly poor and biased and do not meet WP:RS. The inclusion of the Rotherham and other British scandals as evidence of jihad is beyond satire. Does every Muslim that commits a crime do so in the name of Islamist jihad? Does every Christian who commits a crime do so in the name of fundamentalism or terrorism? The editing here has not been WP:NPOV and decisively WP:BATTLEGROUND. The article is an example of WP:FRINGE. Overwhelming consensus has always been to delete. Let's get it done with. AusLondonder (talk) 02:23, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete and salt per numerous others — Malik Shabazz ^Talk/_Stalk 03:08, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment The closing admin may want to remember to salt both the titles, with upper and lower case J. --Fauzan^{✆ talk}_{✉ mail} 03:43, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete and salt – The WP:FRINGE article is a non-notable, non-neutral, footnoted, political attack of a poorly sourced, biased WP:NEOLOGISM with a combination WP:POVFORK and WP:EXAMPLEFARM. There aren't any secondary sources meeting reliability standards of WP:V, WP:RS, which has meant that the article has turned it into a WP:COATRACK full of WP:SYNTH, WP:OR and WP:POV via WP:BATTLEGROUND.

The term/theory mainly expressed by commentators on a right wing magazine has then gone on to spread to those of similar views. Most of the other sources don't discuss the term at all and those that do are unreliable meaning the topic isn't noteworthy enough or has enough significant coverage from independent verifiable sources to support an article. Any encyclopaedic information within the article should be included in Wartime sexual violence and/or Slavery in 21st-century Islamism.

The article has recently been improved in line with policy guidelines by uninvolved editors, however, this has just proven that the topic clearly fails WP:GNG. Two previous AfD has ended in delete, so why are we still having this same discussion again?

Also worth noting that the two editors with the only two keeps make irrelevant comments about the nominator's talk page containing a communist userbox which has absolutely no bearing on the spirit nomination itself, given the clear valid reason given for it. These personal attacks add nothing to the case of keeping the article other than suggesting that those editors themselves hold biased views as well have weak argument on the matter. Tanbircdq (talk) 13:00, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

(ec)*Delete and salt - While WP is not censored, this article is inflammatory and I agree with Tanbircdq that it is full of WP:OR and is a WP:COATRACK and a magnet for editors who are Islamophobic. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 17:04, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Davewild (talk) 19:13, 17 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Akmal Eyzad[edit]

Akmal Eyzad (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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Singer with questionable notability and looks like a coi as well. Wgolf (talk) 17:20, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• Delete Not seeing any evidence of meeting WP:MUSICBIO. All search results appear to be user profiles and other self-published stuff. ― Padenton|✉   18:39, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete Per above. Also, this page may benefit from WP:SKYBLUELOCK as it's been recreated multiple times. --Non-Dropframe _talk 19:22, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete - I can't find reliable sources on a search for them in Google. Also, "External links" section violates WP:FACEBOOK and WP:TWITTER (will fix that meanwhile). --TL22 (talk) 23:01, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete and salt fails WP:GNG, WP:BIO and WP:MUSIC. Salt as created multiple times. Joseph2302 (talk) 01:11, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete Nothing on search, not notable. AlbinoFerret 02:56, 13 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Davewild (talk) 15:33, 17 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Three legged chair or table[edit]

Three legged chair or table (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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Unsourced essay that even gets the reason why a three-legged table does not rock wrong. I can't see this as a notable topic, just a lame dictdef. TheLongTone (talk) 14:53, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Speedy delete - fails in every possible way. This editor has made some other strange articles I'm going to list for adf. —Мандичка^YO 😜 15:12, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete - Completely unreferenced. WikiMan20152014 (talk) 15:24, 10 May 2015 (UTC)WikiMan20152014[reply]
• Delete unencyclopedic. Mellowed Fillmore (talk) 15:28, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• Delete No sources, time for it to go. AlbinoFerret 02:59, 13 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• dont delete

Its not possible to cite sources for this but it is an obvious fact that 4 legged tables are not stable wherease three legged are. this is a matter of observation. Its amazing that the people who want this deleted do not get the point ie that the majority of furniture designers are unaware of this simple fact which casues irriation to so many cafe users. Why not have an article adressing it. I can provide a mathemiaticl proof of why a 3 legged table is stable if you thinkk that is worth it.

