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The result was Procedural Close. Article was redirected to Boss (video games), so this debate is both 6 weeks old and moot. UltraExactZZ Claims ~ Evidence 16:28, 4 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Boss Mode[edit]

Boss Mode (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

The article describes a childish mindset that is both not notable and unverified. And actually, it can't BE verified. -- Cronocke (talk) 20:08, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Delete. I can see it's got sources nicely lined up, but this is just way too ephemeral. It doesn't really seem very 'encyclopedic'. Though that's a rather ephemeral thing for me to say, ironically. - Vianello (talk) 21:14, 25 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was delete. Wizardman 14:52, 6 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

TCExam[edit]

TCExam (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Spammily written article on a software product, Google news hits are mostly for Testicular Cancer Exam and a couple of PRwires Fee Fi Foe Fum (talk) 23:56, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

  1. Neutral - It can be improved...right now it sounds like an advertisement. Whaatt (talk) 00:18, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

-Nakon: This can be improved..for example, I just removed advertisement sounding sentences. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Whaatt (talkcontribs) 00:25, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

merged into the Computer-based training article? Jasynnash2 (talk) 08:47, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]


>Firstly this isn't a vote.
Yes I know, I've read the wikipedia guidelines. I've changed "vote" in "opinion" Nicolaasuni (talk) 10:11, 1 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
>Now to your other points. TCExam is a software product. It doesn't matter if it is free or £1000.00 per user.
In business, a product is a good or service which can be bought and sold. Following this definition, TCexam is NOT a product because it can't be bought or sold. Anyway, if TCExam is a software product, any software is a product, so what is the point? Nicolaasuni (talk) 10:11, 1 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
>Next, Google is not the same as Google News and the statement about Google News is correct (as is yours about Google although some of those 101,000 hits are about Testicular Cancer).
This is clearly false. 101,000 Google results are just all about TCExam software (probably 2 or 3 about Testicular Cancer, and just because the page name). Google news is NOT a valid tool to measure a software popularity and notability. In fact, very popular software installed million times are never cited on Google News! For example the software "Ares galaxy" is download more than 150,000 times a day (more than 152,138,172 in total) and is never cited on Google news. Nicolaasuni (talk) 10:11, 1 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
>Thirdly, the article looked like an advertisement and some users are trying to help it not look that way in order to improve the article. Again whether or not TCExam is free does not change the way the article is written.
I think that someone has tried to mutilate the article. I've read another time the article and it only report FACTS in neutral point of view, so, could you please point me on the sentences that sounds like advertisement? Nicolaasuni (talk) 10:11, 1 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
>Everyday increasing in popularity and being available in a number of places does not automatically make the software notable.
I agree, but seems that this is disturbing some companies that uses people that act like you to denigrate the free open source alternatives. Nicolaasuni (talk) 10:11, 1 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
>Neither does the Sourceforge.net automatically make it notable.
Probably is not automatic but scoring 191 over 175,969 projects 25 Apr 2008 statistics on the first and most important open source repository of the world is not an easy task and for sure an important clue of notability. Nicolaasuni (talk) 10:11, 1 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
>I'm pretty sure there is notability criteria for software and/or computer products on wiki and would suggest having a look.
TCExam is going to be intergated as debian package and other distributions. The sourceforge.net statistics clearly shows that TCExam is currently the first (and most used) open-source Computer-Based Assessment Software of the world. Are not these notable things?
>You need to provide reliable 3rd party sources for the notability portion of this debate and present TCExam from a neutral point of view in the article. Perhaps you could create a simply pros/con table siting reliable 3rd party sources for each.
Here are some independent third-party TCExam articles/sources: Nicolaasuni (talk) 10:11, 1 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Additionally, several forum comments, articles and blog entries are available in several languages (i.e.: Ujian Online dengan TCExam) - a deep Google search is required.
>Lastly, please read some of the policies around here particularly those about Good Faith and Civility. Coming on here and claiming that people are "vendors socket-puppets" is probably not the best way to approach the subject of the articles merits. Jasynnash2 (talk) 13:16, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Please read better, I've never accused anyone to be a "vendor socket-puppet", I've just write "sounds like". As you probably know, there are a lot of people acting for commercial companies whose goal is to discredit competitors. Are you one of those? Nicolaasuni (talk) 10:11, 1 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]





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The result was Delete. Tiptoety talk 04:27, 4 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Datawasp[edit]

Datawasp (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Software was released just a week ago. I think it's not notable, but I'm listing it here because I'm unsure (WP:SOFTWARE is no good). Article created by a SPA with a COI whose only other contributions are wikilinking to this article from other pages. Search on Google for '"datawasp "significant data systems"' returns few hits, most of them from download mirror sites. /Carson 23:47, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was keep per WP:HEY. This article appears to have been improved to show notability with better sources. Bearian (talk) 14:58, 6 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Mas Amedda[edit]

Mas Amedda (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

No citations to reliable sources, no assertion of notability. --EEMIV (talk) 23:06, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was no consensus to delete. Please take any merge discussion to the appropriate talk pages. ···日本穣? · Talk to Nihonjoe 04:40, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Rule of Two[edit]

Rule of Two (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

No assertion of notability. Single cited source is to in-franchise, in-universe plot summary; no material present that offers a real-world treatment of the topic. --EEMIV (talk) 23:06, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was delete. Wizardman 14:57, 6 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Shariff Ameeruddin Ishaqui[edit]

Shariff Ameeruddin Ishaqui (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Contested prod by an IP (probably the creator). Non-notable journalist, a Google search shows no results for this reporter other than on Wikipedia Cunard (talk) 22:56, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was delete. Nousernamesleftcopper, not wood 03:10, 4 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Hatzfeldt Syndrome[edit]

Hatzfeldt Syndrome (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Suspected hoax. There are no PubMed results for "Hatzfeldt syndrome"; "Hatzfeld" only gets hits in author names, mostly in molecular biology papers. There are no PubMed results for "Systemic Neuro-Epiphysial Disorder", and there shouldn't be, because there are no anatomical structures to which the term "neuroepiphyseal" could apply; I'm pretty sure there is no such thing as a "neuroepiphysis", at least not in people. A Google search gets only two hits in seemingly reputable sites that are not Wikipedia mirrors: this and this. For a quite detailed critique by User:Fuzzform of why this article makes absolutely no sense scientifically, please see User_talk:Fvasconcellos#Re:_Hatzfeldt_Syndrome. By the way, I intend to notify WP:MED of this discussion. Fvasconcellos (t·c) 22:56, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I've emailed both the sites you mentioned, asking what their source was (?just WP itself, in which case shame on Oakland Institute). David Ruben Talk 00:15, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Good, I was sidetracked while trying to do the same. Fvasconcellos (t·c) 00:24, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Received nice email back from sleep.org thanking us for the "catch" and they have now removed the term from their dictionary :-) David Ruben Talk 19:47, 1 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was delete. Wizardman 14:58, 6 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Titus James[edit]

Titus James (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Non-notable player - no evidence he has played in a fully professional league; article states he currently plays for SM Caen but he is not listed on their official site; limited Google hits GiantSnowman 22:46, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Reply I'm not doubting his existence, just his notability; if he is playing for Villenoy then he is still not notable. GiantSnowman 11:13, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Agreed, as a footballer he doesn't satisfy WP:ATHLETE. But nor did Sonny Pike. He was a young boy who was so good at football that he went off to a foreign country as a great prospect but never became a footballer; his notability presumably came under the WP:BIO#Basic criteria, being the subject of independent published sources. Titus James looks like a Malaysian equivalent. As the article stands, there aren't sufficient independent sources to assert notability, but that isn't to say they don't exist. All I'm saying is that there might be more to this particular case than just black-and-white football-notability considerations. cheers, Struway2 (talk) 11:51, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
If reliable, independent sources can be found to back up his notability on that front, then the article should remain. All I seem to be able to find are forums and James' personal blog. GiantSnowman 13:46, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
How? He fails WP:ATHLETE as he has never played in a professional league, and WP:BIO as there are no independent, reliable sources which confirm his notability. GiantSnowman 17:33, 4 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Any evidence that he is "very famous"? GiantSnowman 11:01, 6 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was delete. chaser - t 18:35, 6 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

David Paul Grove[edit]

David Paul Grove (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Small part actor. Ghits yield very little in terms of biographical content, mainly filmography. Fails WP:N for me due to lack of real information about the person beyond filmography lists. treelo talk 22:46, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Comment: Article has been deleted twice prior to this nom, once through WP:PROD and again through WP:CSD#A7. Might be a stronger candidate for speedy deletion again through A7, content seems to be fairly inert and unlikely to be too controversial. --treelo talk 22:53, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was keep. chaser - t 20:20, 6 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Leonard Horowitz[edit]

Leonard Horowitz (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Fails WP:BIO and WP:PROF. Tagged for better refs since November 2007, but continues to lack any evidence of notability through independent, reliable secondary sources. Largely a resumé, and without good secondary sources we can't write an encyclopedic bio. MastCell Talk 22:32, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Move for deletion of most tags I've added a lot of material. NPOV isn't easy in cases like these, but luckily, his record speaks for itself pretty well. I think there's a rough consensus against deletion; I've expanded the article considerably; there are now quite a few references. If there's anything lacking, it's how to put him in context. Yakushima (talk) 12:08, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Move to delete AfD tagging - I've beefed up the article considerably. It's got better context now, and refers to his legit peer-reviewed publications. I think it could use a cleanup, still. Maybe there should be something about Horowitz's fight to keep his daughter from TB innoculation in Hawaii (some press attention to that). Maybe there should be cross-linking to related or identical conspiracy theory articles. But that's about it, and I'm tired of this now. Can somebody just substitute a cleanup tag? Yakushima (talk) 09:08, 3 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
No, speaking as the guy who has probably put 20 hours into the article by now, you can see as well anyone, Ewenss, that the article cites his peer-reviewed publications, and mentions his credentials in more than one place. Is it "all about controversies"? It's not controversial whether the FDA and FTC sent Horowitz warning letters about his bogus SARS remedy. They did. Horowitz responded openly, publicly, by TRYING to make a controversy over it, by cocking a snoot at both agencies. ("No such thing as bad publicity", it seems.) It's not controversial that The Final Call cited his work about AIDS and Ebola, with conspiracy theories linking Jimmy Carter and Zbigniew Brzezinski into supposed programs of genocide against African Americans. The Final Call DID publish that. It's not controversial whether Rev. Jeramiah Wright cited Horowitz's Emerging Viruses in support of his contention that the U.S. government lied about having engineered HIV. He did. You can go watch that on video. I'm sure there are quite a few biographies on Wikipedia of people who have become notable chiefly because they sought controversy. (The list would probably include a healthy dollop of conspiracy theorists, and "conspiracy theorist" seems to be a label Horowitz would wear proudly, if anything.) YOU need to make the case that Horowitz is not notable. And you're somehow going to have to do that despite the fact he's been extensively noted, in one way or another. Horowitz gravitates toward controversy, is mainly noted for his statements and writing on certain controversial topics, so OF COURSE the article on him is going to bring up the controversies he's been involved with. How could it be any other way? Yakushima (talk) 07:39, 4 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
The material is about certain specific VIEWPOINTS. That is the basis for articles about viewpoints, NOT a biography. Clearly. Ewenss (talk) 07:41, 4 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
(Just deleted a long and embarrassing rant of mine here. Trying again.) If somebody has become notable for his viewpoints -- and Horowitz is notable for more than that, though not much more -- he's still notable. If he doesn't have much non-conspiracy-theoretic, non-quackery information available about his life, it's because of what he's devoted his life to, isn't it? Given the nature of his work, how much can we believe anyway, to the extent that biographical information comes from him? I believe he has daughter, because she's mentioned in Hawaiian news as part of Horowitz's resistance to TB immunization of schoolchildren. I believe he has a wife -- she's quoted in press releases as defending him against against charges of being a public health menace because of his leadership role in opposing vaccination. Do I mention them without mentioning the Horowitz controversies they are tied up in? Do I just say he has a wife and a daughter? I don't believe these people are imaginary, but they do seem to live in their own heads, and their heads seemed to be stuffed up certain of their orifices. How do I treat the man and his life apart from his weird controversies? He himself makes that almost impossible. He's almost notable for that alone. ;-) Yakushima (talk) 14:30, 4 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
"Long embarrassing rant" sums up the article nicely. Cryptographic hash (talk) 17:51, 4 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Really? I'm trying to stay even-toned. Do you have any suggestions about how I might offer a bit more NPOV? Obviously I can't just delete the words of Horowitz, Rev. Wright or The Final Call wherever they seem to be ranting (it wouldn't leave much to quote from them), but exactly where do you think I'm ranting in article? Yakushima (talk) 04:15, 5 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was delete as failing WP:N (and various more specific branches of it). No prejudice against recreation should sufficient reliable sources be found which can verify notability. ···日本穣? · Talk to Nihonjoe 04:55, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Urs Lüthi[edit]

Urs Lüthi (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Apparently he wrote a well-regarded book about the Berne Trial, a notable event in the history of antisemitism. It's not quite clear from the article, though, whether this is enough to warrant an article per WP:PROF. His date of birth and death appear to be uncertain (indicating that his life hasn't been covered in any detail by anyone), and the assertion of him being a scholarly authority is not substantiated with an inline citation. The name is a common one in Switzerland, so Google yields many hits about unrelated persons. Sandstein (talk) 22:14, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