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The result was keep. Consensus is clear now, with only the nominator still supporting deletion Davewild (talk) 18:58, 17 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Charitha Herath[edit]

Charitha Herath (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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Non-notable individual - fails WP:BIO. The individual, Charitha Herath, was a minor government official and a non-notable academic. Essentially this article appears to be a WP:COATRACK. Dan arndt (talk) 13:00, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• Change to keep - sources Wikicology found support GNG Delete per nom - minor coverage but not enough needed —Мандичка^YO 😜 04:05, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep:- Subject of the article is a Senior Public official and former Chairman of Central Environmental Authority. Subject of the article meet WP:GNG Per significant coverages in multiple independent reliable sources. I found Lankae News, Colombo telegraph, News First, Lanka News, Sunday observer, BBC News, Vivalanka News, Global Tamil News, Srilankans News, Lanka Channels, Ceylon Today, Lanka Sri News, Sri Lanka Catering to mention few. Wikic¤l¤gy^{t@lk to M£} 22:57, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep Sources found by Wikicology shows some notability. AlbinoFerret 03:04, 13 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Comment just because a person exists does not necessarily make them notable. Essentially the individual should meet WP:BIO or WP:NACADEMIC, in this case we have a minor bureaucrat/minor academic that does not appear to have achieved anything significant or notable. None of the references cited by User:Wikicology seem to establish anything otherwise.Dan arndt (talk) 13:31, 13 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

You cannot be serious! Notability is not the same as achievement. Wikipedia often keep articles on the basis of notability and not achievement. Subject of an article need not meet every criteria. These one clearly meet WP:GNG and the sources provided is not only an evidence of existence but notability. Wikic¤l¤gy^{t@lk to M£} 15:16, 13 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Wikicology if you consider that your references establish the subject's notability then why haven't you included then in the article to demonstrate how. Dan arndt (talk) 19:55, 13 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Sources exist as references for multiple reasons and they are primarily used to validate claims on Wikipedia. I really don't have the time to expand the article so why the need to add citations? For example, if am interested in written on his criticism, I may find Global tamil News helpful and therefore add it to the article. That's how things work here. Wikic¤l¤gy^{t@lk to M£} 20:28, 13 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Comment so whilst you consider the individual is notable you don't believe that the article should include those referenced sources that you believe establish its notability. The references in the article clearly do not establish notability merely that he is a minor bureaucrat for a junior government agency and a non-notable academic. Dan arndt (talk) 00:26, 14 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

 Done he clearly meets WP:GNG. Wikic¤l¤gy^{t@lk to M£} 08:18, 15 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• FYI I changed my vote to keep —Мандичка^YO 😜 18:11, 17 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was speedy delete. Speedy deleted as A11/A7/A1 Acroterion (talk) 12:48, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Kzisesta[edit]

Kzisesta (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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Unreferenced, unable to establish notability, contested prod and re-created speedy deletion. WWGB (talk) 12:11, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Speedy delete and SALT. Based on description it is unlikely this will ever be notable. —Мандичка^YO 😜 12:13, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete--Ymblanter (talk) 09:23, 17 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Chrissy Bray[edit]

Chrissy Bray (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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Delete: as insufficiently notable entertainer. Quis separabit? 12:07, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• Delete - No sources to be found anywhere —Мандичка^YO 😜 12:15, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• delete I can't believe such a poor article has survived 9 years. Fails WP:BIO. LibStar (talk) 13:06, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