  • That's probably another Urs Lüthi. As I said, both the first and the last name are rather common in Switzerland. Sandstein (talk) 06:00, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
What is the evidence for Luthi' book being the standard work on the Berne Trial? Has he received a doctoral degree and if yes, when and where? Does he, or has he ever, held any academic positions? Has he written any other published scholarly works and if yes, which ones? Without answers to these basic questions one cannot seriously argue that he satisfies either WP:PROF, WP:BIO or WP:N. Even a convincing WP:N or WP:BK case for his book has not yet been made. I am certainly simpathetic to the goal of having more WP articles on notable topics and people related to the history of the Protocols of the Elders of Zion (especially since far too many people still believe their authenticity), but it has to be done in acordance with WP policies and guidelines. Nsk92 (talk) 14:19, 3 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Reply. No. This isn't a vote, or a trial, but a discussion about the merits of keeping or deleting an article. All opinions are welcome. Phil Bridger (talk) 09:56, 1 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
I am interested in the answer as well since there is no such thing as WP:AUTHOR. More likely that DGG meant WP:BK since he is a regular participant in AfDs regards academics and knows what WP:PROF is quite well. I am still fairly perplexed, though. I don't think one can argue that the subject satisfies WP:PROF. The book about the Berne trial may satisfy WP:BK but in that case one should create an article about the book, not about its author. Nsk92 (talk) 00:58, 3 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was Keep. LaraLove 22:05, 6 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Sara Roy[edit]

Sara Roy (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

This article, which was created and mostly edited by a now-blocked sockpuppet army, is a coatrack for uncited criticism. It has almost no biographical content. — Malik Shabazz (talk · contribs) 22:13, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

In addition, take a look at this book at google[7] the essay I referred to above is reprinted in this collection of "Prophets Outcast" as far as I can tell, she would be the only contributor to not have an article on Wikipedia if this is deleted. Unfortunately the (probably brief) biographical information there, which could be good 3rd party source is on a restricted page. There is little question about her notability though; she's the world's leading authority on the economy of the Gaza Strip under Israel. Even this general guidebook to Israel sees fit to mention her authority in this field.[8]John Z (talk) 07:26, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment I think that you're mistaken when you write "whether there was uncited criticism is irrelevant". Per Wikipedia:Deletion policy, "Reasons for deletion include but are not limited to violation of copyright, content that does not belong in an encyclopedia, content not verifiable in a reliable source, and unreferenced negative content in biographies of living persons". (emphasis added) — Malik Shabazz (talk · contribs) 20:26, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment Clicking on "links" next to the article name, there doesn't appear to be any previous AfD that links to the article. Also, the article's Talk page doesn't mention any previous AfD. — Malik Shabazz (talk · contribs) 20:26, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was keep as meeting WP:MUSIC due to the second album being released. ···日本穣? · Talk to Nihonjoe 05:04, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Naledge[edit]

Naledge (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Does not appear to be notable as per WP:MUSIC -- the only source is a blogspot link and a myspace page. Coccyx Bloccyx (talk) 22:08, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

  • Did you read that article? It's all about Naledge and Kidz in the Hall (in case you didn't notice, Naledge is one of the two members of Kidz in the Hall), not just "mentioning" him "in passing".--Oakshade (talk) 16:14, 1 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • What biographical information about Naledge, the person (not the group "Kidz in the Hall") did you glean from the article? I'm quite curious. Yes, I read it. Coccyx Bloccyx (talk) 17:00, 1 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was speedy delete G10 --B (talk) 00:00, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Najib Afsar[edit]

Najib Afsar (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

One look at the article should be enough. 21655 - ταλκ 22:05, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was Delete. LaraLove 22:20, 6 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Robert Lindblad[edit]

Robert Lindblad (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Most of the apparent references are copyvios, since they are clips from newspapers hosted on his own personal site, and are too small to be readable in any case. The Youtube segment copied from TVA Montreal just provides his own account of how he helped out in one case of a missing child. (Nothing is quoted from any of the official investigators to confirm his role in the case). The article needs much more serious references to confirm the claims made and to establish his notability. Article was created by User:Robert Lindblad who is presumably the subject, which raises questions under our WP:AUTO and WP:COI guidelines. WP:AUTO states that Writing an autobiography on Wikipedia is strongly discouraged.. EdJohnston (talk) 21:51, 29 April 2008 (UTC) EdJohnston (talk) 21:51, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Re EdJohnston & Terraxos

Their is one news article that may be considered too small to read however it can be blown up for a better view by the reader. The Youtube segment is not only Robert Lindblads' own account as it was verified and confirmed by the parents of the child, the investigative reporters of Le Journal de Montreal, and that of the investigative reporters of "J.E. en direct". The police never reveal sources as it is part of the job of an investigator not to reveal sources however the parents of the missing child do confirm Robert Lindblads' role in the investigation in the Le Journal de Montreal article of 31-5-98 as do the investigative reporters of J.E. en direct. More references, proving that Robert Lindblads' notability is not related to one single event, in which the cases were active at the time have been added. These articles being that of The Ottawa Sun (2006) and the S.O.S. (TV-Asahi, Japan 2005) documentary. A radio interview from 2007 has also been added. The French-language coverage is not trivial at all as it is the first proven event recorded in history relating to an active case of a missing child that was solved by a psychic within 2 minutes. The evidence is clear as in Le Journal de Montreal article of 31-5-98 it states that the parents mentioned they called Robert Lindblad and were shocked to hear him state that their child had accidently drowned including where his body would be found and the very next day the article of Le Journal de Montreal of 1-6-98 states that the childs' corpse was found floating in the body of water that Robert Lindblad indicated to the parents. Robert Lindblads' work has been and continues do be done on a daily basis, is highly confidential and sensitive. However a few of the "then active" cases have been discussed in the aforementioned articles and interviews. As an investigator the cases Robert Lindblad works on a daily basis are private and not related to the press. The Dreamtalk interview in August of 2007 and other relavent articles and interviews dimisses the claim of falling into obscurity even though obscurity is part of the realm of a private investigator.

Re Cyberghostface Concerning COI From where do you get promoting your own intetrest? This is in the interest of all Wikipedia readers and is not a self promotion as it relates to the subject of psychics which is and has been included in Wikipedia for many years already. Concerning WP This article is backed up by proven and verified facts from the news articles of Le Journal de Montreal, the J.E. investigative team, and the parents of the missing child to deny reports that follow each other certifiably dated in sequence is to err in judgement. You are in error concerning the WP. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Robert Lindblad (talkcontribs) 21:02, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]


Re Bearian Concerning WP:N you are in error. As defined by Wikipedias' guidelines "The common theme in the notability guidelines is the requirement for verifiable objective evidence to support a claim of notability. Substantial coverage in reliable sources constitutes such objective evidence, as do published peer recognition" Their are 11 articles printed and broadcasts from Canada, the United States, England, and Japan concerning more than one case that specifically meet Wikipedias'guidelines and by the way these are high-quality and reliable sources which are verifiable. As for the page being previously deleted it should be ignored as the person in charge at that point did not bother to spend the time or effort to do the verifications and decided on a prejudicial whim to delete the page. I know this because the articles are verifiable. The 11 articles and interviews from England, Japan, Canada, and the United States dismisses your account of "A person who lives in obscurity is, by definition, not notable."

   —Preceding unsigned comment added by Robert Lindblad (talkcontribs) 21:31, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply] 


Re Stifle —Preceding unsigned comment added by Robert Lindblad (talkcontribs) 21:41, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for verifying them however once again "notability" as defined by Wikipedias' own guidelines is "The common theme in the notability guidelines is the requirement for verifiable objective evidence to support a claim of notability. Substantial coverage in reliable sources constitutes such objective evidence, as do published peer recognition" Their are 11 articles printed and broadcast from Canada, the United States, England, and Japan concerning more than one case that specifically meet Wikipedias'guidelines including recognition of peers. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Robert Lindblad (talkcontribs) 21:36, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. POV fork, again. So title was also protected. - Nabla (talk) 02:40, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Ukrainian Revolution of 1918[edit]

Ukrainian Revolution of 1918 (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

NPOV title: Ukrainian Revolution is applied to events in Ukraine relating to the October Revolution of 1917, but there was no "Revolution of 1918". Historians consider Nestor Makhno and the Ukrainian anarchists to be but one of many players in the Civil War.

This content fork of Makhnovism has been successfully proposed for deletion before, and I expect it to be deleted again without significant debate. But agreeing on a formal AfD now will allow subsequent reintroductions of this title to be speedy deleted.  Michael Z. 2008-04-29 21:20 Z

Clarification: The content of the article is not in jeopardy, because it will remain in the article Makhnovism. (This copy of that article was created by a new editor in an attempt to rename that article against consensus.) Michael Z. 2008-04-30 19:12 Z

Discussion[edit]

I'd like to emphasize that this is not a proposal to remove any encyclopedic material, only this duplicate of the article Makhnovism. A serious vote to keep should explain what text is expected to remain under this title. Michael Z. 2008-04-30 14:43 Z

Merge the text, delete this title[edit]

It looks like there's some support for merging the this version into Makhnovism. Anyone is welcome to do so immediately, since that article is not under discussion here, and I'm sure your efforts will improve it.

Most of the "keep" votes seem to have no problem with deleting this title. So let's do that, because the title seems to be indefensible, lacking references from academic histories (as opposed to political works). Michael Z. 2008-05-03 07:46 z


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The result was Delete --JForget 00:33, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

"What-is-Good-is-Beautiful" Stereotype[edit]

"What-is-Good-is-Beautiful" Stereotype (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Prod removed by editor after 5-day time without specifically addressing the prod concern. Article is not an encyclopedic article but rather an essay with original research/synthesis. Subject is not particularly notable or distinct and could be moved into Stereotype. Page is the original author's only edits and no pages link there. Reywas92Talk 21:19, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Despite the problems with the article, the stereotype is still very notable. The 1972 study has over 600 citations in Google Scholar[10], and the 1977 study has over 300[11].--FreeKresge (talk) 15:46, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was Speedily deleted by Dlohcierekim . Unable to find anything via Google to suggest this is anything but nonsense. Dlohcierekim 21:37, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Meegrob[edit]

Meegrob (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Seems like a WP:HOAX possibly? Gary King (talk) 21:06, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was Delete. LaraLove 22:28, 6 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Colonel Kill Motherfuckers[edit]

Colonel Kill Motherfuckers (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Non-notable film that has a distinct lack of multiple non-trivial sources. Reading through the google hits for an hour or so, I had a very difficult time finding any source on the movie that wasn't either a blog, you-tube, or self-promotional. Trusilver 20:44, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I also note that this article was given a prod tag ten days or so ago but it was removed by the article's author. Trusilver 20:45, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
I didn't get that either, I have sent a message to the editor asking for him to elaborate on his position. Trusilver 01:13, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
You don't need to "prove" that the film is notable, either it is or it isn't. I spent quite a while looking for something to pass WP:FILM and I was unable to locate anything. If you can find anything that qualifies the need for multiple non-trivial sources, then by all means produce them. I will happily withdrawal this AfD if I can see that this is notable. Trusilver 04:23, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I realize this is a last-ditch effort but would matter that I have been cast in a supporting role in a film called "I-59 South" co-starring Olivia de Havilland and Luke Flynn? The film will be on IMDB soon. The only proof I currently have are emails.Erkman27 (talk) 01:48, 6 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was Delete. WP:BIO basic criteria reads If the depth of coverage is not substantial, then multiple independent sources may be needed to prove notability; trivial coverage of a subject by secondary sources may not be sufficient to establish notability. It does not appear that the reliability of The Hindu is in question. However, the coverage in this article is not significant. The subsequently added sources include only trivial coverage. Therefore, the article, in its current state, fails to meet the criteria of WP:BIO in regard to notability. LaraLove 22:59, 6 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Hema Sinha[edit]