LibStar Yikes, I didn't even notice that. And it was tagged multiple times as being purely promotional, etc. Nobody followed up. —Мандичка^YO 😜 14:02, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete – Does not appear to have sufficient notable activity to warrant an article.shaidar cuebiyar (talk) 01:06, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Additionally the article may have Conflict of Interest issues: page creator and major early contributor was also member of subject's website maintainers / uploaders of images. See here. You may have to read the wikicode there for his hidden message.shaidar cuebiyar (talk) 01:17, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete. No real claim to notability and fails WP:GNGDoctorhawkes (talk) 07:23, 16 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was keep. Davewild (talk) 15:31, 17 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Rob Brough[edit]

Rob Brough (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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Delete: as non-notable television presenter. Quis separabit? 11:53, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep host of nationally broadcast gameshow plus long time news presenter. His national profile whilst host of Feud was 1988-95, so not surprising not much is on google. The-Pope (talk) 10:41, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• keep as per the pope. He was host of a long time national tv show. LibStar (talk) 03:13, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• Keep. I'm normally inclined to vote delete for low-profile TV "stars", but he really did have a large profile and good coverage in the pre-internet days. Doctorhawkes (talk) 07:21, 16 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Davewild (talk) 15:30, 17 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Padmnabhacharya swami maharaj[edit]

Padmnabhacharya swami maharaj (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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Blatant violation of WP:RNPOV; turning this into an encyclopedic article would mean a rewrite. PROD by Mike Rosoft and me declined by page author. QVVERTYVS (hm?) 10:09, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Originally proposed for deletion by me with the reason: "Unreferenced, not written in the style of an encyclopedic article - religious claims presented as a fact". The reason still applies - the article's creator just removed the deletion notice without an explanation or any further changes to the article. Delete. - Mike Rosoft (talk) 13:40, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

  @Mike Rosoft: to be fair, some references were added, though the citation style is not quite perfect. QVVERTYVS (hm?) 15:39, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• Delete Not notable. Thanks. Ism schism (talk) 22:26, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was redirect to A Series of Unfortunate Events. Davewild (talk) 15:30, 17 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

V.F.D.[edit]

V.F.D. (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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Similar to the Great Unknown (A Series of Unfortunate Events) deletion discussion, this is a belabored fancrufty analysis of a fictional entity, rife with original research and synthesis, and most crucially, no evidence of independent notability per WP:GNG, that is, real world notability. --Animalparty-- (talk) 08:57, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Redirect to A Series of Unfortunate Events: I probably would have nominated the article for AfD myself if you hadn't. — Bilorv_(talk)^(c)(e) 10:16, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Redirect An impressive piece of fandom that would do well on a Lemony Snicket wiki, but is not suitable for Wikipedia because it's not sourced to third parties and there's no indication of independent notability. The main article probably says almost all that can be sourced. In 100 Google search results the best source I could find was a dialog in AV Club[9] which includes some discussion of VFD, but as I understand it, dialogues (like interviews) aren't reliable sources. --Colapeninsula (talk) 13:38, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was redirect to List of minor planets: 1001–2000. Davewild (talk) 15:29, 17 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

1417 Walinskia[edit]

1417 Walinskia (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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Doesn't meet WP:NASTRO or WP:GNG, but as a low-numbered asteroid, needs a thorough discussion rather than a unilateral redirect. My personal opinion is that is should be deleted or (preferably) redirected to List of minor planets 1001-2000 in line with WP:NASTRO. Boleyn (talk) 08:30, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• Redirect. Nothing of interest found in Google scholar. —David Eppstein (talk) 23:07, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Procedural Keep: Boleyn appears to be on a deletion spree without allowing consensus to develop on the asteroid articles they have previously nominated. AfD is overhead and this is an abuse of the system.--Milowent • ^hasspoken 13:40, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Redirect per WP:DWMP: concur with D. Eppstein. Praemonitus (talk) 19:29, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was redirect to List of minor planets: 1001–2000. Davewild (talk) 15:28, 17 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

1260 Walhalla[edit]

1260 Walhalla (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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Doesn't meet WP:NASTRO or WP:GNG, but as a low-numbered asteroid, needs a thorough discussion rather than a unilateral redirect. My personal opinion is that is should be deleted or (preferably) redirected to List of minor planets 1001-2000 in line with WP:NASTRO. Boleyn (talk) 08:29, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• Redirect. Part of a 16-asteroid group study [10] but it's not enough. —David Eppstein (talk) 07:14, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Procedural Keep: Boleyn appears to be on a deletion spree without allowing consensus to develop on the asteroid articles they have previously nominated. AfD is overhead and this is an abuse of the system.--Milowent • ^hasspoken 13:40, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Redirect per WP:DWMP: insufficient sources. Praemonitus (talk) 19:11, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was redirect to List of minor planets: 1001–2000. Davewild (talk) 15:26, 17 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

1475 Yalta[edit]

1475 Yalta (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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Doesn't meet WP:NASTRO or WP:GNG, but as a low-numbered asteroid, needs a thorough discussion rather than a unilateral redirect. My personal opinion is that is should be deleted or (preferably) redirected to List of minor planets 1001-2000 in line with WP:NASTRO. Boleyn (talk) 08:27, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• Redirect. Nothing of interest found on Google scholar. —David Eppstein (talk) 07:08, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Procedural Keep: Boleyn appears to be on a deletion spree without allowing consensus to develop on the asteroid articles they have previously nominated. AfD is overhead and this is an abuse of the system.--Milowent • ^hasspoken 13:41, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Redirect per WP:DWMP: only positional reports and lightcurve opportunities reported. Nothing substantial. Praemonitus (talk) 19:24, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was Keep (non-admin closure) Pharaoh of the Wizards (talk) 16:14, 13 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

1468 Zomba[edit]

1468 Zomba (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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Doesn't meet WP:NASTRO or WP:GNG, but as a low-numbered asteroid, needs a thorough discussion rather than a unilateral redirect. My personal opinion is that is should be deleted or (preferably) redirected to List of minor planets 1001-2000 in line with WP:NASTRO. Boleyn (talk) 08:25, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• Keep: Mars crossing vestoid with a couple of light curve studies plus information in several other scholarly papers. Praemonitus (talk) 18:32, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep. Along with a couple of light curve studies [11] [12] and brief mentions in several articles about Mars-crossers, it's cited as "the only known Vestoid with a minimum ejection velocity from Vesta greater than 2 km/s" (not counting 1459 Magnya, also a notable Vestoid but not a Mars-crosser) [13]. —David Eppstein (talk) 23:12, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Procedural Keep: Boleyn appears to be on a deletion spree without allowing consensus to develop on the asteroid articles they have previously nominated. AfD is overhead and this is an abuse of the system.--Milowent • ^hasspoken 13:42, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep per Milowent's comments and the fact it is a large 13km Mars-crossing asteroid. Overwhelming AfD is harmful to Wikipedia and demostartes that someone is not a team player. -- Kheider (talk) 15:26, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep Additionally to the above mentioned reasons, there were interesting circumstances to its discovery - it was first discovered by Cyril Jackson but was also discovered 10 days later by Louis Boyer, whose discovery was reported before Jackson's. (Source: the discovery circumstances in the asteroid's JPL SBDB entry). exoplanetaryscience (talk) 14:51, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Withdraw nomination per reasoning given by Praemonitus and David Eppstein. Thanks for your hard work. Boleyn (talk) 18:47, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was keep. Consensus that the article now meets the notability guidelines, most of the deletes and redirects were before the new evidence provided later in the discussion after which there was no support for deletion. Davewild (talk) 15:22, 17 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Growing Up Straight (1982 book)[edit]

Growing Up Straight (1982 book) (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD · Stats)