Hema Sinha (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Previous AfD closed as keep in February but notability was never established. Sole RS coverage mentioned her fashion taste, nothing to establish notability in her profession. She exists and does a job, no evidence she passes WP:BIO TRAVELLINGCARIMy storyTell me yours 23:50, 23 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Comment, from WP:BIO "If the depth of coverage is not substantial, then multiple independent sources may be needed to prove notability; trivial coverage of a subject by secondary sources may not be sufficient to establish notability." that's not in-depth coverage and there aren't multiple sources TRAVELLINGCARIMy storyTell me yours 15:21, 24 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Some times it is impossible to provide multiple sources. Most of the sources are non-English and offline in which we have to depend on available sources. Don’t you think that The Hindu news paper is an independent reliable source? --Tomb of the Unknown Warrior tomb 04:33, 25 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
It is one source, but it doesn't establish notability. It talks about her fashion, not about why she's a notable VJ. I don't question that she exists or does her job, but that doesn't make her notable. Tamil results are extremely limited as well, I just don't think she's notable. We can't operate on something that may exist somewhere -- it needs to be shown to demonstrate notability TRAVELLINGCARIMy storyTell me yours 16:39, 25 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
WP:JNN, Possible bad faith comment by User:Vivin (NotableGuru per WP:JNN). He/she has a bad faith track of targetting my edit and falsely commenting. Check the contributions for more details. --Tomb of the Unknown Warrior tomb 04:28, 25 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Comment - See TRAVELLINGCARI's succinct extract from WP:BIO for the explanation of my vote. No in-depth coverage, and no multiple independent sources. --vi5in[talk] 16:23, 25 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Comment sigh... whatever. If I was really targeting you, I'd probably be running around in all articles you have edited. You'll notice I've only worked on a couple. By all means, go through my contributions. --vi5in[talk] 05:51, 25 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
TRAVELLINGCARI is the one who earlier also nominated it to AfD. Now he is nominating it to the second time. I don’t know why he is not accepting the previous closer of this AfD as Keep. --Tomb of the Unknown Warrior tomb 10:00, 26 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
I adressed that in my nom, notability was not established in that discussion, nor has it been here. Further according to WP:BIO for entertainers, "Has a large fan base or a significant "cult" following. Has made unique, prolific or innovative contributions to a field of entertainment." None of which she has done. I re-nominated, which is perfectly allowed per WP:CCC. WP:ILIKEIT is not a reason to keep this article. TRAVELLINGCARIMy storyTell me yours 15:38, 26 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
You had already argued with the same reason and subsequently replied in the first AfD and the result was Keep. You are still echoing your same rationale. Who talked about WP:ILIKEIT? I talked about WP:RS because the notability established by the Hindu news paper, India’s top news publishing company. --Tomb of the Unknown Warrior tomb 05:53, 28 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Comment exactly, there have been no significant updates because there's no evidence whatsoever that she's notable. Doing no harm and not being spam are not reasons to keep, not being notable is a good reason to delete. TRAVELLINGCARIMy storyTell me yours 14:51, 28 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Further, from WP:NOHARM, "As for articles about subjects that do not hold to our basic tenets (verifiability, notability, and using reliable sources), keeping them actually can do more harm than one realizes - it sets a precedent that dictates that literally anything can go here." There have been no valid, policy reasons for keeping this article and no evidence she's notable TRAVELLINGCARIMy storyTell me yours 17:17, 28 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • That WP:NORHARM subclause is from the very unreliable essay (not even a guideline) WP:AADD, which not only contradicts actual policies and guidelines, but is self-contradictory in many places (it tries to rescue itself with the WP:ONLYESSAY subclause). While opinions expressed in it might be interesting to some users, it is in no manner policy. --Oakshade (talk) 18:58, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
The The Hindu article is about her and her fashion. Thank you. Being a janitor would warrant a "She does a job" argument. Hosting her own national Sun TV Network show does not. --Oakshade (talk) 17:32, 28 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
How can you say that notability is not clearly established. The Hindu news is clearly shows the notability (Just read it in a couple of time). And how can you say that there is no other RS available? If Hindu has an article, I AGF, think that there must be local news articles about her which is impossible to find in net. --Tomb of the Unknown Warrior tomb 05:33, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
I’ve just added a sify news to the article about her identity (the article is not independent about her). There are many google hits (ignore about blogs & other) also showing the clear notability that she is prominent. I request you to take off some time & find more local references, if possible. --Tomb of the Unknown Warrior tomb 07:16, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
The sources added are a passing mention in an article on an unrelated topic and a source affiliated with the subject (the TV station where she is employed). These do not help to establish notability. There do not appear to be further reliable sources that cover the subject in depth; only a single source with shallow coverage, thus failing WP:BIO. Jfire (talk) 17:37, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • First you say "I don't disagree" to Pastordavid's "Reliable sourcing provided (in english)" comment, then you completely contradict yourself by saying the false statement the person "lacks online sources in either language." It's getting impossible to argue with you as your statements are contradictory. --Oakshade (talk) 15:50, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so that consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Sandstein (talk) 20:03, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • What's to take issue with? Both sources, insofar as they are independent from her work, have only a minimal amount of coverage. The purpose of the WP:N caveat for multiple sources is to allow smaller figures some leeway. People who don't have biographies about them or major work covering them can still be included if they are covered by multiple sources. In my opinion, this does not simply mean a bare mention. And for both of these sources that is what they are. Regardless of their independence (which I don't think is questioned), their depth of coverage is what is being questioned. If there were a hundred sources that mentioned her in passing then we could accept a sacrifice of breadth for depth. In this case you are asking us to forgo one significant source for 3 ephemeral sources. That doesn't cut it. Protonk (talk) 04:37, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • The source you mention covers her in vanishingly slight detail. It is literally three paragraphs describing her taste in clothing and jewelery. The other two sources mention her in one sentence each. That is all that is referenced in the article. Regardless of the independence and reliablity of these sources, their coverage of her is insufficient. And your claim that there must be local news is irrelevant. What there must be is unimportant. What is referenced in the article is important. Protonk (talk) 04:43, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Sorry I can’t agree with you. Why did the source covers describing her taste in clothing and jewelery in India’s leading vernacular news paper? The answer is clear that she is notable. Additionally, Relata refero and Pastor David pointed out in Lar’s talk and San's talk page (a similar discussion on this Afd), a marginal BLPs are not a valid reason on commenting Deletion. --Tomb of the Unknown Warrior tomb 05:04, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • They are certainly entitled to their opinion. The fact stands. 2 out of three sources barely cover the subject at all. The third covers the subject in a "Retail Plus" advertising section. I'm not a reader of the hindu times but I'll bet money that section doesn't fall under the same editorial control as the masthead. As a matter of fact, the section is listed under "advertisements" from the front page of the hindu. As far as their motivations go, that is ALSO irrelevant. I can just as easily speculate that the mention was at the behest of a paid publicist just as you can speculate that her mention was because the Hindu times feels that she is the most notable TV host in India. Neither of our speculations should determine what goes into wikipedia. And furthermore, if she is so notable, how come there are only three sources out there with her name on them? Protonk (talk) 06:13, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • No, your argument is not at accurate. I will prove it (keeping in mind that I am a regular reader of Hindu). See my comments below:
1) Retail Plus" advertising section?... No way, see the copyright status in the page down. The email id given ---@hindu.com is the same id given in the contact page of the main hindu website. Anyone can comment on any articles published by Hindu along with this, means the the mastheads are same who prepares other main articles also.
2) advertisements, paid sources?... Where is the section listed under advertisements from the main page? I dint find it. Retail plus Chennai is not a paid advertisement section by Hindu. It is a supplement section exclusively designed for celebrities, magazines, books etc. Since Hindu has strong online archive collections, it is available.
3) three sources, no other sources?... How do you know that? Listen to Pastor David’s comment for Strongly Keeping the article in this case above (before re-listed it). --Tomb of the Unknown Warrior tomb 06:39, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • First, it IS an advertising section. Go to their main page. then tell me what the name of the section of links you click on in the sidebar is (look to the left sidebar, above the google search bar). Second, who owns it is totally immaterial. It is obvious that it is not the same kind of content as the rest of the website offers. Third, even if it WAS on the front page, the depth of coverage is practically non-existent. They mention her, her job, and then talk about her clothes. The other two sources offer practically nothing except a name, so it is THIS source that the article hinges upon. Are you prepared to tell me that an entry in an encyclopedia should be derive from that first source? From the comments about her interest in casual wear? Lastly, and it really is lastly, it doesn't MATTER how many other potential sources exist unless they either show up in the article or on this AfD. If you show me significant coverage in reliable secondary sources, then I'm fully prepared to reverse my vote. but as it stands it is irrelevant that you claim there are many other sources. If they exist, why aren't they referenced in the article? Protonk (talk) 07:12, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • No, no, no I could not find it has been re-directed from Advertisement section. Your assumption is wrong. Check this (see the left bar, Metro plus comes under ‘Features’ section). It also shows that what is metro plus stands for. Moreover, it was a kind of interview & reported by CATHERINE JONA GILON - a reporter in The Hindu, if she is not notable, it would have been impossible. --Tomb of the Unknown Warrior tomb 07:58, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Ok. Using that link, "retail plus" is under advt on the RIGHT sidebar. Same as it was under advt in the left sidebar in the original link. And unless you and I are reading the.....ahhh, heck, I'll just post it:
She’s got the sweetest voice in town; this young girl has made her mark on the small screen with her innate sense of humour, spontaneity and beguiling talk. Retail Plus says hello to vivacious Hema Sinha of Sun Music. “I am most comfortable in casual wear!” says Hema, “My wardrobe is filled with shirts, t-shirts and skirts.” When it comes to brands that make up her shopping list, Wrangler and Scullers are right there at the top. So, where does Hema head to when it’s time to refurbish her wardrobe? “I love to shop at Pantaloons and the Globus stores,” she reveals. And when it comes to makeup, “It’s MAC!” she adds without a second thought. Think Hema Sinha, you can’t help noticing the junk jewellery she sports. “Yes, am passionate about them,” she says, toying with the long chain on her neck. “And perfumes are my other obsession, of which Adidas Playboy and Hugo Boss are my hot favourites,” signs off this pretty VJ.
  • That's it. 10 sentences. 2 of which are not about her fashion choices. The subtitle for "retail plus" is "the unique shopping experience". This is a shopping magazine giving a fluff interview to a VJ. Nothing more. Your assertion that this interview would have been impossible if she were not notable enough for wikipedia doesn't hold water.

(OUTDENT) to review: there are 4 sentences in your sources supporting the notability of this person with regard to her inclusion in wikipedia:

  1. "She’s got the sweetest voice in town; this young girl has made her mark on the small screen with her innate sense of humour, spontaneity and beguiling talk."
  2. "Retail Plus says hello to vivacious Hema Sinha of Sun Music."
  3. "The only notable absentee was Namitha, the other heroine in the film who the anchor for the evening Hema Sinha (Sun Music) kept on saying was "caught in traffic and was on her way to the function"."
  4. "Anchor: Hema Sinha" (from a program directory on her employer's website)

How does this make her notable enough to merit an entry in an encyclopedia? these are direct quotes, by the way. Protonk (talk) 08:12, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Reply. This is the existing WP article: Hema Sinha (Tamil: ஹேமா சின்ஹா) is popular in the Sun Music TV channel of South India. [1] [2] She was previously working for Raj TV but shifted to Sun Music in 2004 (which was then called SCV). Hema has hosted a few shows within the Sun Music channel but is most well known for being a video jockey for the show 'Hello Hello' (everyday except Friday, 0030-0130 MST), which features call-in audience who requests their favourite Kollywood songs.

Hema has also modelled for a variety of commercials, predominantly on the Tamil media. Hema currently does "Sooper - Dooper" , a comedy show in Sun TV.

The above article doesn’t made in OR. The stub article was created (I am not the creator) by the help of Hindu news & other ghits sources. Additionally, when we speak about a VJ/anchor, costumes, fashions and dress code are the main discussed issues. Not any books she received or award bagged. That doesn’t come to the picture. What else you want to know to endorse her notability? --Tomb of the Unknown Warrior tomb 08:26, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Original research isn't the problem. the problem is notability. The 4 sentences that relate to her in the three sources quoted don't establish notability per wikipedia's guidelines. I'm not trying to attack you personally, or her, or the creator of that article. What I'm trying to do is get people to see reason. here is the WP:BIO threshold for entertainers:
  1. Has had significant roles or been featured multiple times in notable films, television, stage performances, and other productions.
  2. Has a large fan base or a significant "cult" following.
  3. Has made unique, prolific or innovative contributions to a field of entertainment.
That is what needs to be shown. Can you at least agree with me that the 4 sentences I quoted above DO NOT meed this standard? If you can't agree with me, please show me how those 4 sentences show that she meets this standard. And I don't want to hear that she has to be notable or else the hindu wouldn't have interviewed her. There is some traction there but really only if it was the hindu doing it, not retail plus. Protonk (talk) 08:34, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • 1) She is notable because of The Hindu article published news about her.
  • 2) The Hindu article is not a paid article, its an independent news item per WP:RS which was interviewed her by Hindu's reporter.
  • 3) The Hindu article speaks about her fashion, dress and costumes etc (note that she is an anchor and it makes sense).
  • 4) As an Anchor/VJ, the independent coverage may not be as available as other notable persons rather incidents/show details may be found if depend google ghits.
  • 5) She is one of the prominent anchor in Sun TV network.
  • With all respect to above reasons, I recommend keeping this stub article and expand it further by the help of local references. Thanks. --Tomb of the Unknown Warrior tomb 09:02, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
You didn't answer my questions. You are also ignoring the fact that the retail source is probably not under the same editorial expectations as the hindu. You are further ignoring the fact that this (and previous) afd has shown there aren't any other sources forthcoming. You have also invented the statement that she is a prominent sun-tv network anchor. This prominence is not established by any quoted source from the article. I'm probably going to quit while I'm ahead here, I guess my only wonder was how this article survived this long. Protonk (talk) 09:12, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
I have not ignored it. Because the fact is that the retail source is also definitely under the same editorial expectations as the Hindu. It is exclusively designed for celebrities, fashion & metro incidents. Since Hema Sinha is a notable VJ, the news has been covered by Hindu’s retail plus page instead of publishing in the front page of Hindu. --Tomb of the Unknown Warrior tomb 09:29, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
WP:IDIDNTHEARTHAT Protonk (talk) 14:53, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
WP:IDIDNTHEARTHAT & WP:RS. --Tomb of the Unknown Warrior tomb 17:25, 1 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Again, it isn't sufficient that the retail section of the hindu covers her. YOU say it is sufficient, but WP:N says that significant coverage of the subject is required. We can go back and forth all day about the reliability of retail plus, but in the end it is unimportant. As it stands, that retail plus article is the only source referenced that comes close to significant coverage, if only because Ms. Sinha is mentioned in more than one sentence. The reason Is ay you are refusing to get the point is because you have been shown that coverage isn't significant. you have been shown that there aren't other sources (in english or tamil) that can expland the article. You have been shown that WP:N has not been met but you dodge the issue each time. The first time I made clear that WP:N and WP:BIO were not met, you simply assumed I was arguing that the article be removed because of WP:OR. Then, when I reiterated by claims, you presumed it was an assault on the article because of WP:RS. Neither is true. I have problems with retail plus, the sun tv network guidebook and sify online as reliable sources, but I don't even need to go that far to meet the threshold for deletion. Even if all three sources are as reliable as can be, she still doesn't meet the notablity threshold. Let me say this again, so I can be perfectly clear: Before we can presume the subject to be notable, she must be the subject of significant (that means non-trivial) coverage from reliable sources, preferably multiple sources. Nowhere in my interpretations of wikipedia's guidelines on trivial mentions for people do I see a suggestion that a 10 line comment is sufficient to base an entire biographical article upon. No do I, in the article, see an assertion of the entertainers notability threshold by any reliable source. This AfD is not, and should not be a referendum on the reliability and impact of the hindu. Whether or not that paper is significant and important is unrelated to the discussion at hand. What IS important is whether or not this woman has recieved non-trivial coverage from multiple, independent sources and whether or not that coverage has imputed sufficent notability for her to be included in wikipedia. THAT is what I was trying to say when I pointed out that literally only 4 sentences existed in the sources that were relevant to the article. Even if you include her interest in wrangler jeans and jewelery that is about 8 sentences total that ALL of your sourcing material mentions here. NONE of those 8 sentences assert notability in any form. 1 of those 8 sentences comes from the TV guide for the Sun TV network. 1 of those sentences comes from a film website where Ms. Sinha is mentioned only because she is apologizing for the lateness of some other, more famous figure. The remaining six come from a magazine entitled "Retail Plus:The unique chennai shopping experience". So if you can somehow show me that this is singificant, non-trivial coverage of the subject from reliable sources, please do so. I'll revert my vote and strike out my text. If all you are going to tell me is a variation on your past comments, then I'm not going to change my mind. Protonk (talk) 18:36, 1 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