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non notable book./ Only 57 holdings in worldcat. Onr review fro m a specialist magazine is not enough for notability DGG ( talk ) 05:31, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Wikipedia:BKCRIT nowhere says that a book's notability depends on the number of holdings in worldcat. It seems strange to be nominating the article for deletion simply because it currently rests on only a single source. There definitely were other reviews; Kenneth Zucker, a well-known figure, reviewed the book in 1984 in Archives of Sexual Behavior, a respectable academic source. Since that source could be added, I don't see a basis for deleting the article (though this isn't yet a vote). FreeKnowledgeCreator (talk) 06:47, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Comment - Don't think article is sufficiently neutral, especially given the WP:FRINGE nature, however basis for nomination is unclear. Worldcat is not relevant. Those in favour of keeping should seek more sources demonstrating notability and ensure article is more neutral. AusLondonder (talk) 10:52, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep sufficient coverage to pass the notability guidelines. Mellowed Fillmore (talk) 12:26, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Redirect to George Alan Rekers, I don't think there's enough coverage to establish that this book is notable independently of its author. Most coverage I could find was passing mentions in news articles about Rekers, e.g. [14] [15] [16] Everymorning talk 14:52, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I looked at those references; most of them are indeed only brief mentions, but the third is slightly more substantial, and in fact quite a useful source. I believe it helps to show that Rekers's book has been a subject of commentary. FreeKnowledgeCreator (talk) 09:31, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete. Does not assert any notability and does not pass WP:NBOOK. Softlavender (talk) 20:24, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete - Fails WP:NBOOK. Rekers is certainly notable, but as Everymorning above, the coverage I'm finding is largely brief mentions/in passing. — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 20:42, 10 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Everymorning is not completely correct; most of those references are indeed only brief mentions, but one is more substantial. FreeKnowledgeCreator (talk) 09:34, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• Comment Have any of the delete voters above bothered to look at the review by Zucker? I don't currently have the full article, but I looked at an extract from it, and it's hardly a passing mention. If I manage to get access to the article, I will be adding it to improve the article; I would then ask the delete voters to reconsider their position. FreeKnowledgeCreator (talk) 07:30, 11 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• I'll see if I can find it via my school's database. Tokyogirl79 (｡◕‿◕｡) 06:33, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you very much, Tokyogirl79. I appreciate your work and your willingness to consider that improving the article is worthwhile. FreeKnowledgeCreator (talk) 07:31, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep. I was able to find the Zucker review and it is quite extensive. I also found a lengthy mention about the work in an academic textbook and a mention in an academic journal article. The coverage is light, but it is enough to pass NBOOK offhand. Tokyogirl79 (｡◕‿◕｡) 07:00, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep per Tokyogirl79. FreeKnowledgeCreator (talk) 07:32, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• No problem- in all fairness the sources are somewhat difficult to find since there's a lot of unusable stuff to wade through. Tokyogirl79 (｡◕‿◕｡) 10:48, 12 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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• Comment I have found another source that discusses this book; it can be seen here on Google books. It states that the book was influential, and gives quite a detailed description of it. I think it's becoming clear that both Growing Up Straight and Shaping Your Child's Sexual Identity are notable and that the deletion attempt is misguided. FreeKnowledgeCreator (talk) 10:42, 13 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment I would accept a merge to the author. I should have thought of that initially. We could justify a separate article perhaps on the basis of the added material, but I think it would be more helpful merged, and according to WP:N, we can choose to do that. DGG ( talk ) 04:31, 15 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • It's not clear to me what the advantage of a merge would be in this case; if there were a benefit to a merge it should be easy to say what it is. FreeKnowledgeCreator (talk) 07:47, 15 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep Non-trivial mentions in academic journals, a major national newspaper, and multiple other sources mean that this clearly passes WP:GNG and WP:NBOOK. Any neutrality issues could be fixed by normal editing. Arthur goes shopping (talk) 06:26, 15 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep This was an important book in its day, but the article here says almost nothing about it. In fact, I find the article to be quite odd. Hopefully someone will improve it. LaMona (talk) 06:06, 17 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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