comment one paper had 2 paragraphs or something of a puff piece about her looks, voice etc. That's hardly in depth coverage or even any breadth of coverage given there's only one article on her in WP:RS. Merkin's mum 10:10, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

  • The countries one of the leading and reliable news papers (ie The Hindu) published two paragraphs itself speaks about notability. A marginal BLPs are not a valid reason on commenting Deletion. --Tomb of the Unknown Warrior tomb 10:19, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
First: The tenet of Wikipedia to assume good faith refers to how we should conduct ourselves with regard to other editors. It does not refer to how we should conduct ourselves with regard to articles. AGF means that I don't assume Tomb of the Unknown Warrior tomb is arguing just to spite me (I don't). It does not mean that I assume that new or heretofore unpublished materials will appear to support the notability of the article in question. It is not an act of bad faith to ask that all relevant sourcing for the article be shown either in the reference section or on the talk page.
Second: This debate is NOT a referendum on the reliable nature of the hindu. If a subject was covered in the exact same detail in the new york times and such coverage was the only source available to assert notability, then I would "vote" to delete such an article. If we concede that the hindu is the most reliable source in the world, that WP:RS should be re-written to include a picture of the masthead on the page, then it still does not make the subject of the article any more notable. Therefore, it is inappropriate to steer discussion of the subject to the unimportant fact of the hindu's notability.
Third (and last, I hope): Having accepted the notability of The Hindu and it's associated website, The hindu.com, it does not follow that editors are required to accept that ALL subsidiaries and daughter publications are equally notable. The New York Times is clearly notable, but it is probably fair to argue that "T" Magazine, the supplimental section on fashion and beauty, probably imputes less notability than the front page. The same argument can be made for the Retail Plus: The complete Chennai Shopping Experience. I'm not arguing that retail plus is totally divorced from The Hindu. I'm arguing that imputed notability has to at least be different. at the VERY least, it is disingenuous to link to and discuss the retail plus article as through it were from the front page of the paper. Just as I would not discuss the "T" Magazine as though it were the NYT front page, it is misleading and inappropriate to do the same for Retail Plus. Protonk (talk) 19:14, 1 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • I think you are totally acting in good faith and assuming good faith. I'm not making personal attacks, please don't accuse me of such. Again, I've NEVER said that retail plus is not from the hindu group. I'm sure they own it. It is clear. What I've said, and what others have said multiple times in this thread, is that retail plus does not appear to be the same as the front page with regard to imputed notability. I've also said that this isn't important. Even if the same article was on the front page of the washington post or the New York Times, it would still be trivial coverage. To me, the triviality of the coverage is more damning than the disposition of the one reliable, independent source. Protonk (talk) 15:09, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was Delete. LaraLove 01:10, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Daniel Varfolomeyev[edit]

Daniel Varfolomeyev (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD) Delete. Non-notable musician. Article is also written by the subject, so it falls under WP:AUTO and WP:COI. Article isn't referenced. Although it has a quite a bit of external links, most of them just reference his name and not much else. CyberGhostface (talk) 20:04, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Delete Written by User:Varfolomeyev Reywas92Talk 21:23, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Delete. Fails WP:MUSIC. Qworty (talk) 01:07, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was Delete --JForget 00:35, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Pass the Peso[edit]

Pass the Peso (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Non-notable contact sport. unverified and probably an WP:HOAX. Carlosguitar (Yes Executor?) 19:47, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was no consensus to delete. ···日本穣? · Talk to Nihonjoe 04:04, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

List of songs portraying paedophilia or sexual abuse of minors[edit]

List of songs portraying paedophilia or sexual abuse of minors (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

This came up for deletion about two weeks ago by an editor who opposed it on moral grounds. I voted keep, but subsequently noticed that the increased scrutiny the article was under has resulted in it being a list unable to sustain a single sourced entry. I am renominating it on that grounds. Toptomcat (talk) 19:40, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

That would be a Merge rather than deletion. And what is this other relevant article? Colonel Warden (talk) 15:38, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Comment The other relevant articles are the articles about the artists/albums/songs. The Joni Mitchell song you added, for example, is already mentioned in the article about that album. The Siouxsie and the Banshees song you added already has its own article as well. The Pat Benatar article already mentions her song Hell is for Children viz child abuse. Etc. -PetraSchelm (talk) 18:42, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • You could say this about any list. The purpose of a list is navigation - linking such articles with a common theme together. Colonel Warden (talk) 06:53, 1 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • I was just explaining what I believe was meant by "prose in the relevant article," since you asked.-PetraSchelm (talk) 07:11, 1 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was delete all. Although I will go ahead and delete the untagged articles to avoid unnecessary bureaucracy, please make sure to tag all articles being considered for deletion when bundling nominations in the future. If anyone wants to try expanding the Yomi article, then feel free to drop a note on my talk page and I'll do what I can to help out. --jonny-mt 05:07, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Ni~ya[edit]

Ni~ya (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

This page, along with other pages for members of Nightmare (band), have no significant, or valuable content. It consists of mostly trivia. --Jacob Talk 19:35, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Is it okay to respond here? Sorry if it isn't. Anyway, I think the X Japan members are a incomparable, as they have been active in the music scene for more than two decades, rather than just since the turn of the century. The band has little international fame, limited nearly to having songs featured in some overseas anime. The members themselves do not have solo projects (unlike all members of X Japan) and the sources on the information on these musicians lives is limited to current interests and hobbies, blood type, etc., as they rarely divulge personal history. In any case, I will look into finding new sources. --Jacob Talk 20:40, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Actually, your right. I've looked there is very little sourcing that can be done for the Ruka, Ni~ya. The Yomi (vocalist) article, could still have potential to be expanded, but I can't find any good English languages sources yet. Perhaps someone with a Japanese Fluency can do some google searches. AtaruMoroboshi (talk) 13:44, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was Merge. LaraLove 01:37, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Aggie Replant[edit]

Aggie Replant (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Unnotable local service project by university students. Fails WP:ORG, if it would even be considered an organization, as its more of an open event. AnmaFinotera (talk) 19:26, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was Keep. LaraLove 02:23, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Rafael Medoff[edit]

Rafael Medoff (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Fails all 6 criteria for inclusion of WP:PROF, fails notability tests for non-academics as well. No significant 3rd party coverage by reliable sources. Tarc (talk) 19:12, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

  • Comment. Actually it is standard practice for books reviewed by such sources as the Jerusalem Post and the Middle East Quarterly to be considered notable. What better ways for establishing notability could you suggest for books and their authors? And Highbeam is simply an archive host - it isn't the original publisher of these articles. Phil Bridger (talk) 00:28, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • For academic books? Academic reviews, at the very least. Further, as written, WP:PROF does not support the view that any person who writes a book that is reviewed somewhere meets it. --Relata refero (disp.) 08:16, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • That's academic elitism; books meet notability requirements by having reviews, whether or not they're in academic journals. In fact, outside academic journals is more notable, since that's rarer and for a larger audience.--Prosfilaes (talk) 10:56, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Not if we're looking for notability as an academic. If so, its academic views that count. --Relata refero (disp.) 12:08, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Who's looking for notability as an academic? The subject is notable as an author and the director of a political think tank. He and his books get plenty of coverage from mainstream media sources in these capacities. He's not a professor, and nothing in the article claims that he is, so why does everyone keep going on about WP:PROF? WP:BIO is the standard here. Phil Bridger (talk) 14:19, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Er, he is in fact an academic. If he's not, then as a general interest author he definitely doesn't make the criterion - he hasn't been reviewed by any high-circulation publications, after all. If he's an activist, there should be sources about him - which is our standard WP:BIO route, right? Two independent sources talking about his life and career? I don't see those either. Any way you slice it, you have to find a criterion he meets; and having a book reviewed by the MEQ doesn't make it in my opinion. We've written WP:PROF so it excludes academics who've written books unless those books can be demonstrated, or cited, as notable advancements or contributions to their field. Relata refero (disp.) 15:42, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
The Jerusalem Post is a high-circulation publication. Phil Bridger (talk) 20:53, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

*KeepI don't know why Relato Refero is arguing so strongly against reality, but, since Relato Refero asserted that theses books are not received by scholars, I punched Medoff into JSTOR. Results: His books gets reviewed: Review: Medoff's "The Deafening Silence, " Yehuda Bauer ,The Jewish Quarterly Review, New Series, Vol. 80, No. 3/4 (Jan. - Apr., 1990), pp. 371-375 , Review: Pragmatic Idealists: Zionism in AmericaReview: Pragmatic Idealists: Zionism in America, Stuart Knee ,Reviewed work(s): Zionism and the Arabs: An American Jewish Dilemma, 1898-1948 by Rafael Medoff, The Emergence of American Zionism by Mark A. Raider , AJS Review, Vol. 24, No. 2 (1999), pp. 337-341. Moreover: His books are discussed in the periodic review articles commissioned by the journal "Modern Judaism," in fact, earlier this week, I inculded Deborah Lipstadt's discussion of Medoff's work in her 1990 review essay of recent work on the Holocaust in "Modern Judaism." More significantly, in 1995 "Modern Judaism" commissioned Medoff to write the review article. Recent Trends in the Historiography of Zionism: A Review Essay, by Rafael Medoff, Modern Judaism, Vol. 15, No. 1 (Feb., 1995), pp. 95-101. Plus: To add to my puzzlement over Relato Refero's motivations, after I saw that he had suggested this article for deletion and spent some time adding material to the article, he put up this on my account page: An editor has expressed a concern that this user may be a sock puppet of Evidence-based. Please refer to contributions for evidence. See block log and current autoblocks. In sum: Relato Refero's postign of this notice did have the effect of adding a new term to my vocabulary. But I hardly think flinging such accusations is an appropriate response to my objections to his attempt to remove this article. In fact, though adding information to Wikipedia pages when I am excited about an institution, a book, a play, or a beautiful building is fun, I don't particularly care for the argumentative, aggressive tone of some editors at Wikipedia. I suspect, moreover, that it drives people from continuing to contribute.13:48, 30 April 2008 (UTC)Fan613

Um. On this, see User talk:Thatcher#Request for a checkuser confirmation of my suspicion. See the checkuser case I linked earlier to why this is a pattern of behavior. Relata refero (disp.) 15:42, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
in spite of the behavior of the above user, the subjects books do get reviewed in academic publications, thus showing notability as a writer. DGG (talk) 00:16, 1 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was no consensus defaulting to keep. I'm sorry to bring such a long, thorough debate to such an anticlimactic end, but the discussion below presents a large number of competing, well-reasoned opinions without arriving at a definitive conclusion. --jonny-mt 05:45, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Charles Augustus Hilton[edit]

Charles Augustus Hilton (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Genealogy page for a completely non-notable Civil War soldier. The complete lack of notability makes for a very boring read, but by all means slog through it if you don't believe me. Qworty (talk) 19:07, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

  • Comment And his notability is ... what, exactly? He certainly does not achieve it through WP:MILMOS#NOTE. --Dhartung | Talk 02:35, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Response His notability comes through his work as a pastor and an educator, which I picked up in the article. He must have done something notable to have a town named after him (that's quite unusual). As I said, the article needs to be rewritten, not killed. Ecoleetage (talk) 02:58, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
He was non-notable as a soldier. He was non-notable as a pastor. He was non-notable as an educator. He was just a guy who was alive for a while. A town can decide to name itself after a blade of grass, but doing so does not make the blade of grass notable. Qworty (talk) 03:04, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Response But that argument could be stretched to insist that all books that praise individuals are PR shams. For example, David McCullough's book on John Adams could be considered a revisionist view of one of the less popular presidents in US history. Besides, every county in the U.S. did not have a biographical dictionary written in the 1860-1890 period -- and please refrain from making negative comments on what you perceive as other editors' lack of knowledge. Ecoleetage (talk) 03:01, 5 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment. Indeed, my city was named after the first postmaster -- a tavern owner/ferry operator who used a cigar box for the mail -- because the post office declined his nominated name of Black Hawk (he actually camped here), as there was another town in Wisconsin Territory that already had the name (it's now in Iowa). The name was decreed by Amos Kendall, Postmaster-General, and as such was entirely arbitrary. --Dhartung | Talk 07:02, 5 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Response The history of Janesville, Wisconsin, is not the subject of this debate, and the experience in naming that town is not revelant to this discussion. Please stick to the facts of Rev. Hilton's perceived notability. Ecoleetage (talk) 12:04, 5 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Comment Please present some demonstrated notability. --Dhartung | Talk 17:31, 5 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • My argument is based on the fact that I do not think that the required sourcing (web or otherwise) has been provided to establish the notability of the subject and I do not believe that such sources are likely to exist based on the limited sources which have been presented and the views of other editors above. If evidence of significant coverage by reliable sources does come to light during the course of the discussion I will strike my vote (although if my argument is disproved I doubt any closing admin would hold it in any regard anyway). Guest9999 (talk) 18:04, 5 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment Why would the century old sources be bogus, particularly on someone who was non-controversial as Rev. Hilton?Ecoleetage (talk) 13:59, 5 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • I confess I find Wikipedia's culture of priveledging online sources over print sources a little odd. Even aside from that it biases the encyclopedia towards recentism, even among recent work, the internet has major holes in its scholarly coverage. —Quasirandom (talk) 19:55, 5 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment It isn't odd so much as one form of systemic bias. Similarly American topics and sources dominate Wikipedia, though this is changing as more non-American editors participate. In this case I don't consider anything dubious about the sources per se, it's what they (fail to) say. They're just no more indicative of notability than being written up in a local newspaper. --Dhartung | Talk 20:17, 5 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was transwiki and delete. I think the disambig page is a good idea and will be glad to implement it once the transwiki is done. --jonny-mt 05:49, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

See you next Tuesday[edit]

See you next Tuesday (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

per WP:Wikipedia_is_not_a_dictionary this is always going to be a stub so its encyclopedic possibilities are limited. Belongs in Wiktionary, where the phrase already has an entry. Rodhullandemu (Talk) 18:59, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Transwiki to Wiktionary - Dicionary definitions do not belong here. Soxred93 (u t) 19:21, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Delete, per nominator. I can't see what encyclopedic information can be described here, although it might make a valid disambiguation page. Marasmusine (talk) 22:51, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
DAB would also be an option, since the article contains two references; I'll leave that to whomever closes this. --Rodhullandemu (Talk) 23:03, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Traswiki Wikitionary, probably put difinition link on See You Next Tuesday, which is not the same. PwnerELITE (talk) 03:00, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was Delete, with reference to WP:SNOW. Stifle (talk) 20:15, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

America 2.0[edit]

America 2.0 (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Essay, personal reflection, OR. ukexpat (talk) 18:50, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was Delete --JForget 00:36, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Relative displacement of media[edit]

Relative displacement of media (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

This is nothing more than a personal essay. It's as though somebody were given a college assignment and, instead of turning it in to the teacher, posted it here instead. Qworty (talk) 18:45, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was delete. Wizardman 14:46, 6 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Female Hercules[edit]

Female Hercules (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Filtering out for moths and the like, ghits return MySpace and YouTube, nothing that establishes notability. No RS coverage and a search turns up nothing at AllMusic either. Doesn't appear to meet any of WP:MUSIC's criteria. TRAVELLINGCARIMy storyTell me yours 18:29, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was Speedy delete per CSD:G1, G3, G10, A1, and A7, and I'm sure I could find another few. Stifle (talk) 20:17, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Vince Cordisco[edit]

Vince Cordisco (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

If not a hoax, then arguably libelous content. Le Grand Roi des CitrouillesTally-ho! 18:25, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

  • Well, every article I have ever argued to delete has been deleted without exception (see User:Le Grand Roi des Citrouilles/Deletion discussions--I wish I could say the same for every article I've argued to keep...). Thus, so far at least, it is has indeed been true that when I give up on an article you know it should be gone.  :) Best, --Le Grand Roi des CitrouillesTally-ho! 17:33, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was Speedy Delete G10 by user:Toddst1, non-admin closure. Have a nice day. --Dennis The Tiger (Rawr and stuff) 19:22, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Cheating online[edit]

Cheating online (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Unsourced, unencyclopedic POV essay. Basically an attack on Amazon.com (the text was removed from that article as well). PROD removed after 4 days. Delete. MCB (talk) 18:17, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was keep. per WP:SNOW Milk’s Favorite Cookie (Talk) 20:38, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Springfield's state[edit]

Springfield's state (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Article on a fictional subject with very little real-world notability. Written mostly in in-universe style. Consists almost entirely of original research. Only the final section contains anything that could be called a reliable source. I know some people hate the word, but this article is just pure fancruft. Terraxos (talk) 18:09, 29 April 2008 (UTC) (See also: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Capital City (The Simpsons), recently deleted for a similar reason. Terraxos (talk) 18:18, 29 April 2008 (UTC))[reply]

After Scorpion0422's expansion of the real world aspect with more sources, Keep. Bill (talk|contribs) 23:31, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was keep. --jonny-mt 05:52, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Bob Kinnear[edit]

Bob Kinnear (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Biographical article on the president of a labour union local. Currently in the news only because his local is in contract negotiations, which is his only reason for notability. Article has been a magnet for vandalism to the point that it has had to be temporarily deleted, stubbed, and now semi-protected. Risker (talk) 17:17, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Response - No, believe it or not. Apparently our mailing lists have "no-index" tags on them, although I will confirm with David Gerard. Risker (talk) 17:42, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Yes, it was created in 2006 when his local staged an 11-hour wildcat strike. There's a huge article about it, though heaven knows why; once again, a short-cycle news story that is worth (maximum) a paragraph in an article about the Toronto Transit Commission. I am still not seeing his notability here. There are at least a dozen more notable union leaders in Toronto, none of whom have articles; in fact, the president of the union itself doesn't have an article, nor does this particular local. It's kind of hard to be a notable president of a non-notable union local. Risker (talk) 18:21, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • I'll reiterate that Bob Kinnear is a notable public figure in Toronto. There's the potential for a decent and balanced bio here, and I hope to write it shortly. CJCurrie (talk) 18:36, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Writing a longer page doesn't necessarily improve the notability issue. Whatever notability he has is directly related to labour actions taken by his union local, one of which he had no control over (the 2006 wildcat strike). I could *almost* see an article on the union local, which has a colourful history, but not Kinnear himself. Risker (talk) 19:00, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
I'm planning to expand this page shortly (I'm not able to do so at the present moment). The page was created as a stub some time ago, and was never given the attention it deserved ... but the proper remedy for this situation is to expand it, not delete it. CJCurrie (talk) 18:31, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
I'm more than willing to keep it on my watchlist and check for vandalism. Hell, I'll keep it as a bookmark and check it every day just in case I miss something on the watchlist. It only takes a few seconds to check history for a new edit. The problem is that there are loads of articles that don't get much attention from regular Wikipedia editors, but get loads of attention from the general public, either via forum posts, word of mouth, newspaper reports, and so on. These articles often gets lots of edits, or, worse, a small number of bad edits, and just aren't ever noticed by most users. I've came across articles in the past, for example, that have had pretty blatant vandalism on them, that has been there for months. These articles are often borderline-notable subjects that would never survive an AfD, but were either not picked up at NewPages, or were tagged for speedy, had the speedy declined, and the tagger couldn't be bothered taking it any further. From that point on, how many people will have that article on their watchlist? Not very many. Hence, vandalism to those articles often goes unnoticed if not picked up by RecentChanges. There should be some method for regular, trusted users (for example, the same users trusted to not abuse Rollback) to view a live list of "least watched articles", which would sort all articles by number of those same trusted users watching an article, and display the ones watched least. The content on the Bob Kinnear article, in my mind, if picked up by the media, could have been seen as much worse than the Seigenthaler incident.
Rant aside, this appears to be a relatively notable person, so for me it's a weak keep. Dreaded Walrus t c 18:56, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for making the argument for deleting not just this, but all marginally notable BLPs (that don't have dedicated editors to keep them clean and free of detrius) so cogently. You have highlighted precisely the problem facing us. There are X thousand dedicated editors here (where X is a small integer, to be sure... maybe 3, maybe 5, maybe 9, heck, maybe 30 if we are lucky, but I doubt it) and 250 thousand BLPs .. with 5% of them currently carrying insufficient cite tagging... how many have a problem? Far too many. How many can be taken under the wing of some or several dedicated editors? Far too few. Please note: I have absolutely no doubt you mean exactly what you say and you will, if this article survives, do admirably at keeping it clean... But there are not enough editors to solve this problem one at a time. ++Lar: t/c 19:06, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
(after edit conflicts) An (old) example of what I was talking about would be our article on Neil Buchanan. Back in 2006, there was often vandalism and nonsense added to that article that went undetected for ages. Look at this version, for example. At least half of that article is nonsense (and doesn't appear in the current version), though much of it had been in place for months, and much of it stayed in place for many months after that. This vandalism stayed in place for four days, but when it was manually removed, much of the rest was not spotted. Indeed, the other edit made is modifying a hoax sentence. The bit about the jumper being alleged to give him "magic powers" was removed two months after insertion. Another bit, about him being a recovering alcohol addict, was added in late May, and removed in early July. And yet still, in July, much of the hoax information from the April version I linked earlier is still in place. This kind of thing happens all the time, but this article is an example that pops into my head due to having the article linked to on a forum I was a member of, a few months before I started editing Wikipedia. Dreaded Walrus t c 19:14, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • What section of WP:BIO does he fall under? Please describe in detail exactly why this union local leader, above all others, is notable. I cannot locate another similar biographical article anywhere on the encyclopedia, and I've been looking for a couple of days. Risker (talk) 15:12, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Basic criteria: A person is presumed to be notable if he or she has been the subject of published secondary source material which is reliable, intellectually independent, and independent of the subject"; thus a verifiable and NPOV article can be written without OR. DoubleBlue (Talk) 16:03, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • One editor has found a single article specifically about Bob Kinnear in an independent source. I note that nobody has chosen to add it to the article; in fact, nobody has added anything to the article at this point. Risker (talk) 16:12, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • How many of them are primarily about Kinnear, and not about the labour action? Risker (talk) 16:20, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • I agree more activity would be better, but inactivity during an AfD is not uncommon. Carcharoth (talk) 16:23, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • "I cannot locate another similar biographical article anywhere on the encyclopedia, and I've been looking for a couple of days. " - Bob Crow is a similar article. Carcharoth (talk) 16:05, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Umm, no. Bob Crow is a national labour leader, not a local labour leader. Risker (talk) 16:12, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • I stand corrected. But you accept that some local leaders are notable enough for an article and that some national leaders are not notable enouh, or is being a leader of a national union inherently notable? For example, the national leaders listed at National Union of Railwaymen, going back to 1871. Should they all have articles? Carcharoth (talk) 16:23, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • I cannot think of a single local union president who would warrant an article simply based on his or her union work. What I could see is an article like CAW Local 200, which discusses the business and activities of the union local and lists its presidents. Incidentally, CAW Local 222, another local of the same union, has a lot more members, and is related to the largest employer in Oshawa. Note the absence of an article on its local president, which I feel is entirely appropriate. He may be locally significant, but not encyclopedically so. Risker (talk) 16:31, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • I would not object to merging to a new Amalgamated Transit Workers Union Local 113 article since he is known only for his union activities. DoubleBlue (Talk) 17:43, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Will this article do: Toronto Transit Commission personnel - which was created a few months ago. I have added the fact that Kinnear is the Local 113 president as of this writing. This article could use some beefing up and cleanup, but seems to include the relevant information that can be expanded upon. Risker (talk) 22:43, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • How does that address BLP concerns? You've proposed moving the stuff about the living person from a relatively high-profile article that people had stated an intention to edit and watch, to a low-profile article that will probably have less people watching, and may, in time, end up as bad as this one was. The real problem is not having sufficient people to review bad-faith edits, or, arguably worse, having such edits reviewed too quickly and insufficiently, leading to the degradation of articles over time. The real solution is either getting more people with clue to edit Wikipedia (though to do this you need to avoid alienating them when they are new editors), or restricting the volume of editing or article creation. Carcharoth (talk) 23:16, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Umm...you seem to have missed my point, Carcharoth. Kinnear is not notable and should not have a biographical article. He is the president of a union local. It is reasonable to identify him by name in that role in the article that discusses the union local, as is common in many other articles. There is no reason to go any further than that in the Toronto Transit Commission personnel article, or anywhere else. As the president of the local, he is the main media contact for obtaining the union position on various points; thus, his name shows up frequently in the paper. Consider him the equivalent of the PR spokesperson for a business, very few of whom would be considered notable enough for a WP article. I get more hits for my company's PR director than I do for Kinnear, and I can quite assure you he is not notable at all; for that matter, neither is our company president. There is nothing about Kinnear that is noteworthy other than his presidency of the union local; thus, a biographical article about him is essentially a coatrack proxying as an article about the union local, because all of the "reliable sources" discuss him strictly from that perspective, with the occasional bit of "colour". Risker (talk) 19:38, 4 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • My point was not that he should be mentioned any more than in passing in that article (I agree that he should only be mentioned in passing) but that if certain people want to edit Wikipedia to say things about this person, then if they can't do that on the article about him, they will still attempt to say the same things in the TTC personnel article. They shouldn't say these things anywhere on Wikipedia, of course, but that just shows that this is never a good reason for deleting anything. Your nomination statement said: "Article has been a magnet for vandalism to the point that it has had to be temporarily deleted, stubbed, and now semi-protected". If Toronto Transit Commission personnel ended up suffering the same problems, would you advocate deletion for that article? Either delete based on non-notability, or clean up/watch/protect, based on editing history. Don't delete articles merely because they are a "magnet for vandalism". That is my point. If something is clearly non-notable, then delete on that basis. If something is borderline notable, then delete if there is vandalism and BLP concerns. If something is notable and getting vandalised, then clean up and watchlist. But I agree. Reducing the number of targets for vandalism on the topic of this person, is ultimately a good idea. So I'm going to !vote merge and protection of the redirect. Carcharoth (talk) 22:23, 5 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was Delete --JForget 00:37, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Forscythe- de Steur[edit]

Forscythe- de Steur (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

I'd expect a security consulting firm involved in the Balkans that was bought out for $17.4 million to have some ghits, it doesn't apart from wiki mirrors. Searching the the alleged founder while filtering for security turns up nothing useful. Not sure if it's a hoax but there's no evidence whatsoever it's notable even accounting for typos. TRAVELLINGCARIMy storyTell me yours 17:17, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Also, I fing nothing on the now parent company, Suisse Securite Internationale. Dlohcierekim 20:15, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
No, I thought the Suisse company bouth the Michigan one?? Dlohcierekim 20:33, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
with monopoly $$? In other words, I agree with Dhartung. I didn't want to call it an out-an-out hoax since it's been here almost a year but it smelled ducky to me TRAVELLINGCARIMy storyTell me yours 20:42, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Good thing I was not drinking-- it would be coming out my nose. As you say, a long standing article that. . . quacks. Dlohcierekim 20:48, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was Redirect to York Region District School Board--JForget 00:39, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Castlemore Public School[edit]

Castlemore Public School (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Non-notable elementary school, google only turns up with this article, their official website and a few directory entries. Mister Senseless (Speak - Contributions) 17:09, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was Redirect to Political parties in the United States--JForget 00:41, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Republican vs. Democrat[edit]

Republican vs. Democrat (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

The article is currently POV, not that that's my reason to delete. I find it hard to imagine how it could even refrain from being a POV article with a non-encyclopedic style, however. I can't really see this article becoming much more than an opinion center for what users think are the main issues between the parties. Being that it's so subject to POV, I think it should be deleted. JamieS93 17:04, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Comment: One of the main points for my nom reason that I meant to mention was WP:OR, which others have subsequently brought up. I was actually in a hurry when I wrote the nom above - apologies if my logic for deletion wasn't very clear. --JamieS93 03:10, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Comment Also, POV is not typically a valid reason to delete an article since non-neutrality can eaisly be fixed. An article consisting of solely original research, however (which I think is the bigger issue with this article), cannot. Mister Senseless (Speak - Contributions) 18:17, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was keep. It is found to be a notable, and verifiable subject, about which independent research exists. The issue of renaming could be settled on the talkpage itself, and hasn't been discussed to consensus here yet, though there seem to be signs that the current title is preferred. Martijn Hoekstra (talk) 11:11, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Brain fart[edit]

Brain fart (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

The Brain Fart is not an actual psychological or neuroscience concept mcain (talk) 16:58, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

  • While the cited PNAS article may be fine (though it is not peer-reviewed), that article never mentions the term "brain fart". If the information in this article is deemed good, perhaps it should be moved to another article like Eriksen flanker task or similar. Right now there is a very specific experiment on a page with a general slang term as a title. mcain (talk) 23:25, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • I would argue that "commission errors under deadline" is a psychological concept, but "brain fart" is a catch-all slang term for "mistake". If the word mistake doesn't deserve its own article, why should brain fart? mcain (talk) 23:25, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Surely some mistake? The topic in this case is different - it is about a transient mental aberration. The title is not important since a change of title may be made without deletion. If you would prefer to call it Lapse of concentration, say, then you don't need AFD. Colonel Warden (talk) 23:41, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Such information would be useful. I've always called these mental hiccups myself, which is certainly less vulgar, imo. English borrows almost all it's names for similar concepts of mental phenom from the French (the article on Déjà vu itself lists several more like itself, including Presque vu, and L'esprit de l'escalier). So... anyone know the French word for fart? :-P -- Kendrick7talk 22:46, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment The word is pet, whence Le Pétomane, and the perfectly mainstream nickname for the airy beignet, pet de nonne (nun's fart). --Dhartung | Talk 02:41, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • It is our policy that article naming should prefer what the greatest number of English speakers would most easily recognize. There is no requirement for article names to be pretentious or formal. Colonel Warden (talk) 07:53, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was Keep per WP:SNOW --JForget 00:42, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Alu (runic)[edit]

Alu (runic) (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

This seems to be a dictionary definition (albeit of a very old word) and I don't see any potential for expansion to an encyclopedia article. What else is there to say besides what it means and how it's used? Powers T 16:08, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

  • This article (though perhaps not in its present state) is not just about a word, it's about a runic inscription. Now, there are quite a few good articles about runic inscriptions, and I don't think anyone would seriously suggest deleting those. The difference here is that this particular inscription occurrs on over 20 artifacts spanning a time frame of roughly 600 years, which makes it highly noteworthy - such that several well-regarded experts have written on the subject. The article promises to have not only linguistic, but also historical, archeological and possibly religious import - on the grounds of its being an inscription, not merely a word. That cannot be said of your run-of-the-mill neologism article. Ergo: Let's wrap up this discussion and keep the article. Aryaman (Enlist!) 21:24, 1 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was speedy close as the nominator has withdrawn and there are no outstanding delete preferences (non-admin closure). Skomorokh 03:23, 1 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

David Benatar[edit]

David Benatar (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Non-notable academic. Only source provided is a scant listing on a faculty page of his school. No verifiable evidence provided that Benatar meets any of the standards of WP:PROF. (Contested speedy.) - Realkyhick (Talk to me) 15:18, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Update: Nomination withdrawn. It's pretty obvious now, given the references that have been added since this article was nominated for deletion, that Dr. Benatar mets notability standards for academics. There's no need for this to go on, so I've given User:Skomorokh an OK to close this. - Realkyhick (Talk to me) 03:08, 1 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep - refs have been provided; I'm convinced. (Article needs cleanup, of course, but they all have to start somewhere.)  Frank  |  talk  20:50, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
please note that I didn't mean to vote twice- if you look it is the same comment, it just came out twice due to some sort of 'glitch in the matrix' :) Merkin's mum 20:01, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
I duuno, are those references "big" enough to establish notability? A campus paper and what seem to be a couple of small South African papers? To me that sounds like some local coverage, but that's just me. For me notability would be established with one major news source. ArcAngel (talk) 20:59, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
So, he's a professor in South Africa, being written about in South African newspapers. What's the problem? I wouldn't expect him to be written about necessarily in British or US papers, any more than I'd expect a British or American professor to be written about in South African papers. Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 21:05, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • So we agree? Hard to tell. His field antinatalism, is very specific. He's cited in Google Scholar as an expert, or at least as a leading proponent of antinatalism. Not sure what you're going for here, Skomorokh. Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 21:36, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Here is the Google Scholar archive of Benetar's published, peer reviewed work. Take a scan of the paper headings (sample: "Cloning and ethics", "Why the Naïve Argument against Moral Vegetarianism Really is Naïve", "Contemporary Jewish Ethics and Morality: A Reader", "Brute Science: Dilemmas of Animal Experimentation" "Beyond the haze of the tobacco bill debate", "Corporal Punishment") If all you see is antinatalism, then you are very much mistaken. Disclosure: I am the creator of the antinatalism article. Skomorokh 21:47, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Blanket statements aren't helpful, but sepcific references and links are. - Realkyhick (Talk to me) 21:33, 29 April 2008 (UTC) — Like the one you just added. Thanks. Only concern is that the search is for "D Benatar," but I'll assume good faith that this is in fact David Benatar. I'm going to let this discussion go on a while, but notability is not as suspect as it was at first. - Realkyhick (Talk to me) 22:28, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Just to note in case you haven't been watching the changes to the article today, Benatar has published in some of the most widely respected philosophy and medical journals in the world - Ethics, Journal of Applied Philosophy, Social Theory and Practice, American Philosophical Quarterly, QJM: An International Journal of Medicine, Journal of Law and Religion and the British Medical Journal. All of this verifiable through the Google Scholar link above. Per WP:PROF, our professor needs to be "more notable than the average college instructor/professor". An adjunct professor or even an associate would kill to be published in Ethics or the BMJ. Regards, Skomorokh 22:33, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
...for which we would probably have to evaluate against WP:BIO1E in order to determine whether or not to create an article, eh? ;-)  Frank  |  talk  23:59, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, the article is now much different than it was when I nominated it. I'm pretty sure now of where this AfD outcome is headed, and that's fine with me now that we've established he's much more than just a university department head with a handful of published works. - Realkyhick (Talk to me) 00:39, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was Delete. LaraLove 04:41, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Wilson Golf Group[edit]

Wilson Golf Group (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Doesn't seem to be a notable conglomeration of golf course. Only sources are primary, and no third-party sources could easily be found.

Also listing a related non-notable golf course owned by them:

Cedar Creek Country Club (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)

Ten Pound Hammer and his otters(Broken clamshellsOtter chirps) 15:14, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

  • The way the article is written is weird and it seemed liked a hoax, but I could wrong. Dwilso 17:12, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was Delete. Black Kite 07:14, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Applewood Hills[edit]

Applewood Hills (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Golf course that appears to be non-notable. I looked for third-party sources and found virtually nothing of worth. Wizardman 14:35, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was Speedy delete, no assertion of notability. Stifle (talk) 20:35, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Friedrich Kussin[edit]

Friedrich Kussin (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

A passing mention in a French language book about Arnhem Bridge does not confer notability for this Nazi official. Ghits are forums and other non reliable sources that simply confirm this fact. TRAVELLINGCARIMy storyTell me yours 14:34, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was userfy. AFD closed early per WP:SNOW. While there were many delete votes, userfying will leave the content available, yet out of the mainspace which is the main point of this AFD. --Rifleman 82 (talk) 05:02, 1 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

African Diamond Mines[edit]

African Diamond Mines (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Nothing more than another school essay User:Globalecon/Global Economics which duplicates much of the information at Blood diamond Diamond and Diamond (gemstone) LegoTech·(t)·(c) 14:21, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

  • No. That note was put there on all pages for this class in an attempt to draw out the deletion process. It's not being used in its intended purpose. Protonk (talk) 05:07, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was Keep. LaraLove 01:11, 8 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

The Five Dysfunctions of a Team[edit]

The Five Dysfunctions of a Team (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

I kind of hate to do this since the page's author e-mailed me asking for help (apparently this is part of a class project), but I just don't see any notability per WP:BOOK. As with most books, I'm finding about eight billion sites to buy the book from, but no substantial third-party coverage. Ten Pound Hammer and his otters(Broken clamshellsOtter chirps) 13:20, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

  • A cursory search indicates that this book is a best-seller; that it has significant influence; that it is covered in major news media; and that the author has sold millions. I have added some cites to demonstrate this. Colonel Warden (talk) 18:14, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Needs more -- so far there's one third-party link demonstrating notability. (Best-seller is an indicator of notability, but doesn't prove it.) Holding off on !voting pending further possible work. —Quasirandom (talk) 19:43, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was delete. GRBerry 17:12, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

XBLite[edit]

XBLite (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

XBLite is an insignificant contribution to the space of BASIC languages and therefore should be removed. The user community is miniscule. For example, the Google group for XBlite, which is the main community vehicle, is only comprised of several hundred users, a very few number of which are active.

Furthermore, the purpose of the article appears to be more about advertising than anything else. 209.159.98.1 (talk) 21:19, 16 April 2008 (UTC) Text copied from article's talk page. ➨ REDVEЯS is always ready to dynamically make tea 13:15, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. Veinor (talk to me) 01:12, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Cafe Cameroon[edit]

Cafe Cameroon (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Contested prod, one local TV source, No vote F (talk) 12:58, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was keep (snowball/non admin). dihydrogen monoxide (H2O) 08:43, 5 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Queen of the Netherlands (ship)[edit]

Queen of the Netherlands (ship) (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Delete nn ship. Creator has removed PROD, and deleted article issues tags, claiming notability established. Only 2 sources given. One is a mere directory of ships, which confers no notability, the other is a chat forum, and hence not a RS. No reliable source given for the tenuous claims to notability by association with notable events Mayalld (talk) 12:47, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

  • Comment Yes, there are sources that mention the ship, but the articles are not about the ship, so they don't meet WP:N. Mayalld (talk) 21:30, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Being the subject of secondary sources is what's stipulated as important to notability guidelines. Those same guidelines don't require that "entire articles" must be written about a topic, but that it receives significant coverage by secondary sources, even if that coverage is within an article/book/story/report about a broader subject (being "the primary subject of..." was taken out of WP:NOTABILITY and related guidelines long ago).--Oakshade (talk) 22:18, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
ghits for "Queen of the Netherlands dredger" producers nearly 300 results. Also reports here of her involvement in the giant land reclamation schemes in Dubai. There is no hard and fast guideline about the notability of ships, some claim that any ship is notable, and one that has attracted so much attention from the world's media is quite comfortably notable. Benea (talk) 14:09, 1 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was Delete --JForget 00:44, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Babak andishmand[edit]

Babak andishmand (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

This article would normally merit a speedy, I think, but was previously prodded and prod tag was removed, so I bring it here to AfD. The accomplishments listed in the article do not establish any notability. Starting artist, who is not notable yet. Crusio (talk) 11:01, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was Delete --JForget 00:45, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Scuffleball[edit]

Scuffleball (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Fails the notability criteria. No coverage in reliable sources. --Snigbrook (talk) 11:00, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

  • The article was not undeleted at deletion review, and is still the same as it was when deleted. I'm not sure if G4 applies or not but it looks like it does. --Snigbrook (talk) 13:53, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Well, if it doesn't apply, I'm comfy with Delete as non-notable and without reliable sources; all I could find was the organization's own website.  RGTraynor  13:58, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was Keep, nomination withdrawn. Davewild (talk) 12:57, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Jemmal[edit]

Jemmal (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

A quick Google search turns up, no city with this name. There are results for a person with the name. Maybe a hoax? Vivio TestarossaTalk Who 10:45, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was Delete --JForget 00:48, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Cartoon-style shooter[edit]

Cartoon-style shooter (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Contested prod; see also WT:VG discussion. dihydrogen monoxide (H2O) 09:10, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was Keep per WP:SNOW (non-admin closure). Clear consensus that the subject satisfies notability criteria. WilliamH (talk) 17:04, 3 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Cutler J. Cleveland[edit]

Cutler J. Cleveland (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

It seems possible that the person could be very marginally notable, but the article as it is now is pure advertising, just a list of his awards. I think it's a big NPOV problem. Not to mention it has no references. I would say it's a big enough problem we should delete it and possibly start over if we find any solid references to use. delldot talk 09:05, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

  • Definitely better than before, but has he been mentioned in the press or other independent sources? delldot talk 09:57, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Note that Keith Pickering is a friend of Cleveland. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.194.4.21 (talk) 08:13, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was Delete. There is a possibly notable event here, but not a notable person; she is clearly only notable for the manner in which she died, and thus falls foul of WP:NOT#NEWS and WP:NOT#MEMORIAL. (There is no comparison to Hrant Dink, who was notable before his death). There is a possibility that this could be incorporated into an article about Brides on tour which appears to have enough written about it in reliable sources to form an article; please contact me if you wish to have the deleted content from this article to do so. Black Kite 07:21, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Pippa Bacca[edit]

Pippa Bacca (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Was speedied for DB bio, however given the level of contribution by users I suspect there may be ground for some discussion. The argument is either non notable biography, or notable murder for the media coverage and the charity circumstances and back story. SGGH speak! 08:06, 29 April 2008

The article is in bad shape, true. For the interesting debate around Pippa Bacca see here: "The terrible truth of the story is that like most martyrs for a cause, Pippa, through her death may have actually accomplished more for peace than she would have, had her walk been completed without incident. Her murder has sent a powerful message about peace and about the continuing struggle of women for personal safety." If the article stands the deletion vote, I am ready to expand the article. Just to note: The same discussion took place with the Italian and German articles. In both cases, the result was to keep the article for the time being. --DaQuirin (talk) 22:40, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Alexb@cut-the-knot.com (talk) 13:31, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was Delete. LaraLove 04:46, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Ebony (album)[edit]

Ebony (album) (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Non-notable unreleased album. No sources provided, no reliable sources found. Rolling Stone has a blank placeholder[40], so does MTV[41][42]. Mdsummermsw (talk) 13:32, 23 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was Delete. LaraLove 04:48, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Word Ways: Going Places with Literacy[edit]

Word Ways: Going Places with Literacy (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

No evidence of notability. -Icewedge (talk) 04:23, 23 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was Merge. LaraLove 01:24, 8 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Psilalonia Square[edit]

Psilalonia Square (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

It's a town square and doesn't appear to be a notable one in English (although that at least confirms existence) or Greek, where its existence is only confirmed in wiki mirrors. This article is nothing more than an unsourced travel guide and without evidence of notability , there's nothing with which to improve it. TRAVELLINGCARIMy storyTell me yours 02:48, 23 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I said that it's a borderline case, but even fountains, have articles here and the article claims that Psialonia square has both a monument and a fountain in addition to other things.--Berig (talk) 18:45, 23 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Ahh ok, thought you said there was inherent notability. My mistake. With regard to other stuff, that's neither here nor there. We can't verify the claims because we can barely prove it exists. Just don't think it's a notable square. We'll see where this goes. TRAVELLINGCARIMy storyTell me yours 23:41, 23 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Alright, no one has added any references, or pictures, so I retract my keep vote.--Berig (talk) 16:03, 26 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was keep. The discussion below sufficiently addresses the issue of continued media raised in the nomination. --jonny-mt 03:44, 8 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Anthony Graves[edit]

Anthony Graves (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Started as a WP:BLP disaster which I've cleared a bit but still just an individual sentenced to death who's conviction was overturned. Currently about to start his second trial. That is all in terms of notability and while it make the news (the Austin Chronicle article is something else), he doesn't seem to be the subject of continued media interest. I don't know of any similar case other than Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Choctaw Three. Ricky81682 (talk) 07:15, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

  • Comment But my concern is whether this falls under "continued media interest" or is this a one-time quick news story? Is the notability simply because of the overturned conviction? If so, then everyone at Overturned convictions in the United States is notable including the deleted Choctaw three mentioned above or perhaps only when they fall into larger tales, like Mychal Bell. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 17:23, 1 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • The media coverage so far spans many years. Media coverage of a person does not need to go into infinity for them to be considered notable. --Oakshade (talk) 18:42, 1 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • I disagree on renaming. Rodney King for example is about the guy and the event. I think there is sufficient information to keep it focused on him. If it were more about the conduct of the prosecutors or something else, then I would understand renaming to Anthony Grave trial or something similar. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 23:03, 6 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was Keep Even though the keep votes are all weak, I believe Stifles remark should also be treated as a weak delete, or a keep, since his conditions, citations to ensure verifiability, is later ensured. Since the nom is neutral, I conclude the consensus here is to keep. Martijn Hoekstra (talk) 20:30, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Josh Phillips (actor)[edit]

Josh Phillips (actor) (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Tagged A7 and deleted, however, an editor expressed concerns so I am listing the article here. No opinion from my side. Tone 06:57, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

  • I have not been able to locate any other sources. I changed my vote to weak keep per the additional sources I've identified. AtaruMoroboshi (talk) 19:18, 5 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was Speedy delete, non-admin closure. asenine t/c\r (fc: f2abr04) 16:05, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Have a crack[edit]

Have a crack (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Definition - surely more wiktionary suitable than here? asenine t/c\r (fc: f2abr04) 05:34, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was Delete --JForget 00:50, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Republigay[edit]

Republigay (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Neologism per WP:NEO. John Nagle (talk) 05:06, 29 April 2008 (UTC) --John Nagle (talk) 05:11, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

"Prod" was deleted, so we have to do this the hard way. Found on RC patrol. Google shows this term used only in a few blogs. Article close to being an attack article. Dictdef. No useful article content. --John Nagle (talk) 05:11, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

A single blog entry does nothing to indicate notability or currency of this term: blogs are not useful references. Acroterion (talk) 01:53, 1 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Query: Are article creator Mattburbank (talk · contribs) (only article Republigay) and author of comment above JD222 (talk · contribs) (new account, only edit is to this AfD) the same person? --John Nagle (talk) 02:58, 1 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was Delete --JForget 00:51, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Don Rumsfeld & Dick Cheney In Hell[edit]

Don Rumsfeld & Dick Cheney In Hell (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Non-notable vanity-press book. Entry seems to have been created by author. Graymornings (talk) 04:09, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was delete. east.718 at 04:28, April 30, 2008

Study abroad information[edit]

Study abroad information (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Another article resulting from the inappropriate class project discussed at WP:ANI#Use of Wikipedia for class project (see also User:Globalecon/Global Economics). This one violates multiple sections of WP:NOT, especially WP:NOTGUIDE. Deor (talk) 03:16, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was Delete. LaraLove 04:50, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Long Lost Son[edit]

Long Lost Son (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

I'm not really sure this film meets WP:MOVIE, based on [52] and [53]. The latter is the NY times that simply mentions the film as a directory/guide. Let's see what the community thinks about this. Wisdom89 (T / C) 03:15, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was Delete, no reliable sources to establish notability, probably original research. Davewild (talk) 20:45, 6 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Nick Jr. What's On Next?[edit]

Nick Jr. What's On Next? (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Article is sorely lacking context so it's not even entirely clear what the article is about. It's also completely unreferenced so verifying the content is very hard and I'm very skeptical of the overall importance of an article which, apparently, discusses various in-between-shows blurbs on Nick Jr.. Pichpich (talk) 03:07, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Delete, don't merge. Think you figured it out. Article is probably impressive work for its author, but it would take a miracle to make this WP:N. Sorry WMA10! Potatoswatter (talk) 03:16, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was Merge and Redirect to Morton-on-Swale (merge has already taken place) as per usual for primary schools and the lack of coverage to establich independent notability. Davewild (talk) 20:51, 6 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Ainderby Steeple Church of England Primary School[edit]

Ainderby Steeple Church of England Primary School (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD) - Delete Non-notable school in an article without verifiable sources or links to independent media coverage. Ecoleetage (talk) 02:36, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was Delete. LaraLove 04:52, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

African American Drug Kingpins of New York City[edit]

African American Drug Kingpins of New York City (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

This article offers nothing in the way of notability, research, verifiable sources or encyclopedic relevance. Ecoleetage (talk) 02:30, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was Redirect. LaraLove 17:27, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Irvington Middle School[edit]

Irvington Middle School (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Horribly written, unsourced article about a non-notable school. Google doesn't reveal anything convincing. — Wenli (reply here) 02:29, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

(talk) 09:48, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

  • Response - my use of the word "redirect" was a poor choice of words. What I meant was channel efforts of these middle-school editors. They are interested and have technical editing ability. I fear we drive them away, seeming as if we are an exclusive club, and I wonder if we have a place - other than the sandbox - to direct them toward. (See Rawbacon's comment below.)  Frank  |  talk  14:05, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was Keep - boldly closing early per the snowball clause - Peripitus (Talk) 10:34, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Vernon Heywood[edit]

Vernon Heywood (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Not Particularly Notable WP:BIO Llamabr (talk) 19:35, 28 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was Delete. Appears to be NN. Yet again, IMDB cannot be used as a RS. Black Kite 07:27, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Jesse Kozel[edit]

Jesse Kozel (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

This is another article (which seems autobiographical) with only YouTube and MySpace as a resource. Including the comment in the edit summary for creation, this meets WP:CRYSTAL, WP:V, and WP:MUSIC. Does not seem to be notable. Also a contested PROD. Soxred93 (u t) 02:18, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

HIS IMDb.com page is listed there as well as his Official MySpace page.

Here is the LINK TO HIS OFFICIAL WEBSITE TOO! JESSE KOZEL There is no reason to delete him. He has MANY roles this year coming out and he is an actor people are TALKING ABOUT. —Preceding unsigned comment added by USpanish (talkcontribs) 03:49, 5 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was Delete. Essentially a G4, as the content is functionally identical to the previously deleted content, and no new claims of notability are made. Black Kite 07:29, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Jetman (Facebook application)[edit]

Jetman (Facebook application) (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

This is a non-notable Facebook application. Please see the other two discussions for details.

  • On an entirely separate matter, It's dismaying that the editor who nominated this article - which is not something that should be done lightly - didn't bother to use copypaste. But that's manners, not relevant to the article. --Kizor 11:05, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was Keep based on sourcing provided in this discussion Gnangarra 14:28, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Artemis Eternal[edit]

Artemis Eternal (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Fails WP:NFF and does not give any evidence with regards to notability. Girolamo Savonarola (talk) 02:07, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I added a reference if that helps. Artemis Eternal --Alreajk (talk) 03:06, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Not in itself, unfortunately. I'm not contesting its existence, but it's notability. You might want to refer to WP:NOTFILM to see what we generally require to assert notability. You should also be aware that future films aren't notable enough to warrant independent articles unless they have already started filming (and have a reliable source to prove it). Girolamo Savonarola (talk) 03:18, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
That's not strictly true. There are cases in which the preproduction of a film is notable enough to have significant coverage in reliable sources -- for example, Rapunzel. That appears to be the case here as well; Stover's unique funding ideas seem to have garnered attention. Powers T 14:28, 6 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry, just remembered that Rapunzel is in full production and has been for years, but I think my point stands. Powers T 14:30, 6 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
I see. Alright delete it then. I'll copy it to my user namespace and create the article when it receives more attention and begins filming. Thanks for your help and input. --Alreajk (talk) 22:26, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was Delete --JForget 00:53, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Interfusigrating[edit]

Interfusigrating (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Per Wikipedia:Avoid_neologisms#Articles_on_neologisms Oore (talk) 01:40, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was Delete. LaraLove 04:54, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

New Joints & New Entries from 106 & Park[edit]

New Joints & New Entries from 106 & Park (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

List of featured music videos on BET's 106 & Park show. The show itself is not based on any kind of sales or airplay data; this seems to go against WP:NOT#IINFO and just basically is not encyclopedic. Additionally, a similar article listing 106 & Park videos was deleted per AfD several months ago. All of this was in the main 106 & Park article but was removed, only to have an editor copy it and move it to this new page. There is no way to source any of this prior to 2007 (the show started well before then), and as it is a daily show, these tables and the article itself has nowhere to go but huge. Conversation on the main 106 & Park talk page was questioning the inclusion of this info there before I removed it and everything here is a direct copy/paste of the source that is listed at the bottom of the article. - eo (talk) 01:39, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was merge with September 11, 2001 attack memorials and services. Sjakkalle (Check!) 11:28, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

First anniversary of the September 11, 2001 attacks[edit]

By far the shortest, least informative and least useful of the 9/11-related articles that are listed on the template on all the pages. Although it was a major event I don't find usefulness on articles about anniversaries of certain events. Also, red links and citations for lack of sourcing are abound. --Nicholas Weiner (talk) 01:34, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was Delete. Just a local gaming group, the "reliable source" article makes it quite clear how local. The "700+" Google hits for the convention come down to just about 30 relevant hits - mostly forums and blogs - when English results only are requested (the phrase is common, and irrelevant, in Italian). Black Kite 07:40, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Gaming Association of Southwestern Pennsylvania[edit]

Gaming Association of Southwestern Pennsylvania (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Non-notable organization (120 members), with just one local newspaper article. Clarityfiend (talk) 01:26, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was Delete. LaraLove 04:58, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Love motive[edit]

Love motive (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

A 100% WP:OR literary concept. JuJube (talk) 00:50, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was delete. The current contents are badly written and unsourced; they should not be merged in this state as this would degrade the quality of the target article. Sandstein (talk) 21:11, 6 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Tanegashima knife[edit]

Tanegashima knife (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Article fails to assert notability, no sources to justify text and google search for "Tanegashima knife" shows two hits, both wikipedia, and "Tanegashima knives" shows 17, none of which are evidence of coverage in secondary sources or any coverage besides sales sites. WLU (talk) 00:43, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was speedy delete, copyvio. - Bobet 02:01, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Meggan anderson[edit]

Meggan anderson (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Non-notable actress, a quick IMDB search does bring up a few screen credits, but most of them are small NN one-shot appearances, none of which satisfy WP:BIO. Mister Senseless (Speak - Contributions) 00:32, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry if this seemed like a quick nom, but everything I could find made me think she wasn't a WP:BIO candidate. I did do a gnews/ google search beforehand, most of what I found was (with maybe one exception) trivial, mostly passing references or press releases from PETA. If you can find some other sources, I'm willing to withdraw. Mister Senseless (Speak - Contributions) 04:49, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Somehow I missed the fact that those g-news hits were all PETA press releases. I'll stick with giving it a little time, though it may not make a difference in this case. JeremyMcCracken (talk) (contribs) 11:18, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was Delete. LaraLove 04:59, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Boy Howdy (logo)[edit]

Boy Howdy (logo) (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Subject is not notable. Article has no sources and is mostly original research. The article is about a logo for Creem, which contains the same image and already contains similar information. Ward3001 (talk) 00:29, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

That's Creem. Ward3001 (talk) 00:19, 3 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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The result was delete. Discounting some poorly argued opinions, of which three were for "merge" and two for "delete" (Dorftrottel, lack of notability is not a criterium for speedy deletion), contributors have overwhelmingly determined that this thinly sourced detail of an (albeit very notable) fictional universe should not have an article of its own. They have also by a ratio of roughly two to one determined that the content should not even be merged. That's probably close enough to allow for a brief mention (to the effect of a few sentences or a paragraph) of this subject in an appropriate article. Sandstein (talk) 21:31, 6 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Force lightning[edit]

Force lightning (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Non-notable plot gimmick/special effect. Single citation is to unreliable source. Original research ("a single powerful blast may be sufficient to kill a person instantly") and plot summary. --EEMIV (talk) 00:18, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Comment You haven't addressed that there is no evidence of the WP:notability of this subject. If it's not notable, why should it have its own article? The subject doesn't need to be described by a long page of information clearly from primary sources (mostly computer game manuals), all the reliable sources about "Force lightning" can be covered in a paragraph or two in a more general article on the Force. Ryan Paddy (talk) 23:42, 1 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Comment: I have seen no indication that it is not notable. It appears in some of the most successful films of all times and also in video and other types of games and even if as you suggest it should be covered in an article on the Force, then we would still merge and redirect without deletion. I see zero benefit to the project in outright deletion and as DGG notes below when an article has potential, we do not delete, we redirect with the allowance for the existing article to be improved when additional sources are added. Best, --Le Grand Roi des CitrouillesTally-ho! 00:04, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
The burden of proof does not fall on those asserting non-notability; the burden of proof is on those claiming notability -- and there is no evidence of "Force lightning"'s notability. This effect/gimmick does not inherit notability from the films or games in which it appears. Given the lack of sources and in-universe treatment, I see no utility in retaining this article, and simply merging it into Force powers would shift one pile of unsubstantiated dreck into another, simply exacerbating the project's problem with unsubstantiated in-universe plot summary and OR. --EEMIV (talk) 00:17, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Appearances in multiple media, even toys, and given the hits this article gets (thousands of readers and clear evidence of editors working on the artucle) suggest notability. As a sub or break off article, the effect/gimmick inherits notability from the films and games in which it appears and is covered by a mix of sources, both primary and secondary and just needs clean up, not deletion. I see no gain for our project in not retaining this article. As a community of editors, the burden is on ALL of us to do what we can to improve articles and not to just order others to do so, especially on a paperless encyclopedia without a deadline. Best, --Le Grand Roi des CitrouillesTally-ho! 00:21, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Comment One way that we can improve the encyclopedia is to avoid subjects that lend themselves primarily to unreferencable waffle. I've looked for independant sources on "force lightning" and failed to find them. Unless some can be found, it doesn't warrant an article to itself because the independantly referencable discussion of the subject is so small that it can easily fit within another article. I've never seen a guideline that suggests "sub articles" should be exempted from WP:N, I don't think that's the case. Note that the opinion of many here is to merge/redirect. Clearly actual deletion would be counterproductive, but that's just a technicality.Ryan Paddy (talk) 02:00, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Comment: Unless if we can say we have exhausted all publications, i.e. sci fi, toy, and Star Wars magazines, then I don't think we can say definitively that a non-hoax topic such as this one cannot be better referenced. If there is any consensus to merge and redirect then we do not need a deletion discussion to do those. Best, --Le Grand Roi des CitrouillesTally-ho! 03:11, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Given the absence of reliable sources and the non-encyclopedic tone of this article, I disagree that deletion is "clearly" "counterproductive." Unreferenced plot summary and trivia like this dilute the pool of actually well-done Battletartrekwars-related articles. --EEMIV (talk) 03:32, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
So, you're suggesting that this special effect's incorporation as an action figure *accessory* suggests notability? "clear evidence of editors working on the artucle" is a vague and, like this article, unsubstantiated rationale to keep it. I have no idea -- and doubt you do, either -- how to back up this claim of "thousands of readers." All ~25 articles that link to this "article" use the term/idea in the context of plot summary, without any discussion or notion of real-world notability. And as for the idea that this thing should remain until all potential sources have been examined -- well, you simply have it backwards; sources should be on hand and incorporated into an article as it's developed. Editors who want to add/restore/retain material have the burden of meeting Wikipedia's WP:V and WP:N standards -- that clearly hasn't been the case in this thing's almost-three-year history. Perhaps you should userfy this article until citations to reliable sources establishing notability, verifying claims and providing an out-of-universe perspective come up. --EEMIV (talk) 03:32, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, it does indeed suggest notability as its something that is specifically mentioned as a major feature of that action figure. Deletion rationales for the article tend to be "I don't like it" in nature. I can back up the claim of thousands of readers with the fact that I link to a page above that demonstrates in one month alone the page received thousands of hits. Articles develop over time. Wikipedia is in effect a constant work in progress. Therefore, the article is still being developed and should remain in mainspace where any editor can come and continue to improve it. There's no deadline. Instead of userfying it, the article has a greater likelihood of improvement if it remains in mainspace. Best, --Le Grand Roi des CitrouillesTally-ho! 04:03, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Comment I'm not saying that no references could ever be found. But what are the odds of finding significant reliable coverage in an independant source? Slight to none, reflecting its lack of notability. Wikipedia:WikiProject_Star_Wars says that "Only a few characters, items, or spaceships deserve their own entry" and that trivial information is "frowned upon". This article is not on a subject of primary importance to Star Wars, and can only ever contain trivia because force lightning has never been a subject of interest in its own right outside of fan sites. The deletion discussion here can establish a consensus on whether the subject warrants an article to itself, which can then be referred to when implementing the redirection.Ryan Paddy (talk) 03:44, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Comment: Considering the popularity of Star Wars, I think the odds are very good that given time and adequate searching on not just online, but published sources significant reliable sources could be found. It is a important force power and given that Star Wars just keeps making games and figures these sorts of aspects will only increase in notability and coverage. Regards, --Le Grand Roi des CitrouillesTally-ho! 04:03, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
And, as usual, nothing speaks against recreating the article iff and only when reliable sources verifying notability have been found. Such sources should be included right on article creation. Please stop speculating; and please start acknowledging valid arguments. Dorftrottel (harass) 09:57, May 2, 2008
While my argument is to keep, I will acknowledge that there are valid arguments presented for merging and redirecting without deleting; however, there are no valid arguments for outright deletion. Sincerely, --Le Grand Roi des CitrouillesTally-ho! 13:20, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, there are. Dorftrottel (vandalise) 13:27, May 2, 2008
Not really. Best, --Le Grand Roi des CitrouillesTally-ho! 13:30, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Please reply to this post. Dorftrottel (warn) 13:31, May 2, 2008
'Comment Two references have also been added. If they demonstrate notability then it should have an article. Searching snippets on Google Books they just look like pasing mentions, which wouldn't demonstrate notability: here and here. There are only two passing mentions in the second source. In the first source there are three passing mentions, but there may be other sections in the book that have deeper coverage. Anyone have the book to confirm? I'm still of the merge and redirect opinion unless such notability is shown. Ryan Paddy (talk) 20:36, 4 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Comment The sources appear to be exactly what I would expect: Star Wars paraphenalia with passing mentions of force lightning. If they only include passing mentions, they absolutely don't demonstrate notability. And if the publisher also does extended universe books, they're not independant either. What I doubt you'll find is independant and substantial coverage of force lightning in a reliable source. And that is the criteria for notability. Come up with a news article on the subject, or an academic paper, or a chapter in a book, or a magazine article, or whatever. Otherwise, no evidence of notability has been demonstrated. Ryan Paddy (talk) 04:27, 6 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was delete. Wizardman 15:07, 6 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Darren Sukenik[edit]

Darren Sukenik (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

No notability out of a sales report. No sources. Personal web-site claims that he is constantly "ranked #1 broker Downtown" but there are few verifiable sources that back this. seicer | talk | contribs 00:18, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]


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The result was merge all to Edea (musical group). Will do it now. Neıl 11:37, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Samuli Kosminen[edit]

Samuli Kosminen (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)
Tommy Mansikka-Aho (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)
Marika Krook (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)

Non-notable musician. I am nominating for deletion because of the following line in WP:MUSIC: "Members of notable bands are not given individual articles unless they have demonstrated notability for activity independent of the band." Tavix (talk) 00:08, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

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The result was Delete - WP:SNOW applies. Stifle (talk) 14:38, 1 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

National super hero day[edit]

National super hero day (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Non-notable corporate holiday. No references. Prod removed by author. JuJube (talk) 00:06, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

  • Geez, now I wish I'd said "stronger-than-a-locomotive delete" or something like that. ("Speedier-than-a-speeding-bullet delete" doesn't apply here, I think.) AnturiaethwrTalk 04:51, 29 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
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